(Topic ID: 140684)

Suggestions of games with varied shots/deep ruleset


By delt31

3 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 46 posts
  • 22 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by PinballNewb
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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    #1 3 years ago

    I have a really good flow game (High Speed 2) and I'm looking for a pin to compliment it with a deep rule set and varied shots. I'm not looking to crush it on the budget but regardless, I would like to hear all suggestions. I'm currently looking at a Jurassic Park as I love the theme and it seems deep. Might pull the trigger very soon but here are some others I already know are not for me:

    FT
    BSD
    Demoman
    Judge dredd - the stallone movie left such a bad taste in my mouth and that artwork is pretty lame. I need to get past the theme but not sure I can so prob a pass too.
    Metallica - didn't like it
    T2 - like it but doesn't seem deep with modes.
    Any pin with country theme/feel.

    Was thinking about the dark knight (after custom music it's good) but hear it's very simple too.....Adams Family and Twilight could be it but very expensive. Having a hard time deciding b/w them too.

    #2 3 years ago

    JP is an excellent choice. TZ is another. Simpson's Pinball Party would be my top suggestion.

    Also: Elvis and World Poker Tour.

    #3 3 years ago
    Quoted from cody_chunn:

    JP is an excellent choice. TZ is another. Simpson's Pinball Party would be my top suggestion.
    Also: Elvis and World Poker Tour.

    Thanks! Tried Simpsons and although quality I think I'm tired of the Simpsons. That being said might still look into it bc it def has that deep rule set. Twilight zone could def be it but starting small with JP first. Seems like best bang right now

    #4 3 years ago

    Jd is based on the comic and came out before the movie i believe, some of the best art on any machine imo. Rules aren't that deep though but lots of shots. Maybe try an rbion, i miss mine great game

    #5 3 years ago

    Ripleys believe it or not

    #6 3 years ago

    Hmmm need to try that one out....

    #7 3 years ago

    I wouldn't be wrong in saying that Jurassic park is more complex than dark knight right? If you had to track these three would it be Jurassic, Ripley's than batman?

    #8 3 years ago

    Stargate is a budget game with a pretty deep ruleset. LOTR is my first go to game with deep rules though. You also hate a couple of my all-time favorites, so my opinion is probably useless to you.

    #9 3 years ago

    Batman and Jurassic park do not have deep rules or a lot of shots. However, ripleys has both. Decent upper flipper shots and its of flow plus a decent rule set.

    #10 3 years ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    I have a really good flow game (High Speed 2) and I'm looking for a pin to compliment it with a deep rule set and varied shots.
    Any pin with country theme/feel.

    With these points in mind, I would highly recommend you consider looking into Road Show. It's a Lawlor game, so plenty deep enough, has varied and unique shots that are integrated into modes very well and is probably as "country themed" as you're gonna get. Road show was done one year after Twilight Zone, so some of it's rules are inspired by Lawlor's previous games. The only downside is linearity (modes cannot be stacked and must be done in order to an extent), but as long as you have something else to play (HS2) you'll be fine. Bowen Kerins recently did a tutorial and goes into detail about the gameplay here:

    Good luck with the hunt buddy!

    #11 3 years ago
    Quoted from Bubbatom:

    With these points in mind, I would highly recommend you consider looking into Road Show. It's a Lawlor game, so plenty deep enough, has varied and unique shots that are integrated into modes very well and is probably as "country themed" as you're gonna get. Road Show was done one year after Twilight Zone, so some of it's rules are inspired by Lawlor's previous games. The only downside is linearity (modes cannot be stacked and must be done in order to an extent), but as long as you have something else to play (HS2) you'll be fine. Bowen Kerins recently did a tutorial and goes into detail about the gameplay here:
    » YouTube video
    Good luck with the hunt buddy!

    Thanks - I actually looked at this game but realized it was way too country for me. Sorry just can't stand country based anything.

    #12 3 years ago
    Quoted from markmon:

    Batman and Jurassic Park do not have deep rules or a lot of shots. However, ripleys has both. Decent upper flipper shots and its of flow plus a decent rule set.

    Batman people agree on but Jurassic not have deep rules or lots of shots?

    #13 3 years ago
    Quoted from Hougie:

    Stargate is a budget game with a pretty deep ruleset. LOTR is my first go to game with deep rules though. You also hate a couple of my all-time favorites, so my opinion is probably useless to you.

    LOTR looks great. Pretty pricey though but I'll keep my eye out. I might just end up going with TZ in the end.....Addams family is good too. Decisions...

    #14 3 years ago
    #15 3 years ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    LOTR looks great. Pretty pricey though but I'll keep my eye out. I might just end up going with TZ in the end.....Addams Family is good too. Decisions...

    Well if you are comparing TZ and LOTR, I'm not sure you can call LOTR pricy but be fine with the price of TZ. Around here they are pretty similar in price. Addams as well.

    #16 3 years ago

    yeah you're right. I guess those three are all pricey!

    #17 3 years ago

    It depends on how you define deep. JP is about as far from deep as I can think of with a game - the main goal is to hit the shots during multiball for HUGE multiball jackpots. If you can pull that off, you get giant points. The modes are cool, but not necessary for the biggest points.

    If it is just "stuff to do", TFTC is a similar era DE title that has more modes on it to do.

    Having said that, I think JP is a better game. What it seems like you're looking for is more of a mode-based playing game, in which case JP will fit the bill just fine. I'd argue (although some people may laugh at this) that SF2 is a "deeper" game just based on the different things you have to do to advance, but I would definitely suggest JP before it.

    If you are looking at something else, try the other DE DMD era titles, as they are all rather similar, but all have a bunch of modes to do - excepting LW3.

    #18 3 years ago

    yes - mode based is what I'm looking for....

    #19 3 years ago

    DE DMD era games are great if you are a fan of mode based games! JP, WWFRR, TFTC, Tommy, R&B .....

    #20 3 years ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    I wouldn't be wrong in saying that Jurassic Park is more complex than dark knight right? If you had to track these three would it be Jurassic, Ripley's than batman?

    Depth-wise I'd put it Ripley's, Batman, Jurassic Park. (from most deep to least deep) Although as far as how I'd rank the quality of the games, I'd go Batman, Ripley's then JP.

    I think the best games to consider are ones with Keith Johnson rulesets. LOTR, TSPP, WPT, WOF, HRC, WOZ, etc.

    #21 3 years ago

    A newer Stern will have the most depth but more expensive. ST is my favorite modern Stern and you might be able to find a used pro for decent money. TSPP was also one of my favs and has super deep rules. They do hold their value pretty well so not the cheapest. Shadow is not that expensive, has modes, and a lot more challenging than HS2. Congo and I500 are also great mid 90's games but kinda rare so prices are going up. Just keep finding games to play to see what you like and keep an open mind. Some of my favorite games are ones I thought I would hate or used to not like.

    #22 3 years ago
    Quoted from WaddleJrJr:

    Depth-wise I'd put it Ripley's, Batman, Jurassic Park. (from most deep to least deep) Although as far as how I'd rank the quality of the games, I'd go Batman, Ripley's then JP.
    I think the best games to consider are ones with Keith Johnson rulesets. LOTR, TSPP, WPT, WOF, HRC, WOZ, etc.

    wait never heard anyone say batman dark knight has more depth than JP? I was watching videos and although there are multiple modes, all the shots for Dark Knight seemed to be the same (hit flashing targets) and the rest was multi ball joker or scarecrow. Am I missing something?

    #23 3 years ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    wait never heard anyone say Batman Dark Knight has more depth than JP? I was watching videos and although there are multiple modes, all the shots for Dark Knight seemed to be the same (hit flashing targets) and the rest was multi ball joker or scarecrow. Am I missing something?

    I find most of the DE games of that era to be like Addams Family where the modes are just a "pump and dump" type thing. Sure there's a lot of modes, but the game isn't about playing the modes it's about just continuously starting more of them. So yeah the content exists in the game, but it's never actually worth playing.

    Meanwhile with Batman the modes are worth good value, however the reason they're not seen very much is because it's dangerous to start them. However with the 3 main multiballs (Scarecrow, Joker, and Batpod) as well as the Bat Signal challenge, there's still plenty to do without the modes, and having the modes gives you an extra layer of stuff that you can add to what you're doing, and provides for a ton of content that must be played through in order to get to the final wizard mode.

    #24 3 years ago

    TSPP, TZ and RBION would be 3 top picks for deep rules and varied shots. LOTR is deep but I would not call any fan layout varied.

    #25 3 years ago
    Quoted from Shoot_Again:

    TSPP, TZ and RBION would be 3 top picks for deep rules and varied shots. LOTR is deep but I would not call any fan layout varied.

    But is varied referring to the uniqueness of the playfield layout, or the variety of things the game requires you to shoot in order to get a good score?

    Because if the latter is the case then I'd personally say the opposite of what you said. I find that TSPP, TZ, and RBION all have a very under-used left side of the game, while LOTR requires shots across the entire playfield.

    #26 3 years ago
    Quoted from WaddleJrJr:

    I find most of the DE games of that era to be like Addams Family where the modes are just a "pump and dump" type thing. Sure there's a lot of modes, but the game isn't about playing the modes it's about just continuously starting more of them. So yeah the content exists in the game, but it's never actually worth playing.
    Meanwhile with Batman the modes are worth good value, however the reason they're not seen very much is because it's dangerous to start them. However with the 3 main multiballs (Scarecrow, Joker, and Batpod) as well as the Bat Signal challenge, there's still plenty to do without the modes, and having the modes gives you an extra layer of stuff that you can add to what you're doing, and provides for a ton of content that must be played through in order to get to the final wizard mode.

    Prob showing my inexperience but when I see JP modes, I always try to complete them and then start a new one. If I try to start a new one before my previous mode is done, it just shoots the ball back out at me until my mode completes. Sorry but not following this pump and dump thing. maybe in TAF, you can just start modes on top of modes? As for batman, I was really thinking about buying it but never saw these modes you're talking of. Understand some don't play them but are there more modes than just hit the flashing targets? I know how multi ball works so any other info on the other modes and their variety would be helpful. thanks!

    #27 3 years ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    Prob showing my inexperience but when I see JP modes, I always try to complete them and then start a new one. If I try to start a new one before my previous mode is done, it just shoots the ball back out at me until my mode completes. Sorry but not following this pump and dump thing. maybe in TAF, you can just start modes on top of modes? As for batman, I was really thinking about buying it but never saw these modes you're talking of. Understand some don't play them but are there more modes than just hit the flashing targets? I know how multi ball works so any other info on the other modes and their variety would be helpful. thanks!

    Yeah, basically just shoot all the lit shots.

    More information on Batman's rules here - http://www.pinballnews.com/games/batman/index4b.html

    As far as Jurassic Park goes I'll have to read up on it and see. I haven't played much JP so I may be confusing it with the other DE games like Tommy, Last Action Hero, and GnR.

    EDIT: Skimmed through the Jurassic Park rulesheet and it seems like I was initially correct about JP. Quote here, "You can have any number of Computer Screen awards running at one time; you can relight the Control Room and collect new awards concurrently with awards that are already running."
    Link to rulesheet: http://pinball.org/rules/jurassicpark.html

    #28 3 years ago

    Data east rule sets almost all feel the same. Jurassic park is not good software wise and I can't see anyone calling it a deep game. You asked for a deep game. Jurassic park is not one.

    Batman has a decent rule set. There are lots of things to do. But there are not a lot of shots. You asked for a game with a lot of shots. Dark knight is not one.

    Ripleys has some of the most (non target) shots in any single pinball game. Ripleys has a really deep rule set with a very challenging to achieve wizard mode. It foots your bill perfectly.

    #29 3 years ago

    thanks. I played Ripleys last night on the pinball arcade and I think you're right. The theme and the voices (especially the monkey) are holding me back as it would be an instant buy otherwise. JP software just updated with some big improvements so I think I'll sink my teeth into that first!

    #30 3 years ago

    While you've got great suggestions (and I'd agree with LOTR and TSPP - and WOZ $$$$$$$) have you considered Maverick, not really that sought after, but it's actually got a great ruleset, tons to shoot, and they can be found for not too much dough. Friends got one for sale but I'd imagine you could find one locally. Ramps, drops, all kinds of things to do on that table.

    #31 3 years ago

    I'll throw STTNG out there as a game with a bunch of shots and modes, good rules, cool theme, doesn't totally break the bank. Lots of good suggestions so far though. If you're looking for reasonable price, cool theme, deep complex rules, and shots used all around the table... you've probably got to give a little one one of those.

    #32 3 years ago

    JP you can stack modes but after you start one you have to either go to the power bunker (upper right scoop) to "power" it back up to start another mode and stack it. Or if you go thru either one of the inlanes, it turns the power on for a few seconds so you can stack modes that way as well. ive had 3 or 4 modes going at the same time most games

    #33 3 years ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    yes - mode based is what I'm looking for....

    TFTC has 12 modes.

    #34 3 years ago

    The Shadow. Difficult enough modes. Lots to shoot. Diverting ramps. Upper mini playfield is a great change in gameplay.

    Star trek the next generation. Lots of modes and variety.

    Johnny Mnemonic, not too deep but fast and fun to play.

    Congo. The music can get annoying but it has quite a bit of game there.

    #35 3 years ago

    thanks guys - these are all great suggestions!

    kind of off topic but what is the point of stacking modes in JP? Just to have more to count for when you shoot? I can see things getting crazy - not even remembering what to shoot for!

    #36 3 years ago
    Quoted from erak:

    The Shadow. Difficult enough modes.

    The mode difficulty isn't a problem on Shadow it's that damn tight mode start shot! I usually complete the other game objectives before even starting a second mode!

    #37 3 years ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    thanks guys - these are all great suggestions!
    kind of off topic but what is the point of stacking modes in JP? Just to have more to count for when you shoot? I can see things getting crazy - not even remembering what to shoot for!

    i just try to get thru as many modes as possible so i can get to extra ball faster and also if you get thru all the modes it starts "System Failure" where its a 6 ball multi ball and any switch you hit during it is worth a ridiculous amount of points (i think 1 mil each one that registers) lasts for 45 seconds then it kills all the coils and drains the balls, then restarts with a new ball and you can go thru the modes again.

    #38 3 years ago

    Some may disagree with me, but I am a big fan of Tron when it comes to some modes and the shots. Looping some of the light cycle shots is very satisfying. Check it out if you haven't yet.

    I'd agree with STTNG. There are tons of modes that vary the gameplay and all of the shots are on point if you tune it correctly.

    I'd agree with The Shadow for sure. There is a huge variety of gameplay options on this table. Great multiball with a fun jackpot to hit, the battleground is a fun upper playfield, and some of the hurry ups like Mongol are fun to hit.

    Nobody has mentioned No Fear yet. I know it's not a particularly DEEP game, but the modes change things up from time to time and the flowiness of the shots is pretty good. Also, they don't break the bank as far as I'm aware.

    I'd have to disagree with the previous post about JM. It's got a good amount of modes, plays fast, and has some very satisfying shots. You have your base modes but then you can also get into Yakuza Strike and there are some good options up in the matrix lock.

    There are my two cents. Take them or leave them. Good luck with your search! I wish I could provide more insight on JP or The Dark Knight, but I have little to no experience with those.

    #39 3 years ago

    bang for your buck i think batman forever is pretty sweet too. just got one and am loving it so far. several modes, all with different goals and some difficult ones that i have yet to beat. has a kick back, a cannon like T2/ACDC and sweet ramps/habitrails.

    #40 3 years ago
    Quoted from InfiniteLives:

    i just try to get thru as many modes as possible so i can get to extra ball faster and also if you get thru all the modes it starts "System Failure" where its a 6 ball multi ball and any switch you hit during it is worth a ridiculous amount of points (i think 1 mil each one that registers) lasts for 45 seconds then it kills all the coils and drains the balls, then restarts with a new ball and you can go thru the modes again.

    Wait - I thought you had to beat all of those modes to get system failure. You saying you just need to start the modes but not actually complete them to get system failure? For example, you hit the scoop top right to start a new one? I don't understand how that's possible since some modes only last for 25 seconds!

    #41 3 years ago

    you can time out the modes and it clears it on the list, you'd have to hit the 2 ball multi ball shot and the extra ball, but the rest time out and would result in system failure

    #42 3 years ago

    oh so even if you don't achieve the mode the game still allows you to count it as long as you hit 2 ball and the extra ball? I guess incentive to win the modes is to actually get more points on your way to system failure?

    #43 3 years ago
    Quoted from delt31:

    oh so even if you don't achieve the mode the game still allows you to count it as long as you hit 2 ball and the extra ball? I guess incentive to win the modes is to actually get more points on your way to system failure?

    Correct. Like Addams Family, playing the modes is only for points, just starting them counts as your progress towards the wizard mode. And for the most part the modes aren't really worth playing, because the risk of taking the mode shots gives far less reward than other opportunities in the game (primarily Multiball and System Failure).

    #44 3 years ago

    OK - I kind of like that. Let's you play your style. Don't like the modes continue on but if you want the highest score possible, win the modes and then move on. oh pinball - you so crazy.

    btw - new code for JP apparently balances out the modes more so it make sense to try certain ones out.

    #45 3 years ago

    Well Transformers LE is one that no one has mentioned. It has a deep rule set (and some might say requires a lot of chopping wood) and several wizard modes... Plus I think the combo LE is pretty cool looking and can be had for a steal...

    #46 3 years ago

    FWIW I only have the room (and wife's consent) for two pins at the moment. I decided on The Shadow for my second pin and think I made a great choice. There are a ton of shots, fun and different modes including a well done video mode, an upper playfield that changes things up, and ramp diverters that play into strategy of what you want to do next.

    There's a lot of bang for buck there. Additionally I have not found the game to be anywhere near as brutal as some may say. The right mode start is a tight shot for sure, however I find my ball times tend to be the same if not longer on TS compared to my WCS. Mind you WCS has outlanes wide open and TS are set much easier. In a few words, I'm loving it!

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