(Topic ID: 197901)

Target Alpha

By mikusm

6 years ago

Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 16 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 years ago by steviechs
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders


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#1 6 years ago

A little help on my TA. Game works fine, however, scores bonus slow. One click on the bonus per cycle instead of five. I have aligned the bonus relay. Any ideas?

#2 6 years ago

Check the bonus unit to see if it's sticking. Manually operate the the bonus unit to see if it rotates smoothly...

#3 6 years ago

I had the same issue and it was a switch on the bonus relay, I think G that that wasn't getting pulled in by a switch on the score motor. If I manually held in the bonus relay the counter fired off like a machine gun 5 at a time.

My recollection of the relay might be wrong, typing this up at work.

#4 6 years ago

I see that the G relay should engage and stay locked in until the bonus unit hits the 15th position but mine is cycling. The circuit that should hold it down consists of the Dx, 15th pos."bonus" unit (NC), G, Q (NC), Ax (NC), and S (NC). The unit is working but counting slowly which rules out Dx, Q, Ax, and S leaving 15th pos and G. I have cleaned both switches and ensured they are makin contact. I've checked all the wires and am able to ohm it out from th Dx switch to the Ax. I'm stumped. Please help.

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#5 6 years ago

To confirm, this problem occurs when the bonus points are counting down? Can you post a photo of the circuit that contains the G relay coil, and a photo of the reset bonus unit coil circuit that shows the complete circuit from left to right?

#6 6 years ago

Both circuits (G) relay and Add "Bonus" unit are in the pic

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#7 6 years ago

Yes. To confirm. When the bonus unit is counting down.

#8 6 years ago

What you described is exactly the issue I had. Check & clean the 1C and 2B score motor switches

One of those 2 locations fires 5 times per motor revolution (visible on the motor pulse diagram near the index). The other one is probably the culprit

#9 6 years ago

You can also check the operation of the reset bonus unit coil. Check the P relay switch with the slate/red wire and red/white wire. Make sure the switch is clean and adjusted properly... Do you have a multi-meter? You can check the resistance of the reset bonus unit coil (solenoid). It should have a resistance of 2.0 or higher. 2.5 or higher is ideal...

#10 6 years ago

Hi mikusm
I do not know the Target Alpha - I do have an hard to read copy of the schematics. First "general thoughts / words / questions": Did Your pin ever work in Your possession the way You would like it to run ? In ipdb I see that in the last ball You will be rewarded "double bonus" ? Does this work ?
Can You fully play - it is just a "nasty, upsetting" problem ? Did You search the net with --- youtube target alpha --- and have watched the videos "how the bonus is handled" ?
In Your collection I do not see another EM-Pin with "Bonus Feature". Are You familiar with the "regular Bonus-Ladder" like Far Out or Surf Champ ?: http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=823&picno=52841 --- http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=2459&picno=34780 ?
I believe that in Target Alpha the Bonus (count down) is handled different - it is not a ladder as in Far Out / Surf Champ - it is an 15 or 16 position stepper - every time You loose a ball: This stepper is stepped through all positions --- Your answer to this question following is important to me (understanding): Does Your Bonus-Unit have "ONLY one coil mounted means single steps in just one direction" --- or does Your Bonus-Unit have "TWO coils mounted means it does sometimes step forward - but sometimes it resets" ? (((I assume ONLY one coil - but I ask about to know the truth)))
This stepper is stepped through all positions - each position corresponds with one of the 15 drop-Down-Targets - a "step to an position and the pin asks": Has THIS Drop-Down-Target dropped - then I give 1000 or 2000 points to the Score-Drum --- a step to the next position (next DD-Target) and the same question / maybe action and on and on.

When You do work in Your pin: Do only one thing - then do some tests - I strongly advice "not to loose the 'not so pleasing BUT RUNNING feature of bonus rewarding' " --- one thing, then some tests - so You always can go back / undo what You have done.

When we do troubleshooting we talk about "look at the switch-whatsoever - is this switch acting good - are the contact-points clean" --- we always must consider: A wire can be broken-off somewhere (the switch-whatsoever is good) - the wire on the other end of this wire coming to the switch-whatsoever - on the other end the wire has broken-off.

I show some snippets of "my not so good schematics" - please show of better quality "what I have encircled red" --- in the encircled red area I do have problems understanding ...
Please show a good copy of the area "activating the G-Relay" - the "marked orange" stuff I interpret: "Motor-4D-Switch" is to start the feature of "handling bonus-points to give" - then the "Motor-4A-Switch" is pulsing - five times per turn means five times per "one-third of a revolution". IF (if, if) the "Switch on K-Relay" is truely closed (and the connecting wires are good) - if the "Switch on K-Relay" is truely closed: All pulses coming from "Motor-4A-Switch" can pass and make the Bonus-Stepper step through the positions.
The K-Relay is an 6VAC-Relay - its coil is shown in the Lights-Sction - the K-Relay has just this only-one Normally-Closed-Switch --- in the last ball the K-Relay constantly pulls - its switch is open - NOT ALL of the five pulses of the "Motor-4A-Switch" can pass - I believe to read "Motor-2D and Motor-3B" - they match with "closing of an Motor-4A pulse" --- when You have double-bonus: ONLY TWO steppings on the Bonus-Stepper are done - so there is time to give TWO thousand points on the "encircled red area" - and the "encircled red area" I do not understand.

When You want to troubleshoot: Have a good look at the only switch mounted on the K-Relay --- contact-points clean ? - truely closed ? connecting wires soldered-on ? Do not forget: The other ends of the connecting wires run to Score-Motor-Switches - THERE all good ?

Wild guessing to explain the behavior of Your pin: The K-Relay switch is no good and one of the Motor-Switches is also not good (either Motor-2D or Motor-3B). Greetings Rolf

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#11 6 years ago

Hi mikusm
maybe the fault is "my wild guessing, end of post-10" - maybe the fault is in the "activating the G-Relay - THERE the pulses of Motor-4A are hindered to pass" - so I need to see the area in the schematics "activating the G-Relay" --- and to understand how the 1000 or 2000 points per Drop-Down-Target are given: I need to see a better "encircled red area, JPG in post-10". Greetings Rolf

#12 6 years ago

Hi mikusm
grumble - my JPG, post-10 is an old one --- I had an closer look, well - the activating of the G-Relay is on the bottom of my JPG - I come to Your "post-4, G-Relay is cycling" --- what happens when You MANUALLY press the armature of the G-Relay - have (manually) activated the G-Relay for a long time (till end of the Bonus-feature) ? Please give an more detailled description of "G-Relay is cycling" - make references to Score-Motor-Turns, to Score-Motor-Positions. Greetings Rolf

#13 6 years ago

Hi mikusm
see the JPG here - my "brown stuff" --- IF (if, if) the "Self-Hold-Switch on G-Relay, brown question mark" is not good - not closing --- then the motor starts running and as the motor-1c-switch (brown marked) opens: no more connextion therefore the G-Relay drops out --- there is only time to make one pulse of the "motor-4A pulses to step the Bonus-Unit" --- see on the left upper corner in the motor timing chart. This explains the slow motion stepping on the Bonus-Unit - one step per "turn means a third of a revolution". And because the G-Relay quits pulling (upper right corner): Only the first shot of the pulses reach the L-1000-points-relay.
So investigate in the "bottom of JPG" wiring - and to prove me right or prove me wrong: Manually keep the G-Relay activated - are now the bonus given fast ? Greetings Rolf

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#14 6 years ago

The problem is in the brown area. I can home out through the path and there is continuity however G doesn't lock engaged until the 15th position switch opens. When I jumper from relay side of 15th position switch to SL-wH side of G switch it works. Machine went on the fritz from all or the movement and I'm trying to get it working again to verify.

#15 6 years ago

Hi mikusm
I am german speaking - I do not understand "machine went on the Fritz" - my impression is "something non-pleasing".

When You manually keep the G-Relay activated: Does the pin behave "normal speed stepping" ? I put many letters on the wiring - from where to where do You "jumper and it works" ?
Do You jumper "E to F" ? IF (if, if) "Yes" --- where is the Bonus Unit mounted ? - and where is the G-Relay mounted ? IF (if, if) The Bonus-Unit is mounted on the playfield and the relay sits in the cabinet: There must be a connecting wire and this connecting wire runs through an Jones-Plug. All good ? Greetings Rolf

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#16 6 years ago
Quoted from rolf_martin_062:

where is the Bonus Unit mounted ? - and where is the G-Relay mounted ?

Correct, bonus unit is on the playfield, G-relay is on the bottom board.

Quoted from rolf_martin_062:

I am german speaking - I do not understand "machine went on the Fritz" - my impression is "something non-pleasing".

This means something is wrong, usually unknown or not always able to reproduce the issue. Most likely OP is trying to get the game back to a working state to finish looking at the bonus issue

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