(Topic ID: 87835)

Taxi needs to warm up for several minutes before being playable?

By Whridlsoncestood

10 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 35 posts
  • 10 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by koen12344
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders

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Linked Games

  • Taxi Williams, 1988

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#1 10 years ago

Something that I should of taken care of earlier before I started my restore is this issue I am having. I got this taxi in as a train wreck. Got it working 100 percent and then started having a slight issue before I tore it down.

Game has pinscore LED displays so nothing is outgassing before I start.

When you first turn the game on only a few segments on the display come on. Maybe a couple more lfickering as well. Many inserts dim. CAB lights in the back lanes especially worse than the others. If you start a game immediately the coils are very week. Can't even shoot a ball in the outhole to the trough. After a few minutes coils are good and inserts are good and most of the display segments are back. After about 10 all the display segments are nice and bright.

When I started on the restore I did the cabinet first. When I cleaned all the boards I replaced C1, C3, C9 and C10 on the power supply board and the big blue capcitor on the lower right hand corner of the head. I plugged the old playfield back in outside of the cabinet for testing purposes and the issue is still there.

I'm guessing there is another capacitor I should be looking at replacing but I'm not sure which one. What seems odd to me is coils, displays and lighting are all different voltages. Wall voltage is fine.

Playfield is almost done being restored. Should be back in, in another day or two. I can still boot the game and check the displays without the playfield in though. Any other suggestions to look at?

-Jim

#3 10 years ago

119.7 at service outlet. 119.7 at lines going to transformer when game turned on and cold.

Tested lines out of the transformer. All cold as well

White lines-88.5 on schematics. Reads 93.2
Grey/white. 9.7-reads 10.5
Grey/green. 9.7- reads 22
Blue/white-13.5-reads 14.4
White/red 26-reads 30.5
Black/yellow 48-reads 55

Testing voltages at coils. Some at 75. Others at 40. All tested cold.

Test points on power supply board
TP1 +5V reads 4.98
TP3 +12v reads 13.5
TP4 -12v reads 14.4

Also noticed flippers don't work at all until warmed up.

After the transformer these AC lines go to the power board and the auxiliary driver board to get rectified to DC voltages. Not sure where these voltages are going wrong. Transformer is the last common link between them.

-Jim

#4 10 years ago

Talking with My buddy Taxman it looks like this might just be a 5v issue. Coil voltage seems fine when game is cold. 5v opens the Predriver transitor to send higher voltage to open the coil transistor to ground. If I have good voltage to coil I must have a weak connection to ground. Possibly the 5v not strong enough to open the transistors properly. Same with lamps. Transistors not opening and displays the same thing. Pinscores run off of the 5v line. Test point on powerboard how 4.98 when cold so that's good. Possibly a cracked solder joint on the header pin going out.

Taxman has a new powerboard for taxi I can swap in. Will try that if re flowing the header pins doesn't fix it.

Oh and that way high reading I was getting on the grey/green line was because it was the common line of the 3 pair. I was using the grey line as common and hence it was a readig for 9.7+9.7=19.4 so my 22 is in line.

Sound logical to anyone else that this is just a 5v to CPU board issue?

#7 10 years ago

My next step wen I get a chance is to measure 5v at the CPU connector and the 5v test point on CPU (assuming there is one, haven't looked yet) to see if there is a problem at the harness. I reflowed all header pins on the power board last night specifically the 5v pins. No change in behavior. Also I want to measure that 5v line and see if it rises from 4.98 as it gets warm. I have a decent meter but not really sure if it can read any ripple I may have.

I see now C8 is for the 5v line and will probably order some as its a good part to have on hand at the very least.

I have not checked but does taxi have a flipper engage relay? I don't have weak flippers at start up I have no flippers. Once warm they are on full strength. Again assuming weak voltage to relay engaging high voltage to flippers.

Won't be home for a couple days but will look into it first chance I get. This one is wracking my brain and I want to get it resolved. More of a nuisance as after a couple minutes game will work flawlessly for the day.

#9 10 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

Its time to reflow some header pins.

Did the power board ones. Even though they looked perfect no change. Will check and do the CPU ones next chance I get.

#12 10 years ago

Thanks Viper. I'm not free until begining of next week. If you want to come by next week that's cool. If your at Allentown I can get you the shirts there too.

I will let you know when I check TP2 on the CPU.

-Jim

#14 10 years ago

What controls the inserts though? Lamp matrix correct? What opens the transistors to ground? 5v like the coil ore driver transistors? All my voltages from transformer are fine. Everything warms up at same rate and time. There has to be one common link to all this.

#16 10 years ago

Would this weak voltage to the lamps at the transformer only affect a few of the inserts? For example in the front center of the playfield. All passengers light up by there is an issue with the 4 playfield multiplier inserts and the green airport value inserts.
Also with LEDs in the weak dim inserts don't light at all until slowly one by one they come on as it warms up.

#21 10 years ago

GI has been great. No issues at all with it.

I obviously have a 5v issue somewhere at the least with the displays working off that. Lamp power would be the two 9.7v lines out of the transformer and coils the 26 and 48 lines. All test fine at pins from transformer at connector. Will try to test after that connector to see if I have a bad pin/connector connections seems odd that all of these pins would have to be equally flakey connections and how does this relate to the 5v issue since I have good 5b at power board? Also another equally flakey connection at CPU from power board perhaps. Very odd that multiple issues all "warmup" at the same rate. Also a bad connections will usually cut in/out when you wiggle connectors right? Can't make that happen with this.

I need to dig some good time in poking around again. Problem is I have limited time to test these things. Run a test. Turn it off quickly. Back on another test. Off quickly. After a couple tests I'm getting pretty warned up to no issues.

#22 10 years ago

Steady 4.94 at CPU TP2. Well above my buddies fully working taxi at 4.87. Looking at transformer connector now.

#23 10 years ago

No change on any behavior messing with transformer connector.

Tried disconnecting pinscore displays no change.

#24 10 years ago

Found this looking closely at CPU. Bad attempt as fixing acid

image-95.jpgimage-95.jpg

#29 10 years ago

I will hit it with vinegar and reflow/retin everything and see what happens. Worse case I pick up a rottendog in Allentown at a show price. Probably not a bad idea period to get a rottendog.

#33 10 years ago
Quoted from Pinballerchef:

Just get it fixed!! We Allentown pinball crazy heads have no tolerance for a machine working half assed....nobody likes to watch things "warm up"
My TFTC was doing the same thing and it was driving me bonkers......plus it started getting worse so I had it all fixed up for and in tip too shape. I'm feelin' for ya!

Don't wory. Board will be repaired or replaced by Allentown. All will be fine. Game will also be in the tournament.

I will probably order the parts and work on it over a couple nights and have a backup if all goes well.

-Jim

#34 9 years ago

Put in a working system11 CPU. All is well. Rottendog replacement is being picked up Friday morning at Allentown.

-Jim

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