It would be as if Levi came in here and suddenly announced his total disdain for Stern, Ka-Pow, and the overpriced Beatles abomination.....

Alternate universes, baby!

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The thing is as well, when threads like this blow up with outrage, and all of Pinside is smeared as a cancer or whatever, the reality is its just a handful of people. Very small percentage of the daily regular users.

50 downvotes = 1/10th of 1% of Pinside daily users (5000).

Obviously things are seen disproportionately, but that is true of the internet and the state of things.

You are too positive for this negative crowd

It has changed one persons opinion and I personally am pretty disappointed in ICEMAN. I thought he was going to stand his ground on being against this money grab BS and constant schilling by distributors on here about how hype every game is, how 2000 is limited, and how you 'better buy now or miss out'.

Sad to see but it appears he got sold on the "it will only cost you a grand for the fun once you resell the game". It is like the crack dealer just continuing to badger the addict till they cave and buy another game form them. They laugh at how easy it was to make another $1500 of their loyal customer and then repeat it all over again while the customer tosses away another grand once they sell.

I guess take note for all the schill distributors, that seems to be a good line to use on your bank rolled customers that are a bit tentative as prices continue to rise on Stern reskins and pro models now selling for 8k.

I truly hope you enjoy your game Iceman and I love you brother, but still sad to see the flip flop on the principle of not buying into the cash grab and then changing so dramatically before even playing for yourself. Game looks fun so I am sure you will dig it, but man... 8k for that is just sad IMHO.

Stern has obviously still not found the top of the pile.

Seems like every company should adopt this model. If I were charlie, I think you seriously have to consider making 50 "unobtanium editions" of your next title and selling them direct to customer for 25k. Slap on some different trim, put on all the options (no need for the shaker apparently though), and upcharge all for the perception.

Think about it as the way to then fund your next big license.

I know this is a Beatles thread, but I will say just 2 things about Maiden.

I think there is actually lots of humour in it. The call outs are actually some of the funniest in modern pinball.

As far as the music... no argument. I got bored of the Maiden very quickly.

Mine now plays Tom Petty, The Who, Queen, Bowie, Danny Michel, Rush etc etc.

It’s DEAD easy to replace music with Pinball Browser. My MET plays Kendrick Lamar, Nikki Manaj, Migos etc etc.

That program is one step away from drag and drop. I simply don’t get this complaint.

Back to Beatles.

Pin looks great. Looks really fun. Looks better than initial images. Value assessment is bizarre.

Have we learned anything?! Probably not.

Disappointed in Iceman, lol. Were you 2 going to stand together and change the world. You really need to stop calling others a schill with some of the crap you have pulled over the years.

A man on an island is truly a lonely man

Also it's "shill." You should know that if you are going to accuse every single member of Pinside of doing it, all the time, while constantly having to defend yourself of the same charges (ie: Alien, Spooky et al)

I don't see the difference between "tossing away another grand" when buying an IMDN Premium or this Beatles pin. In IMDN's case, Stern gets a premium price for half-baked features that customers struggle to dial in (and add little to the gameplay).

I'm not happy with the 8k price for Beatles Gold, but I think it's a really cool design point (modernize an 80's design and couple it with a timeless license). I also think it's interesting that all 3 versions have exactly the same mechs and gameplay. I prefer this "model", since asking game designers to squeeze in new features doesn't always end well for customers. AS, MET, KISS, and IMDN have one thing in common...the "Premiums" are less-than-great. AC/DC is a notable exception...thanks to SR

snaroff

lol...

you do realize that to be a schill you need to actually gain some benefit from doing so. e.g. these distributors on here hyping are making big bucks on this Beatles schilling. Each one sold is likely netting them $1500+

What is it with this "Schilling" nonsense?

You a big red sox fan?

shill
/SHil/
informal•North American
noun
noun: shill; plural noun: shills

1.
an accomplice of a hawker, gambler, or swindler who acts as an enthusiastic customer to entice or encourage others.
a person who pretends to give an impartial endorsement of something in which they themselves have an interest.
"a megamillionaire who makes more money as a shill for corporate products than he does for playing basketball"

verb
verb: shill; 3rd person present: shills; past tense: shilled; past participle: shilled; gerund or present participle: shilling

1.
act or work as a shill.

You mean like getting early games and pumping things to no end. With holding information about games that would be taken negatively. Convincing people to put money on games that are dead in the water. Seems pretty shilly to me.

Distros sell games, that how the make money genius.

not sure where you are getting your info?

Any games I got early are because I bought and paid for them before others.
I never withhold anything from anyone. When a game sucks I am happy to say so
I never actively hunt out sales for any game and ask people to put money down.

I think you have a tough time deciphering a fan being excited about a game (e.g. Iceman hyped on a new title) vs a shill (you happy levi; I spelled it right for you) e.g. all the Stern distributors that are hyping games and in some cases even telling flat out lies to sell games and convince people to put down $$$$$

What's the craziest part to me is that I believe that you actually believe what you are saying is true.

I think it was listing every beatles song that got you the downvotes.

Huh? Looks pretty much the same to me. I think it's more a case of some people have zero imagination and assume something will suck until they see it in action. No imagination + pessimism = loudmouthed hater.

Look, I understand Why snow is upset. It sucks to be abandoned in a crusade.

Where would Thelma have been without Louise?

Or Sigfried without Roy?

Or Alvin without G?

When a great partnership dissolves, it sucks. I too am surprised by Iceman's betrayal, but it really was never about the partnership.

it was about the game! Iceman changed his mind but Hilton shouldn't take it personally. There's still others who hate the Beatles, even if they aren't quite as passionate. You'll find a NEW Iceman, Hilton! Just stay the course and stick to your guns.

You're a scrappy operator counting every dollar. He's a collector looking to spend his dollars to have fun. Different equation when you turn your hobby into a jobby.

But the operator equation isn't really that different, is it? He can route a game like Beatles and sell it in two years for close to what he paid for it.

I'm not overly surprised by Ice changing his mind.
The main issues with the game are it looks like shit, and it's expensive (or at least I think that's what it was) . Well ice isn't short of monies and plenty of games aren't the best looking; so after simmering down it just sort of becomes another game.

Shh... if you bring logic into this, distributors will stop selling $8k games to Hilton for $6k based solely on his impassioned accusations of money grabbing.

Boom! Coindoor!

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Okay! I'll shut up about it.

Still don't want one....

Oh yeah, that's just what Stern WANTS you to think.

how do we know the game comes with working coin mechs?!

lol.

I put games on route for fun and those are a small fraction of my collection. I buy games for me and to have fun. This is all just part of the hobby.

My equation is the same as ICE. He just has way more cash than I do. Buying a game for me or to share on route is the same equation. Needs to be fun, something I will enjoy, and make sense for my finances.

The only difference for route is a little more leeway to buy a game that costs more then I normally would personally pay since it will eventually earn back some of the cost for my sweat equity of maintaining it.

I like the Beatles and it looks fun. I personally cant afford 8k for a gold that i think will take a 1500 drop on the secondary (if I ever sold, which I very rarely do). For route, i don't see it making any more than any other game (I actually think it will drop very quickly on route and dont see it as something players will gravitate to) so why pay 8k for a Beatles when I could spend that on a known fun earner like a remake or much less for a different Stern pro? other flip side is for similar money I could buy a JJPPOTC for route and I personally would always rather spend route dollars supporting some new innovation and those that are developing that innovation. I think JJPPOTC could do just as well as Beatles and likely be a long term route earner (like Woz and DI have proven to be)

I would be more concerned with working code to accept coins

Is there a photo of how it shows all 4 scores?

Do you REALLY believe that?

What was the last Stern game to take a $1500 drop? WWELE? Xmen LE?

It's extremely uncommon. These games are not going to be trading at 6500 in a year. No freakin' way.

In the end, it will turn out to be a sought after collectable. I doubt they depreciate much, if at all.

Killer, eh? You can actually easily read all 4 scores! And they said it couldn't be done.

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Thanks!

A small nitpick from me - going with the "simulated EM reels," I think they should have laid off the score inflation. Make it 6 digit scoring instead of 8. Coming from an EM guy, All those zeros looks funny.

Door decal in goodie bag?

That's exactly why it's not the same equation. I have a few acquaintances with significantly more money than average. Here's one thing they all have in common, without exception: when they're on the clock, they will scratch & claw to save a nickel. When they're off the clock, and this is especially true on vacation, they will light fire to cash in ways that make me ashamed to live in a first-world country. Their "work hark, play hard" mentality extends to "earn hard, burn hard."

Make a couple million bucks and you'll actually relish completely blowing some of it from time to time. I do not speak from experience.

Hmmm ... look familiar?

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Yeah, I see a PRO with over 1600 games made (a lot for most Sterns) but at LE price point.

I think 6500 is a likely drop point on the secondary market IF they really sell all 1600 golds. I personally still think there is a distinct possibility that they will only build 700 golds and the second run does not happen or happens in a small number to just meet distributor demand.

Beatles is the topic of the now, but like everything else it will be largely forgotten when the next batch of titles come out. I see much less discussion on Beatles than would be expected/compared to other new releases also. Lastly, I see plenty of golds available for sale still. This title is not as hot as many would like you to believe.

IF they sell to the home Beatles collector for 8k, then there will be plenty available on the secondary in a couple years.

20% drop is the new norm on new removed from box/lightly used high dollar games.

I really think many here are under estimating where these games are going outside the pinball world. And remember 1600 games is a drop in the bucket compared to the usual production amount for a cornerstone game. Pinside is what, 30% of the pinball community as is repeatedly said on here.

I had a discussion with a distributor who told me he is fielding calls from casinos and other types of establishments wanting one of these.

I’m buying one and plan on keeping it for a long time. Do I expect it to go up in value? No, but it really wouldn’t surprise me if it did and I can’t say I’ve thought this about any other machine.

Well Levi, I was going to tell you that Stern started the 7-digit scoring with Big Game and carried on through to Seawitch that also has 7-digit scoring. So, why not just make Beatles 7-digit scoring like Seawitch?

But you got me to thinking about something I never really paid attention to. I turned on all my 7-digit Sterns and, lo and behold, the units digit never comes off of zero. You can have scores such as 10,20, 30, ect. But you will never have scores like 11,21,31, or 43 or 75, etc.

So, in reality, Seawitch is a 6-digit pin. I suppose Beatles could drop the units digit ( your pic shows all scores with zero in the units position) and turn into a 7-digit pin. But in this day and age, no one does anything with pennies except toss them into a jar. So, a 6-digit pin sounds reasonable.

I had an EM Sonic Cherry Bell with 6-digit scoring. However, the units and tens digits were static. And while you might have thought your score was 999,900, they reality is the score reel was a 4-wheel assembly so your real, reel score was 9,999.

Stacking the score with static zeros a waste.

Nice observation, Levi.

I WANT MOREEE FLOATING HEADSS

I keep reading all you write and I don't read much about you not liking the pin. Rather, you lean to the issue of pricing and how everybody is getting bent over with Stern's pricing. But Stern is pricing for all it can get; Stern does not owe me a living, or a pinball machine, so I get the pricing. That's business.

Stern is looking for the early adopters. The ones with money. The ones with money to burn. The ones who have to have the newest. Or the latest. Or the units where only 10 were made in the color of red. Gauging the motivations, or I.Q.s, of the early adopters could turn into a long discussion.

Stern is looking for those buyers who bought the first ball point pens in the 1945 and paid $12.50 per pen for the privilege. At today's prices that $12.50 pen would cost around $170.00 !

After the early adopters are satisfied, prices may soften and we can pick over the scraps. That is capitalism.

And it has been my experience that those who are focused on the price are the ones who want it the most.

Right. Except for a couple oddball woodrails, EM reels maxed out at 6 in the 1970s. So an 8-reel simulated EM scoring is kind of funky.

this game will have it all on the display!

lcd graphics check

simulated em score reels check

simulated dmd menu system check

People said the same about KaPows first title BM66 upon its reveal and release, reality is you can’t pick up an LE or SLE now for less than the cost of it NIB, in most cases LEs and SLEs that have been put up for sale have sold for more than there original NIB cost.

No way Beatles drops much if at all, unless people hate it which doesn’t appear to be the case now people are playing one.

Has spike2 been cracked? Wondering about possibility of swapping in some of Beatles later tunes for current mix in Beatles pin. Would also be handy for those Beatles fans wanting some variety. This option might also be impacted given short, irregular song lengths already announced.

yes, be we are not talking about a LE or SLE here... We are talking about a pro model with over 1600 of them to be made.

I am not sure how I would really like the pin till I actually play one. I like the theme, I like the beatles, the art falls in the good enough department, and this is the first music theme Stern game where I even listen to the band.

How it shoots will be big and the intergration of the spinning disk could go either way from what I have seen thus far.

You are 100% spot on that price is the issue. Stern can and should make money, but making money and greed are 2 very different things IMHO. This is a cash crab and they have surely not found the top.

Even if they needed to add on a grand for the Beatles license (hint: they did not but they will claim they did) then I could possible talk myself into it. At $2500 up tick for a baseline pro model, my money will stay put.

Kind of hard to tell from the video we’ve seen so far but I think the songs are longer than many here are expecting.

Saw over 100 new posts after a game was shown at a show.... came fhere for the news...

And all I got was the same old whysnow/iceman shitshow. Thanks pinside. You can do better

Beatles store has cracked into their second 10-pack.