(Topic ID: 146688)

Teardown Techniques


By jsa

3 years ago



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  • 64 posts
  • 35 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by j_m_
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    #1 3 years ago

    Before embarking in my first playfield teardown, I'd love to hear any tips/techniques people may have to make the process a bit smoother. Methods of determining the order, organizing and taking photos, whatever.

    For example, for soldered connections, do you de-solder everything and re-solder it again, or carefully leave certain wiring attached? How do you manage the wiring harnesses, leaving them in place?

    Anything goes here, I'm looking for wisdom. Thanks!

    #2 3 years ago

    Take pictures of everything. EVERYTHING.

    Remove ramps and habitrails first, note order, take a picture everytime you remove something.
    Remove all the plastics, take pictures of the area everytime you remove something.
    Remove all the other hardware, leave in rubber posts.
    Switches have connectors under the playfield.

    #3 3 years ago

    I don't desolder unless necessary for a repair. Desoldering would be a lot of work, and could introduce a lot of errors in the reassembly process.

    #4 3 years ago

    Lots of pictures is your best weapon - especially in this digital age where they don't really cost you anything.

    I like to use a lot of space when taking playfields apart, so I can set up the various layers in their basic layout relative to position on the playfield for easily remembering where things go back. I keep meaning to build a rolling cart with several 2'x4' shelves on it so I can make a portable stack out of what normally ends up all over the place, but haven't gotten around to that still.

    One thing I've done recently that helped with full teardowns is use a piece of foamcore to mount the posts into temporarily, in a layout similar to where they go in the playfield (but scaled down) so I don't have to remember which type of post goes where. I had it on carpet, so I just used one layer and poked them out the bottom, but if you put it on a hard surface you'd need a few layers to cover the post depth.

    #5 3 years ago

    I tend to do things by assembly and/or section off the playfield depending on the layout. I also bag parts in ziplock bags, and include an index card labeling what the contents of each bag is for.

    This is on top of the zillion photos, of course. If there are a lot of different types of screws, I take a photo after each screw is removed so I know where it goes.

    Also, have a ruler handy so you can include the ruler in the photo next to posts/screws and whatnot.

    What game will you be tearing town?

    #6 3 years ago

    Pictures, pictures, pictures. From every angle, before taking apart, during and right after you remove the part. Then take all of the pictures and back them up in two places (learned this the hard way with a hard drive crash).

    A notebook. Sketch out connections or note the order things are assembled

    Get a lot of ziploc baggies and a sharpie. Bag and label as you go to keep track of everything. Tumble and polish in batches will help ensure everything is accounted for.

    Start a list of parts early and order extras when you do. Nothing is more frustrating then just getting your order from Marcos/Pinball Life and then realizing that you need one extra thing and now need to wait another week and eat another $10 in shipping.

    Don't push it. Work at a good pace, but know when to quit. Nothing sucks more than f'n up a part/plastic/playfield than when you didn't quit when you were too tired/not into it at the moment.

    Soldering/wiring. I snip all coils and add molex connectors when I reassemble. GI and other smaller connections, I leave intact.

    #7 3 years ago

    In tearing down pins, it's usually done in chunks. I take many pictures of that specific area I'm working on. All those parts go into a labeled bag, ex UPPER LEFT RAMP.

    Then, I usually diagram on a notebook that section, and label it the same , ex UPPER LEFT ramp. I like to rough-out a diagram, noting specific things, like missing screws on parts, etc. That way, when reassembling, you're not looking for a missing screw! I also like to number pics on my diagrams that correspond to the pics Ive taken. Ex: UPPER LEFT RAMP 3-15. 3-15 means those specific pics go with that specific area.

    Just take a TON of pics. Lots of angles. Also, I like to point to things in my pics of note. That way when going back days later, I can recall why I was taking THAT specific pic.

    #8 3 years ago
    Quoted from epthegeek:

    One thing I've done recently that helped with full teardowns is use a piece of foamcore to mount the posts into temporarily, in a layout similar to where they go in the playfield (but scaled down) so I don't have to remember which type of post goes where. I had it on carpet, so I just used one layer and poked them out the bottom, but if you put it on a hard surface you'd need a few layers to cover the post depth.

    THIS. For everything topside, at least. I typically use a few pieces of thin cardboard, but same idea. Just load up the cardboard by punching the posts and any hardware through while keeping it in the same pattern. Maybe I'm too obsessive, but I want everything to go back exactly where it came from.

    I've had instances of hardware giving me trouble unless it's going back into it's original hole. After a few of those confusing situations, I will always do things this way. Even if it takes slightly longer.

    #9 3 years ago

    It doesn't matter how many pictures you take, you will always need more. So go crazy with the camera. I usually start at the plunger and go around the machine counterclockwise. I do this for each "layer" I encounter. Each time I take something off, I photo it as well, and pay attention to the type of screw, post, etc. with a picture of it next to its place on the playfield. I organize in plastic zip locks, and just write on the bag with a sharpie.

    I keep a running list of parts I need.

    I do not re-solder, unless there is a bad connection or reason to do so.

    For the underside, I label everything with a number, with a corresponding number on the playfield, with a sharpie. So hole 27 takes the GI socket that I put a 27 on, etc. For some things, like transistor boards or switches, I'll outline them with the sharpie as well as number them. Once I have everything disconnected, with lots of photos, I slide the wiring harness onto a large piece of cardboard, labeling head and foot. Putting the wiring harness back then just requires sliding it onto the playfield underside, and screwing things back in place in reverse numerical order. Obviously I clean everything and replace/resolder connections as necessary.

    Underside things like rollover switch brackets and such can be photographed once the wiring harness is off and put in plastic bags as well.

    This is a huge project. Don't count on things being disconnected just a few days. It'll be months, if you are a hobbyist with other family responsibilities, before you reconnect that last plastic or put on that last rubber ring. Document in a way that someone who wasn't present when it was taken apart could use the documentation to put it back together.

    #10 3 years ago

    This is how I do it . I take A ton of pictures . Then when I remove a nut to take off a plastic I put it back on . Unless you are doing a playfield swap there really isn't a need to unsolder anything . I do major test downs all the time and if you just take your time , label any plug you have to unplug ( electrical tape 1,2,3,4 etc.. ) you should be fine . Take pictures at different angles incase there are stacked plastics . If you have questions ask . You should be ok

    #11 3 years ago

    Let me start by saying I FREAKING LOVE THIS FORUM. Thank you everyone. Amazing.

    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    What game will you be tearing town?

    Theatre of Magic. I plan to have the playfield restored by a pro, as I don't happen to have a clearcoat painting chamber in my house, but I figure I should step up to tearing down and cleaning up the parts.

    Quoted from Dante:

    I snip all coils and add molex connectors when I reassemble. GI and other smaller connections, I leave intact.

    Do you have a photo of one of your coils once you put the molex connector on?

    Quoted from boneman91:

    I do not re-solder, unless there is a bad connection or reason to do so.
    For the underside, I label everything with a number, with a corresponding number on the playfield, with a sharpie. So hole 27 takes the GI socket that I put a 27 on, etc. For some things, like transistor boards or switches, I'll outline them with the sharpie as well as number them. Once I have everything disconnected, with lots of photos, I slide the wiring harness onto a large piece of cardboard, labeling head and foot.

    Quoted from Phatchit:

    Unless you are doing a playfield swap there really isn't a need to unsolder anything

    There are definitely connections, like single mounted bulb sockets, that are soldered under the playfield. So when you guys say you don't de-solder, I'm assuming that means you leave the connected socket connected to the wire harness and then move the wire harness in one move to your staging area (and back later). Am I getting this right?

    Quoted from epthegeek:

    One thing I've done recently that helped with full teardowns is use a piece of foamcore to mount the posts into temporarily, in a layout similar to where they go in the playfield (but scaled down) so I don't have to remember which type of post goes where. I had it on carpet, so I just used one layer and poked them out the bottom, but if you put it on a hard surface you'd need a few layers to cover the post depth.

    epthgeek that sounds like a winning method. If you happen to have a photo of your foamcore loaded, I'd love to see it!

    Again, these tips are fantastic, keep them coming.

    #12 3 years ago

    If you need to desolder stuff, just cut it loose instead. Now leave 1/8 to 1/4 inch of old wire when cutting so you can see what the wire color was for easy resoldering.

    #13 3 years ago
    Quoted from Dante:

    I snip all coils and add molex connectors when I reassemble.

    I too like to use Molex connectors. As I tear down, I install the Molex plugs. That way I can remove whole assemblies. I usually lay them out with their attaching hardware either on a piece of cardboard or more often another machine...all in their relative position. Then at my leisure, I can disassemble each major component and rebuild and clean. It's fun on the other end of the restore to put the full components in and just plug them in.

    Here's the underside of a KISS and you can see lots of Molex plugs...

    Lower_playfield.jpg

    #14 3 years ago
    Quoted from jsa:

    epthgeek that sounds like a winning method. If you happen to have a photo of your foamcore loaded, I'd love to see it!
    Again, these tips are fantastic, keep them coming.

    Unfortunately, I don't have a shot of that. TONS of pictures of various games in states of dismantle, but I never pointed the camera at the foamcore holding board. Sorry.

    #15 3 years ago
    Quoted from Dante:

    Pictures, pictures, pictures. From every angle, before taking apart, during and right after you remove the part. Then take all of the pictures and back them up in two places (learned this the hard way with a hard drive crash).
    A notebook. Sketch out connections or note the order things are assembled
    Get a lot of ziploc baggies and a sharpie. Bag and label as you go to keep track of everything. Tumble and polish in batches will help ensure everything is accounted for.
    Start a list of parts early and order extras when you do. Nothing is more frustrating then just getting your order from Marcos/Pinball Life and then realizing that you need one extra thing and now need to wait another week and eat another $10 in shipping.
    Don't push it. Work at a good pace, but know when to quit. Nothing sucks more than f'n up a part/plastic/playfield than when you didn't quit when you were too tired/not into it at the moment.
    Soldering/wiring. I snip all coils and add molex connectors when I reassemble. GI and other smaller connections, I leave intact.

    This is pretty much exactly my approach as well, especially the good pace part. Look at my pinball Magic shop out thread to see what happens when you rush.

    You can NEVER have TOO MANY photos. Let me say it again. You can NEVER have TOO MANY photos.

    Chris

    #16 3 years ago

    An IPAD or similar tablet is great for pictures. The screen size is big enough to look at the pictures and you can bring it right to your work area.
    Unsolder or not depends on how far you want to go. Much easier to really clean the harnesses without the sockets attached. I throw light sockets into a tumbler as well to clean them up.

    Zip lock bags are great and I also use USPS boxes (free) to organize things as I remove them. Number the boxes and reassemble in reverse.

    #17 3 years ago
    Quoted from jsa:

    Dante said:

    I snip all coils and add molex connectors when I reassemble. GI and other smaller connections, I leave intact.

    Do you have a photo of one of your coils once you put the molex connector on?

    Yep, mine look just like Freepolay40s pictures

    But here are some other great threads that folks have done. MOF did a really nice PF Swap writeup in the first link, definitely worth checking out.

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/playfield-swap-guide

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/tech-playfield-swap-advice

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/high-speed-restoration

    -1
    #18 3 years ago

    I don't see how some of you put posts, hdwr, etc on foam core or cardbd to remember location. Just about all of the pcs are generic, and if you have pics, you know what goes where. Strip all hdwr and throw it in the tumbler. And I agree, clip wires from coils, switches with 1/2" left on so you know for sure it was there. Its pretty obvious when you lay out the harness again.

    #19 3 years ago

    In addition to LOTS of pictures from multiple angles, one thing I found makes it extremely easy to re-assemble is to make a list of each part you remove, as you remove it, listing the number and type of screw/nut/bolt/etc it was attached with.

    Then, simply reverse this list while referring to the pictures, and the re-assembly is stress free.

    #20 3 years ago
    Quoted from sc204:

    An IPAD or similar tablet is great for pictures. The screen size is big enough to look at the pictures and you can bring it right to your work area.
    Unsolder or not depends on how far you want to go. Much easier to really clean the harnesses without the sockets attached. I throw light sockets into a tumbler as well to clean them up.
    Zip lock bags are great and I also use USPS boxes (free) to organize things as I remove them. Number the boxes and reassemble in reverse.

    I use a tablet or laptop for reviewing photos during reassembly.

    I use an adjustable wire bookstand to hold up the tablet. It was cheaper than a tablet cover, and I needed to order a few bookstands for another project anyway. It has worked out pretty well so far.

    20141013233243299.jpg

    #21 3 years ago

    I tend to put my parts in a big pile like raking leave in the fall. Then I jump in.

    th.jpeg

    #22 3 years ago

    Any flat screen TV with a USB input will allow you to plug in a stick of pictures.

    So if you have one hanging in your garage, you have a great photo resource already installed.

    #23 3 years ago

    I actually take tons of photos and then separate all my parts into bins.

    Taxi_179.jpg

    #24 3 years ago
    Quoted from Jjsmooth:

    And I agree, clip wires from coils, switches with 1/2" left on so you know for sure it was there. Its pretty obvious when you lay out the harness again.

    You want to be careful doing that, especially on flipper coils. You don't want to end up short and there are times you will be if cut 1/2" off. A simple picture of each coil showing the wire colors is all you need, then simply unsolder them.

    #25 3 years ago

    Here's the link to the book stand I'm using: amazon.com link »

    #26 3 years ago

    If I am going to reassemble in a short period of time or if it is a place I can leave it undisturbed, I like to set up a table right next to the machine and lay out all of the pieces I remove in the location that they are removed working outward with the parts as they get lower in the stack. Upper most ramps closest to the middle, etc. I also try to put screws and nuts back on to the post they came from if possible.

    #27 3 years ago
    Quoted from Skypilot:

    I tend to put my parts in a big pile like raking leave in the fall. Then I jump in.

    th.jpeg

    Yep. Do it. Don't be afraid. Some of these so called techniques will add weeks to your project, and are not needed. I was nervous on my first one, but not anymore. These are mass produced, and have a lot of "give". Jump in.
    And throw everything that will fit into the tumbler......

    #28 3 years ago

    Don't bother cleaning and tumbling common screws.

    Way cheaper to buy new than to pay for Flitz.

    https://www.boltdepot.com/

    #29 3 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    Don't bother cleaning and tumbling common screws.
    Way cheaper to buy new than to pay for Flitz.
    https://www.boltdepot.com/

    Great timing. I actually had planned to post a thread to ask where to source those common stainless steel fasteners.

    Thanks!

    PS> So is it Pan head, or Round head or Truss head in my JP machine?

    #30 3 years ago

    Did anyone mention pictures yet?

    As everyone is saying, pictures from every angle for every step. Yes, you may end up with hundreds of stupid pictures... And that one snapshot that tells you how it goes back together.

    Also, do NOT assume the last person that worked on the game put it back together correctly. That hex post that is 1/4 inch shorter may not have been in the right spot when you took it out. Sometimes that just makes things look funny, and other times ball flow may be impacted.

    #31 3 years ago

    In addition to tons of pictures, separating into bags, laying out parts in relative positions, I also quickly scribble major steps in a notebook so I can work backward when I put things back together.

    This way I don't skip putting pieces on in the right sequence. I also jot down the number of fasteners, lengths, type of screw head, etc.

    Only takes a couple extra minutes and works to keep me organized.

    Eric

    #32 3 years ago

    Can anyone recommend a good iOS photo app to catalog pictures as you take them? The default Photo app on iOS doesn't let you name or annotate photos...

    #33 3 years ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    Did anyone mention pictures yet?
    As everyone is saying, pictures from every angle for every step. Yes, you may end up with hundreds of stupid pictures... And that one snapshot that tells you how it goes back together.
    Also, do NOT assume the last person that worked on the game put it back together correctly. That hex post that is 1/4 inch shorter may not have been in the right spot when you took it out. Sometimes that just makes things look funny, and other times ball flow may be impacted.

    Adding onto that, it's also a good idea to look at reference photos from other games to make sure things on your game are correct. Also, while IPDB is a great resource, don't assume that those reference photos are 100% correct either. If there's something that doesn't look quite right, feel free to post a photo request thread.

    #34 3 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    Don't bother cleaning and tumbling common screws.
    Way cheaper to buy new than to pay for Flitz.
    https://www.boltdepot.com/

    I'd do this if I knew what to buy as a replacement...

    #35 3 years ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    Adding onto that, it's also a good idea to look at reference photos from other games to make sure things on your game are correct. Also, while IPDB is a great resource, don't assume that those reference photos are 100% correct either. If there's something that doesn't look quite right, feel free to post a photo request thread.

    Since you may want to make things even nicer than when you removed them..... This is especially true for the wiring harness which from the factory usually has a few "rats nest" looking areas or may have been tuned into a mess by prior repairs or mods. A great source of pictures online is from the professional restorer's galleries. I used High End Pins pictures a lot when doing my Star trek restore. Lets you see how they figured out how to make the wiring look twice as good as NIB.

    under playfield 1.jpg

    #36 3 years ago
    Quoted from markp99:

    Great timing. I actually had planned to post a thread to ask where to source those common stainless steel fasteners.
    Thanks!
    PS> So is it Pan head, or Round head or Truss head in my JP machine?

    Using stainless is a pain in the ass. Nothing sticks to your magnetic nut drivers and screwdrivers. They look pretty though.

    #37 3 years ago

    And I still laugh about the first time I took my Dracula apart. I was so proud of myself for getting it all back in there... right up until I went to slide the glass back in the game and I couldn't because the glass hit the coffin... Fun times. Oh yeah, there will be mistakes

    #38 3 years ago

    And one other thing, no need to label board connectors. No need to write on the side of the connectors the corresponding board connection. Just looks ugly
    The harness will fall pretty much back in place. Due to the configuration of the pins and blanks in the connectors it is hard to connect to a wrong spot on the board. And if you have 2 choices or are not sure which board a connector goes to just look in the manual (available on line if you don't have it) and it will tell which connectors with which color wires go where.

    #39 3 years ago
    Quoted from sc204:

    And one other thing, no need to label board connectors. No need to write on the side of the connectors the corresponding board connection. Just looks ugly
    The harness will fall pretty much back in place. Due to the configuration of the pins and blanks in the connectors it is hard to connect to a wrong spot on the board. And if you have 2 choices or are not sure which board a connector goes to just look in the manual (available on line if you don't have it) and it will tell which connectors with which color wires go where.

    All I do is take detailed pics of the boards and where the connectors go, making sure to show the wires and colors. Yes, a harness will have a memory, but you WILL have questions on a number of them.

    #40 3 years ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    And I still laugh about the first time I took my Dracula apart. I was so proud of myself for getting it all back in there... right up until I went to slide the glass back in the game and I couldn't because the glass hit the coffin... Fun times. Oh yeah, there will be mistakes

    LOL Been there, done that. The only thing I ever have to write down are the location and lengths of any hex or round standoffs or spacers. I can tell everything else from my pics.

    #41 3 years ago
    Quoted from sc204:

    And one other thing, no need to label board connectors. No need to write on the side of the connectors the corresponding board connection. Just looks ugly
    The harness will fall pretty much back in place. Due to the configuration of the pins and blanks in the connectors it is hard to connect to a wrong spot on the board. And if you have 2 choices or are not sure which board a connector goes to just look in the manual (available on line if you don't have it) and it will tell which connectors with which color wires go where.

    Or you can just use these, which I got from somebody's advice on Pinside. They are invaluable to me during restorations. Label everything on the teardown (along with pictures and written documentation) and it makes the reassembly a cakewalk. Just clip 'em off when everything's together and working well.

    amazon.com link »

    #42 3 years ago
    Quoted from westofrome:

    Can anyone recommend a good iOS photo app to catalog pictures as you take them? The default Photo app on iOS doesn't let you name or annotate photos...

    I have a folder for every game I've ever done. Inside that folder are usually 5 others. Top of playfield, bottom of playfield, cabinet head, cabinet body and parts. The parts contain pics of any ramps, coil assemblies, etc., that I need to take apart and put back together. You can get a lot more detailed than this, but this works for me.

    And I never have to write down the order things come off or are done. The way I take my pics, I just go in reverse order when I reassemble things.

    And never, never, never tell yourself you'll remember something and not take a pic. You WILL forget when the time comes.

    #43 3 years ago
    Quoted from Bryan_Kelly:

    All I do is take detailed pics of the boards and where the connectors go, making sure to show the wires and colors. Yes, a harness will have a memory, but you WILL have questions on a number of them.

    If you have to repin, some of that "memory" will be lost.

    #44 3 years ago
    Quoted from 27dnast:

    I'd do this if I knew what to buy as a replacement...

    This cheat sheet will show you how to know what washer fits what bolt, and what all the different head configurations are, and how to measure the length of a fastener (do you include the head, or not????).

    There are actually 2 pages, so download it here:

    https://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-information/Printable-Tools/Fastener-Basics.pdf

    Fastener-Basics.pdf

    #45 3 years ago

    What would be awesome is if someone else other than me went through and labeled all the screws and bolts in each manufacturer's games. So all the bolts they used in Williams, Bally, etc.

    One nice easy chart so I can just order all the bolts without having to sit there and measure each one.

    #46 3 years ago

    I just take tons of pics, before anything is taken off and during...each time you remove something, take a pic. If you've done that particular game before, you might not need as many pics. I number everything I take off and use plastic gallon zip locks to hold everything that I take off at each step....if it will fit. If I take a ramp off, I just put a piece of tape on it with the number. Eventually I have everything off the top and bottom with numbers. Then when I am ready to re-assemble, I just go in the reverse order and everything goes back on as it should. Eliminates having to take things off and on more than once because it was installed in the wrong order. I also de-solder all coils before removing the assemblies. I label the wires so I know where they go. So far, I haven't had any issues doing it this way. I don't really need to "lay out" everything in the place it was on the play field because that's what the pictures are for. Unless its a special post or screw, the pictures show me where they all go too. Not too hard when you get the hang of it, but it can be intimidating the first time.

    Brian

    #47 3 years ago
    Quoted from jwilson:

    What would be awesome is if someone else other than me went through and labeled all the screws and bolts in each manufacturer's games. So all the bolts they used in Williams, Bally, etc.

    One nice easy chart so I can just order all the bolts without having to sit there and measure each one.

    You will find that most games use the same parts. If you are doing a lot of restorations, make up a kit of common stuff:

    Pop rings use 6-32 nylon lock nuts, so get 100 of those, get 100 8-32 nylon lock nuts too for most other mechs.

    Get 100 6-32 and 8-32 T-nuts.

    Get 200 #6 and 200 #8 washers.

    Get 500 2" 6-32 pan head Philips machine screws

    You get the idea.

    If you are redoing a Gottlieb, then replace all those slotted screws with Phillips heads - this will prevent many accidents where the drive slips out of the crappy slotted head.

    #48 3 years ago
    Quoted from Skypilot:

    I actually take tons of photos and then separate all my parts into bins.

    Taxi_179.jpg

    That's a great work bench/rotisserie. Did you build that? Plans? Awesome!

    Mike

    #49 3 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    You will find that most games use the same parts.

    Cool, thanks for the list!

    #50 3 years ago
    Quoted from Bryan_Kelly:

    And never, never, never tell yourself you'll remember something and not take a pic. You WILL forget when the time comes.

    Do I know this!...Did that once for one item on MB. Oh i'll remember... That did not work out so well.
    Thank god for the internet.

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