(Topic ID: 203010)

Switch Matrix Problem???

By oldschoolbob

6 years ago


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#1 6 years ago

I'm working on a Bally 8 Ball and I think I have a switch matrix problem. When I add credits I get a chime. When I start up a game I get a chime but then the chimes stop. Almost any switch I hit the outhole solenoid goes off. (targets, roll-overs, pop-bumpers) Everything except the slingshots. The roll-overs seems to fire the outhole 5 times.

I changed the diode on the outhole switch and it didn't make any difference. I'm at a lost as to where to look for the problem.

Anyone have a suggestion?

Thanks

Bob

#2 6 years ago

Go into switch test and document what switches incorrectly register as what number

#3 6 years ago

Thanks

That's a good place to start my hunt. Don't know why I didn't think of that.

I'll let you know what I find.

Bob

#4 6 years ago

Do you have an original MPU or an Alltek board installed?

#5 6 years ago

It's an original MPU and it looks in good condition.

I ran the switch test and it looks like they are all working properly and no stuck switches.

I didn't have my solenoid test sheet with me during the test but several of the solenoids were not responding. I'll check tomorrow which ones are out.

Could a bad diode on a solenoid be causing this?

Bob

#6 6 years ago

I checked all the switches in test mode and they all check OK. But in solenoid test I got a mess of problems.
01 - outhole kicker - OK
02 - knocker - disconnected
03 - side return kicker - OK
04 - chime 10 - nothing
05 - chime 100 - fires outhole kicker ?????
06 - chime 1000 - fires side return kicker ???????
07 - extra chime - OK
08 - left pop-bumper - nothing
09 - right pop-bumper - fires right slingshot ??????
10 - bottom pop-bumper - nothing
11 - left slingshot - nothing
12 - right slingshot - OK
13 - coin door lockout - OK
14 - flipper relay - OK

05,06,and 09 are screwed up.

Any idea what to look for? I'm lost!

Thanks

Bob

#7 6 years ago
Quoted from oldschoolbob:

05,06,and 09 are screwed up.

Look at the these switches to see if there is a broken diode or capacitor and also on the Left and Right Slingshot switches as well.

#8 6 years ago

I checked the switch diodes - I replaced the diode on the outhole because it looked dark. That didn't change anything.

I just tested the solenoids from the driver board- everything worked as it should - no problem there.

In switch test everything checks OK. In solenoid test it's messed up. Firing solenoids from the driver board looks OK.

Something is telling the solenoids to fire out of order.

Could this be a problem with the PIA's?

I have a Stern Wild Fyre that is working. Could I switch MPU's with that game to check if the problem is with the MPU?

Thanks

Bob

#9 6 years ago
Quoted from oldschoolbob:

I have a Stern Wild Fyre that is working. Could I switch MPU's with that game to check if the problem is with the MPU?

Do it. If there is still a problem, then the wiring on the switch input to the MPU would have a few wired to the incorrect pins.

#10 6 years ago

You have a loss (bad connection) of the PB2 signal between the MPU board from pin 2 of J4 to the solenoid driver board pin 4 of J4. So check/replace these two wire terminals at the connectors.

See the table below, on the left in the four digits:
A binary logic '0' is essentially 0 volts and indicates a logic low.
A binary logic '1' is essentially 5 volts and indicates a logic high.

The solenoid select signals PB3, PB2, PB1, PB0 respectively represent a binary output number that selects particular solenoids at the solenoid driver board. The second binary digit from the left is the solenoid select "PB2" signal. Anywhere where PB2 is not changing to a logic level of 0 (low) at the solenoid driver board decoder is where that solenoid will not be able to be selected. i.e. the second column from the left in the binary numbers listed are where that signal needs to go low (logic 0) in conjunction with other solenoid select signals in order to activate those solenoids. And your PB2 is stuck high (logic 1) at the solenoid driver board decoder chip so wrong or no solenoids are being selected.

PPPP
BBBB
3210
------------------------------
0000 - N/A
0001 - chime 10 - nothing
0010 - chime 100 - fires outhole kicker ?????
0011 - chime 1000 - fires side return kicker ???????
0100 - extra chime - OK
0101 - knocker - disconnected
0110 - outhole kicker - OK
0111 - side return kicker - OK
1000 - left pop-bumper - nothing
1001 - right pop-bumper - fires right slingshot ??????
1010 - bottom pop-bumper - nothing
1011 - left slingshot - nothing
1100 - N/A
1101 - right slingshot - OK
1110 - N/A
1111 - N/A

#11 6 years ago

Thanks Quench, I think you hit it perfect.

I was thinking the PIA's could be causing the problem so I pulled the MPU to replace them. The connectors were very hard to remove (like corroded on). When I put the board back in it wouldn't boot. No 12 volts. I have 12 volts at the connector but not on the board. Most likely bad connector. I plan to replace all the connectors and headers but I wanted to fix this solenoid problem first.

Tomorrow I'll replace the offending connectors and see if that fixes the problem.

I'll let you know how it turns out.

Bob

#12 6 years ago

Today I replaced a couple of connectors and put the board back in. Now the LED lights but it won't boot. I got disgusted and took the board back out and replaced all the headers. (may as well do it right in the beginning) I put the original PIA's back in and bench tested. AOK.

Tomorrow I'll replace the crimp connectors and try again.

Thanks

Bob

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