Looking forward to seeing how functional that left spinner will be. I do like the idea of an extra spinner, but seems like a gamble. For example, does that spinner interfere with the action of the left most pop bumper? It also looks like the edge of the spinner could get smashed / nicked while it's spinning (if pop bumper sends the ball right back into it while spinning). Might be worth putting some mylar down under that spinner?

Fathom makes you drop in order to light extra ball it adds so much fun cause when you f up you need to quickly get them down to try again. Ball times are not super long , at least for me

Yes, all of those items will ad to the game satisfaction scale. One new mechanical difference between the two pins is the way the ball launches. With The Beatles there is a launch ramp that shoots the ball into the orbit in counter-clockwise rotation. With Seawitch, there is a flexible metal flap one-way gate that the ball pushes thru on launch and the metal flap gate closes behind the ball and closes the orbit so the ball cannot return to the shooter (this is not the one-way wire gate you see on The Beatles for the skill shot).

The problem with the flap-gate is if you hit a clockwise orbit shot with either the right hand upper of right hand lower flipper, when that shot comes around clockwise it hits the flap gate which flexes with the ball weight. This flex upsets the trajectory of the ball towards the upper right hand flipper and with your next shot.

The next shot: If you are extremely good or extremely lucky, you can get a double-clockwise-orbit shot. Seawitch, with that flexible gate does not give double-clockwise-orbit shots easily. In all of the games I played, I have probably achieved 7 or 8 double-clockwise-orbit shots. There was one time I got 2 1/2 orbit shots.
+++++++++++++++++
I was listening to that Ka-Pow interview where he said the magnet up top was added to prevent endless loops (orbits). Now, maybe, when these guys were working on the prototype with the new launch ramp and no flap gate, shooting endless clockwise orbit shots with the upper right flipper might have been a happening thing for them. But no way would that happen with a Seawitch, so my thinking is no way was that magnet added to prevent endless loops; That magnet has some other purpose.
++++++++++++

I am wanting to do a modification to my Seawitch. I want to add that launch ramp and get rid of the flex gate and see if endless loops can be made possible.

I found out I live about 5 miles from a Stern distributor and this shop in on my go to see lest for today.

bad news guys.. my mom isnt going to buy one.

The geometry of the upper loop seems to be slightly modified from Seawitch perhaps enabling clockwise looping from the upper right flipper which is nearly impossible on Seawitch.

Oh yeah, it is different. If you look at the overhead pic of Beatles that geometry of the loop is setting up perfectly for placing the ball at optimum setup for the upper right flipper.

I know that the drop target discussion is SOOO sixty minutes ago....but Big Hurt has controlled drop targets with fun rules for them.

Raven has controlled drop targets as well. Think about that. Controlled drop targets on a crappy 80's game.

Meteor 1979 had computer controlled drops, it ain't rocket science

So did Fast Draw in 1975. Well, not computer controlled obviously, but the ability to have the game drop certain drops without the ball hitting them.

Vector isn't a great game, but the way it uses memory controlled drops is.

I head a rumor that their site is run by the same hosting company that does KaPow's

Seriously, I'm sure the game will be sold out long before WOG lists them for sale.

Imagine there's controlled drop banks
It's easy if you try
No ramps above us
This playfield is all kinds of dry

Imagine all the people
A simple layout but willing to pay....yoo whoooo

You may say I'm a dreamer
But the real Seawitch is the only one
Hopefully someday you will join us
And the pinball world will be as one.

(and yes, I know this is solo John sans Beatles)

Looks like their target demographic is choosing MET instead!!!!

Met Granny (resized).jpg

I get the impression things are not selling anywhere as well as you presume. Joe seems to be a bit touchy on the subject all together...

joe statement (resized).JPG

Vector is a great game.

The problem is that if anything is not working, the whole thing falls into the toilet.

It's a good choice for a home game where someone keeps an eye on it; but on route, it just had too much interconnected mechs.

Why would Joe being reactionary about someone insulting his game be any indicator of sales?

They would call this "laughing all the way to the bank".... I'd think....

When it is selling well then people tend to not be so defensive.

Reality is that original comment was not insulting his game very hard. Just a fact someone made (Beatles is factually a reskin of an old game with a spinning disk mech borrowed from earlier games and Beatles art) and their desire to see Munsters. It was not like the poster was going out and putting it on his timeline, but rather that Joe is defensive enough to go find the post in a pinball group and reply.

May be best for him to turn off social media for a few weeks post release as that wont earn any fanfare.

Joe should have just stuck to teasing that guy for wanting to see Munsters.

Twister has a magnetic disc?

Maybe he is just touchy because people get on his nerves big time.

ST:TNG AND No Fear

Good to see FB has people just mocking and retorting others angrily with disdain, like every other website. I wish my mom had a pin in her basement.

He spent 2 years of his life developing something that everyone said could never be done.

Then instead of being able to enjoy his success, a bunch of pindicks are shitting on him and his hard work.

More likely tired of all the complaints.

Haha! Sales, design, defense or not I love that reply.

“Hey dipshit!!! You suck!! You suck!!!” - for two weeks.

“My, a little touchy, aren’t we?!”

Awwww! When you put it that way....... Poor snowflake.

Of you get shit you talk ass!

With the difference Kaminkow can talk a$$!

But srsly, that pic someone posted there... Why spending your time making this, stating something completely dumb? Beatles does not push Munsters back.

(Bill&Ted is)

We (pinheads) are critical of every new game that comes out; as we should be for any 7200 purchase!
If the game is selling well, then seems silly to be so defensive. Let the product and sales do the talking.

I really dont think it can be construed as shitting on him/his work. He had to know a common critique when you reskin a game and sell it for a huge mark up that these would be just that... it is a largely recycled game sold with a license alone. I dont think he is entitled to be both defensive and greedy. Just does not work well on anyone.

It’s only $7200?

For a game with 4 flippers, spinners, and a shitload of drops?

What’s everybody whining about?

Man, when did WPT get to be a $7200 game?

wpt (resized).jpg

timing was spot on there!!!

LOL!

Overpriced products tend to be criticized on the internet. For good reason.

If you don't want to hear the criticisms, stick to Sterns FB page, where they control reality!

When Stern was about to close down because they didnt make enough money.

I appreciate that in the modern internet and social media era, we are used to having all aspects of pricing and production about some of our favorite products. That being said, I see no obligation on the part of Stern or any distributors to share their costs, pricing decisions or profits with the consumers.

If you can find a good deal, by all means, take advantage of it.

I have zero interest in owning one of these. I'd probably walk by one on location and drop quarters in something a bit more robust.

However-

The level of vitriol over this title is getting a bit ridiculous. If it isn't for you, fine. They will sell out in a reasonable amount of time. The Beatles package may not be of interest due to theme or color choices. But at the end of the day, the art is of consistent quality. You can read the fonts. The LCD display art looks clear and professional. You can figure out where to shoot the ball easily. You can walk up to the machine and play it without reading a 1000 page manual on gameplay. Games are on the line and being built within 2 weeks of us seeing the initial pictures. No year long wait for delivery. No preorder money up front. Nobody here was tricked out of any money. Stern has producing games down to a science, and people still piss and moan incessantly. Some of you complain like it is your full time job on here...and I just don't get it. This is a damn hobby where we play with expensive toys for fun. No wonder any person of any stature in the pinball industry avoids contact with pinheads in the mainstream social media environment.

It took 2 years to come up with that layout, mostly ripped from an existing 30-year old SS game?

At least for me, I've said it's not a game I'm interested in (especially at the stated price points for what it offers) and just having some fun. I didn't say it was a total heap of shit. I'll certainly give it a few plays when I see one and see what it's like. I always do on any game. Like every game that's released, there will be high-fives from some, and criticisms by others.

For what we pay for these friggin things and the anticipation when we hear a new title may be coming and the possibilities, everyone is allowed to be either happy, or disappointed. It's like any other product in the world. You certainly can't make EVERYONE happy in business, but some decisions in this hobby from the big dogs do make me scratch my head.

No matter what, the game will sell, regardless of what anybody here or anywhere else says. It's f@#$'in Beatles. Anything Beatles will sell...to somebody. Now back to my mom's pinless basement...

This is how the upper playfield drop targets work in Black Hole.

2,288 posts about 1,964 machines. Can't believe I've read all this crap. And contributed! Ugh.

There are people who post 30+ messages to Pinside EVERY. SINGLE. DAY. and have been doing it for over 5 years.

+1

I cannot wait to play this game.

Finally, a voice of reason! WTH are you doing in here? This is the He Man New Pin Haters Club!

Ok just kidding of course but really my take is...

High priced pin but I think it looks pretty darn fun and cool with the added features. And the Beatles license and collectability is going to add to the value.

I look forward to playing one!

Lets amend that and exclude the guys in the tech forums...some of those guys should be knighted for the level of help they give. But yes, I know who you meant.

Pindicks are always crying like bitches, before they have even played a game.

They are just sad sub-humans with no joy in their lives.

I thought it was a great (and accurate) comeback.

What was the mark up on the game?

I did not see the BOM, licensing and production costs posted. Link?

timing was spot on there!!!

LOL!

Vid, do you mind if I use "Pindick" for the name of a mod I'm working on?

Wow! So you mean 500 witty pinsiders are finally gonna be able to live their dream of "This game better fuck me for that price!!!"

Only if you license it from Python