Come on - Cointaker don't deserve any credit. It seems they were just in the right place at the right time. The Dutch court is responsible for forcing the resolution. After its judgement the games would have ended up sold, Cointaker or not.

If this was a general liquidation, which it appears it should have been a long time ago, all creditors could have had equal opportunity to benefit from the proceeds of the sale of the 40 games. But since it was just the result of ARA instigated court action, the court wasn't obliged to look at all DP liabilities. Just those to relating to ARA.

They do because they tried to reach out first to the people with deposits. They could just sell to the highest bidder and considering some people have tried to sell these games in the past close to 20k I think they're being pretty fair! 12,500 for a pinball is a lot no doubt but supply and demand could drive the price even higher, but they're reaching out to those people first. I say that earns respect.

For $25k would you rather buy Beatles Gold, BM66SLE, Alien w/ $5k left or TBL w/ $5k left?

$20k sounds about right for TBL and I expect prices will settle there as the built games arrive. So if you freed one for $12.5k, congrats you just made $7.5k. Don’t feel bad, that’s less than the $8.5k your EA lost There was no ideal outcome and whoever was offered and took the game was smart. The market is what the market is.

TBL pinball is certainly a story for the ages. It is joining other Illuminati’s like Alien, RAZA, Magic Girl, Predator and BBB. Some fared better than other. TBL is pretty bad.

It's definitely up there with the worst. And this seems to be the perfect bookend to a familiar pinball tale - the early adopters/pre-order customers being royally screwed just like they have been throughout the whole journey.

Not cool Dude. "Sarcasm" sign or not.

Cheers. Thanks for taking the time. Stand up PM for sure.

Brian

I really hope no one who wired CT the big bucks did so with the intention of flipping. That would be way beyond not cool. I'd almost bet someone does, and people will line up to buy it.

I gotta lay off the weed--it only took minutes for some yahoo to list his for 45K. Some people are beyond jerks.

Are you kidding me? These games will be on pinside/ebay the first week.

Always glad to work things out and come to a respectful and mutual agreement, and make a new friend as the conclusion of our PMs went!

Now....on the other hand....

Like I said, Brian, he never disappoints. That being said, I think I'll add this guy to my ignore list. In 3...2.....*the sound of silence*.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhh...that's better : ).

"with the intention of flipping".....
......Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.
Not a feakin chance I'm flipping it if I actually get a game.
QSS

In my honest opinion no pinball game is worth over 10k no game no matter how rare it’s just a pinball game. On the other hand everything is worth what someone is willing to pay. Again I love the game feel bad for everyone screwed over by the countless start up pinball companies. Selling these 40 games opens wounds but it should also serve as a reminder not to support companies with no track record I would never even trust buying a game from someone in another state much less another country. Put cash down as u load it into ur truck. With all that being said I’m happy if some of these games end up at pinball shows and or pincades that is better than never seeing the game or a boycott

I’d guess 10 will go on eBay immediately, 10 more will sit in a box for Atleast a year before sale, then half will be opened and flipped and enjoyed. Mine would be opened and flipped. One day I hope it is accompanied by Alien #2 because Alien #1 only lasted 3 months.

The question is.. if no EAs had sent in preorder $$, would there even be ANY TBLs in existence? 1.5 mill for the 185 fully paid games (not sure if that includes the 40 that shipped and the forty shipping at 12.5k?) .. but either way I wonder what Dutch would look like today if they hadn’t taken any preorder money. Some was blown but seems like a bunch was needed for making the games upfront. W/out that model I think we’d have 2 or 3 protos and that’s it.

No one should give a pinball company pre-order money ever again. That policy works for the company but not the customer. Just say never again no how tempting. If a company doesn’t have enough money to manufacture good reason not to trust them

No shit, thats like advising somebody to look both ways after they have already been hit by a car.

So what if Cointaker is actually paying $10K per Game and charging $12K plus shipping ($12.5)? Does that change anything?

Okay thanks you're so damn smart that's obvious, smarter than me clearly because I would have never thought that was so obvious! LOL
But answer me a quick question. Why do people keep doing it?
It isn't just one game we're talking about here its multiple!

I havent followed from the beginning but, why wasnt the presumptive consumers, having allready payed represented in the legal hearings?
Why did the ara get everything and the buyers/investors nothing?

ARA were just a contract Manufacturer, that didn't get paid.

DP made lots of promises and attempts to make payment and failed.

ARA took action so they could make claim to the games and recover the monies owed

The Cointaker deal must have been more than $8,500 US a game as ARA were getting greedy and I walked away from the deal

My guess is DP negotiated a deal to payout ARA using money from Cointaker to be able to continue manufacture after retooling boards etc, however the TBL license is done, so maybe some other game, Dp are doing exactly what Heighway did limiting liability by having directors resign.

Nope, the game isn't as awesome as the resale price has fooled you into believing.

The rarity and collectibility has more to do with the hyped-up interest than anything about hitting this shot repeatedly to start a mode.

Played the game several times and found it to just be as or more unreliable as all the new Stern/jersey jack machines

Not worth a cool $12,500

I've played the game and here would be my quick take:

Theming: Perfect. You couldn't theme the game any better, they really incorporated the theme of the movie into the game.

Playfield: Look at what you're seeing from stern lately and compare it to this... its a masterpiece. It has an upper and lower playfield. How many games ever made within the last 10 years could claim that?

Artwork: Its a bowling movie so only so much could be done, its not star wars. For the theme I think its great.

License: It's considered the #1 Cult Classic movie of all time. So I would give it another A plus!

They incorporated clips from the movie into the game perfectly, there just isn't a single knock on the game itself other than the biggest one...

Can you get parts, will the game hold up, support for the game, code updates, blah, blah... that is the F in the room.

So where does this game sit? It probably needs to be a collector game, with limited playing time. If it ends up in a pincade I would only do that if the person running that pincade is a master at fixing pinball games. I would not consider myself in that category so for me its home use only.

The game is good, the theme is fun, the interest is high because of what a great job they did with the game. As with all of these companies there is going to be risks in buying them, because their company might not offer long term support.

Many props and cons but the game if it never breaks is a home run!

In the movie.. the dude just wants his rug back.. and gets taken for a wild ride.. how fitting.. this has got to be the most dramatic saga in all of pinball. Or was it alien? Or maybe predator? Or maybe Magic Girl.. I digress.

I went back and forth about trying to get one of these $12,500 games.. I'm glad I didn't make up my mind before they were gone..

I have put mine on route and it gets heavy heavy plays. My friend TJ operates it for me as he's one of the best operators and techs in our area. The parts are all standard so that's not too much an issue. Other stuff that has broken is the subway which was made of perforated metal. Some other design features TJ had provided input to Dutch about and were incorporated into the Xytech protos that help the game survive better on route. Weirdly enough the game doesn't have audits for # of games played so I don't know that but can infer from the other audits and earnings how much it was played and I think it was probably the most heavily played TBL out there. After initial issues TJ got things smoothed out and it worked pretty well under heavy & regular play.

I would call that a vote of confidence thanks for posting that!!! Very helpful!

I agree. And it is interesting and funny how route 2 is exactly the deeproot business model.

Hard to operate a business with that big cost. Even with investors, who get antsier the more they gotta throw in. Time will tell if we ever see machines. It would be cool if they can make it happen!

I am unaware of a ranking of “cult classic” movies. Could you provide a reference? If such truly exists, is it the “definitive” ranking of said films? Can you define a “cult classic” (questionable capitalization omitted here), as I am unaware of what films qualify?

Finally, are you familiar with the term perseveration? If not, I suggest you learn it, as your posting exemplifies it.

Here are some ways to help your child (pinhead) with perseveration.
Talk about it. ...
Respond with empathy to reduce anxiety. ...
Encourage self-monitoring. ...
Help him make connections. ...
Identify the appropriate stopping point. ...
Create a “stuck signal.” ...
Have a plan for getting “unstuck.”

only if it includes such 'cult' classics as
Heaven's Gate: The Definitive Story,
Jonestown: Paradise Lost,
and Waco.

Your post is totally and utterly ridiculous. Anyone and I mean anyone can search for top 25 cult movies, top 25 ranked cult movies, blah, blah... Big Lebowski comes up #1 or in the top 10 on nearly every single list. Instead of acting like a weirdo why don't you just do the search yourself.

There is no such thing as a definitive list because all lists no matter who makes them are their own opinions. However nearly if not all lists created have Big Lebowski as their #1 to top 10 film. Secondly, there is a website called 'ranker' where people can vote so if we call that 'definitive' because everyone can vote. Oh since you're acting super weird and lazy I did it for you... https://www.ranker.com/list/cult-movies-and-films/reference

Whoops Big Lebowski is #1 imagine that!

Since you can't seem to look up 'cult classic' here is the wikipedia page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_film if reading is something you're capable of maybe you'll take the time to read it yourself.

Unlike you I actually try to post facts not fiction not make believe. When I said Big Lebowski is considered the #1 cult classic movie of all time I guess I knew exactly what I was talking about. had you put out some effort you could have seen that for yourself.

Since we're on the topic of is Big Lebowski a good theme or not...

Its listed on Ranker as the #1 Cult Classic movie of all time!

Ranker also lists Big Lebowski as the 14th best comedy of all time.

I think its a pretty good theme and beloved film by many. Its a cult classic because it was discovered on cable, dvd, or just simply after its theatrical run, which wasn't great. The film has a very loyal fan base, and now they just announced a sequel based on the character 'Jesus'.

Other movies ranked under 'comedy' that would make great themes for pinball: Airplane #2 - Caddyshack #6 - Animal House #7 - #11 Vacation #12 Young Frankenstein #18 Blues Brothers

Cult Classics that would be great pinball games on ranker: #3 Blade Runner #9 Psycho #11 Lost Boys #14 Army of Darkness

Rolling Stones list of top Cult Classics has Big Lebowski #2 behind Rocky Horror https://www.rollingstone.com/movies/movie-lists/readers-poll-the-25-best-cult-movies-of-all-time-18696/2-the-big-lebowski-38531/

Dude how great of a pin could they make with The Rocky Horror Picture Show?

I heard Franchi did some art but nothing ever came of it. A non Stern company needs to be all over this if so!

Some guy on another thread totally embarrassed himself by stating something like 'lets face it JJP is a niche company like Spooky'. LOL A niche company doesn't sell 5000 plus copies of WOZ, or license stuff like Toy Story. Get the point?

However I've been saying that companies like American Pinball, need to get off this original pinball theme kick, otherwise they're never getting out of the batters box. I think that company has potential but take my word for it Octoberfest if its lucky will sell 150 copies. Now they're talking about doing even more original themes but based on classic public domain characters. This won't work either because nobody and I mean NOBODY wants a Robin hood pinball. LOL

American Pinball should go after these niche classic licenses because they would be cheap, and the fanbase behind them would go crazy for the game. American Pinball should become the KING of NICHE just like Chicago is the king of remakes. They could announce a game and they would pre sell everything within days of the announced title.

Friday the 13th will sell 750 copies - Rocky Horror Picture Show the following is massive and would sell 750 copies easy - Halloween, Army of Darkness, Airplane, the list goes on and on.

I wish American Pinball would look into this direction because if they did we'd have a serious contender on our hands, because I think they do a great job with theming. They just need to license something that they can make money on selling 1000 or less machines.

They should contract for TBL. Period.

If some of the new 40 were bought by other distributors, these are for profit operations and will assuredly be resold for more than 12.5k.

Doesn't seem to be any different than someone buying to "flip."

For better or worse, its unlikely most of these 40 will be going to their long term homes initially. I wish I had the foresight and 12.5k on hand at the time. A solid investment, though I'd never have been able to bring myself to resell, it's a real cool game

I know that to be incorrect. Someone posted in the 40+ thread they got one from their distributor and it wasn't a 'for profit operation'. Ive been told where three are going and I don't believe any of those three will be flipped for a profit. Those people bought the game because they love it. I can't wait to play it as fortunately a friend picked one up.

So machines were bought for 12.5k by the distro, and being sold to one of their customers for 12.5k? Not doubting you just looking for clarification. Itd be cool to hear that they weren't all gobbled up to make a buck

I don’t see why their distributor couldn’t have been cointaker or nitro

So glad people got these machines. When the next set gets released, I’ll be buying those as well

Make sure you stream it

It wasn't

It's not my place to say exactly what he paid. I'm sure some people will flip them to make a quick buck though, that's bound to happen.

What will be the going rate for a flipped machine??

Easily 20k plus. Alien LE is going for 16.5 right now and it’s rarer than that and probably more loved, although i have played both and Alien is the better game imo.

Nope, TBL is better than Alien!

4D64DFAD-9DF1-475A-A0F7-30FB258E0C27 (resized).jpeg

He said Played, not artwork. "Playing Pinball Matter" PPM

I never said anything about the artwork, I said TBL is a better game and the cabinet and backbox (not the art) are MEH... IMHO

I’ve Been lucky to own a lot of great pins
Rode my bike from town to town to play as a kid. Still get excited to find a beater and tear it apart. For me TBL is the Game
If I ever do get one it will for awhile be in my living room ! On the rug and never to be sold . Would gladly let other pin lovers play it

Hoping this gets made in numbers and everyone who wants one gets one !
Left of the fireplace is waiting!
4383A889-8E79-4FD3-A0F4-8BD81F7303AE (resized).jpegimage (resized).jpg

That room could really use a rug.... you know, to tie it all together.

Well my wife’s little dog pees on the rugs
I threw them all away

That’s some funny shit ! Or is it ?