Hi gang, I'm Steve and i'm hoping you'll accept me as a new member of your club! I have had my T2 since 1994, I worked for a Williams distributor when T2 was released and spent ALL my lunch hours playing one for many months! Mine is an HUO that I bought from one of the vendors that we had originally sold it too in 1992, he had it in his home arcade and was never used on his route.
It's in pretty excellent condition, but it does have a few bumps and bruises on the backbox from moving it several times, including up and down basement stairs 3 times, and from Detroit to Las Vegas! I have converted to 100% Comet frosted dome white LED's, and all red Titan Comp rubber. It has a plastics protection kit and every playfield part is original except for the sling plastics... I broke the left one and had to replace both with repro's. The only "mods" i've done is "Brite Eyes" and I added a 16" SMD LED strip under the upper glass trim to light up the top of the playfield. Oh, and my launcher hits the 2nd from the top target 100% of the time, always has!
I also own a Pinbot, Getaway, and a Hurricane. My personal opinion is that even to this very day, T2 and Getaway are tied as the 2 greatest pinball machines ever created!!

Thanks for the welcome Joey! I can get some pics posted this weekend, but pics never really do anything justice... You obviously havn't spent much time playing The Getaway!
You should, you'd change your mind!!

Agreed! That is awesome! you're very talented dude! Is that made of metal or plastic?
I think the price is totally fair, and I would like to help with the group buy.. But my T2 is a HUO and all my playfield elements are in mint condition, so I am keeping my plastics original unless stuff just starts breaking and falling apart. I'm still kinda pissed that my sling plastics are repro cuz I broke the left one...

2 required... 3/8-16 x 2" wing bolts. You could just use standard hex bolts, but you'll want to add a proper washer. Same for all WPC games.

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Hey gang,
I got in on Thiago's "last chance" for his topper, and I wanted to share part of the PM I sent to him...

----So I received my topper yesterday, I havn't installed it yet, but I did unpack it to check it out.
I gotta tell you, I had no idea how much went into making that piece!! I want to give you my highest compliment on craftsmanship and design! I am highly impressed with your work, and the high level of meticulous quality and detail that you put into it... Even the packaging was excellent!----

That guy is a class act!

They all hit differently, it makes no difference.... It's a skill-shot because you have to time your shot to hit that target when its lit. That's also the reason the lights scroll faster each time you hit it.
If you didn't know what target the shooter would hit and the lights were also moving... it would be a LUCK-shot, not a skill-shot!

Yea, ummm, I, uhhh... hmmm.........

Sorry dude, I assume, like me, everyone who saw this post assumed you'd figure this one out on your own with a simple tape measure... 27" x 18-7/8" x 1/8"

No on both, your game is doing what its supposed too.

A "wet" petroleum-based and flammable lubricant (oil, grease. etc) was never intended for this assembly for obvious reasons, and it will become a problem later, one way or a possibly devastating other. But if you insist that you must have lubricant, use a dry graphite or teflon NON-flammable spray lubricant.

Mirror the trigger... flip it over. And the spring goes inside the assembly, not outside.

Ugh, i'm trying to go from memory here, I bought my T2 new in '91 and havn't needed to remove the grip since I installed it out of the box. But I will remove it and open it up to take a pic for you, but I can't do that until later tonight... Best I can do.

Yup, HUO. I personally unboxed and assembled it (and 100's of others) because I worked at a Williams distributor in Michigan at the time. We sold it to an operator (friend of mine too) in 1992, who took it to his house for his personal collection, then I bought it from him 2 years later. I've had it since 1994. When these machines came new, the gun handle was not attached, I had to attach it to every single one. There was also a "recall" of sorts on the handle, and I had to open all the early ones we got and replace the offending parts. Mine came as new with the improved handle because it was one of the last ones built.

Some pics of the trigger handle, what it's supposed to look like...
It is normal for the spring to sloppily go through the collar, the collar's only function is to limit travel of the trigger/pin.
The spring actually compresses inside the collar when you pull the trigger.

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I'm ashamed to admit, that I don't remember. When I bought the machine, I was not even working at that distributor anymore, and that was the last time I saw or talked to him... 22 years ago. A lot of names and faces have been deleted from the ol VRAM since then.

No prob bud, sorry for taking so long.

Now I need a return favor! I need a pic of the driver board IN the game, nice high-res, making sure that every connector on all 4 sides can be seen. I'm doing some research on possible variants between early and late versions of this game. So multiple people that would do this would be greatly appreciated!

The boards are basically the same (WPC), but there's a possibility that some of the actual wiring connections are different.
Thanks for the effort!

Awesome! thanks very much bud. I see that your GI connector was no exception to the T2/WPC "burn" plague!

Congrats... The only plastics ever available are NOS, and a few repro specifics like slings. ebay is your best bet, good luck finding much.... More mods than any other machine I know of, spend a Sunday reading through this thread.

Its likely the game doesn't know you hit the drop target, use the switch test to see if it registers the target in the up and down positions.

That just means your drop hole switch is working, but clearly the drop target sensor is not working, I cant remember if its an opto or a cherry switch, but I guarantee that is the problem and should be a very simple fix.

The switch looks like its similar to a roll-over switch, and I cant see the wire part of the actuator. You can push the drop target up and down with your hand to see if the switch actuator moves when the target drops down. You can also gently move the switch actuator with your finger to hear and feel the click of the switch operating. As a side note, i'm concerned about the spring sticking out from behind the drop-target assy in the first pic that clearly isn't attached to anything?? I believe that's the spring the pulls the target down when its dislodged. I apologize for being vague, I am at work now and dont have the benefit of being at home to look at my game.

^^^ yea, that. I suspect your problem may be as simple as reattaching that spring, If the spring tension is not there pulling the target fully down, there is not enough pressure to fully depress the switch actuator, and the drop target itself weighs nothing, so the dead weight of it alone will not close the switch.

Well then, you've narrowed it down to that switch as we suspected... Do you feel and hear the switch clicking on and off when you press and release the actuator? if so, its likely a broken wire somewhere, and you may want to test that diode. Those micro switches can fail, but its exceptionally rare.

Well, without any feedback about testing the switch itself, i'm still reluctant to assume the switch, or even the diode is bad. He hasn't even confirmed that the drop target is actuating the switch! What if the tab on the drop-target that hits the switch broke off? Its possible a wire is broken in the column or row chain, or a wire pulled out of the connector on the CPU. Do we even know that every other switch on that row/column is reporting? Troubleshoot thoroughly first, buy/replace parts second. Hell, i've seen WAY more U20's fail than microswitches!

As a side note, take a close look at the pic of that switch, its been replaced before, and its incorrect... Whats in there is a hacked inlane rollover switch with the actuator bent straight(ish).

And why are the wires attached differently in these 2 pics??? The 2nd (bottom) one is correct.

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^^^ Those are 2 pics that YOU posted earlier, look at the wires on the switch, the bottom pic is right, if its hooked up the way of the top pic, its wrong!

Always best to ask...

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For the moment, I can tell you that the wiring and the diode orientation in THAT pic ^^ is correct.
The switch actuator position does not need to be modified, leave it as it came out of the package. And the tab on the target that actuates it should be obvious and self-explanatory... Unless of course my theory in an earlier post is true, that the tab on your drop target has broken off.
Unfortunately I cant get this pic for you because I have a machine being shopped in front of my T2, its not preventing it from being played, but its too close that I cannot slide the PF glass completely out.
Sorry I cant be more help ATM, can anyone else get a pic for this guy??

In the mean time, study very closely the diagram in post #4249, it should really be all you need.

Maybe this'll help, a pic of the drop target and the tab that actuates the switch is marked in red.

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The black thing in that pic is the only thing "that comes down". If you're referring to the coil shaft, that's what pushes that black thing back up! The only thing that touches the actuator on that switch is the tab (with the red arrow pointing to it) on that black thing... That simple.

Dude, yer killin me... that metal tab at the bottom of the plunger... the switch actuator goes ABOVE it, not UNDER it!
Whats happening is, the switch actuator is preventing that metal tab and the target from going all the way down. After the coil energizes to lift the target back up, that tab falls back onto the switch and closes it, making the game think that the target is back down, so it keeps trying to kick it back up! click click click.... But it will only try a few times and then give up, then next time you boot the game, it may throw an error code telling you that your drop target is broken.

Please read this very carefully this time...
The switch is actuated by a raised PLASTIC tab on the PLASTIC drop target, nothing that moves and is made of metal should EVER touch ANY part of the switch, just that little plastic tab that is a molded part of the plastic drop target! Please look again at the picture I posted OF the drop target and locate the plastic tab shown on your game. If you cannot see that tab on YOUR drop target, it is entirely possible that it has broken off, in which case you HAVE to replace the plastic drop target piece... $3.49 in-stock at Marco! http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/03-8750

Sorry if I seem frustrated, its not you, its this venue for providing support, not easy for either of us...

PS. One more thing... If you want your ejected ball to stop bouncing back into the trough... bend your eject guide so that it's oriented as shown in this pic. ONLY bend the piece with the red arrow next to it, so that it looks exactly like this! No need to remove the apron or anything, just grab it with your fingers or pliers and bend it! If it still does it, bend it a tad more until it stops! End of that annoying issue!

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Oh boy... he's gonna take the whole assembly apart.... We may need a whole new thread for this! lol

It just occurred to me... I hope you ordered this too... http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/31-1640

Dammit!! For the THIRD time, get that switch actuator ABOVE that metal tab on the coil plunger or i'm going to drown you myself!

In that video, I dont see the target moving at all, and you should be using the solenoid test to do this. try making a video in solenoid test mode for the drop target and zoom in on the target. Are you certain you reassembled the drop target assembly correctly? Did you desolder the coil when you removed it? Did you resolder the coil wires correctly?

And Congrats, your finally have the switch installed correctly!!

ok, whats happening is, you go into "ball seek" mode when you try to start a game, the usual cause of that is first the dumb question... are you sure there are 3 balls in the trough??
If so, remove all the balls from the game and go to the switch matrix test, and make a list of what switches show as closed.
THEN, put the 3 balls in the trough ONE AT A TIME and make sure each trough switch shows as closed.
BTW... I AM a "big gun". We'll get you going again.

ok, there are some good signs here... you didn't actually follow my switch test instructions correctly tho... I need you to add the balls WHILE in switch edges test... So, put the 3 balls in the game, go into the switch edges test, and your matrix should look like the first pic below, if not, that's what we focus on. The 3 together on the lower left are the 3 trough switches, I suspect that your game will not be showing the middle one.

That would be your middle trough switch, which shares a common wire with the drop target switch! And if my suspicion is correct, you simply have a sloppy (bad connection or short) soldering job at your drop target switch... The reason I say that is because looking at your pics and video, I cannot really tell whats soldered to where, my wiring is VERY distinct... see second pic.
And I also noticed after taking this pic, that your switch is on backwards, (the bracket AND the switch) so correct that while you're fixing that (sorry to say) horrible solder job. Study the second pic VERY carefully and make your switch assembly look exactly the same!

PS. We'll get to the target not staying up, that's the easy part...

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This is your pic, SEE YELLOW ARROWS... To me, it looks like one or possibly even both of those wires are touching the switch bracket, which is a short to ground... HUGE problem!
Now look at the RED ARROW... what is that? part of an old diode? It almost looks like it may be a diode lead bypassing the actual diode! another HUGE problem! Whatever that is, get it out of there!

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Joey, relax bud, no offense taken, I was simply reassuring Scamp that I have the skills, experience and knowledge to help him through this. And honestly this is not really a "tech" issue yet, this is a game-specific mechanical issue that I believe belongs in this thread for the benefit of future reference.

The game will not start if it thinks there is a ball missing (because all 3 trough switches are not closed), so when you try to start a game, it goes into "ball seek" and all coils fire, including the trough eject. Then the shooter lane switch sees the ball that was ejected when a game is not "in progress", it kicks it out so it can go back to the trough. Scamp's unique twist to this is that it's very likely that his middle trough switch is not functioning correctly, and the game logic goes even more nutty because it's essentially wondering as a human brain would... How the hell can the MIDDLE ball be missing?!?
Anyway, as soon as he cleans up the soldering job on his new switch, he will hopefully be ok and didn't cause any damage to the switch matrix circuit. Then we can move onto adjusting the drop target assembly so the target stays up.

As a test, take one of the balls out of your game, and press the start button... the same thing will happen on yours.

Good, and make sure you didnt miss post #4300 on the previous page... Lets not waste any more time backtracking and making the same mistakes.

So far so perfect! Notice that one of the switch holes is slotted? that is so you can adjust the switch to be fully depressed when the drop target is down. Do yourself a favor and tweak that adjustment AFTER you reattach the target, but BEFORE you put the whole assembly back into the game... So next show me a pro looking solder job on that switch and the coils! Good work so far bro!

Top shaft: washer - target - washer - SPRING (which I don't see it in the pic) - washer - "C" clip
Bottom shaft: washer - target (no washer on back) - "C" clip.

Make SURE that spring is on the top shaft, its essentially what causes the target to lock into the UP position.

If you have some dielectric silicone lube, put a bit JUST on the indentations around the top shaft where the washer rides along the drop target. Otherwise use a VERY thin coating of vaseline.

Thats always the first place you look! And if that spring was not in there during the last round, that'll be why the target wouldn't stay up.
I think I see a light at the end of this tunnel! And i'm praying that we don't run into any electronic issues with the switch matrix now. But i am optimistic since your short was to ground and not voltage.

Probably a small adjustment to the switch actuator in the drop-hole. bend the tab that sticks up so that the top edge sits as close to the center of where the ball rests. make this ___| look more like this ___/
Not easy to do with the skull in place, so you might try to do it from under the PF.

Awesome!!! I'm so glad dude!! And you did it bro, I may have guided you a bit, but YOU did it, good on you man!!
I'm just here to help out, and i'm glad I was able to do so here. I appreciate your generous offer, and its quite tempting since I have a shiny new set of sling plastics for my Whirlwind ($24.99) sitting in my Marco cart, but i'm going to pay-it-forward on this one... Because I too need a little help every now and then!

Steve

^^ What he said. The coil and armature raises the drop target, nothing more, it has no contact or involvement with the switch. My best advice in your case is... If it aint broke, and you dont know how it works, leave it alone!!

Are you sure the coil is actually energized when the flipper is stuck?

You have 2 different problems, if you can push the flipper back down, and it doesn't resist or go back up on its own, then the coil is not energized and the flipper just sticking... Meaning:
A coil sleeve issue.
A return spring issue.
An assembly alignment problem.
Broken bushing.
Plunger link bolt is too tight.
Bat clamp is too loose.
or a combo of any of these.
Typically this indicates that its time for a "flipper rebuild".
As far as the switch not registering, that is unrelated and purely coincidental. Get the flipper moving correctly again and then get into that.

Shorted driver transistor or an issue with the EOS switch and/or circuit. It could also be a shorted diode, but highly unlikely.. And if it was, it would likely take out the driver transistor with it. Any other coil with same issue is 99% the first thing.

Yes

You can use #SW-1A-120, just connect to the leaf contacts and dont use the 3rd lug.

Your game has a system 11 coin door! How'd that happen?

Its not supposed to autofire, and your game should not go into ball-seek mode if your "cannon loaded" switch is operating properly. Its very likely that your limit switch and actuator cam are out of adjustment. Its a very precise mechanism and offers no slop room for error.
Also, if my memory is correct, there's a menu adjustment pertaining to cannon autofire you may want to check.

Sorry, but this statement is absolutely incorrect, but believe what you want, i've only owned my T2 for over 22 years, and been a Williams pinball technician for 24 years, what do I know... I wont chime in on this again.

The autofire may be a function strictly under a super jackpot attempt scenario, I don't want to say for sure, because honestly I cant instant replay in my head the last time I had such an event in a game. BUT under NORMAL game play where you are shooting at one or multiple targets to start multi-ball OR the standard jackpot shot (any other balls in play are locked in this case) the cannon absolutely IS NOT supposed to autofire, period.... If it DOES, your cannon's home switch is out of adjustment, an extremely common problem with this game. Believe me or don't, i'm not going to keep retyping the same thing over and over. I am only answering the question 100% accurately for the sake of future reference for this thread as a resource for this game.
With all the advice I have offered in this thread, please ANYONE chime in now if I have ever give you bad or incorrect info or repair assistance for your T2!

lol, thanks bud, im still really glad we got your game straight so you can enjoy it, and i'm proud of you, you did the work!

L-2, what it came with from the factory. I just tested my game (by hand), I loaded the cannon to shoot for multi-ball, let the cannon cycle (home to home) 2.5 times and then hit the trigger and the ball instantly fired.
I have never actually walked away from a game in progress with the gun cycling, so then I tried that... What happened was, the gun cycled (home to home) 4 full times and the game went into ball-seek mode and kicked the ball out of the cannon just as it hit the home position, so the ball shot backward up the feed ramp! I grabbed the ball so it wouldn't roll back to the cannon which was still moving, that could have been a disaster!! Obviously none of that is supposed to happen, so I double checked all related switches and they checked out fine. So then I did some research and apparently this was an issue way-back-when, and I need a ROM update! But as it sits, as long as I fire the cannon within 4 cycles, (which I apparently have for over 22 years) it's a non-issue for me... But at least my cannon home switch is properly adjusted!

Seriously? for the 4th time... THE CANNON SHOULD NOT AUTOFIRE!
If it does, your home switch it not adjusted correctly!!
If you like it autofiring, leave it alone, if you want it to be right, get your manual out and properly adjust the home switch!

Yes, Marco has the pivot hardware, go to the website and search by game, you'll find them. The guide is likely going to be hard to find, but who knows!

Thats the one! The 1/2" hex nut is supposed to be there also. you don't need to buy the proper hex nut from Marco, you prolly have a suitable one laying around your garage somewhere. As long as you only have 1 pivot nut in place on one side, your playfield is sitting crooked, which absolutely affects play!

Insert lifting on T2 is extremely common... If you find one that has NO lifting, its been worked on. If you see one with a nice clean no-wear playfield, but it has a mylar on it, its because someone leveled all the inserts which will damage the DP. In my opinion, I would rather have flat inserts and a mylar than an unaltered DP playfield that plays like a washboard.
The third option is to strip the PF, level all the inserts, and shoot a new clearcoat on it.

Only if the Diamond Plate is wearing off, which it clearly is, and certainly does! So people, PLEASE put a PF protector on there, or new clearcoat BEFORE your playfield has no DP left on it and your inserts start wearing off! Keep in mind that in 2016, there is FAR MORE technology in mylar film than there ever was in "Diamond Plate" clearcoat, and it will last 10 times longer!

Right sling is broken also, and virtually every insert on the PF has wear, clean that thing up and get a mylar/PF protector on there STAT!!

Williams never used plexiglass for backglass, on any pin. Its supposed to be tempered glass.

Yeah... and why??

One guy is not "everyone" bro.

Big mistake

Right, that was their logic on wasting a ton of time and money to put it there on a million machines.

ok, my sense of humor for this "loscanones" asshat, is officially gone... Blocked.

Ooooooh, shiny! What did you do? Looks like you need a right sling plastic, I have a nice used undamaged original one if your looking.

PM your address, i'll get it out to you next week.

You're wrong.

I've had mine since 1994, i'd call that a keeper!!

The sign plastic is available on ebay, the bracket will be a tuffy, you might want to make your own.

Congrats! Looks like a helluva nice & unmolested one too! Score!
Keep it covered or the sun from that window will turn all your PF reds to neon pink!

You have the proper parts, just in the wrong places... Obviously someone who shopped that game at some point, mixed up the gates.
There are 3 that all fit the same spacing, so they can get mixed up of you're not paying attention or don't realize the difference.
The one with the return spring goes on the shooter lane, The chase loop and skull gates are very similar, but not exactly the same, which is why they each have different part numbers. Those 2 can be mixed with no issues.
So swap your gates back into the proper locations and you're all set... Nothing to buy.

My thoughts exactly...

Yup, that's referred too as a "credit dot", if it's there, it means there are errors in your machine.

Could you post a pic of your "friend", so we can make sense of whatever you're talking about?

Its a small and very specific L-bracket, you wont find one at Home Depot, you'll likely have to make one of some sheet metal, the original part is unobtainium. There is supposed to be one on each side of the skull, so if the other one is there, it should be pretty self explanatory!

Do a Google image search to find T2 playfield pics, you'll find tons of pics of what the L-brackets look like.
The real mystery here is wtf happened to the L-brackets from your game!?! It kinda looks like it was stored outside for a few years with no PF glass on it, maybe some critter ate them??

Right, so sit the skull in the general area of where it goes, and hope it just stays there!
Even 2-sided taping the bottom of the skull to the chin guard, or even to the horseshoe behind it, or BOTH would make half-assed hack sense... but nooooooo, that would take effort!!

Looks pretty good, but i'm not a fan of colored GI lights, and the yellow flipper bats are an abomination.. replace them with the proper black bats. The stickers on the apron are a major bummer... Sorry, you asked!

Not just 2 lights, unique and specially made, worth every penny.

Yup, i'm crazy... My time roaming around Home Depot, and labor trying to half-assed replicate these excellent quality custom manufactured LED's, is worth a helluva lot more than $15. It's that simple, period.

Nifty! I've not seen that on ebay, do you have a link?

Thanks for the link, I ordered a sheet. I'll use half for T2, and half for Getaway, both will look kickass with red DMD's!

I used a roll-on glue stick and ran a bead of the glue around the border of the DMD glass and stuck the film (didnt peel anything) with the glossy side against the DMD glass, it looks amazing on my Getaway, not fuzzy or blurry at all... Just Red!!

Yes.

Nonsense! That guy is a very honest seller. His prices are sometimes nuts, but you will get your items, and usually very quickly.
I have bought many many things from him over the years, and have had multiple PM convo's with him too, he's a good dude.

After the lights go off, check to see if you have 5v at the 4-pin connector (with yellow wires) coming off of the transformer, if not, your transformer is shot, which is what I suspect.

Wow, even the demo video kicks ass!! Well done ColorDMD!! I might just have to blow my wad on this... But according to the website, the firmware is still not available?

I just want to know how well it works, period.

Thanks for taking the time to do this, i've seen all I need to see!

Apparently it is... now I just wish it was something I could un-see!

They exist, I have one, but it's not for sale.

I noticed the inlane inserts too, didnt want to say anything tho... the fact that you didnt notice is proof that this is not the end of the world, and nobody else will ever notice the flaws either. More than likely, the mfg. didnt notice it either. The most important thing is that the inserts are labeled correctly!

Nice work!! I love to see restoration work actually done correctly!

I believe I have an extra set, i'll double check in a couple hours when I get home... If you're interested.

I sure hope you're right, I ordered a decal set for my Demo Man on Monday, I got the order confirmation email right away, and havn't heard a peep from them since...