TAF, 4 Bookcase optos not working. 53,54,55, and 56.

(Topic ID: 233038)

TAF, 4 Bookcase optos not working. 53,54,55, and 56.


By Kazak

19 days ago



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  • 18 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 11 days ago by Pesmerga
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 19 days ago

TAF, 4 Bookcase optos not working. 53,54,55, and 56. Everything else is fine, unlike similar forum topics which include Thing also malfunctioning etc. All went out together sometime between shut down and start-up. No response at all in switch tests. Anyone had this? What's the best place to start? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

#2 19 days ago

Do your other optos work? I would suspect the 12-volt fuse as a simple answer if all of the optical switches don’t work suddenly. Pull fuses and check with a meter.

#3 19 days ago

They all the a "5" in common. Look at your switch matrix in the manual, look for the "5" wire color and other switches it goes to, then look for a broken wire.

Check the moving harness with the book case for a broken wire too. Could be broken inside the casing where you can't see it. Did you remove the top of the book case ? I'd start there, maybe broken wire/solder joint.

LTG : )

#4 19 days ago
Quoted from pintechev:

Do your other optos work? I would suspect the 12-volt fuse as a simple answer if all of the optical switches don’t work suddenly. Pull fuses and check with a meter.

F115 and F116 OK. Other Optos all seem OK.

#5 19 days ago

OK - then follow Lloyd’s advice - could be a broken wire.

#6 19 days ago
Quoted from LTG:

They all the a "5" in common. Look at your switch matrix in the manual, look for the "5" wire color and other switches it goes to, then look for a broken wire.
Check the moving harness with the book case for a broken wire too. Could be broken inside the casing where you can't see it. Did you remove the top of the book case ? I'd start there, maybe broken wire/solder joint.
LTG : )

All OK under bookcase lid. All other things in column 5 switch matrix OK. With all4 being open, is it possible it's a common wire or solder joint ssomewhere? Can I check with a test point or anything? (Novice)?

#7 19 days ago

I'd grab a meter and start at the bookcase. Take the top off. Check continuity of each wire from the top to the connector below the playfield.

LTG : )

#8 14 days ago
Quoted from LTG:

I'd grab a meter and start at the bookcase. Take the top off. Check continuity of each wire from the top to the connector below the playfield.
LTG : )

Checked out continuity of LED's bookcase to connector... all OK. Is there a way to tell if it's the lower optos, or the top LEDs that are the problem? All 4 are always open. I hate removing the turntable unless I have to. I appreciate your thoughts on the matter. Thanks

#9 14 days ago

Infrared IR Remote Tester/Detector - Card With Double Sided Foam Tape amazon.com link »

These are getting hard to find, but I’ve used one since I was in high school when it was still dad’s route repairing optos. It’s made to test TV remotes but it works good to tell you if your IR LED is on. We used to use phone cameras but that doesn’t seem like it works anymore and as of late, we just replace the opto if it’s in question. This being said, I have to agree with where LTG said to look...most likely failure here is a broken wire. Ground or +12VDC.

#10 14 days ago
Quoted from ryanbrooks:

Infrared IR Remote Tester/Detector - Card With Double Sided Foam Tape amazon.com link »
These are getting hard to find, but I’ve used one since I was in high school when it was still dad’s route repairing optos. It’s made to test TV remotes but it works good to tell you if your IR LED is on. We used to use phone cameras but that doesn’t seem like it works anymore and as of late, we just replace the opto if it’s in question. This being said, I have to agree with where LTG said to look...most likely failure here is a broken wire. Ground or +12VDC.

Have checked LEDs with infra red cam. All OK. Have tested receivers with a torch, all work in Switch Test 3 , but I have noticed on the display that the torch will light up all the xs on rows 3-6 of the switch matrix. (depending on where I shine the light). Yet I still get nothing from the LED's, even though they are on according to the infra-red camera. Noticed my J208 appears to be connected to J209 (are these parallel?). Very confused, but thanks for your persistence.

#11 13 days ago

You are 100% sure SW57, the bumper lane opto for thing flips is working? Roll a ball over it again to be sure. All 5 optos in a column out at once would be a common problem. Four out of five does not seem common.
If for sure only the 4 bookcase optos are effected, the only real logical causes are either loss of ground to the LEDs or loss of 12v supply to the receivers.
If possible put a voltmeter on dc volts on the LEDs. One connection of each LED should be zero volts (ground) the other 1v to 1.5vdc. This gives you the volts across each LED to light them.
Check volts on all 4 receivers. Volts should be 12vdc on one lead of each, the other lead will toggle from zero to 12v depending on whether the opto beam is blocked on not.
If all this checks normal, procede to the 7 opto PCB and make sure all wiring there toggles the same way for each opto. Two different LM339s are used on the board for these four opto switches, so seems to me it's not the 7 opto board most likely.
The most common thing would be in reality all 5 optos are not working, and in that case it would be the wire from the 7 opto board that is column 5 is broken off one of the other non-opto column 5 switches on the playfield.
Good luck.

#12 12 days ago
Quoted from Ronkz650:

You are 100% sure SW57, the bumper lane opto for thing flips is working? Roll a ball over it again to be sure. All 5 optos in a column out at once would be a common problem. Four out of five does not seem common.
If for sure only the 4 bookcase optos are effected, the only real logical causes are either loss of ground to the LEDs or loss of 12v supply to the receivers.
If possible put a voltmeter on dc volts on the LEDs. One connection of each LED should be zero volts (ground) the other 1v to 1.5vdc. This gives you the volts across each LED to light them.
Check volts on all 4 receivers. Volts should be 12vdc on one lead of each, the other lead will toggle from zero to 12v depending on whether the opto beam is blocked on not.
If all this checks normal, procede to the 7 opto PCB and make sure all wiring there toggles the same way for each opto. Two different LM339s are used on the board for these four opto switches, so seems to me it's not the 7 opto board most likely.
The most common thing would be in reality all 5 optos are not working, and in that case it would be the wire from the 7 opto board that is column 5 is broken off one of the other non-opto column 5 switches on the playfield.
Good luck.

Thanks heaps. I had missed diagnosing sw57. As soon as I can I will check for broken wire as you described. This makes perfect sense to me... thank you. Will let you know outcome.

#13 12 days ago
Quoted from Ronkz650:

The most common thing would be in reality all 5 optos are not working, and in that case it would be the wire from the 7 opto board that is column 5 is broken off one of the other non-opto column 5 switches on the playfield.
Good luck.

Bummer. Have checked and the three non-opto swtiches on that column of matrix all work ok. What did you make of the fact in my previous post about rows on switches activating with the Optos according to the DMD display in Test mode 3? It would appear to be a short, but like I say, the opto LED's are lit and the sensors seem to be working (not in conjunction, though) in test mode. The bookcase LED optos read above 1v across their terminals when when machine is on. I think they are emitting IR as my video cam suggests. I really hope to lick this one...
Thanks for your persistence and patience.

#14 12 days ago
Quoted from Kazak:

Bummer. Have checked and the three non-opto swtiches on that column of matrix all work ok. What did you make of the fact in my previous post about rows on switches activating with the Optos according to the DMD display in Test mode 3? It would appear to be a short, but like I say, the opto LED's are lit and the sensors seem to be working (not in conjunction, though) in test mode. The bookcase LED optos read above 1v across their terminals when when machine is on. I think they are emitting IR as my video cam suggests. I really hope to lick this one...
Thanks for your persistence and patience.

Should the red LED on the 7 opto board be on? (It's not).

#15 12 days ago
Quoted from Kazak:

Should the red LED on the 7 opto board be on? (It's not).

Just found "Row short message on Bookcase opto 4, when open and closed using a torch (message when it closes). Does this help you help me? When I light Opto receiver 3 (sw55) the whole row of the matrix for sw56 -Opto 4 - Row 6 again, lights up. Now I'm having a hard time get a response from opto 1 and 2. I think perhaps a short in row 6? But all switches in row 6 except opto 4 bookcase (sw56) seem to be OK

#16 11 days ago

Yes the LED on the opto board should be lit. If it's not lit you've lost the 12v power supply somehow, and no way in the world any opto can function that the board controls. Have you checked the 12v supply on the opto board?

#17 11 days ago
Quoted from Ronkz650:

Yes the LED on the opto board should be lit. If it's not lit you've lost the 12v power supply somehow, and no way in the world any opto can function that the board controls. Have you checked the 12v supply on the opto board?

How do I test voltage to the board? Sorry about taking so long to get to this diagnostic point, but I sense we are almost there. Have been reading the Bally repair guide, and doing what I can. At where and what points could I test with DMM to check 12v to the board? Have triple checked F115 and F116. Grateful for your help and persistence.

#18 11 days ago
Quoted from Kazak:

How do I test voltage to the board? Sorry about taking so long to get to this diagnostic point, but I sense we are almost there. Have been reading the Bally repair guide, and doing what I can. At where and what points could I test with DMM to check 12v to the board? Have triple checked F115 and F116. Grateful for your help and persistence.

According to the 7-opto board schematic you have to check at j3 (pins 1-2) and j2 (pins 10-9) for the 12v! Also i suggest to check if the capacitors on the board have leaked acid..they often fail..

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