(Topic ID: 294827)

The 1971 Project : help me get these machines back in shape!

By Gott72

10 days ago


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  • 17 posts
  • 9 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 days ago by Gott72
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Linked Games

  • Astro Gottlieb, 1971
  • Now Gottlieb, 1971

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#1 10 days ago

1971.... what a year.... let's see... there was...

Vietnam, Attica Riots, Apollo missions, "All In The Family" started, Charles Manson found guilty of Murder, Jim Morrison of the Doors died, USA left the gold standard, Walt Disney World opened, D.B. Cooper, ....golly... what a depressing year... BUT, WAIT!

There were some fantastic PINBALL machines launched by Gottlieb! And I have two, in my current possession, that need some serious care.

ASTRO and NOW.

Help me revive them. I'll be posting in this thread, asking questions, posting updates, etc. Hopefully I'll paint the cabinets this summer, Astro has a BGRestro glass on the way, Astro got new plastics today, there are $800 of parts coming from PBResouce, and quite. few concerns to cover.

ASTRO (500 made) has :
• No power switch or plate under the machine
• Permanently locked in a game with FIVE balls to go
• Pop Bumpers won't score
• No CHIMES! despite chimes inside cabinet

NOW (1250 made) has :
• Pop bumpers that won't score, along with possibly other non-scoring parts in the game
• Possible lack of slingshot action (I need to see the game in action and/or buy a schematic)
• Various lights malfunctioning
• No chimes! despite chimes being inside cabinet
• Wrong target faces that won't score when they pop down into the playfield.
• Trajectory problems (mild) in the two kickers down front.

Both will need playfield touchup in the future. ASTRO is beat, NOW is fairly good.

Score reels reset properly. I'll exchange most all plastic parts and rubbers, posts, etc.

Please give me any advice, here, if possible. I never had non-scoring components on the games I have owned.

Thanks!

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#2 10 days ago

My first problem: no switch OR switch plate inside the ASTRO. I can find the switches, but not the metal plate. Does anyone know a place that has these plates? Are they common electrical items from a hardware store, or specific to Gottlieb? Thanks for the help.

First image is from NOW, the second is from ASTRO...

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#3 10 days ago

I suggest that you being by acquiring schematics for the machines, assuming you don't have them.
You can probably download them from the pinball database IPDB.com
It would be better to have paper copies so you can highlight areas that you test that work properly, in the effort to location problem areas.
As far as missing parts, I am not sure exactly where to look.
You might start here: http://www.pbresource.com/index.html
Good luck on that.

#4 10 days ago

Gottlieb usually used two power switch mounting plates per game. Note that the center portion of the plate has been stamped to have a slightly recessed circular area. What GTB would do is to orient the top plate so that the bulging-out side of the recess faced the switch. The nut to hold switch shaft to the plate was then installed to attach the switch to the top plate.

Next, the bottom plate would be oriented so that the bulging-out side of the recess faced away from the switch. The bottom plate rested against the top plate, and the recessed portion of the two plates created a space for the switch mounting nut, while also covering the nut so that it could not be unscrewed from outside the cabinet. This double-plate assembly was then screwed to the inside of the cabinet on the wooden switch block to mount the entire switch assembly to the cabinet bottom.

In short, you may have an "extra" switch mounting plate (the bottom plate) on your NOW game that you can borrow to use on your Astro. If you do this, of course, neither game will have protection against someone unscrewing the switch mounting nut from the outside of the game. Unless you plan on putting these machines on location, hopefully that isn't something you need to be too concerned about.

- TimMe

#5 10 days ago
Quoted from Dent00:

I suggest that you being by acquiring schematics for the machines, assuming you don't have them.
You can probably download them from the pinball database IPDB.com
It would be better to have paper copies so you can highlight areas that you test that work properly, in the effort to location problem areas.
As far as missing parts, I am not sure exactly where to look.
You might start here: http://www.pbresource.com/index.html
Good luck on that.

This is great advice, I just want to mention that GTB schematics are not available for free download online. The current copyright owner is still licensing these schematics, so the good news is that you can (and should) purchase copies from The Pinball Resource if you don't already have them.

- TimMe

#6 10 days ago

Oh, yes--schematics are ordered.

Did anyone ever try one of these?

https://www.delcity.net/store/Recessed-Toggle-Switch/p_820346.h_820347.r_IF1003?mkwid=s&crid=&mp_kw=&mp_mt=e&msclkid=16bbc5bed77d16068afda57fc6b9dc60&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Shopping%20-%20Switches&utm_term=4577404348781905&utm_content=Switches%20-%20Toggle

It looks promising.

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Naturally it attaches below the cab, but I am not looking into having this game in an arcade.

#7 9 days ago
Quoted from Gott72:

It looks promising.

I like this a lot. Do you know if it’s rated for line voltage? It seems so.

Not sure if you want to go this route when it may be pretty basic to recreate the original switch plate, but this would make for a great retrofit.

#8 9 days ago

kinkyinky post pics of that Astro pf you are doing for me...

#9 9 days ago

I wonder if DesiLu sued Gottlieb for using the term "STAR TREK" on the inserts.

#10 9 days ago

It is odd and awkward that they used STAR TREK, openly, unabashedly. Perhaps, since Star Trek was cancelled by 1971, Hollywood was writing it off as a trademark. Syndication was just beginning to get big at that time, though.

Quoted from AndrewP:

I like this a lot. Do you know if it’s rated for line voltage? It seems so.
Not sure if you want to go this route when it may be pretty basic to recreate the original switch plate, but this would make for a great retrofit.

10 amps, 12 VAC.... I think the electric is stepped down already, so it should work, but I'm not going to swear on it.

However, I was more interested in using the plate and conjoining with another switch.

Quoted from pinhead52:

kinkyinky post pics of that Astro pf you are doing for me...

I'd love to see pf work. I probably won't do mine until 2022, but I have to get it done--especially on ASTRO.

#11 9 days ago
Quoted from Gott72:

Did anyone ever try one of these? [Cole Hersee Recessed Toggle Switch & Guard]

Weird that the product info doesn't tell you how many amps the switch is rated for. In this application, you would have line voltage going through those screw terminals on the back, so you would want some form of protective insulation above the switch. I like the guard (metal cup), though, and would be tempted to buy just the guard from that source and get a toggle switch elsewhere. There is a standard size hole for such switches; a toggle switch from the hardware store should fit in that guard.
.................David Marston

#12 9 days ago

The data sheet says 25 amps at 12VDC lamp load.

Anyway, I think you can get these parts from Pinball Resource.

#13 9 days ago
Quoted from Gott72:

Did anyone ever try one of these?

My preferred method on "keeper" machines is the one TimMe suggested or to use a plate from a scrapped machine. If it is not a keeper, I drill a 1/2" hole in a thin piece of sheet metal (usually aluminum) and put in a new switch from the hardware store. You are buying yourself a extra work with that part and it will not look as original, plus it will be more expensive.

#14 9 days ago
Quoted from Gott72:

10 amps, 12 VAC.... I think the electric is stepped down already, so it should work

Nope. Don't use this switch. The power switch for Astro is on the primary side of the transformer, running at 120 VAC. EM pingame transformers of this vintage typically pull between 1 and 2 amps at 120 VAC when the machine is idle, and probably 3 amps + under heavy load (during game reset, for example).

You can always get a rough idea of what a circuit like this will need to handle by looking at the primary fuse rating. The GTB games of this era were typically fused at 5 amps, so you can expect that the primary side of the transformer will (at most) pull about 66% of the fuse rating (in this case 3.3 amps) under normal usage.

If it were me, I would want to put in a power switch rated at 120 VAC @ 10 amp or 15 amp. The extra margin of current capability is insurance against having the switch fail prematurely under normal usage.

- TimMe

#15 8 days ago

I worked on that NOW today.... embarrassed, but found a cause of almost all the troubles: a THIRD jones plug to the upper was not plugged in and sagging in the back of the cabinet!! Its receptacle was cleverly hidden behind score reel braids. Oh the shame!

That corrected almost everything, so the current list of defects now reads...

NOW (1250 made) :
• ONE drop target, of eight, doesn't score
• Trajectory problems (mild) in the two kickers down front
• Various cosmetic problems to be repaired this summer: coin door, plastic bits, rubber bits, cabinet respray, coin slots, targets replaced, etc.

It's a beautiful machine for 50 years age. A tad dirty inside. Works well, might need pep in the flippers. Fun and striking art of the psychedelic era!!
A good player in present condition.
I'll post photos when cleaned up.

Quoted from TimMe:

If it were me, I would want to put in a power switch rated at 120 VAC @ 10 amp or 15 amp. The extra margin of current capability is insurance against having the switch fail prematurely under normal usage.
- TimMe

Noted. Thanks for the word of caution. I hadn't checked the schematic before I spoke.

#16 7 days ago

Here's a start and a part way done image of the pf. I like how Brian (kinkyinky) can lighten the wood and remove some of the UV fade from the pf.

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#17 7 days ago
Quoted from pinhead52:

Here's a start and a part way done image of the pf. I like how Brian (kinkyinky) can lighten the wood and remove some of the UV fade from the pf.

Ugh. I wish my playfield was in that shape. Looks beautiful when stripped down!

This one, I just took off the posts and plastics and rings and lights... and it looks dirtier than your upper pic.

I swear this game was never serviced in 50 years, aside from rubber rings circa 2000 and probably some bulbs, but the bulbs look like 1970s originals! It has copious litter and old bulbs scattered inside the cabinet.

I tossed it all--using new bulbs and posts and rings and plastics (thanks to you).

At this moment I am closing on a house in Palm Desert. Hopefully I can get a tech from the PB Museum to get my playfield stripped, sent out for art restore, and put together back in the machine later this year or next.

Hey there! Got a moment?

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