(Topic ID: 154529)

T3 startup issue


By CookyJar

3 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 34 posts
  • 7 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by CookyJar
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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#1 3 years ago

Having a startup issue with my T3. Setup the machine and everything seemed to work right, went into the menus to adjust some of the options. I can scroll in and out of the menus, but cannot change any of the adjustment values for some reason. So my quick fix idea is to pull the batteries and reset the system, bad idea. Now when I go to startup the machine it tries to boot, then goes to "open door". I open the coin door and attempt to go into the menus, but none of the buttons work. So right now it's stuck in the "open door" and I can't get anywhere with it. Has anyone ever experienced this problem, or know what could be causing it?

#2 3 years ago

Can you snap a picture of the right corner of the MPU all around the battery pack? I suspect battery alkaline damage.

#3 3 years ago

Looked clean, didn't see any damage. Here's some pics of the battery area.

IMG_20160311_090335_(resized).jpg

IMG_20160311_090344_(resized).jpg

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#4 3 years ago

Re seed the ribbon cables.

#5 3 years ago

I would do what surfsled suggested as a first step. You do have some battery corrosion on the spring where the lowest battery is sitting in the holder. I would either replaced that battery holder with a new one or install anyPin NVRam to eliminate it altogether.

#6 3 years ago

Thanks. Will try re seating the ribbon cables and see how it goes.

#7 3 years ago

I think you may have a bad row or column failure in your switch matrix.
if I recall, the switch matrix input is coming into the MPU at CN7 to the left of the battery pack.
So, can you measure all the resistors to the left of the battery pack and report the resistances?

I would imagine you could still add coins to be able to play the game.

#8 3 years ago

I tried reseating the connectors and checking the ribbon cables with no luck. Didn't have time to check the resistor measurements as the pin is at work and I ran out of time today. Also, I'm not sure exactly how to measure the resistors.

Can't add coins as the game will not even boot. It's just odd that it worked with the exception of not being able to change the settings, then after just pulling the batteries it wouldn't boot. Could it be a bad ROM? Will have to continue to check on Monday. Any other thoughts are welcome.

#9 3 years ago

Will try reseating the ROM too

#10 3 years ago

Ok, so I checked the board for acid damage, nothing. I re-seated all the connectors and socketed chips and nothing, the game still won't boot and will display "Open door", which does nothing when opened. Looked through all the connectors under the playfield and just a general look through, the only minor thing I came across was a loose wire to the backbox fuse holder. Also, one of the playfield G.I. fuses keeps blowing, F27 I believe.

Other then checking the resistors (which I'm not sure how to do) as recommended by PinballManiac, I'm not sure what else to do. Any ideas?

#11 3 years ago

Set your meter to about 10k or 20k ohms or just ohms (horseshoe) and measure each resistor there. The row of resistors should read all close in value.

"Open door" usually indicates failed batteries or if you just installed new batteries, that you need to do through your adjustment menu and making sure that you see the game reset, otherwise "open door" message will continue to show every time you open the door.

#12 3 years ago

I wish I lived closer.

#13 3 years ago

Try reseating the first 2 connectors just to the top left of the battery pack.

#14 3 years ago

Stern have the worst battery holders. It is quite likely the connection to the battery pack has become lose as a result of changing the batteries. I have had that happen with Stern games. I would take the board off and reflow the solder to the battery pack. That will solve your "open door" issue, I believe, so you can focus on the other issue.

Afraid I haven't experience the other issue.

#15 3 years ago

The resistors seem to have the same value. Pulled the board and tested the battery voltage on the board and I'm getting the correct voltage. Resseated the connectors to the left of the battery pack, no luck. Once I open the coin door, i can't get into the menu, which may be related to my not being able to change the adjustments earlier.

Also, all of the GI fuses have 8amp fuses instead of 5amp. And the F27 GI fuse keeps burning up as soon as I put a 5amp in and power up

#16 3 years ago

Figured out one problem, the memory protect switch on the coin door was stuck. So even when I opened the door it still thought it was closed and wouldn't reset and boot up. So now I have a booting working game! Nice simple solution after pulling the board, checking/reseating connectors, etc.

However, still haven't figured out the other problem. One of the G.I. fuses (F27) keeps popping immediately on game boot. Not sure when the problem originated, as I just picked up the machine. I did have it shopped and LED'd before pickup. Any ideas on where I should start looking for the source of the problem?

#17 3 years ago

I would look at every GI lamp and look for a short: ie. solder splash or wires touching in places they shouldn't be touching.

#18 3 years ago
Quoted from surfsled:

I would look at every GI lamp and look for a short: ie. solder splash or wires touching in places they shouldn't be touching.

Doing that now, didn't realize that the pop bumpers are on the same GI wiring. Never noticed that on Williams games.

#19 3 years ago

Figured it out! Traced through the G.I. line and found a bad socket. The bottom had fallen off and was touching the other connection which caused it to short and blow the fuse.

#20 3 years ago

You may want to go and upgrade to NVRAM. That MPU is not easy to find if it gets damaged to the point it is not economical to repair.

#21 3 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

You may want to go and upgrade to NVRAM. That MPU is not easy to find if it gets damaged to the point it is not economical to repair.

Haven't tried NVRAM, but I've been wanting to. Actually going to put this T3 on location and see how it does.

#22 3 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

You may want to go and upgrade to NVRAM. That MPU is not easy to find if it gets damaged to the point it is not economical to repair.

Do you have any suggestions on where to buy NVRAM if quality is most important and cost is least important? Many thanks

#23 3 years ago

This is a new NVRAM and not the only one out there. I've been buying from here.
http://www.pinitech.com/products/6264_adapter.php

So it is an easy upgrade for your Stern T3 Whitestar game. Remove your batteries. Pull out the old ram and install the NVRAM (notch pointing down). Then you just reset for Free Play and any other settings. Turn it off for at least 5 seconds and turn it back on so you know it is holding the settings.

#24 3 years ago

BenetBoy78, what game are you going to put NVRAM in?

#25 3 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

BenetBoy78, what game are you going to put NVRAM in?

I wanted to do all of them. I have Williams/Bally and latest Sterns.

Does the machine always need to be plugged in? If not, how does that work?

Many thanks, Mike V

I opened up my collection so you can see and advise. Again, thank you!!

#26 3 years ago
Quoted from BenetBoy78:

I wanted to do all of them. I have Williams/Bally and latest Sterns.
Does the machine always need to be plugged in? If not, how does that work?
Many thanks, Mike V
I opened up my collection so you can see and advise. Again, thank you!!

The new types of NVRAM use "FRAM" (ferroelectric RAM) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferroelectric_RAM These do not use any batteries, the machine does not need to be powered on, etc etc. Think of it as just a magic way that without batteries, the new memory chip/adapter can retain all the high scores & game settings for 45+ years.

The easiest way to figure out what you need is to look up your game on IPDB.org and see the manufacturer / boardset information there (ie. Sega Whitestar). Sega being the manufacturer, Whitestar being the boardset. Then you can use the charts on the nvram product pages at PINITECH.com to figure out what RAM you would need.

Disclosure: The "Pinitech" website mentioned above is mine. I've tried to make it easy to figure out what your upgrade options are for nvram, where to locate existing RAM, what is an easy swap-out and what boardsets usually require having to desolder the existing RAM and install a socket. You're welcome to PM or email me if you'd like and I can help you figure things out further based on the games you'd want to upgrade.

#27 3 years ago
Quoted from BenetBoy78:

I wanted to do all of them. I have Williams/Bally and latest Sterns.

I ask since you don't show a collection list.
All DE, Sega, and the Stern SAM games will be the easiest ones to do as it would be to pop out the old chip and install the new one.

#28 3 years ago
Quoted from BenetBoy78:

I opened up my collection so you can see and advise. Again, thank you!!

Uhh...maybe your collection is not set to public view or something.

#29 3 years ago

Very cool. Thinking of picking up two since I also have a LOTR. I don't care about resetting everything on the T3, but is there any way to replace with NVRAM with out loosing the current memory? Like when you replace the batteries with the machine on so everything won't be lost?

#30 3 years ago
Quoted from CookyJar:

Very cool. Thinking of picking up two since I also have a LOTR. I don't care about resetting everything on the T3, but is there any way to replace with NVRAM with out loosing the current memory? Like when you replace the batteries with the machine on so everything won't be lost?

Looks like you need 4.
Taxi has a System 11B board which are very hard to find original boards for. Get this one taken care of before your WPC games is what I do suggest. The old RAM will have to be cut off or carefully desoldered and install an IC socket.

#31 3 years ago
Quoted from CookyJar:

Very cool. Thinking of picking up two since I also have a LOTR. I don't care about resetting everything on the T3, but is there any way to replace with NVRAM with out loosing the current memory? Like when you replace the batteries with the machine on so everything won't be lost?

No sorry. No chance of saving the setting or scores. You do not want to plug this in with power on. Removing the old RAM off the board will be the same as removing the batteries=memory loss.

#32 3 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Looks like you need 4.
Taxi has a System 11B board which are very hard to find original boards for. Get this one taken care of before your WPC games is what I do suggest. The old RAM will have to be cut off or carefully desoldered and install an IC socket.

Yikes, looks like I haven't updated my collection on Pinside in a while! I sold my Taxi to get a Whirlwind, then I traded my Whirlwind and Rollergames for a Twilight Zone and I just recently traded my TZ for the T3.

Quoted from PinballManiac40:

No sorry. No chance of saving the setting or scores. You do not want to plug this in with power on. Removing the old RAM off the board will be the same as removing the batteries=memory loss.

Oh, well I figure that wasn't possible but wanted to double check anyway. Thanks!

3 weeks later
#33 3 years ago

Any luck with installing NVRAM ?
Hope you got your Stern games done at least.

#34 3 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Any luck with installing NVRAM ?
Hope you got your Stern games done at least.

Decided to wait till Allentown and see if I can pick it up then. If not then I'll buy online.

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