System 7 and/or pinballpcb help

I have a Jungle Lord machine that was given to me. When I got the machine it was missing the MPU and the Driver Board. I first ordered a new MPU with roms and driver board from pinballpcb.com. We got those installed and noticed that the LED on the MPU was staying locked on "0" and the blanking light would not come on. I looked in the manual for the MPU and it states that the blanking light must be on for the MPU to function correctly. It states that the likely cause is the connection to the driver board or the IC23 chip. The power supply was putting out some funky readings and was rigged up in the first place with some burnt connectors. So I ordered an new power supply, and sound board as it was working intermittently and replaced them. Now it has good clean power, all the GI lights are coming on and the sound works when tested with the diagnostic button. Tried turning on the machine with the new power supply and the MPU still stayed locked up at "0". I spoke with pinballpcb and they suggested that I try "unlocking" the board by turning the machine on and off quickly. I did so and nothing changed. They then sent me out replacement chips of IC1, IC13, and IC19b. I replaced the IC1 as instructed first and turned on the machine. When I did 3 of the 5 drop targets popped up on the rear bank and the F2 fuse blew. The blanking light never came on the MPU stayed on "0". I replaced the fuse and turned back on the machine. Nothing happened, no fuse blown, but the volts came up correctly on the voltmeter for the power supply, above 28v. I proceeded to change the other 2 chips that they sent me and they didn't change anything. The MPU still stays locked up with the LED displaying "0". The scoring displays never come on, I assume because the MPU never boots.

I have included pictures to show what is going on.
Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

IMG_4324 (resized).jpg

IMG_4325 (resized).jpg

IMG_4326 (resized).jpg

IMG_4327 (resized).jpg

IMG_4328 (resized).jpg

IMG_4329 (resized).jpg

#2 3 years ago

BMC

athens95

McCullough Amusements

Cincinnati, OH

10y 57,900 364 52

Nice, more rare, version of the red cabinet Jungle Lord.

Seems you did just about everything correct. But the game won't boot. I didn't see anything on your displays either.

Being all new replacement boards this is a tough one to troubleshoot with most people.

When I get a game like this I proceed like the below.
1. Unplug everything except power going into Power supply.
2. Turn game on and check all voltages at power supply.
3. Hook up CPU/Driver board to incoming power ONLY. With all other solenoids and lights not connected. On this game you have to have CPU and Driver together.
4. Turn on, see what happens. If you don't get good signals here you have a CPU or driver board problem that has to be corrected before you proceed.
5. If above is good, with game off attach display output and turn on. See if this works.
6. If still working, slowly plug in other features. One at a time, obviously while game is off. And see where your problem is.

If you have something blown in the PF, you will narrow your search when you blow the fuse just after you plug in that device.

With you swapping out so many chips I am nervous that you have one leg off, bent, bad contact and you might have to call in some help to get the PCB's up and working. If your boards are good hopefully you will get past that step and find a bad coil or some other issue causing your problem.

#3 3 years ago

JON

Schwaggs

A zero remaining on the display means the program is not running (most common) or the display PIA is bad (would be VERY unusual on a new board).

If the CPU does not run, the blanking signal will never enable.

Focus on the MPU board ROM chips. Make sure they are all in the right sockets and none of the pins are bent under.

If you ever install one backwards, it will blow the ROM chip so make sure you haven't installed any backward and if you have, you will need to replace it.

#4 3 years ago

???

rx2006je

Pinside+ Frequent

Quoted from Schwaggs:
A zero remaining on the display means the program is not running (most common) or the display PIA is bad (would be VERY unusual on a new board).
If the CPU does not run, the blanking signal will never enable.
Focus on the MPU board ROM chips. Make sure they are all in the right sockets and none of the pins are bent under.
If you ever install one backwards, it will blow the ROM chip so make sure you haven't installed any backward and if you have, you will need to replace it.

How do I know if I have installed one backwards? I will try going through a step process. I may send the boards back to pcbpinball to let them check the board so see if they are good.

#5 3 years ago

JON

Schwaggs

OP
Quoted from rx2006je:
How do I know if I have installed one backwards? I will try going through a step process. I may send the boards back to pcbpinball to let them check the board so see if they are good.

I don't think you can tell by looking at them. You need a ROM burner/reader to verify them.

Check all the ROMS for bent pins and double check you have the ROMS in the right sockets, verify you have the switches set correctly.

Post a close-up picture of the ROMS and switches so we can help you doublecheck them.

#6 3 years ago

???

rx2006je

Pinside+ Frequent

Here are pictures of the switches and rom chips on the board. Flipper rom IC17 was the only rom that the pins were not bright and shiny. All pins were seated correctly and no legs were bent on any chips that I saw.

IMG_4332 (resized).jpgIMG_4333 (resized).jpgIMG_4334 (resized).jpgIMG_4335 (resized).jpgIMG_4336 (resized).jpgIMG_4337 (resized).jpgIMG_4338 (resized).jpg

#7 3 years ago

GIC

goingincirclez

GIC Pinball

9y 116K 2,835 27

The one thing that seems like a possible "gotcha" is IC17. Do you know if that ROM chip is a 2532, or a 2732? If you look at the switch table, swtiches 22/23, and 32/33, would be different depending on which type of ROM is used for IC17.

Unfortunately it seems the label on the ROM is covering the screened text on the chip. So you may have to peel off the label to confirm. For what it's worth, 2732 ROMs are generally more common, especially where "modern" reissues (such as yours with holographic labels) are concerned. But it looks like your board is configured for 2532. So it might be worth a look.

#8 3 years ago

JON

Schwaggs

Quoted from goingincirclez:
The one thing that seems like a possible "gotcha" is IC17. Do you know if that ROM chip is a 2532, or a 2732? If you look at the switch table, swtiches 22/23, and 32/33, would be different depending on which type of ROM is used for IC17.
Unfortunately it seems the label on the ROM is covering the screened text on the chip. So you may have to peel off the label to confirm. For what it's worth, 2732 ROMs are generally more common, especially where "modern" reissues (such as yours with holographic labels) are concerned. But it looks like your board is configured for 2532. So it might be worth a look.

That is exactly why I asked for pictures of the switches - I wanted to see which type of chip it was configured.

I would try configuring it for 27XX chips by changing the following switch settings:

Turn OFF W22 and ON W23
Turn OFF W33 and ON W32

Change the switch setting with the power off.

#9 3 years ago

???

rx2006je

Pinside+ Frequent

So when I asked for help from pcbpnball where I got the board from he asked me if I changed the switches too. I told him I didn’t I just installed the board as it came from him. He said usually the send it out with the more common 2732 but sometimes they use the other depending on what they have available. I tried changing the switches for the 2732 setup and still got nothing but a “0” on the MPU. Considering sending the board back to be checked to see if there is something wrong there.

#10 3 years ago

JON

Schwaggs

OP
Quoted from rx2006je:
So when I asked for help from pcbpnball where I got the board from he asked me if I changed the switches too. I told him I didn’t I just installed the board as it came from him. He said usually the send it out with the more common 2732 but sometimes they use the other depending on what they have available. I tried changing the switches for the 2732 setup and still got nothing but a “0” on the MPU. Considering sending the board back to be checked to see if there is something wrong there.

Sounds like you've tried all the right things and sending it and the ROM chips back to be tested is the right plan. I would send the driver board too so they can test them as a pair.

#11 3 years ago

???

rx2006je

Pinside+ Frequent

Quoted from Schwaggs:
Sounds like you've tried all the right things and sending it and the ROM chips back to be tested is the right plan. I would send the driver board too so they can test them as a pair.

Will do, I will update when I get boards back.
Thanks for all the advise.

3 weeks later

#12 3 years ago

???

rx2006je

Pinside+ Frequent

sent boards for repair/check. My old power supply wreaked havoc on the the MPU and fried a bunch of chips. New power supply and all is working as it should. Now I just have to get the start button fixed and I can finally get to play a game.

#13 3 years ago

???

rx2006je

Pinside+ Frequent