(Topic ID: 47092)

St:tng owners welcome aboard the uss enterprise

By Pinballgeek

11 years ago


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#1101 7 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

i'm a big fan of the flex-head LEDs. i bend them so that they are pointed directly towards the insert, but as far away as possible. that makes them diffuse across the insert more completely with less of a "hot spot".

+1 on this comment. I did the same for FT and ToM and it turned out great. When I finally have time for STTNG resto after home renovations will repeat for this game too.

#1102 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

The problem is I've never done up a game with leds. I don't know how many go on it, or the types/sizes etc... I really have no clue. I thought a kit would save me some time.
What are the best to use? Cointaker?

ttp://www.planetarypinball.com/reference/partsmanuals/WMS_Parts_Green_16-9932/index.html#/72/
according to the linked manual, there are thirty-six #555's and eight #906 in the backbox. and another fifty-one #555's and eleven #906 on the playfield; so eighty-seven #555 and nineteen #906.
Apparently there were two #44, two #89 (even though these aren't used in the game), five #555, and one #906 in the caxh box spare parts bag.
There are two #555 in the cabinet for START and TO BE CONTINUED BUTTONS, as well as two #555 in the coindoor for the coin mechs, I don't think these were included in the total.

Pin_Guy just posted this two days ago. You can count on most of the insert lights being 555 but not all of them are.

#1103 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

I really have no clue

You can find a complete list of all the bulbs on this site, or in the manual (again, available on this site). I find the kit way too purple...

EDIT: Thanks bobukcat!

#1104 7 years ago

My 1 owner huo sttng I just got...

20170127_154137 (resized).jpg20170127_154137 (resized).jpg

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#1105 7 years ago

Hey guys, I Have the laser canon mod (can't remember where I bought it) and it's probably my favorite mod in all of pinball. Anyway, my right canon laser doesn't go on now. Either in game play or tests. I checked connections, etc, but there's not much to it. Can't see a wire break anywhere. Anyone know where to get a replacement laser like that?

#1106 7 years ago

I wonder if you could buy a replacement laser from Mick at mickspinball.com?

The website reads like they are the creator/source for this mod. I could be wrong though.

#1107 7 years ago
Quoted from Kronlar:

I wonder if you could buy a replacement laser

My left cannon laser went way of the the dodo.... Email Terry at pinball life and he will arrange your replacement ! Had mine in 5 days, great service from them

#1108 7 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

More than the shield inserts dim, the entire GI lighting "flicker" when you take damage. If you disabling dimming, you are missing one of the coolest features of the game. Agreed that GI OCD is not mandatory, but neither are LEDs.
I should have said, GI OCD is mandatory with LEDs in the GI in my opinion.

are there any leds that would work on their own without the ocd?
I thought there were some noflik leds out there

#1109 7 years ago
Quoted from BobC:

are there any leds that would work on their own without the ocd?
I thought there were some noflik leds out there

You can get non-ghosting LEDs that will reduce the flicker in inserts. You can also get LEDs that reduce the flicker some people see when power LEDs from AC (like in the GI circuit of most games). However, I am not aware of any LEDs that dim properly on their own on WPC era machines. The way the dimming function operates works great with incandescent bulbs, not so much with LEDs.

#1110 7 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

You can get non-ghosting LEDs that will reduce the flicker in inserts. You can also get LEDs that reduce the flicker some people see when power LEDs from AC (like in the GI circuit of most games). However, I am not aware of any LEDs that dim properly on their own on WPC era machines. The way the dimming function operates works great with incandescent bulbs, not so much with LEDs.

Is it just one ocd board to install? Where do you buy it from?

#1111 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

Is it just one ocd board to install? Where do you buy it from?

Yes, just one board. Very easy to physically install. It comes with great instructions. You basically remove a couple connectors from the driver board, plug them into the GI OCD, then plug in a couple jumper cables between the GI OCD and the driver board. http://ledocd.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=24

You can use your PC through a USB cable (provided) to program it (if you want some GI strings brighter, dimmer, dimming ramp rates, etc). You can also program it to turn off the backbox GI when you are in a game to eliminate backbox glare from the glass.

#1112 7 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

Yes, just one board. Very easy to physically install. It comes with great instructions. You basically remove a couple connectors from the driver board, plug them into the GI OCD, then plug in a couple jumper cables between the GI OCD and the driver board. http://ledocd.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=24
You can use your PC through a USB cable (provided) to program it (if you want some GI strings brighter, dimmer, dimming ramp rates, etc). You can also program it to turn off the backbox GI when you are in a game to eliminate backbox glare from the glass.

Thanks. I found a thread from a couple years ago where the guy installed 2 boards? Has something changed since then?

#1113 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

Thanks. I found a thread from a couple years ago where the guy installed 2 boards? Has something changed since then?

Well, there is one board to smooth out GI lighting and dimming - GI OCD. Most games do not need this as very few games dim the GI during gameplay like STTNG does.

The other board is LED OCD which will smooth out insert lighting. You can avoid the need for this board by using non-ghosting LEDs. On the other hand, you can use the cheapest ghosting LEDs and control the LEDs better with LED OCD. For example, if you have a game you wish to retain the nostalgic gentle on and off effect of incandescents, you can use LED OCD to create that effect with cheap LEDs. You can also control the brightness of insert LEDs to better match the brightness from insert to insert or the overall brightness of all the inserts (i.e. you can use super bright LEDs for everything and tune them down on super small inserts or inserts close to the player).

Not everyone values the flexibility and options these boards provide, but for those that do, they are first class products.

#1114 7 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

Well, there is one board to smooth out GI lighting and dimming - GI OCD. Most games do not need this as very few games dim the GI during gameplay like STTNG does.
The other board is LED OCD which will smooth out insert lighting. You can avoid the need for this board by using non-ghosting LEDs. On the other hand, you can use the cheapest ghosting LEDs and control the LEDs better with LED OCD. For example, if you have a game you wish to retain the nostalgic gentle on and off effect of incandescents, you can use LED OCD to create that effect with cheap LEDs. You can also control the brightness of insert LEDs to better match the brightness from insert to insert.
Not everyone values the flexibility and options these boards provide, but for those that do, they are first class products.

So if I use the cointaker non ghosting premium kit then I won't need the led ocd board?

#1115 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

So if I use the cointaker non ghosting premium kit then I won't need the led ocd board?

You will not need LED OCD for the inserts, correct.

If you use non-ghosting LED in the GI, they will still flicker when the game tries to dim them.

#1116 7 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

You will not need LED OCD for the inserts, correct.
If you use non-ghosting LED in the GI, they will still flicker when the game tries to dim them.

Thanks!

#1117 7 years ago

I'm not usually an LED guy but given how dark this game is I think GI OCD plus very bright LEDs in the GI spots might be worth a shot.

#1118 7 years ago

On my STTNG, sometimes when it goes to load the left cannon, the ball comes out so forcefully that it flys off the wireform leading to the cannon and drains down the left side. This happens maybe 1 in 6 times.

Has anyone else experienced this, and any idea what I can do to prevent it? The wireform itself looks normal.

#1119 7 years ago
Quoted from Fytr:

On my STTNG, sometimes when it goes to load the left cannon, the ball comes out so forcefully that it flys off the wireform leading to the cannon and drains down the left side. This happens maybe 1 in 6 times.
Has anyone else experienced this, and any idea what I can do to prevent it? The wireform itself looks normal.

I used to have this problem. I put a line of black electrical tape along the under side of the top of the VUK. It deadens the ricochet enough that the ball hasn't jumped the track since.

#1120 7 years ago
Quoted from Fytr:

On my STTNG, sometimes when it goes to load the left cannon, the ball comes out so forcefully that it flys off the wireform leading to the cannon and drains down the left side. This happens maybe 1 in 6 times.
Has anyone else experienced this, and any idea what I can do to prevent it? The wireform itself looks normal.

Had the same problem and the VUK next to it would kick so hard the ball would bounce off the wire rail and all the way back down the scoop at times. I moved the coil bracket for both of them down the slots about 1/8", this essentially weakens the solenoid and lets them both gently but still forcefully put the ball where it's supposed to be.

#1121 7 years ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

Had the same problem and the VUK next to it would kick so hard the ball would bounce off the wire rail and all the way back down the scoop at times. I moved the coil bracket for both of them down the slots about 1/8", this essentially weakens the solenoid and lets them both gently but still forcefully put the ball where it's supposed to be.

Yeah, my left VUK was doing that too, I put some weather stripping between the plastic and the wireform to deaden the "bounce" and that solved it. Both of these issues started after a recent shop job where I cleaned the assemblies and replaced the coil sleeves.

Was moving the coil bracket down just a matter of loosening the screws, sliding it a bit lower, and tightening?

#1122 7 years ago

Things that make you say "COOL!"

Did you know, there is a way to pass instruction codes to your MPU?

For instance, entering the code 8556 in your game will bring up a list of Steve Ritchie games. To get the game listening for code entry, all you do is press both flipper buttons (B), then hit the left (L) flipper button the same number of times as the code you are entering, so 8 times to set an 8, to enter the number and move to the next digit you press the right (R) button. After entering the 4th number you hit the right button again to execute, meaning all codes will end with 2 presses of the right button. Simplified B, 8L, 1R, 5L, 1R, 5L, 1R, 6L, 2R.

#1123 7 years ago
Quoted from Pin_Guy:

Things that make you say "COOL!"
Did you know, there is a way to pass instruction codes to your MPU?
For instance, entering the code 8556 in your game will bring up a list of Steve Ritchie games. To get the game listening for code entry, all you do is press both flipper buttons (B), then hit the left (L) flipper button the same number of times as the code you are entering, so 8 times to set an 8, to enter the number and move to the next digit you press the right (R) button. After entering the 4th number you hit the right button again to execute, meaning all codes will end with 2 presses of the right button. Simplified B, 8L, 1R, 5L, 1R, 5L, 1R, 6L, 2R.

I've heard of that as a way to unlock Easter eggs. Google it. There's some fun ones.

#1124 7 years ago

I've got a NOS STTNG playfield if anyone is interested.

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#1125 7 years ago
Quoted from simplykind:

I've got a NOS STTNG playfield if anyone is interested.

And I'm spent.

#1126 7 years ago

So I just ordered the full cointaker kit of non ghosting leds, and also ordered the GI board. Are there any really difficult leds to get at on this? Hoping to hear from someone that has done a full led conversion and how difficult it was... any tips on any leds hard to get to?

#1127 7 years ago

No need to tear apart the game, hardest was probably the insert ones near the spinner, because the subway is in the way. A cheap pair of long, curved forceps and magnetic long nut driver are your friends! For all the GI, unscrew the bulb holder base from underneath the PF to swap the bulb. The only things you need to remove on top the PF is the Borg ship cover and the canon covers. I was able to do my pop bumpers without removing the ramp, just the covers. Don't forget backbox and coin slots/front buttons! Keep the game off when working, shorting GI to switch lines will blow your board up.

#1128 7 years ago
Quoted from mavantix:

No need to tear apart the game, hardest was probably the insert ones near the spinner, because the subway is in the way. A cheap pair of long, curved forceps and magnetic long nut driver are your friends! For all the GI, unscrew the bulb holder base from underneath the PF to swap the bulb. The only things you need to remove on top the PF is the Borg ship cover and the canon covers. I was able to do my pop bumpers without removing the ramp, just the covers. Don't forget backbox and coin slots/front buttons! Keep the game off when working, shorting GI to switch lines will blow your board up.

Cool thanks. I might need to message you if I run into anything. Can't wait to see this game with full leds. This game has never had anything done to it at all, it was a 1 owner huo with a little over 300 plays, still looks like new...

#1129 7 years ago

When I install the LED OCD board can I test it with the regular incandescent bulbs still in? I want to install it and make sure it works ok first. Anything difficult about installing that board? I ordered the bracket so I can mount it without screwing into the backbox.

#1130 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

When I install the LED OCD board can I test it with the regular incandescent bulbs still in? I want to install it and make sure it works ok first. Anything difficult about installing that board? I ordered the bracket so I can mount it without screwing into the backbox.

depends -- are you asking about GI OCD or LED OCD?

if you install GI OCD with regular incandescent bulbs still in the game, it will blow the fuses on the board. it is designed to run LEDs (although you can get away with a few incandescents in there).

LED OCD is okay with any mix of incandescents and LEDs.

#1131 7 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

depends -- are you asking about GI OCD or LED OCD?
if you install GI OCD with regular incandescent bulbs still in the game, it will blow the fuses on the board. it is designed to run LEDs (although you can get away with a few incandescents in there).
LED OCD is okay with any mix of incandescents and LEDs.

I purchased this board http://ledocd.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=24

So do all the LEDs first, then install that board?

#1133 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

I purchased this board http://ledocd.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=24
So do all the LEDs first, then install that board?

yes +2

1) install GI LEDs (including the shield inserts, which are actually on a GI string)
2) play a few games where you get to Borg Multiball
3) observe the flicker
4) install the GI OCD board
5) repeat step 2
6) observe the beautiful dimming during Borg Multiball

#1134 7 years ago

actually you don't even need to play -- if you go into the test menu, there is a setting to manually cycle through the brightness levels from 1 to 8 (although 7 and 8 are the same). with LEDs in, you will see awful flicker at several of these levels. put in the board, and the flicker is gone.

#1135 7 years ago

oh one more thing -- the GI OCD board converts the current from AC to DC, which means you actually have to put any wedge-style GI bulbs in the correct orientation (in terms of positive and negative leads), or they won't light up. without the board, they light up fine in either orientation, but GI OCD cares about the polarization of the bulb, because it provides DC current. This doesn't apply to the 44/47 bulbs (the ones with the cylindrical base), just the 555 ones (with the wedge-shaped base).

On STTNG, the only wedge-style GI bulbs are the shield inserts and the backbox. so if you install the board and some of your shield inserts or backbox bulbs aren't lighting up, just turn the bulb 180 degrees and try again.

During initial development, Herg came over to my place to test the GI OCD board on my STTNG, and when we booted it up, none of the 6 shield inserts lit up. he thought there must be a bug with his board, or a cabling problem, and we messed around with the multimeter and software diagnostics for a while, but in the end it turned out i simply had all 6 bulbs oriented the wrong way, which is a 1 in 64 chance but somehow i managed to do it, haha.

i don't think the bulbs are labeled for which lead is positive or negative, so you will likely have to guess and then any that don't light up, just flip them around.

#1136 7 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

oh one more thing -- the GI OCD board converts the current from AC to DC, which means you actually have to put any wedge-style GI bulbs in the correct orientation (in terms of positive and negative leads), or they won't light up. without the board, they light up fine in either orientation, but GI OCD cares about the polarization of the bulb, because it provides DC current. This doesn't apply to the 44/47 bulbs (the ones with the cylindrical base), just the 555 ones (with the wedge-shaped base).
On STTNG, the only wedge-style GI bulbs are the shield inserts and the backbox. so if you install the board and some of your shield inserts or backbox bulbs aren't lighting up, just turn the bulb 180 degrees and try again.
During initial development, Herg came over to my place to test the GI OCD board on my STTNG, and when we booted it up, none of the 6 shield inserts lit up. he thought there must be a bug with his board, or a cabling problem, and we messed around with the multimeter and software diagnostics for a while, but in the end it turned out i simply had all 6 bulbs oriented the wrong way, which is a 1 in 64 chance but somehow i managed to do it, haha.
i don't think the bulbs are labeled for which lead is positive or negative, so you will likely have to guess and then any that don't light up, just flip them around.

Thanks for the advice everyone. I purchased the premium cointaker non ghosting kit. I'm not sure exactly what I'll be getting in it. Are they all just standard white color lights? Or are some of them colored leds? Is there instructions on which leds to put where?

#1137 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

Thanks for the advice everyone. I purchased the premium cointaker non ghosting kit. I'm not sure exactly what I'll be getting in it. Are they all just standard white color lights? Or are some of them colored leds? Is there instructions on which leds to put where?

it should be pretty obvious. put green bulbs under green inserts, put red bulbs under red inserts, and so on. the GI is probably all white.

#1138 7 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

...
1) install GI LEDs (including the shield inserts, which are actually on a GI string)
...

When you go to replace bulbs in the large light board under the playfield, where the shield insert lights are mounted, make sure you remove the board from the machine first and then very carefully support the sockets with one hand while you gentle remove and insert the bulbs. These sockets are not strong enough on their own and you can easily have them coming lose of falling off completely when trying to remove or insert a bulb. It's also easy to mess up the through-hole solder pads on that board when you go to repair loose sockets.

#1139 7 years ago
Quoted from Fytr:

When you go to replace bulbs in the large light board under the playfield, where the shield insert lights are mounted, make sure you remove the board from the machine first and then very carefully support the sockets with one hand while you gentle remove and insert the bulbs. These sockets are not strong enough on their own and you can easily have them coming lose of falling off completely when trying to remove or insert a bulb. It's also easy to mess up the through-hole solder pads on that board when you go to repair loose sockets.

This is actually a very good and important tip that is relevant to STTNG. Fytr is talking about the 555 lamp base (there's 6 of them) on that board. I had to repair one on mine because it was damaged.

#1140 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

Thanks for the advice everyone. I purchased the premium cointaker non ghosting kit. I'm not sure exactly what I'll be getting in it. Are they all just standard white color lights? Or are some of them colored leds? Is there instructions on which leds to put where?

When I bought one of their kits for JP several years ago it included a sheet of paper telling you which LEDs were for what insert, GI, etc. Unfortunately it had many errors, included too few flashers, didn't address the 455s that are supposed to be behind the title, etc. I don't know if they still include that instructions set or not but hopefully they have the kit right for STTNG.

#1141 7 years ago
Quoted from mavantix:

This is actually a very good and important tip that is relevant to STTNG. fytr is talking about the 555 lamp base (there's 6 of them) on that board. I had to repair one on mine because it was damaged.

I'll definitely be back in a few weeks when I get to installing this stuff. My plan is to change out all the lights in the backbox and also the 6 of them in the middle. Then I'll install that gi board and test it. Then I will install all the rest of the playfield leds.

So how fragile are those shield lights? This machine has been babied for 24 years, I doubt those 6 shield lights have ever even been replaced. There was only a little over 300 plays on it when I bought it, still looks NIB.

#1142 7 years ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

didn't address the 455s that are supposed to be behind the title,

That's news too me! When I got mine no 455's in the game period!
You say they belong behind the title?

#1143 7 years ago
Quoted from pcprogrammer:

I'll definitely be back in a few weeks when I get to installing this stuff. My plan is to change out all the lights in the backbox and also the 6 of them in the middle. Then I'll install that gi board and test it. Then I will install all the rest of the playfield leds.
So how fragile are those shield lights? This machine has been babied for 24 years, I doubt those 6 shield lights have ever even been replaced. There was only a little over 300 plays on it when I bought it, still looks NIB.

It's not so much that the socket is fragile, but the socket might be very tight and might require a worrying amount of force to get the bulbs in. At least that's how it was for my shield inserts. The rest of the sockets were okay I think.

#1144 7 years ago
Quoted from transprtr4u:

That's news too me! When I got mine no 455's in the game period!
You say they belong behind the title?

That was on Jurassic Park (JP), which did have 455s behind the title originally, not STTNG. To be fair I don't think blinking LEDs to replace 455s were even available at the time, but there were numerous other issues - primarily not enough flashers for the game.

#1145 7 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

It's not so much that the socket is fragile, but the socket might be very tight and might require a worrying amount of force to get the bulbs in. At least that's how it was for my shield inserts. The rest of the sockets were okay I think.

Same here, LED 555 bases are often harder to insert than the incandescent bulbs and Fytr has a great point. It's worth the extra time to remove that light board as it pretty simple to do.

#1146 7 years ago

Probably about half way done with the playfield swap, what a project...didn't help that I took a year off from working on it, lol.

Working on cleaning up the cabinet next, replacing the front decal, and then wiring up what I can from the wiring harness before putting the playfield in the cabinet and installing other items. I've been debating ordering a new cabinet and decals but that would be over $1k.

The STTNG playfield is very heavy populated so I don't want to leave it on the rotisserie with the wiring harness, subway, cannon motors and VUK mechs for very long. Will complete the rest of the swap in the cabinet where the playfield will have better support.

Finally wrapped up wiring the new ramps this week, new subway has been ready to go. Every part and screw that is small enough to be tumbled has been polished.

20170201_200725 (resized).jpg20170201_200725 (resized).jpg

#1148 7 years ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Probably about half way done with the playfield swap, what a project...didn't help that I took a year off from working on it, lol.

This is on my list to do someday. My playfield has some shield insert wear. Its going to have to be when I'm OK with not having the game playable for a year or so. I've had it for six years and I'm still not willing to have it down that long.

#1149 7 years ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

The STTNG playfield is very heavy populated so I don't want to leave it on the rotisserie with the wiring harness, subway, cannon motors and VUK mechs for very long. Will complete the rest of the swap in the cabinet where the playfield will have better support.

I do understand the concern here, but you have both the top wood rails and the slide rails in place, both of these will help prevent the playfield from warping. I would recommend at least installing all of the wiring harnesses while the table is on the rotisserie, the time and aggravation you will save by working on it in this position cannot be overstated.

harness install (resized).jpgharness install (resized).jpg

#1150 7 years ago

Hey guys, first little issue with my sttng. After you play a game (or even when you just turn the machine on) it just launches a ball over and over again. I put a link to the video below. I can start a game and it seems to play fine, just not sure why it is doing that auto launch thing. This ever happen to anyone?

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