(Topic ID: 19556)

TFLE owners explain what I'm missing out on


By smassa

7 years ago



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  • 15 posts
  • 11 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by smassa
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    #1 7 years ago

    Looking for input from those out there that love their TFLE. I have a good opportunity to pick up a deciptigon LE and I've only played the game about 4 or 5 times. Once was a private owner and once at PHOF. I'm not sure if I'm missing something about the game but my early impression's weren't very good. What am I missing or is it not worth going after and just waiting for the next game to be released?

    #2 7 years ago

    I dunno, I hate SM and AFM so we are probably just pinball opposites. However, I like TFLE because it is just a pure adrenaline rush. It's a shooter's pin on steroids. You have to hit your shots and hit them quickly. I really can't explain it otherwise -- I don't even care for the theme much, but I like this pin for some reason.

    #3 7 years ago
    Quoted from smassa:

    Looking for input from those out there that love their TFLE. I have a good opportunity to pick up a deciptigon LE and I've only played the game about 4 or 5 times. Once was a private owner and once at PHOF. I'm not sure if I'm missing something about the game but my early impression's weren't very good. What am I missing or is it not worth going after and just waiting for the next game to be released?

    Tons of discussion both pro and con on many forums.

    Let's assume we are talking about a fully working game. If the Megatron trough is not working right or the miniplayfield is not working or the anti-loft drop target plastic is not installed, those things start you off on the wrong foot. And those issues were part of what started the TFLE disdain in the community. But that is not the focus of my post, since in my mind, those issues can be addressed and should have been by any owner by now. Regardless, even after they have been addressed the love is not there for many.

    I love the game, but I think I am in the minority. I can appreciate why people would not like this game, and I had posted from day one I knew this game would frustrate folks.

    Despite the various non-gameplay complaints about TFLE easily found in the archives, I think the most basic way to explain why the game is not well-received among the playing/collector masses is as follows:

    TFLE is very challenging to beat, but lacks the front-end candy and ruleset help-alongs many players/owners want.

    Specifically:

    TFLE is *strictly* dependent on goal completion and does not allow for simply playing a mode to qualify for the miniwizard mode (Sentinel Prime/All Hail Megatron/Roll Out; you pick the name). So if you cannot get to that stage, Cybertron is going to be even worse and far out of reach.

    Many popular games with mini-wizard modes have some portion of the game that allows for a player to have simply "played the modes or multiballs, but winning was not required" Alien Invasion in TSPP, TABA in LOTR, Battle Royale in S-M, Bat Signal multiball in BDK come to mind to name a few.

    In TFLE, finishing the timed modes is imperative for the larger goals and finishing any single mode in one try is challenging. Doable, but most players will need multiple tries even with the Allspark award time extended.

    The second are where many games grab players is with multiballs that are not that difficult to start.

    Both TFLE multiballs (Megatron and Optimus Prime) are hard to start requiring several shots. Megatron is particularly difficult for players since the scoop is tight. Balls do not randomly end up in the lock. (BTW-I think couch mb in TSPP is one of the hardest mbs for casual and skilled players to start).

    When TFLE mbs are started, they are very difficult to win (again imperative for deeper goals) regardless of which faction you start with. The lack of multiball progression toward a SJP turns many players off. In TFLE, winning the multiballs is a must so not being to save your progress mb to mb is a major sticking point for players.

    The other front end candy in games is the toys. In TFLE, operation of the Iron Hide mini-playfield is not intuitive for players and getting the rhythm takes many games. Also each successive round takes 8 shots to start, so it is laborious. Also it begs the question-what am I doing? In factory settings there really is no scoring objective that is meaningful. I suggest setting Special = Extra Ball to have a goal worth playing.

    Another TFLE gameplay complaint is the lack of flow of the ramps. I think flow complaints are a pile-on after thought given all of the other frustrations people have. It is true that having the ball go into the Iron Hide playfield every time does not make sense, but it does not kill the game whatsoever. There are popular Stern games that are more liked where a flipper shot to return inlane shot takes longer than TFLE. LOTR immediately comes to mind with its POTD. The Tortuga disc in POTC is another example. In TFLE multiballs, balls sent to the ramps actually give the player a moment to breathe, since all the orbits return the balls to the flippers. The game is plenty fast and flows fine.

    The irony of statements that TFLE ramps "kills the flow" is that games that give players no time to breathe-almost pure flow, like Iron Man are complained about as being too fast and drainy.

    Those are my basic takes on why the game is not popular.

    I feel TFLE is soild, but perception is everything. There were several things that alienated people about its release and not getting over that, focus was turned to gameplay where players were smacked down with no candy.

    The game warrants some minor tweaking by the end user to make the game more fun-for example as I suggested-let special= extra ball. The outlanes need rubber grommets to allow for nudging. There is too much to do in the game to have so many side drains off the metal and plastic posts. Keep the outlanes opened though.

    I think if Stern had added mb progression into the rules that would have drastically changed how people reacted to the game.

    Anyway, play it as much as you can first, don't just read reviews to decide. Unlike TRON LE which is so hard to find, there is no hurry to buy TFLE since they are around. If the game clicks with you then go for it.

    #4 7 years ago

    I am a big fan of pinballcorpse's reviews of games. He did a knock out review of Tron compared to SM earlier today that I found very useful. I hope he provides a break down for more games in his rankings and makes them public for people to see . . . it would be a great guide for me.

    I'd like an AC/DC premium break down pinballcorpse, haven't played it but thought about adding it if it were as good as so many say.

    #5 7 years ago
    Quoted from pinballcorpse:

    Tons of discussion both pro and con on many forums.
    Let's assume we are talking about a fully working game. If the Megatron trough is not working right or the miniplayfield is not working or the anti-loft drop target plastic is not installed, those things start you off on the wrong foot. And those issues were part of what started the TFLE disdain in the community. But that is not the focus of my post, since in my mind, those issues can be addressed and should have been by any owner by now. Regardless, even after they have been addressed the love is not there for many.
    I love the game, but I think I am in the minority. I can appreciate why people would not like this game, and I had posted from day one I knew this game would frustrate folks.
    Despite the various non-gameplay complaints about TFLE easily found in the archives, I think the most basic way to explain why the game is not well-received among the playing/collector masses is as follows:
    TFLE is very challenging to beat, but lacks the front-end candy and ruleset help-alongs many players/owners want.
    Specifically:
    TFLE is *strictly* dependent on goal completion and does not allow for simply playing a mode to qualify for the miniwizard mode (Sentinel Prime/All Hail Megatron/Roll Out; you pick the name). So if you cannot get to that stage, Cybertron is going to be even worse and far out of reach.
    Many popular games with mini-wizard modes have some portion of the game that allows for a player to have simply "played the modes or multiballs, but winning was not required" Alien Invasion in TSPP, TABA in LOTR, Battle Royale in S-M, Bat Signal multiball in BDK come to mind to name a few.
    In TFLE, finishing the timed modes is imperative for the larger goals and finishing any single mode in one try is challenging. Doable, but most players will need multiple tries even with the Allspark award time extended.
    The second are where many games grab players is with multiballs that are not that difficult to start.
    Both TFLE multiballs (Megatron and Optimus Prime) are hard to start requiring several shots. Megatron is particularly difficult for players since the scoop is tight. Balls do not randomly end up in the lock. (BTW-I think couch mb in TSPP is one of the hardest mbs for casual and skilled players to start).
    When TFLE mbs are started, they are very difficult to win (again imperative for deeper goals) regardless of which faction you start with. The lack of multiball progression toward a SJP turns many players off. In TFLE, winning the multiballs is a must so not being to save your progress mb to mb is a major sticking point for players.
    The other front end candy in games is the toys. In TFLE, operation of the Iron Hide mini-playfield is not intuitive for players and getting the rhythm takes many games. Also each successive round takes 8 shots to start, so it is laborious. Also it begs the question-what am I doing? In factory settings there really is no scoring objective that is meaningful. I suggest setting Special = Extra Ball to have a goal worth playing.
    Another TFLE gameplay complaint is the lack of flow of the ramps. I think flow complaints are a pile-on after thought given all of the other frustrations people have. It is true that having the ball go into the Iron Hide playfield every time does not make sense, but it does not kill the game whatsoever. There are popular Stern games that are more liked where a flipper shot to return inlane shot takes longer than TFLE. LOTR immediately comes to mind with its POTD. The Tortuga disc in POTC is another example. In TFLE multiballs, balls sent to the ramps actually give the player a moment to breathe, since all the orbits return the balls to the flippers. The game is plenty fast and flows fine.
    The irony of statements that TFLE ramps "kills the flow" is that games that give players no time to breathe-almost pure flow, like Iron Man are complained about as being too fast and drainy.
    Those are my basic takes on why the game is not popular.
    I feel TFLE is soild, but perception is everything. There were several things that alienated people about its release and not getting over that, focus was turned to gameplay where players were smacked down with no candy.
    The game warrants some minor tweaking by the end user to make the game more fun-for example as I suggested-let special= extra ball. The outlanes need rubber grommets to allow for nudging. There is too much to do in the game to have so many side drains off the metal and plastic posts. Keep the outlanes opened though.
    I think if Stern had added mb progression into the rules that would have drastically changed how people reacted to the game.
    Anyway, play it as much as you can first, don't just read reviews to decide. Unlike TRON LE which is so hard to find, there is no hurry to buy TFLE since they are around. If the game clicks with you then go for it.

    Thanks for taking the time to really get into what the Pro's n con's of the game are. Guess I'll do a little more thinking on it.

    #6 7 years ago

    Wha? I find Megatron extremely EASY to start multiball. If the drop target is enabled it's not nearly as easy, but still not bad. Optimus on the other hand...that bitch rolls the ball down the plastics and STDM half the time I've played it...

    Not really sure comparing Tortuga is fair here, since that's an intentional ball lock mechanism, and there's targets in there? I love locking a bunch of balls in that thing. It's like a Anti-Drain Warranty.

    I really enjoy playing TF, but it's hard to quantify. I like the sound package...not so much the voices, but the big siren that goes off every time you relight the shots in multiball is fun.

    #7 7 years ago

    I played the game for 30 mins ~ it was a pro and I really liked the game. I'm already down for x-men, but I need one more pin, I'll just wait for next stern/jjp if nothing I like, I'll just get TF.

    #8 7 years ago

    Wow. That was one of the best reviews I have read. Never understood the negativity toward this pin, now I do. I have tf pro and seriously, I love it. Compliments my others. Fast and fun. Could use an update in the software that so many ask for. We all keep wishing on order to make this pin even greater. Thks pinballcorpse

    #9 7 years ago
    Quoted from Frax:

    Wha? I find Megatron extremely EASY to start multiball. If the drop target is enabled it's not nearly as easy, but still not bad. Optimus on the other hand...that bitch rolls the ball down the plastics and STDM half the time I've played it...
    Not really sure comparing Tortuga is fair here, since that's an intentional ball lock mechanism, and there's targets in there? I love locking a bunch of balls in that thing. It's like a Anti-Drain Warranty.
    I really enjoy playing TF, but it's hard to quantify. I like the sound package...not so much the voices, but the big siren that goes off every time you relight the shots in multiball is fun.

    I personally don't find Megatron that bad, but I have seen others struggle on my game and complain the shot is too tight.

    Tortuga was mentioned merely as an "anti ball flow" example. It serves its purpose just fine IMO but is not a "flow" device.

    #10 7 years ago

    Pinball corpse hit most of it on the head. I've had my TFLE since day 1 of release and still play it religiously. I think theme matters in this pin which I love transformers. Personally, I think the voices are great; ESP SS and megatron. And the music is top top notch.

    It's definitely a players pin; once you learn the shots and get comfortable with the machine, the flow is incredible. If you can look past the cons of the game needing tweaks and adjustments stacked with difficult gameplay; it's a fast, furious, adrenalin filled, great and FUN pin.

    #11 7 years ago

    Thank you for reading my long-winded diatribes. I appreciate the feedback.

    I have numerous posts on the various pinball groups about what I like in TFLE (it is a favorite game of mine), but I think the OP was looking for reasons why the game may not be popular.

    Always happy to provide any positive feedback on TFLE as well

    #12 7 years ago

    I love the theme and love the game, it's a keeper, but if you played it and don't like it, why buy it? I played it at expo and fell in love.....

    #13 7 years ago

    It's really just too damn hard out of the box. So far I still have my outlanes wide open, and only added rubber to the little metal lane divider post. My plastic outlane posts are still bare. I may add rubber to them as well, but trying not to. I have never completed OP mb, but have came close a few times. I could not believe what a difference just adding rubber to the metal divider posts made, can't imaging closing the outlanes at all or adding rubber there as well.

    #14 7 years ago

    Your missing nothing lol

    #15 7 years ago
    Quoted from ovfdfireman:

    I love the theme and love the game, it's a keeper, but if you played it and don't like it, why buy it? I played it at expo and fell in love.....

    I dunno....maybe sometimes games grow on you after a while. Plus when you've only play a game a few times you may be missing things.

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