(Topic ID: 274420)

System 4 Board Booting into Audits

By frisbez

3 years ago


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  • 17 posts
  • 7 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by frisbez
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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    #1 3 years ago

    I have a system 4 board that has me scratching my head. I've replaced multiple ICs on it to get it to finally start booting, but it is always booting into the audit menu.

    It passes all tests from Andre v2 and Leon's ROMs.

    However when it boots with the game ROM (I am using it for a Lucky Seven) it goes straight to the audits menu. The quick power cycle trick doesn't work. When I press the diagnostic switch the lower LED comes on indicating a ROM issue, however all 3 ROMs are new EPROMs with valid checksums.

    I replaced the 2 game PROMs with a single 2716 EPROM at IC14 but pinwiki does not list any potential problems that might cause.

    Anybody have any thoughts about where to go from here?

    #2 3 years ago

    Have you tried with a nvram or battery?

    #3 3 years ago

    New batteries, but the old battery pack so it might not be giving good voltage. But that doesn't explain why the quick power on/off trick won't get it to boot correctly?

    #4 3 years ago

    How did you programm the eproms?
    I did it with the GQ-4X usb programmer.
    I had to change the settings to one of the slower writing speeds to get the eprom right.
    It looks good on high speed, but the cpu board doesn't read it good.

    I think if it is booting into diagnostics, it can't read the game eprom.

    #5 3 years ago

    Stuck in audits after cycling:
    Check for a shorted Diode 19 and or diode 17
    a shorted diode will not allow any back up power to ram or allow battery power no matter any rapid power cycle.

    A software fault due to early code:
    Use a Flash or Gorgar roms at IC20 IC14 Ic17 to rule out bad roms and test if the cpu does boot.

    sys 4 (resized).pngsys 4 (resized).png
    #6 3 years ago

    Game ROM issue is another way to get stuck in audit mode. It is probably having trouble IC14 if the Andre test fully passes and normal software reports a ROM fail. The test Andre test ROM runs out of an OS rom spot and does not really test anything with IC14.

    #7 3 years ago

    I just burnt some a Hot Tip ROM and it boots just fine and the Williams memory test gives no errors.

    I had seen several threads about the IPDB Lucky Seven ROMs not working correctly but my checksum matched the one listed in this older thread.

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/lucky-7-valid-rom-checksum

    Not sure where to go from here as all of the game ROMs on IPDB have that same checksum that is not working on my board...

    #8 3 years ago
    Quoted from frisbez:

    I just burnt some a Hot Tip ROM and it boots just fine and the Williams memory test gives no errors.
    I had seen several threads about the IPDB Lucky Seven ROMs not working correctly but my checksum matched the one listed in this older thread.
    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/lucky-7-valid-rom-checksum
    Not sure where to go from here as all of the game ROMs on IPDB have that same checksum that is not working on my board...

    Did you also try the PinMame rom file?
    That CRC is different from the file listed as Game ROM L1.
    And the PinMame rom file IS working in PinMame (I just checked).

    #9 3 years ago

    Burned a new ROM with the PinMame file and the Williams memory test now works correctly! I imagine it was probably just a bad EPROM.

    The game is still booting into audits though. I am going to pull and test D17 and D19 as suggested.

    I have also found a thread saying that IC24 going bad can cause booting into audits so I will check that as well.

    Thanks for the assistance all. I will post back with any further issues.

    #10 3 years ago

    Ok this board is starting to be seriously frustrating. Both D17 and D19 tested ok. I socketed and tried a new chip in IC 24. The game is still booting into audits. I can scroll through them fine but cannot advance to lamp tests etc.

    Anybody have any ideas? I am using Seigecraft's System 3-11 diagnostic switch but could the male header on the board need to be replaced?

    #11 3 years ago

    Forgot to say. Battery voltage on the board is 4.94 so that shouldn't be the reason it's booting into the audit menu.

    #12 3 years ago

    Have you tried a different 5101 RAM chip? I have seen many fail over the years. Worth swapping out to see.

    #13 3 years ago
    Quoted from Robotworkshop:

    Have you tried a different 5101 RAM chip? I have seen many fail over the years. Worth swapping out to see.

    I have tried a few different 5101s with the same results.

    I have a donor board that I've pulled ICs off to try as well. At this point I've tried multiple 6800s, 2 different 6875 clock chips as well. All have the same results.

    I have not replaced the crystal.

    Unless someone has a better idea that is probably where I will go next.

    1 week later
    #14 3 years ago

    I have a Lucky Seven and I am using ROM checksum 00018602. They are the PinMAME roms. It boots up into the game and I can press the diagnostic switch on the CPU to start the self test (CPU board leds blink twice). After the self test you're in the game status function mode. In this mode put the door switch auto and you press advance. It starts cycling through the display tests. When it is doing this you can switch straight to the lamps flash test by pressing the advance button twice within one second.

    I used the "pincoder" roms to troubleshoot my machine. If you can burn your own ROMs that would be worth a look.

    #15 3 years ago

    Try booting the board without the Siegecraft diagnostic switch board attached. Or at least, make sure the memory protect switch is left open. System 4 didn't use memory protect and closing that switch ties pin 1 and 2 together which technically shouldn't do anything since pin 1 shouldn't exist on the board or be connected to anything but worth a try.

    1 month later
    #16 3 years ago

    Circling back to this, unfortunately I still haven't got the board working.

    Currently it boots into audits but the p1, p2 and p3 displays are all garbage. The primary display and p4 are working fine. It is not an issue with the Master Display Board because it is a Wolfpac (and it was doing the same thing with the original displays). IC6 the 74154 also tests ok.

    If I try to move through the tests the display test will work but then it crashes if I try to move past that to the solenoid test.

    I have ordered some more ICs to continue shotgunning my way through I guess. I have traced the address and data lines for continuity and shorts and haven't hit anything that is obviously bad. I ordered a bench display tester to help with bench testing, and I am considering buying a oscilloscope. Definitely the most frustrating board I have ever worked on.

    2 weeks later
    #17 3 years ago

    Finally making some progress on this. The display problems ended up being a stupid mistake on my part. I had the displays plugged into the wrong players. I am not sure why this mattered, but apparently with the Wolffpac displays it does.

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