(Topic ID: 312939)

Suggestions for a nut starter tool (or better technique)

By ForceFlow

2 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 49 posts
  • 19 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by mbwalker
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic Gallery

    View topic image gallery

    pasted_image (resized).png
    pasted_image (resized).png
    2012-06-10_20-08-34-e1339377735827 (resized).jpg
    2012-06-10_20-07-59 (resized).jpg
    2012-06-10_20-07-20-e1339377708481 (resized).jpg
    pasted_image (resized).png
    pasted_image (resized).png
    pasted_image (resized).png
    3586E1A8-FFB6-4717-B466-038642AC2C2B (resized).jpeg
    242B7601-F642-4174-9123-D6712CEC75CC (resized).jpeg
    pasted_image (resized).png
    pasted_image (resized).png
    PXL_20220402_223458368.MP (resized).jpg
    #1 2 years ago

    There are some situations in a tight space where I'm trying to get a small nut (#2, #4, #5, or #6, usually) onto a threaded screw. There's only enough room for a flat wrench, and not enough room for a second hand to back the nut, or a socket.

    I've tried the box end of a wrench and painter's tape, but then the nut just ends up flopping around and I can't see enough of it to center it over the screw. With a small adjustable wrench, the nut just spins in the jaws.

    So, I usually try to start the nut with needlenose pliers and grip it really hard, and while I can get the nut onto the stud more often than not without the nut spinning too much in the plier's jaws, there isn't usually enough room to rotate the nut far enough to catch the threads.

    I sometimes have to make multiple attempts over the course of 10 minutes or so just trying get a single nut started. The situation doesn't come up often, but it annoys me enough where I'm looking for another solution that would make this task far easier. Any ideas? Thanks

    #2 2 years ago

    how about 3d print an adaptor to hold the nut in place on your wrench

    have made a few over the years just for that pain in the arse location just to get the nut started

    #3 2 years ago

    Instead of needle nose, I've also had some instances where I've used straight or curved hemostats to get it in position. Then finger tip to hold up, onto thread; and try to start.

    But if you can't get even a finger under the nut, it gets trickier, I realize.

    Used goofy combos like hemostats, then a credit card (or other plastic) strip or a popsicle stick under it, to continue to hold it up; while I release the hemostats and attempt a slight spin with the wrench etc.

    Then go look for the nut

    #4 2 years ago
    Quoted from pacmanretro:

    straight or curved hemostats to get it in position

    Yeah, I've tried those too. The nut still spun around too much.

    Quoted from swinks:

    how about 3d print an adaptor to hold the nut in place on your wrench

    I don't have a 3D printer.

    Quoted from swinks:

    have made a few over the years just for that pain in the arse location just to get the nut started

    Have you posted the design anywhere?

    #5 2 years ago

    Tape it to your finger. Easy to manipulate it, lots of blind work in farming, hard to reach places. Works good

    #6 2 years ago
    Quoted from swinks:

    how about 3d print an adaptor to hold the nut in place on your wrench
    have made a few over the years just for that pain in the arse location just to get the nut started

    I was going to say the same thing.

    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    ...I don't have a 3D printer...

    I've seen some rather great deals for only about $100 for really decent starter printers. Comes in handy for pinball mods too.

    #7 2 years ago

    Magnet

    #8 2 years ago
    Quoted from Hayfarmer:

    Tape it to your finger. Easy to manipulate it, lots of blind work in farming, hard to reach places. Works good

    I haven't had much luck with that. The nut wiggles around too much, low tack tape isn't strong enough, and higher tack tape takes too much force to separate from the nut, so then the nut just comes off since it's just barely started on the threads. If I try to get a small tool in there to hold the nut and pull away, then the nut usually ends up crooked on the threads.

    That can sometimes work to pick and place if the nut is magnetic, but then how do you rotate to start the thread? And what about nuts that are not magnetic?

    #9 2 years ago

    Maybe you can find a precision nut driver in the sizes you need?

    PXL_20220402_223458368.MP (resized).jpgPXL_20220402_223458368.MP (resized).jpg
    #10 2 years ago
    Quoted from PunkPin:

    Maybe you can find a precision nut driver in the sizes you need?[quoted image]

    In this situation, there isn't space for a driver. Just a flat tool like a wrench or pliers. Otherwise, it would be pretty trivial to get the nut started.

    #11 2 years ago

    Huh, this looks interesting.

    https://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/2012/06/10/nut-starter-tool/

    Though, I kind of think the nut might not be held tightly enough to be able to rotate it onto the threads. Then again, if it's held too tightly, then you run into the same issue with the tape trick if you don't have enough threads started.

    2012-06-10_20-07-20-e1339377708481 (resized).jpg2012-06-10_20-07-20-e1339377708481 (resized).jpg2012-06-10_20-07-59 (resized).jpg2012-06-10_20-07-59 (resized).jpg2012-06-10_20-08-34-e1339377735827 (resized).jpg2012-06-10_20-08-34-e1339377735827 (resized).jpg
    #12 2 years ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    Yeah, I've tried those too. The nut still spun around too much.

    I don't have a 3D printer.

    Have you posted the design anywhere?

    I have just done a quick custom design and print for one off issues to suit different nuts etc and then it lost or thrown away - like a mini wrench / spanner with a section for the nut to drop into with a retainer.

    Since I am metric I measure up the problem nut and make to suit but without a 3 printer this idea does not help much.

    What about cutting a jig out of a few millimeter compressed cardboard or perspex with some tape. It won't tighten but might get 1-2 threads on

    #13 2 years ago
    Quoted from swinks:

    I have just done a quick custom design and print for one off issues to suit different nuts etc and then it lost or thrown away - like a mini wrench / spanner with a section for the nut to drop into with a retainer.
    Since I am metric I measure up the problem nut and make to suit but without a 3 printer this idea does not help much.
    What about cutting a jig out of a few millimeter compressed cardboard or perspex with some tape. It won't tighten but might get 1-2 threads on

    Sounds like ForceFlow could use a slightly undersized nut holder to keep the nut in place and start it, then slip it off when done. Perfect application to 3D print since it can be made thin to squeeze into a tight area.

    ForceFlow So an open ended wrench would work, it's just that there's no way to hold the nut? If one was printed just a hair undersized, would that work?

    Like this but slimmed down on the sides maybe:
    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png

    #14 2 years ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    Huh, this looks interesting.
    https://cheerfulcurmudgeon.com/2012/06/10/nut-starter-tool/
    Though, I kind of think the nut might not be held tightly enough to be able to rotate it onto the threads. Then again, if it's held too tightly, then you run into the same issue with the tape trick if you don't have enough threads started.

    I'm going to make one of these!!

    #15 2 years ago

    Would this work?

    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
    #16 2 years ago

    Here’s a few tools that I use in tight spots.

    242B7601-F642-4174-9123-D6712CEC75CC (resized).jpeg242B7601-F642-4174-9123-D6712CEC75CC (resized).jpeg
    #17 2 years ago

    I've used this a lot in tight spaces, though not on a pin specifically. Would this work? There are lots of different brands/options.

    3586E1A8-FFB6-4717-B466-038642AC2C2B (resized).jpeg3586E1A8-FFB6-4717-B466-038642AC2C2B (resized).jpeg
    #18 2 years ago
    Quoted from TDK-WPG:

    I've used this a lot in tight spaces, though not on a pin specifically. Would this work? There are lots of different brands/options. [quoted image]

    Titan makes one that works great.

    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
    #19 2 years ago
    Quoted from mbwalker:

    Would this work?
    [quoted image]

    Interesting idea. Have you tried it? I could see that possibly working for larger nuts, but I'm not so sure about small ones under a #6.

    Quoted from TDK-WPG:

    I've used this a lot in tight spaces, though not on a pin specifically. Would this work? There are lots of different brands/options. [quoted image]

    How to you prevent the nut from falling out of that tool? That's essentially the problem--this operation needs to be done without hands (or a finger) on the nut.

    #20 2 years ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    How to you prevent the nut from falling out of that tool?

    I use a strip of Gorilla tape over the top of the tool and the nut - holds long enough to get it started.

    #21 2 years ago

    3d printed spanner with a small spring leaf arm to keep tension on the nut

    #22 2 years ago
    Quoted from onemoresean:

    Here’s a few tools that I use in tight spots.
    [quoted image]

    I have ratcheting wrenches--The problem with those is that the nut pops off through the back side. If you use tape, you can't see the center of the nut. If you put a hole in the tape to see the hole of the nut, the tape tears. Scotch tape isn't really strong enough. Maybe packing tape? I can't recall if I've tried that.

    #23 2 years ago

    Found this attachment, though I think it might be a bit too large, and you wouldn't be able to see the nut in the wrench.

    https://shop.snapon.com/product/Magnetic-Nut-Holder/Nut-Holder/YA207

    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png

    [edit]: Yeah, probably too big. The description says "Holds nut on sizes 3/8-3/4"

    #24 2 years ago

    Wedge a small piece of paper in the box end of the wrench when putting the nut in, oldest trick in the book. Leaves the opening visible, keeps it from moving around

    #25 2 years ago
    Quoted from metal-mods:

    Wedge a small piece of paper in the box end of the wrench when putting the nut in, oldest trick in the book. Leaves the opening visible, keeps it from moving around

    Hm, haven't tried that one. Does it actually work with small nuts?

    #26 2 years ago

    Sure does. You'll have to play with it a couple times to see what the right amount of paper is. With the small nuts, it's not much at all

    #27 2 years ago
    Quoted from metal-mods:

    Wedge a small piece of paper in the box end of the wrench when putting the nut in

    I agree, as an add on if you find it still slips out, use a wide elastic instead of paper, as you get extra grip that way.

    #28 2 years ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    Interesting idea. Have you tried it? I could see that possibly working for larger nuts, but I'm not so sure about small ones under a #6.

    If I did, I can't remember. LOL. I've done a lot of weird improvised tools over the years.

    That picture was a #4. Here's a #2. I was able to thread a screw into it w/no problem. Pretty sure a flat blade screwdriver to help keep it flat when starting the screw might help.

    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png

    #29 2 years ago

    I'll 3D print an open end wrench for you, if you need it. I'll make it slightly undersize to help hold the nut in place, plus a lip to keep it from popping out. Just need the width of the nuts.

    One of the other options mentioned above may work out - just tossing that offer out if needed.

    #30 2 years ago
    Quoted from mbwalker:

    I'll 3D print an open end wrench for you, if you need it. I'll make it slightly undersize to help hold the nut in place, plus a lip to keep it from popping out. Just need the width of the nuts.
    One of the other options mentioned above may work out - just tossing that offer out if needed.

    Thanks for offering--I think I'll hold off on that for the moment and maybe see how the paper jam and zip tie tricks work first.

    I would think there has to be other options to 3D printing, since I image I'm not the only one who has encountered this problem before.

    #32 2 years ago
    Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

    Will a 4" needle nose vice grip or extra long help?

    The long reach pliers have the same problem as standard needle nose pliers--the nut spins in the jaws.

    I've tried needle nose vice grips--the nut spins in the jaws there too. Not enough grip in that direction no matter how hard you clamp down I guess.

    #33 2 years ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    ...I've tried needle nose vice grips--the nut spins in the jaws there too. Not enough grip in that direction no matter how hard you clamp down I guess.

    So why does the nut spin if clamped in some small vise grips? That should hold the nut rather tight. Almost sounds like the threads on the bolt are messed up and are binding up in the nut.

    #34 2 years ago
    Quoted from mbwalker:

    So why does the nut spin if clamped in some small vise grips? That should hold the nut rather tight. Almost sounds like the threads on the bolt are messed up and are binding up in the nut.

    The nut spins/rotates perpendicular to the jaws when I bump the nut up against the screw threads. Not in parallel with the jaws.

    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
    #35 2 years ago

    Ive never had that spin with the teeth on a vise grip tightened well.
    Or when it didnt thread easily.

    I just did #6 on a pirate chest, very tight, it took a few bolts to find one that, "just grabbed"

    Perhaps temp Loctite or super glue the nut to something else and snap it free?

    #36 2 years ago

    Magnetic sockets? I use them all the time at work for small hardware, 7mm or 5.5mm in dash work.

    #37 2 years ago

    Have tried to find a screw the same size and partially thread the nut on the end, then hold the screw in a pliers and bring the nut over the top of the target and spin the nut with your finger?

    #38 2 years ago

    Wouldn’t a magnetic nut driver work, or am I not understanding correctly. Search Klein magnetic nut driver on Amazon. I use them all the time.

    #39 2 years ago
    Quoted from Lermods:

    Wouldn’t a magnetic nut driver work, or am I not understanding correctly. Search Klein magnetic nut driver on Amazon. I use them all the time.

    Sounds like FlorceFlow has limited height to work with (or some other similar constraint). So the approach has been to try to use something thin, like a open ended wrench or pliers. That's my take-away on it w/o seeing pictures.

    #40 2 years ago

    Two things to try with box wrenches-either magnetize them, and I mean big strong heavy rare earth shit, or, get a flipper alignment shim, and tape or rubber band it to your box wrench, and in some instances, I’ve done both.

    #41 2 years ago
    Quoted from mbwalker:

    Sounds like FlorceFlow has limited height to work with (or some other similar constraint). So the approach has been to try to use something thin, like a open ended wrench or pliers. That's my take-away on it w/o seeing pictures.

    If that’s the case, I’d use needle nose vice grips.

    #42 2 years ago

    I've used the Wera Joker wrenches for this kind of issue with 5/8 or 3/16 nuts. Holds the nut, and has ratchet action: https://www-de.wera.de/en/great-tools/joker/

    They're not cheap, but you only need a couple of sizes. I'm sure someone could 3D print something similar without the ratchet action.

    #43 2 years ago

    I'm curious as to what item needs this type of bad access. Is it to avoid taking some sub assembly out of something?

    #44 2 years ago

    I just watched a "hack " video on YouTube, they put the top of a bolt in a rubber hose, maybe that could work for a nut?

    #45 2 years ago

    I was going to suggest an 3D printed open end wrench with a lip on the top and bottom to hold the nut in place. But if the vise grips aren't cutting it, then I doubt a 3d printed gizmo would work.

    Something like this. Holds the nut stationary so the threads can get started. Modded to fit what ever weird location he's working on.
    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png

    #47 2 years ago

    Thats a great Tool! Everyone should print both of these referrals!!

    #48 2 years ago
    #49 2 years ago

    I think we need ForceFlow to chime in...

    Reply

    Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

    Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

    Donate to Pinside

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


    This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/suggestions-for-a-nut-starter-tool-or-better-technique?hl=ryanbrooks and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

    Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.