Every time I read this thread, I think to myself better you guys than me ‍♂️

Gotta b loose with your Money to pay full amount on this game before getting it;D

guess I would do a $1000 for someone's full paid spot. I can handle loosing that, I will just check it off as donation to fellow pinsider.

Isn't there a Hurricane Florence thread you should be posting in?

I did, same line

Had the pleasure of playing TBL #40 yesterday on location at The Ice Box in Seattle. The Dude's car was disabled and the lower bowling alley wasn't activating either, but it was still a lot of fun to play. My thanks to Dan (this TBL's owner) for making this available to the public!

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TBL and Alien. The only two pins I was really excited about. Dammit.

Definitely two of the best pin themes of all time.

Have the lawyers gone out for their lunch again yet after meeting once with no outcome other than agreeing to meet again?

The lawyers agreed to order the same thing off the lunch menu that day. They couldn’t agree what to get (1 holdout), so all went home feeling right, but hungry. And we know nothing happens on an angry stomach. Local weather reporters noted a thick, black cloud of smug above the building that day. #tbl_pinball-that.ship.has.sailed.and.it.sunk# or #tbl_pinball-remaining.ea’s.in.lifeboats.believe.ship.will.be.raised.repaired.andsetsail.with.them.onboard.until.happy.conclusion...wow!dreamers#
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The silence from DP is deafening......

It’s over...but I’m sure everyone is still optimistic in that private group!!!

So so sad. I have said it before and ill say it again, this is one of the best games every designed and built and easily among top 3 of the last 10 years. I am an immediate buyer if this ever becomes real again but most certainly not at the unobtainium collector prices now (20k+) If the game was a shit show like some of the other games that have crashed and burned, this wouldnt hurt so much but being that its such a fantastic game just makes this more painful and frustrating for all. All the stars were aligned....except for actual business and fiscal management. And all of the lies along the way sure didnt help credibility...I look forward to a day when this actually comes back alive but i have absolutely no faith that it will.

I dunno...Just my opinion; I think taking this to a private Pinside group is a slippery slope. I read Pinside (way too much) to keep up with everything pinball, including the behind the scenes activities of the companies putting out the games. It helps me decide my next purchase.

I guess an argument can be made that the "Official _____ Threads" should also be private as they would mainly be for owners. Same with the JPOP/Skit B threads.

....or maybe it's my own selfish reasoning ; I've followed this thread for over 3 years and not knowing updates or an outcome is pretty anti-climactic.

How about a DIY Kit of the game, and let folks put it together themselves for
various success or failure threads Kit cost would be about 3-5 grand, not
too large of a 'project' say for 1-2 years, and folks would actually go from
claiming knowledge of what they speak to actually appreciating what it takes
to build a pinball. BTW, pinball is hard, no actually its HARD.

I blame Robin, not the guys that requested the feature. You want a private group, fine, go to Facebook etc but last I checked I paid for access to all Pinside has to offer. I felt it was a slap in the face to us plus members who have followed this thread from the beginning and have a genuine interest in the outcome and progression.

You’re not missing anything.

Whatever the outcome, there are several machines built at ARA. So, what will become of them?
They are not going to be destroyed or will not be resold knowing that they are the property of the buyers

They are ARA property and can do what they like with them as they own them and haven't been paid for them

They are not yours nor do they owe them to you, they didn't take money from your DP did

No, it seems to me precisely that it is up to justice to say to whom they belong
The final customer is the person who has preordered it.
I think that anyone who has pre-ordered this game with committed money should come together to file a common complaint and claim their right as a creditor

You are a dp creditor not Ara you have no claim with them, would be like saying you paid the guy who made sterns cabinets and they sold it to Stern who sold the complete game to someone else. You only have claim over the person you paid, any other case would be dismissed.

Sorry but they are the facts, it's like homepin sold all the Aussie preorder buyers their games to Canada.

Where I said TLB buyers were creditors of ARA?
Justice needs to say who is right and who is wrong.
However, there is a commercial chain and the final customer is buyer. If these games were the ARA property why didn’t they sell them, take the cash and go ahead?

that will happen, but they are a contract manufacturer suing dp to be able to do just that or get paid

They should push them off the factory roof - Todd Tuckey TNT style

^ .... just kidding, I would never advocate violence against machines. TBL's will most likely being liquidated through a handful of currently unknown distributors. These will be advertised and sold to individuals with cash. So if you expect to buy one, start putting aside money now and save up between $10k to $15k. You will hear about it here with plenty of time, and if you are willing to pay, you will get one imo.

Exactly and sooner than you think, Money is burning a hole in my Bank Waiting

who handles this "private" TBL group/thread?

They can’t be liquidated to any distributors. Some particular distributors gets some orders with DP.
If ARA is right but DP insolvent I think the best solution is that distributors that have orders and direct buyers to DP find an agreement with ARA.
everything must be done so that those who have paid receive their game

One of the many reasons my "heart is gray". Never again.

But therein lies the problem.

There are 2 parties financially exposed right now on this deal and 1 party is GREATLY more exposed than the other and only one of whom is actually attempting to pursue the debtor legally at this point in time.

Party 1 is the individual buyer who is exposed to the tune of $8000 each and sitting on their hands with hopes and prayers of a future for this game. Party 2 is ARA who heavily invested in time, resources and materials to build many machines and have yet to be paid. They are likely exposed well into the hundreds of thousands of dollars. The current legal proceedings are between ARA and DP. ARA is owed a ton of money and likely has a slam dunk open and shut case. Howver DP has no money so the only resolution to the inevitable judgement against DP is to liquidate the existing boxed up games with all proceeds going to ARA.

Giving those games to the "rightful owners" does nothing to solve the actual case at hand. Until the Early Acheivers step up and go after DP themselves, they have nothing to gain and stand no chance (ok, maybe a tiny chance?) of a positive outcome on this situation unless somehow miraculously whatever deal can be reached between ARA and DP allows for production to start up again, albeit very unlikely.

Early Achievers are collateral damage in this situation.

That a perfect summary of the situation. DP clients can turn to DP for a claim, but ARA has no relation to DP's clients and would most likely sell their machines for money to cover their losses instead of delivering them for free to pre paid clients of DP

So do you agree with that?

Yeah, the thoughts that ARA would ‘give’ the built TBLs to an EA are just phantasy. Will never happen. In case ARA gets the right to sell them (don’t forget not only UA has something to say on this but the software to run a TBL is IP from DP !) they will sell them, not give them away.

EA has a claim to DP, not ARA.

By the way, This has been covered several times already. Guess this helps to pass time

In any case the situation really sucks. I really love playing that game, and would kill to have one at home. Throwing coins in it just to hear "give me the fuckin' money" was already enough to throw coins in it !

You mean ARA has not received a single euro/dollar from DP?
What/who is IP?

I think this is a very slippery slope. What if new manufactures request a private forum and they start ripping people off but nobody has any visibility of it?

He’s saying that while Ara built the games... the software is still the intellectual property of dp.

But what would a bankrupt company do to fight it ? And I think there is something about them being finished goods being taken in ownership that would allow them to liquidate them.

This has been my idea from the start.

Why would ARA take DP to court now? No money to be had after all. But if this would prevent DP from starting up production and raising money and thus causing their bankruptcy this might free ARA’s hands to resell the parts and finished goods they have and no worries on Intelectual Property from UA or DP.

But this old wine in new bags. Back to the private forum

You guys are just jealous. This club is not exclusive though, my membership is fully transferable for the right price.

As an added bonus, by purchasing my spot, you are welcome to plant your boot firmly on my ass and kick me out once you are in!!

Can someone recap the approx money at risk by class? Something along the lines of

180 paid in full to DP ~ 8.5k
50 refundable deposits @ Distributors ~ $1k

I am trying to put the general malaise into perspective. If 180 people in a niche industry lost $8.5k, that is a big impact on the market. Maybe 90 of that class are on Pinside and they should meet and connect with the other 90 folks to discuss how to better their situation. The rest of Pinside who follow this thread have no skin in the game. Many of us here have strong opinions about past events and also wish to see games made and EA’s to get what they paid. But the bubble has burst, that time has passed and things are FU@KED!! The 40 boxed TBL will be sold and I blame Dutch nihilists

about 180 paid in full ($8500) to DP. Rest have a refundable 1k deposit with a distributor.

I've still got a $1,000 refundable deposit with Tommy from Nitro.

QSS

Pinball News included this in the most recent newsletter, "There is some news regarding Dutch Pinball, but due to the personal nature of this news, I'll let Dutch Pinball go public first whenever they feel the need to do so." Hard to imagine it's good news.

Jaap is in the hospital undergoing treatment for an illness. I am pretty sure that is what they are referring to.

I too find it a puzzling newsletter. If you think it is of personal nature why mention it at all??

Anyway, it must refer to the illness of Jaap. He has recently be diagnosed unfortunately with throatcancer and undergoing chemo therapy and radiation therapy. It’s serious and makes realize what’s most important in life and it ain’t pinball

Hoping for a speedy and full recovery!

Damn!!! Get well Jaap.

QSS

Something every dude needs! Although still only in pre-order....

Link

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This "Dude" just needs his damn TBL. (argh!)

What you need is a TBL on free play and a magic carpet to take you there...

Thanks Kim...

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