(Topic ID: 323056)

Target Alpha Issue

By EMBrain

1 year ago



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  • 7 posts
  • 2 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by EMBrain
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IMG-5465 (resized).jpg
Target Alpha Motor 1C scoring (resized).jpg
Target Alpha G relay (resized).jpg
#1 1 year ago

The game plays perfectly except once in a while it will add 1000 points to two players, happens even when a one player game is active, when the ball kicks out and the targets reset. The 1000's chime goes off and the 1000's reel for PX and PX+1 activates.
Bonus scoring and double bonus scoring all pay out exactly what is required.
I'm positive the 'G' relay is activating on the target reset somehow. Like I said it's rare occurrence maybe once even 10 games.
Any help would be appreciated.

#2 1 year ago

Do you mean that the G/Bonus Score Control relay fires again, after the bonus has been counted, while the ball is being returned? If so, it could be that the 15th Position Make/Break switch on the Bonus Unit is gapped a little too close.
Target Alpha G relay (resized).jpgTarget Alpha G relay (resized).jpg
I think the way this works is that when the ball drains, the G relay fires until the Bonus unit has stepped through all 15 steps. When the Bonus Unit reaches the 15th position the Make/Break switch in the red box should toggle and fire the O/Ball Return relay. The normally closed 15th Position switch (at the bottom of the schematic above) should relax the G relay at the same time.

If the Make/Break switch chatters while the targets reset but the ball is still in the Out Hole you might fire the G relay again in addition to the O/Ball Return relay.

/Mark

2 weeks later
#3 1 year ago

Thanks Mark, I'll take a look and and make and adjustment, it's exactly as you discussed.

1 month later
#4 1 year ago

So, back to this issue with , Target Alpha, multiple players receiving points. It was originally with the 1000's point but it moved to the 100' now. My current situation is that when the ball drains and pays bonus the ball is kicked out and over the through switch, is when the anomaly occurs. I believe it is when the 'P' relay activates the 5 bank target through a switch on 3B and the player unit activate and if a target is down the switch will activate on the way back up! causing the D relay to kick in and provide 500 point across multiple players as the player unit is moving..
What blocks the target bank from adding points when the target is reset? Is this a timing issue?

#5 1 year ago
Quoted from EMBrain:

What blocks the target bank from adding points when the target is reset? Is this a timing issue?

A lot of the scoring, including the drop targets, is disabled while the Score Motor is running by a normally closed switch at position 1C (in the red box below).
Target Alpha Motor 1C scoring (resized).jpgTarget Alpha Motor 1C scoring (resized).jpg
If that switch doesn't open or is shorted somehow while the Score Motor is running points could continue to score. A simple test would be to nudge the Score Motor so that it starts turning, then hit a 10 point switch or an inlane rollover switch to see if it scores. Those switches should be ignored while the motor is turning too.

#6 1 year ago

Thanks Mark for the insight. I've gone over switch 1C and tested the scoring and it seems to be working OK. After a few jumper tests the issue seems to be somewhere between 3B (blue) and the COIL and the fuse holder on the 5 bank target.

I have a jumper on the load side of the fuses, between the purple to yellow wires, and pulled the fuse for the 5 bank target, so two coils are using the same fuse and the same motor switch 2B, and all works OK.

I then jumpered directly from 2B ( 10 bank target reset switch) Orange wire to the load side to the fuse (yellow) with the fuse pulled on the 5 bank target and it works OK.

Current status is the jumper on the load side as the image shows, seems to be a workaround until I find the real cause.

IMG-5465 (resized).jpgIMG-5465 (resized).jpg
#7 1 year ago

So, I dug into the 3B switch and it was gapped to close..I regapped and removed my jumper and all is good. 3B is difficult to see without pulling out the motor. I adjusted and tested with DMM and motor rotation.

I guess the 3B would close ( when it shouldn’t) and when the P relay pulled in it would fire the reset on the 5 bank target just before the motor starts… causing extra points to be added across multiple players.

At least that is my analysis …

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