Quoted from spfxted:

There are The Beatles......and then....
...all other bands...

Quoted from RonSS:

I'm one of those people. I don't get it, but then again, I'm not a teenaged girl from the 60s...
I certainly respect them, they just don't get my heart pumping or elicit strong emotions from me. I'd guess the pin wouldn't either in terms of audio/visual.
Glad it's there for you guys and gals though..

Quoted from TheLaw:

We get it, you're super old; congrats on still being alive.
I'll give McCarteny Eleanor Rigby, and of course half of Day in the Life.
SGT peppers aint bad and that's one I hadn't accounted for, and I'll throw in little help from friends.
The rest of everything he's ever made is just blah, meh, or whatever boring word you wan't to use. So 4.5 out on that many albums... I think Harrison has more; And of course Lennon is a master, no argument there.

Quoted from John_I:

Pinside is its usual predictable self. LOL at least I am getting used to it.
What we knew a week ago:
- Beatles pinball is coming from Kapow and built by Stern
- It's a boutique game, limited release, not taking the place of a Stern cornerstone game
- It's going to be expensive and aimed at rich old Beatles collectors
- It's not going to have a coin door or be allowed on location
- It will have campy 60's artwork
- It will be a Gomez re-skinned Sea Witch with a spinning disk added
- If you don't like classic early SS games, you won't suddenly like this one
- It is not targeted at the Pinside or Expo crowd
- The usual haters on Pinside are tripping over each other dog piling on every aspect of this game.
- Stern doesn't care about what people on Pinside say about this game. The Munsters is for them.
What we know now:
- Beatles pinball is coming from Kapow and built by Stern
- It's a boutique game, limited release, not taking the place of a Stern cornerstone game
- It's going to be expensive and aimed at rich old Beatles collectors
- It's not going to have a coin door or be allowed on location
- It will have campy 60's artwork
- It will be a Gomez re-skinned Sea Witch with a spinning disk added
- If you don't like classic early SS games, you won't suddenly like this one
- It is not targeted at the Pinside or Expo crowd
- The usual haters on Pinside are tripping over each other dog piling on every aspect of this game.
- Stern doesn't care about what people on Pinside say about this game. The Munsters is for them.

Quoted from benheck:

We've all agreed that pinball is gonna hit a wall when all the current collectors retire and move to Florida. This pin targets the retired people. Do they even buy stuff? Traditional marketing says no.

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

True!
I'll just point out one more time that like many, many things about this game we don't actually know what songs will be in the game. Iron Maiden has 6 song modes but another 6 or so songs in the game that aren't written on the playfield.

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

True!
I'll just point out one more time that like many, many things about this game we don't actually know what songs will be in the game. Iron Maiden has 6 song modes but another 6 or so songs in the game that aren't written on the playfield.

Quoted from vid1900:

Sometimes they would record the "same song" but with totally different meanings.
Pleasant Valley Sunday and Penny Lane came out at the same time and are both the same theme; observations about the simple town around them.
While the Beatles are idealistic, the Monkees are cynical under a saccharine sweet glaze.

Quoted from sven:

I'm 40 and I listened quite a lot to the Beatles a period when I was a teenager. And I know a guy who's still in his twenties who really loves all sorts of music, and Beatles is quite on top of his 'classics'-list.

Quoted from InfiniteLives:

would you be shocked to find stern didnt pay for those songs?

Quoted from CrazyLevi:

That’s not fair dude! You know Ozzy is a huge Beatles fan. So are tons of metal heads. I love the Beatles bro.
Anybody who says the Beatles aren’t loved by a broad swath of music fans demographically is either trolling or ignorant.

Quoted from vid1900:

Very idealistic.
A mere 10 years latter and the kids would be singing "God save The Queen, she ain't no human being"[quoted image]

Quoted from vid1900:

How about a Beatles toilet seat for $79 ?[quoted image][quoted image]

Quoted from gdonovan:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_on_One_(tour)
Lets go back to my original question- How popular is The Beatles outside of the US and UK?

Quoted from gdonovan:Your kidding right? Mustang are WILDLY popular cars, Ford has had them in continuous production since 1964.
You can actually buy brand new reproduction 1960's body shells
https://www.cjponyparts.com/mustang-body-shells-frame-assemblies/c/60020480/?msclkid=e302af15ba8913f55853f4f55c6f7d80&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Sheet%20Metal&utm_term=new%20mustang%20body%20shell&utm_content=Mustang%20Body%20Shells
Matter of fact if you wanted too, you could build a brand new 1968 Mustang without a single used part if so inclined.

Quoted from gdonovan:

I'm not a Ford guy and I know about Mustangs and their history. They most certainly were sold outside of the US at launch in 1964 (For example they could not use the name Mustang in Germany in 1964 as it was owned by Krupp and Ford refused to buy the rights for it so called the cars T5 instead)
Ford sold more Mustangs in 2016 in Germany than Porsche had sales there in 2016.
Maybe Mustang owners have little interest in being pin owners.
The fact a company spent millions upon millions of dollars tooling up to stamp out new 60's bodies should give you some idea how ridiculously popular and deep pockected some Mustang owners are.

Quoted from Psw757:The podcast with Joe AND Gary answer all these questions except price.
9 songs now maybe more and they aren’t short 30 second clips.
There WILL be a coin door
Ship in the next 2 weeks - already in production.
Claims to have best video content to date
At least 2 different multiballs
Deep enough that it has a wizard mode were Joes exact words.

Quoted from Whysnow:

I like the look.
If ANY distributor is reading and has one for normal SternPRO pricing then I am interested. I know rumors are 7k plus, but rumors are also that distributors buying a 10 pack are able to set any pricing structure they want. I foresee that there are big spenders willing to pay high dollar for the Diamond and PLatinum, but good shot that golds will be sitting at the current asking prices. If you want to reach out, you know how to find me. Willing to sign NDA and not disclose price or your info so nobody gets in trouble with big papa.
I have games for possible trade or straight cash.

Quoted from Whysnow:

In case anyone buying a Beatles is looking to sell a junior version...
Machine - Wanted
Wanted: Seawitch (a.k.a. Beatles junior)New!Wanted! “Title says it all

I can't afford a Beatles, but thought someone may be looking to sell a Seawitch in order to make room for their new game.

Looking for 100% playing and averag...”
3 hours ago Madison, WI
Wanted
Whysnow

Quoted from jasonp:

West Long Branch, NJ – Nearly five decades after they broke up, the Beatles are the clear leader when Americans name the greatest rock and roll band of all time. The Monmouth University Poll finds that fully 86% of U.S. adults like the Beatles while only 8% dislike them.
Read the rest here https://www.monmouth.edu/polling-institute/reports/monmouthpoll_us_110818/
I guess this settles it..............

Quoted from JodyG:

Can someone give me a tl;dr here?

Quoted from Whysnow:

100% will be more profitable.
3000 for a NICE seawitch. Set it at .50 per play. Lets imagine it gets 100 plays a month for easy math. $50 a month and will do that every month for the next 12 months. $600 a year. At the end of the year Seawitch is still worth 3000 resale (likely more based on current trends). 20% return on the money.
Beatles is 8000. Set it at $1 per play. Lets imagine it gets 1.5 the plays for the first 3 months, so $150 a month. Then is will drop to $120 a month or morely likely $100-120, so say $1600 in coin a year. At the end of the year that Beatles is worth 6500-7000 resale. Sell it and you made $100-600. Even is you imagine it sells for more after a year or does spectacular... you are looking at 6-12% return.
The math works out in favor of the Seawitch and if I ma being honest, experience shows the Seawitch will do better than my estimate and be worth more than what you bought it a year later.

Quoted from Whysnow:

I had similar thoughts. Tried to see if I could convince myself on it.
In general, I will make a trip to play one on route (possibly the one at Tilt in Minn?) but I dont think this is anywhere near the value at 8k for home use.
I also was evaluating for route and I dont think this will do well on route because it is a tough game. Given the pricepoint it will need to be at same coin drop price as any other new game ($1 or more in most cases) and the general route player is not going to get the value for the buck. As a route player, I would spend time on pretty much every other game that is $1/play after the pinhead novelty wears off from the first session.
I would be better off buying a Seawitch and pricing it at .50 per play for route.

Quoted from Whysnow:

Not my experience at all for jjp games. Maybe we got lucky? Maybe we are awesme techs, lol. Jjp games are built well and hold up ime. Few small things but nothin the scale of others.
Biggest headache to date on any NIB game was GOTG pro, shit code combined with corrupt node board and super bad customer service to get the node boards all figured out over multiple months. Had stern service rep end a call whileI was actively working on the game and giving feedback, measurements to help them diagnose a larger scale problem. It was 5pm and his day was over... finally got it figured out but went thorugh multiple node boards and months of an intermittently broken game. Uggh that was frustrating.
But i degress. Concerning beatles, yes the pricepoint just won't work out for me on route. Bummer cause I wish it could. Pro price and I am on board, but Won't fall for this psycology trick to try and get peopleto buy a pro at premium pricepoint just for the fun of it.

Quoted from snaroff:

Just today, I tweaked my captive balls for the 5th time.

Quoted from TheLaw:The music IS horrible....buuuuut Can;t imagine 65 beatles is much better

Quoted from PinMonk:

They shot their wad with diamonds and platinums on the first batch they ran. The remaining half will be golds with a smattering of platinums - there's no reason for distributors to buy 10 at a time to get a diamond and two platinums because that won't be available on the second half unless Stern expands the amount of diamonds available and ups the platinums, too. So it seems like the second run (IF it happens) will have a much harder row to hoe than even the first one which should have been gangbusters but is languishing based on the sale ads here and super-slow beatles store sales (2 in the last almost 4 weeks, after the initial 10 sold).

Quoted from Whysnow:

sure thing. You have 8k to give me for the Beatles?
Seawitch enters the stable this week and will be route ready as soon as you hook me up with that 8000...

People dont seem to understand that for 8k, I can buy a brand new munsters and refurbish a Seawitch.
Munsters and seawitch will for sure out earn Beatles.
Bonus that at the end of routing, the Munsters will be worth nearly what I buy it for and the Seawitch will be worth more.
Beatles on the other hand will drop 15-20% for resale.

Quoted from Whysnow:

If you pay attention, you will see that Stern Whysnow is constantly telling half truths and inflating numbers.

Quoted from TheLaw:

Honestly, are you fucking drunk?

Ok that's it, if that isn't a personal attack I don't know what is; I need a mod over here right stat now!

Quoted from rockfantasyman:

I have the Beatlemania in shop now at Rock Fantasy if anyone wants to give it a spin ! its earning well I got the one that Jack used to stream on Friday in NYC . I LOVE IT ! most everyone who played it enjoyed it a lot

Quoted from Whysnow:

Munsters is likely to earn as well as Beatles (or very close)...and will resale with likley no loss

Quoted from Whysnow:

Sweet!
If they end up not doing great after a while and you want to move one along for another operator, im your huckleberry
Your locals are damn lucky!

Quoted from Whysnow:

depends on the type of people there but i would guess it is more casuals. In that case, theme wins.

Quoted from Whysnow:

very true.
I just want more pinball, so I think everyone shoudl buy a beatles and route it
Esp someone close to me so I can come play it!

Quoted from Whysnow:

I think my work here is done ...
[quoted image]

Quoted from Whysnow:

WARNING, tldr

my source is the same as ASOA... you just pull a WAG and post it up.
However, my WAG actually:
1. looks at the numbers claimed to be sold by distributors with us all knowing that many of them flat out lie to push sales and then looking at all the other information out there. Watching the behaviors over the past few months of these salesmen has been telling in its self as some become desperate to sell stock.
2. Takes everything that the sales team at Stern says with a grain of salt. It is their job to sell and they have been shown time and time again to lie (call it half truths if that makes you feel better, but they spew BS much of the time > not personal as it is just their jobs). Watch their decisions to delay MUN post holiday in an effort to push Beatles.
3. look at the number recorded on public sites and correlate that with other games and numbers after a similar amount of time.
4. watch the hype here on the #1 collector site anywhere. Hype is all but dead here aside from a handful of owners (rightfully excited as the game is fun) and the various distributors (both ones that are open about being distributors and the few that post anonymously here but are in fact sellers/resellers)
5. Call around and talk to distributors. They all have them for sale, they still have them for sale, and the prices have dropped. You dont drop a price in order to sell an item that is supposedly flying off the shelves.
It really does not take much common sense to come to this accurate conclusion. If these golds are selling like gangbusters, where the hell have they gone to, lol. Some mysterious pool of NIB pinball buyers?
ASOA's WAG is that he is a distributor without bias... Keep in mind he wont tell us any actual data like how many he bought, how many he has sold, what prices he sold his diamond and platinums for and now what the golds are selling/ not-selling for.

I actually love the Beatles. I think the game is super fun (I played the 2 they had in Chicago). I think the theme is great also (finally a band theme I like).
Dont misinterpret my despise for distributors on a collectors forum spewing BS and false hype as hate for the game or them personally. I just think it is important that there is a voice of reality to counter the salesman pitches from some on here with the constant hype train.
Passion for the hobby is not hate. I dont want to see any of my fellow hobbyists fall for the fake hype. Beatles is a fun game, but priced much too high and the sales mirror that conclusion.
A little reality for you on what numbers are public
https://pinside.com/pinball/machine/stern-the-beatles/owners
58 Golds can be accounted for (both private and public).
Most will accept that Pinside represents 30-50% of the public pinball collector world in numbers of games. PInside seems to be more heavily US/ NA based in users, but still useful.
You can of course cross reference with pinball owners which tends to be more overseas and find 5 gold owners.
Some may say that Pinside is a small percentage. Reality is that public locations are well accounted for here and on pinball map (total of 49)
For a small comparative, go look at WWE which is well accepted as being the worst selling modern Stern. There are 76 locations (pinball map) and 33 private owners. That means WWE is 2x the seller that Beatles currently is. Distributors will argue that WWE has been out longer, but we all know that the majority of game sales for any title happen in the first bolus in the first month prior and month post release. We are 5! months post announcement and 3 months post sales. Ample time for them to get out there.
need another comparison? How about Mustang, the widely accepted 2nd worse selling modern Stern. 100 locations and 83 owners.
Just stop buying into the false distributor hype on this title.
The clear reality is that the game was overpriced and the sales reflect it. This went over like a lead balloon and keep your eyes wide open when someone in sales tells you they are not biased (lol)
Own the game already?, GREAT! have me over to play. The thing is a blast IMHO!
Thinking of buying the game? awesome! just please understand the difference of salesguy hype and the reality of how many are sitting in back stock.
I believe that Stern "sold out" for the first run to distributors. They marketed this great by forcing distributors to buy a 10 pack to get in on the first run. Sold them on the hype and many distros cashed in big on the Diamond and platinum sales.
I believe that Stern is running some more in Jan because there are surely some distributors with customers that want this game and those distributors did not buy in for the first run for the 10 pack.
The reality is that Stern sells on hype to distributors and they in turn sell on hype.
Stern does not care if distributors are stuck with stock on a 10 pack and that shows as they run more games for new distro orders instead of telling Distros to sell their back stock to each other.

Quoted from jfh:I can’t imagine Stern would ever allow a MAP reduction. Maybe “buy a gold and get $2k off another title”. Game play is surprisingly fun but the art package and animations remind me of a Saturday morning cartoon.
Hilton’s WAG above is reasonable and thought out. I have talked to a number of collectors I know where money is generally not an issue and that I expected would be in the target market including one Beatles super fan. Not one of them has played the game and they all said some variation of “it’s priced too high for what it is”.
I think Stern knew these were going to be a tough sell when they came up with the 10 pack distributor idea which essentially incentivized dealers to buy more golds than they otherwise would have been interested in.
The Beatles situation is sad because it may hamper further retro redesigns using the excuse they don’t sell well while not admitting that the failure was due to the pricing model and not the game itself.

Quoted from Whysnow:

I dont know much...

Quoted from Whysnow:

If you wanna help us. Then give us some comparative numbers for time and sales of other games! You are one of the biggest sellers around and this seems like a really long time for you have sold so few games.

Quoted from hassellcastle:

Keep it up Hilton.
The constant jabs at everything I post are really getting old and just further shows you to be a troll.
I’ve had you blocked but, it’s ironic after every post I make I can see a blocked post moments later.
Are you coming to TPF? Man I hope so. I can’t wait to meet you in person. Can’t hide behind a keyboard in Texas.