(Topic ID: 96577)

Taxi for sale, power problems, turn and run?

By Pinball-Pat

9 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 26 posts
  • 11 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 9 years ago by msj2222
  • No one calls this topic a favorite

You

Linked Games

  • Taxi Williams, 1988
#1 9 years ago

Hi guys, I found a fixer-upper. But it doesn't really power up. When switched on, you get a sound tone, but no lights (translight or play field). Does this mean a bad board? What would be the first thought. I'd buy the machine and tinker with it but I'm scared it may be a board I can't buy anymore. I looked in the head, and I can see a diagnostic light blinking, but without a manual and standing in a strangers garage it's hard to troubleshoot. For 800$ should I risk it?

#2 9 years ago

Could be boards, a fuse, or a combination. Is everything there? How good is the cabinet and playfield?

#3 9 years ago

The good news is, all of the boards in that game are replaceable. It's a Williams System 11, which is basically everything they did between 1986-1990.

The bad news is, if there are multiple bad boards, you could be in for as much as you would be for a better example. I don't know System11 board prices, but assuming they're comparable to WPC (their later hardware,) you could be looking at a couple hundred bucks for a driver board and a few hundred for an MPU.

#4 9 years ago

At $800, it comes down to how inclined you are to do board repair work, and how nice the game is otherwise.

Taxi could be $1200-2000, depending on how it is cosmetically and whatnot. If you're willing to do circuit board repair, and have the tools (proper desoldering gun, preferably Hakko 808) and are willing to spend some time and/or read up on stuff online, you COULD have a really nice game for just over $800. By contrast, if it's got a rough playfield and bad plastics, and you're going to buy replacement boards, you could end up $1500 into a game that's barely worth $1000.

One bit thing to look at - the spinout ramp (where the ball launches) usually takes a beating. I believe they're finally being reproduced, but expect to spend $100-200 on one, I'd guess.

#5 9 years ago

I didn't have much luck finding board info online. I understand separate boards do different things. I heard a tone so I'm assuming the sound board is working. Somewhat at least. All the fuses looked good. I didn't see any obvious corrosion. Original looking battery holder with newish batteries in it. The of looks ok, dirty but not too worn. The cabinet is flaking on all sides. No plunger.

#6 9 years ago

That part is concerning. Taking it at face value, it's a $5ish part. The fact that it's missing means someone robbed a $5 part from this game to put on another game, in all likelihood. I know enough to have a decent idea what I'm looking at on boards; if I didn't, I'd see a missing plunger and run like hell.

If you post pictures of boards in the backbox, the battery holder, under the playfield, etc, maybe we can be more helpful.

#7 9 years ago

I'm decent at soldering, and can do some basic troubleshooting. Marco supplies on seemed to sell 1 board. It looked like there were quite a few in there. Can someone tell what mpu and driver board mean. Which would light up,the game?

#8 9 years ago

Yeah, I thought the same about the plunger thing. The mentioned they've had a few taxis over the years, and this is the last one. Make me think it could have been a donor. If they have the resources to fix it, but are choosing not to...
Maybe I should steer clear. I just got the itch so damn bad to buy something

#9 9 years ago

I didn't think to take any pictures...
Woulda coulda shoulda...

#10 9 years ago

Okay, so you've got a few boards in the backbox. I'm pretty green on System 11 games, but I'm sure someone who knows them can chime in. In the backbox, there should be:

CPU (which I mistakenly called an MPU earlier) - basically the brain of the game.
Driver board - controls solenoids and lamps
Audio board - sound stuff
Display board - controls the score display
Interconnect board - on System 11 games, I think this was basically a go-between for the driver board and stuff on the playfield.

While you would think the driver board would be your problem, if the game's not really doing anything, it's likely the CPU. Tho the batteries look good now, previous ones could've leaked. If acid wasn't cleaned up properly, that could be causing issues now.

#11 9 years ago
Quoted from Pinball-Pat:

The mentioned they've had a few taxis over the years, and this is the last one. Make me think it could have been a donor. If they have the resources to fix it, but are choosing not to...

I hate to say it, because Taxi is a fun game, but I probably would steer clear. It does sound like it's probably all the bad parts of several games.

It this a former operator, by chance?

#12 9 years ago

Missing parts and not working? Then offer accordingly or walk away.

$800 is way too much for a non working sys 11 game. Offer $200 and that's being generous.

Rob

#13 9 years ago

They wouldn't take $600.00
I'm not afraid of doing some work, and learning. But $800 does seem steep for this thing...

So it could be a driver board, and display board. Or just the interconnect board. I saw some pics online of battery corrosion on a chip below the batteries once. Can you get ahold of single chips anywhere or are the board replacements really the way to go?

Yeah, they are operators. Past or current, not totally sure.

Not very honest, telling me it could be worth 6 or 7K since its a Marylin edition. I know better. If I argued all the fictitious info I got there it would have been a pretty heated exchange. Instead a nodded my head I was told they commonly sell over 3k. Sheesh, used car tactics...

#14 9 years ago

Run. Don't walk. Machine is worth $400 being generous here. $300 would be fair. Anybody who knows enough to conjure up a bullshit story like that, really knows more about the current state of the machine than they are leading on. If you aren't fully versed in this machine, I would venture to guess there are other things that are missing or not working that you don't know what to look for, no offense. Serious save your money, time and anything else. If you are still talking to the guy, tell him $400 and leave your phone number and politely leave. Sometimes they don't call back, but sometimes they do.

-Jeff

#15 9 years ago

Yeah, you're looking at someone else's project (or worst possible combination of 4 separate projects.)

#16 9 years ago

I would not be surprised if you get a call back from him wanting that $600. Though after researching cost of potential boards, $400 should be the highest you would want to go. Watching Ebay, you can find an original working, non-acid damaged MPU (not one that had a lot of acid damage repair done to it) for $200. I would pick an original board over a Rottendog MPU anyday. Wise though to relocate the battery pack or install a NVRAM chip so you wouldn't have to worry about batteries anymore. A system 11A or system 11B MPU will work in this game, though you will not be able to upgrade to the NVRAM on the 11A board because of the replacement RAM being used.

So anytime you look at a pinball machine, whether it is working or not, is to locate the batteries and look for any corrosion on the batteries, battery pack, and above and below the battery pack. Yes, fumes can cause damage above the battery pack if the batteries were left a good long time.

I would suspect the MPU as the problem first off. If it does not boot, then you will not show anything on the display.
It could be possible that the MPU is booting even If there is acid damage to the parts below the battery pack, that likely could be the cause of the display not working.

Yes, it is not too difficult to source the parts for the MPU.
Minor MPU acid damage is ok to repair, but medium to heavy, I would replace the board.

#17 9 years ago

Be aware, just because it has a new battery holder, doesn't mean there isn't battery acid damage.
Good chance too that the interconnect board is burnt on the bottom right where the GI power comes in (assuming it is connected). Luckily, new replacement interconnect boards are now available for $110 plus shipping.
http://greatlakesmodular.com/

I would assume you would need the interconnect board, MPU and display (LED are available).
Depending on how nice you want it, you can get a new playfield and cabinet decals, possibly a backglass too.
Likely you could even up with a $2k to $2500 into the game if you do a lot to it.

#18 9 years ago

Couple things here

You can use a NVRAM chip in *any* sys11 game. The anypin NVRAM combo 5116/6264 version can be jumpered to either. You just leave 4 pins hanging outside the socket, and jumper it to run as a 5116 if you're using an original Sys11 MPU that can't accommodate a 6264.

If the game is complete other than that plunger, there are no big holes burned in boards, and the CPU board (Sys3-7 had separate CPU and driver boards. For Sys9 and Sys11, the CPU and driver combined the 2 separate boards into a single board) does not have corrosion, $800 is a deal. If the CPU has ugly corrosion, plan on a $300 replacement.

Displays could be a few hundred bucks, or it could be a problem on the power supply. I had a Taxi years ago, and the displays went out because of a single resistor - less than $1 in parts!

But, if you can't repair the boards yourself, keep in mind that sending them out could be $200-300 to have them all fixed up and rebuilt, assuming the CPU is economically repairable. That doesn't include displays, as generally, those are something you don't send out for repair.

I don't see why you'd replace the interconnect board. A burnt input connector is a pretty straightforward repair. A repaired original may never look like new, if it's burnt, but it can be repaired to be 100% functional relatively inexpensively!

#19 9 years ago

All this information is starting to paint a picture. The batteries were suspiciously new, considering they said they haven't checked out the machine in 10 years and haven't plugged it in even. They also mentioned a few times I could buy new boards.

I'm thinking they replaced the battery holder, since it looked "too new". There was a wiring harness unplugged. I thought at first it was an accident but maybe this hides other trouble. The thing is still pretty intriguing. The plunger was there too, lying in shambles inside the coin door.

Thanks for all the info everyone

#20 9 years ago

One more easy one guys...
What do the batteries actually do. Store high scores?

#21 9 years ago

They store all the settings (easy, hard, balls/play) as well as the audits (# of games played, # of extra balls, # of specials) plus of course scores. On a system 11, with dead batteries, it should flash "Adjust Failure" if the batteries are dead and force you to go into test mode to get past it.

I own 3 Sys11's and currently have a friend's Taxi here as I fix a few things for him. Given what you've described, and the clueless seller (or outright deceptive seller) I'd say $200 sight unseen (to me) is more than fair, $300-$400 tops if you are okay with playfield condition, plastics, plasmas and mechanics underneath.

Some sellers see listing prices on ebay = value vs. the actual sold auctions indicating value. IPDB is wrong, more than 200 Marilyn's exist, and is never gonna be worth $7K as they claim. Use your knowledge from actual closed auctions of working vs. non working from eBay and PinPedia.com's results to learn value.

On a Sys11, the CPU board does the brains, some sound, all solenoids/flashers, switch matrix and lamp matrix all in one. Untested they go for over $100, fully tested working $300 typically. Then there is a power board for GI, CPU and plasmas, then another board for solenoid power, then the plasma driver board which with 2 working plasmas run $125-$175 typically, plus a sound board that runs about $50 typically. So there alone you're at $500-$600 if the 3 main ones are missing or bad, added to $800 makes that a bad investment before you even start looking at plastics and playfield.

#22 9 years ago

Thanks Pac-Fan.

#23 9 years ago

I Ran!

I just couldn't get past my gut on this one. I'm pretty sure I could have fixed the boards up, but there were too many unknowns on this one. And the reputation of the folks I was shopping from preceded them. I came across a couple forum members who said they would "think long and hard" about doing any dealings there.
Thanks for all the input guys.
Feeling like I dodged a bullet.
I'll find something yet.

#24 9 years ago

I've learned gut instincts are the ones to go to when you are in a bind between really wanting something and not sure if it is right. You made the right call.

#25 9 years ago

Sometimes ops will put every broken board they own, all into one game.

Seen it many times.

#26 9 years ago
Quoted from Pinball-Pat:

I Ran!
I just couldn't get past my gut on this one. I'm pretty sure I could have fixed the boards up, but there were too many unknowns on this one. And the reputation of the folks I was shopping from preceded them. I came across a couple forum members who said they would "think long and hard" about doing any dealings there.
Thanks for all the input guys.
Feeling like I dodged a bullet.
I'll find something yet.

Good Move!

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