(Topic ID: 254504)

STTNG issues after 300 mile trip


By r00DVM

14 days ago



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#1 14 days ago

So I went down to south florida today to pick up an STTNG at a damn good price. Played a game on it before making the purchase and the only glaringly obvious problem was that when you hit either flipper at any point in gameplay it automatically plays the “shuttle craft leaving” sound and animation on the screen... figured it was something making contact where it shouldn’t and I could figure that out.

After the trip now when you turn it on the game will launch one ball at a time over and over again, sometimes they make their way back out and sometimes they disappear around the back of the playfield and don’t come out. IF I can manage to have all 6 in the drain at once it will let me start a game but the shuttle animation issue persists.

The startup diagnostics say right flipper EOS (found that the ground was missing its leaf spring - easy fix) and soundboard U8 checksum error so I’ll check the connections there.

Could the busted leaf spring be shorting something out causing the animation? It doesn’t only happen with right flipper press, it happens with both...

The ball launching thing? I’ve seen a few threads mentioning to check the diverter and I’ll do that later tonight or tomorrow - what am I looking for? Why would the diverter being bad cause the game to launch balls in the first place? Is it potentially a problem with the launcher that loosened on the drive home? Because it wasn’t doing that at the person’s house when I tested it

#2 14 days ago

The game is supposed to store 3 balls in the playfield and only have 3 in the trough. It locks one at either canon and one back in the borg lock i believe.

#3 14 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

So I went down to south florida today to pick up an STTNG at a damn good price. Played a game on it before making the purchase and the only glaringly obvious problem was that when you hit either flipper at any point in gameplay it automatically plays the “shuttle craft leaving” sound and animation on the screen... figured it was something making contact where it shouldn’t and I could figure that out.
After the trip now when you turn it on the game will launch one ball at a time over and over again, sometimes they make their way back out and sometimes they disappear around the back of the playfield and don’t come out. IF I can manage to have all 6 in the drain at once it will let me start a game but the shuttle animation issue persists.
The startup diagnostics say right flipper EOS (found that the ground was missing its leaf spring - easy fix) and soundboard U8 checksum error so I’ll check the connections there.
Could the busted leaf spring be shorting something out causing the animation? It doesn’t only happen with right flipper press, it happens with both...
The ball launching thing? I’ve seen a few threads mentioning to check the diverter and I’ll do that later tonight or tomorrow - what am I looking for? Why would the diverter being bad cause the game to launch balls in the first place? Is it potentially a problem with the launcher that loosened on the drive home? Because it wasn’t doing that at the person’s house when I tested it

Ok, for the diverter, here is what most likely happened:

First up (and most likely) the tieback wire broke, locked on the diverter coil, and took out the drive and or predrive transistor for that diverter coil. It is a small board on the upper right corner of the backbox. The tieback wire connects at the drop target lug coil that is in the upper part of the pf, bottom of the pf when the pf is in the up position. Most likely you will need to fix the tieback, replace the coil, and the transistors.

Luckily this is a super common issue. Search the forum, and you will find the info you need.

#4 14 days ago

Welcome to STTNG ownership. You could easily have more than 1 issue going on.

Check the subway diverters (could be loose), the diverter coils (could be fried), tieback wire, auxiliary driver board transistors, etc...

#5 13 days ago
Quoted from pinball_ric:

The game is supposed to store 3 balls in the playfield and only have 3 in the trough. It locks one at either canon and one back in the borg lock i believe.

is that so? So, it should fire three balls and then be ready to go? So if balls are coming back to the trough then something IS wrong with the diverter cuz it should shoot 1, 2, 3 and then be ready to start instead of sometimes shooting 5-6

#6 13 days ago
Quoted from dsuperbee:

Ok, for the diverter, here is what most likely happened:
First up (and most likely) the tieback wire broke, locked on the diverter coil, and took out the drive and or predrive transistor for that diverter coil. It is a small board on the upper right corner of the backbox. The tieback wire connects at the drop target lug coil that is in the upper part of the pf, bottom of the pf when the pf is in the up position. Most likely you will need to fix the tieback, replace the coil, and the transistors.
Luckily this is a super common issue. Search the forum, and you will find the info you need.

I get the wire maybe breaking in transit, I’ll try to locate it tomorrow and fix it if it’s broken. I don’t see any good reason why it would burn out after being unplugged to move it and immediately upon plugging it back in - hopefully I’m right

#7 13 days ago
Quoted from Pinless:

Welcome to STTNG ownership. You could easily have more than 1 issue going on.
Check the subway diverters (could be loose), the diverter coils (could be fried), tieback wire, auxiliary driver board transistors, etc...

Haha thanks! It’s gonna be a bit of a nightmare but I know I’ll love it once I’m done. I bought it having never played one before today - just heard great things and love the subject matter.

#8 13 days ago

Any insight on why it plays that animation every time the flipper is pushed? I can try to get a video tomorrow but anyone who knows the game should know which animation I mean - the shuttle craft takes off from the center of the screen and heads away. It plays EVERY time a flipper button is pressed during play (I’m not sure if it’s doing it in the menu, because if not maybe it has something to do with the flopper’s movement causing a weird contact point?)

#9 13 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

Any insight on why it plays that animation every time the flipper is pushed? I can try to get a video tomorrow but anyone who knows the game should know which animation I mean - the shuttle craft takes off from the center of the screen and heads away. It plays EVERY time a flipper button is pressed during play (I’m not sure if it’s doing it in the menu, because if not maybe it has something to do with the flopper’s movement causing a weird contact point?)

Maybe a switch matrix issue? In switch test mode, observe whether hitting the flipper buttons cause any switches other than the EOS switches to be activated, like the made ramp shot switches.

#10 13 days ago
Quoted from floyd1977:

Maybe a switch matrix issue? In switch test mode, observe whether hitting the flipper buttons cause any switches other than the EOS switches to be activated, like the made ramp shot switches.

as of right now this sounds like a foreign language to me, but i will look into it tomorrow when I'm back at the machine - thank you lol

#11 13 days ago

Not familiar with this exact machine, but a switch matrix issue could be causing multiple issues, including the diverter not firing when it should. Once you get to test the switches, note all that don't work and compare to the matrix, which is in the manual. You may find several in a row or column out which will tell you which wire to track down , looking for a break.

#12 13 days ago

Think of the matrix like this, it is a way to have 64 switches working on 16 wires. Essentially 8 seperated wires and 8 seperate grounds, all monitored. So if wire 1 is grounded through wire 9, the macine knows which switch was hit. If wire 1 is grounded through wire 10, it knows another switch is hit. So if a wire is disconnected, all the switches along that wire are out from that point on.

#13 13 days ago

This is not your game but see how each row and column has a single wire associated with it. In the circle the whole column is green/orange wire, and if that wire connects to any wire from a row it activates the switch in that box.

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#14 13 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

So I went down to south florida today to pick up an STTNG at a damn good price.

Congratulations, you have chosen a fantastic pin.
When you have time, be sure to check out the STTNG owners forum, you will find a ton of useful information there.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/sttng-owners-club

#15 13 days ago

So I’m getting a top drop target error - the switch is fine but the lever mounting points on each side are worn off so the lever doesn’t stay on. Is this an appropriate replacement? Mine has a resistor soldered across two of the three contact points, do I need one?

https://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/12-SMSB

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#16 13 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

So I’m getting a top drop target error - the switch is fine but the lever mounting points on each side are worn off so the lever doesn’t stay on.

You may be able to fix this by squeezing the mounting tabs on the actuator arm with a pair of pliers

Quoted from r00DVM:

Mine has a resistor soldered across two of the three contact points, do I need one?

This is a 1N4004 blocking diode, it is required on all switches to prevent the active column signal from propagating to other columns.

#17 13 days ago

Thats a diode you can test it With a MM and see if its still good. That will tell you if you need a new one.

#18 13 days ago

Shoot beat me to it

#19 13 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Guy:

You may be able to fix this by squeezing the mounting tabs on the actuator arm with a pair of pliers

This is a 1N4004 blocking diode, it is required on all switches to prevent the active column signal from propagating to other columns.

Yeah, I tried squeezing it a little tighter but there really isn’t much of any “nub” for it to attach to... my other thought was to drill it out and use a piece of paper clip or wooden toothpick (because conducting electricity is bad, probably) to act as the nubs.

Would this switch being bad cause the “buzz buzz buzz” that happens during play as the ball goes into that top hole?

#20 13 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

Would this switch being bad cause the “buzz buzz buzz” that happens during play as the ball goes into that top hole?

hard to say, with this switch out of the loop, the game will think the drop target is always up, if its supposed to be down for staging or ball locks then the game will be firing the drop coil. You may also be hearing subway firing to sent the ball to the proper location, this is less likely as unless the machine is staging, balls in the top hole should be fed to the upper left VUV which requires no subway diverters to activate

#21 13 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

it automatically plays the “shuttle craft leaving” sound and animation on the screen...

I believe there are two shuttle craft animations, one shows a shuttle craft leaving UFP HQ in San Francisco, this is activated by closure of subway opto SW46. The other is just a shuttle craft and is activated by closure of the switch at the top of the right ramp SW87.

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#22 13 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Guy:

I believe there are two shuttle craft animations, one shows a shuttle craft leaving UFP HQ in San Francisco, this is activated by closure of subway opto SW46. The other is just a shuttle craft and is activated by closure of the switch at the top of the right ramp SW87.[quoted image]

its definitely SW46 messing up because sometimes when the ball is kicked out of the trough to the starting point it'll activate the "Command decision" rather than allowing me to choose between the ~5 initial options OR during play my rank will keep rising randomly and that switch is the same one that controls both of those things.

My subway is DISGUSTING - I swear i thought it was a metal subway until I started reading more about the game and realized they're all plastic. Its also cracked beneath the center hole so I am deciding if I want to replace it completely (another $120?!) or take it off to clean it and attempt a repair of some kind

#23 13 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

its definitely SW46 messing up because sometimes when the ball is kicked out of the trough to the starting point it'll activate the "Command decision" rather than allowing me to choose between the ~5 initial options OR during play my rank will keep rising randomly and that switch is the same one that kicks controls both of those things.
My subway is DISGUSTING - I swear i thought it was a metal subway until I started reading more about the game and realized they're all plastic. Its also cracked beneath the center hole so I am deciding if I want to replace it completely (another $120?!) or take it off to clean it and attempt a repair of some kind

You can bet your last dollar that most or all the optos are very dirty too, you may also have a gummed-up diverter. I'd suggest you read the owner's thread as pin_guy suggested and set out to clean the subway, all optos, and make sure all diverters are clean and move freely. That's a good starting point to working on your other issues. You really do need to put the game in switch tests and see if any one or combination of switches are triggering others, it sounds like they are. Then read up on how to isolate any problems with the switch matrix to the playfield or boards and proceed from there. This all sounds worse than it is but you have lots of great help on this site with intimate knowledge of this game.

#24 13 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

My subway is DISGUSTING - I swear i thought it was a metal subway until I started reading more about the game and realized they're all plastic. Its also cracked beneath the center hole so I am deciding if I want to replace it completely (another $120?!) or take it off to clean it and attempt a repair of some kind

A lot of these are cracked in that spot as its the main shot to advance in the game; plus if you raise your playfield without removing all the balls, the staged balls will slam right into the plastic ends of the subway. There are metal subway protectors available to help with future breakage; for a player quality machine, you can post in the STTNG owners thread to see if someone that has an old subway leftover from a restoration project that they would part with; but if you are planning on a full restoration (new quality or better) you will want to replace it for sure.

New Quality or better:

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#25 10 days ago

This machine is crazy.I had similar problem before several days and found 7 balls in the machine.
I have it from around 7-8 years and never touched the balls and always played it.Now I found that they were 7.How this could be happen to play with 7 balls?
Of course after remove one ball and everything is fine.

#26 10 days ago
Quoted from arakissun:

This machine is crazy.I had similar problem before several days and found 7 balls in the machine.
I have it from around 7-8 years and never touched the balls and always played it.Now I found that they were 7.How this could be happen to play with 7 balls?
Of course after remove one ball and everything is fine.

that’s nuts! I definitely have 6 in there and I’ve ordered new ones because the previous owners never opened the machine in the years that they owned it so I’m sure they’ve never been replaced.

#27 10 days ago

Okay so I got my new subway with protectors in the mail, got the old subway out and everything disconnected - the top diverter... what’s the easiest way to get that out of the old in and into the new one? It looked like pulling the set screws and shaft and then reinserting on the new one but that shaft is LOCKED in there. WD-40? Lighter fluid?

#28 10 days ago

Also, now that it’s all apart and I’m cleaning the optos it looks like either the entire opto art or at least the LEDs on sw46 were replaced. All the other ones sit INSIDE their black or white plastic housing (I assume to protect the integrity of the beam) while in 46 they are sticking out a fairly significant amount(at least 2mm on each side) - can that be making the switch register as “open” sometimes because the “beam” isn’t as direct as it should be?

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#29 10 days ago

Just desolder and shorten the legs, they should be inside the housing, so it can't pickup other light (by deflection)

#30 10 days ago
Quoted from Thor-NL:

Just desolder and shorten the legs, they should be inside the housing, so it can't pickup other light (by deflection)

that’s what I thought! I’ll do that before I put the subway back together. Still trying to get that top diverter shaft out

#31 10 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

Okay so I got my new subway with protectors in the mail, got the old subway out and everything disconnected - the top diverter... what’s the easiest way to get that out of the old in and into the new one? It looked like pulling the set screws and shaft and then reinserting on the new one but that shaft is LOCKED in there.

Are you referring to the linkage that contains the setscrews or the diverter itself. These parts were well designed and should come right out, if it was incorrectly installed and the setscrews where tightened down outside their slots, you could be dealing with metal burs on the shaft. The pictures I provided should help in this area as you can see all the parts removed and how it should look when put back together.

#32 10 days ago

PRO TIP:

Best cleaning method for the Stainless Steel Subway insert (ball track) is to go over it with a 3M Scotch-Brite Fine-Finishing Sander after removing all the crud.

amazon.com link »

I used this on all of the upper playfield ball guide rails as well as the subway track.

#33 10 days ago

I almost forgot...

Please look over this post for more detailed information on bulletproofing the subway diverters.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/sttng-owners-club/page/53#post-4768297

This is what I use on metal-metal moving parts:
amazon.com link »

#34 10 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Guy:

Are you referring to the linkage that contains the setscrews or the diverter itself. These parts were well designed and should come right out, if it was incorrectly installed and the setscrews where tightened down outside their slots, you could be dealing with metal burs on the shaft. The pictures I provided should help in this area as you can see all the parts removed and how it should look when put back together.

yeah, I see them disassembled in your photo but I can’t get that shaft out at all even after the set screws were removed. I ended up cutting away the old, broken subway but there’s no way to get it into the new subway without removing that top diverter shaft. I’m at work tonight but I’ll get pictures tomorrow or Monday when I go back to the shop to work on it. Just looking for ideas for penetrating lubricant I can use to help it slide out easier then I can clean it and put it back together afterwards

#35 10 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

I see them disassembled in your photo but I can’t get that shaft out at all even after the set screws were removed.

Ok. I'm still confused on this as you aren't taking the shaft out of the crank (part that contains the setscrews), you are pulling the crank off the shaft. You should already have the plunger of the coil, if not this is why its difficult.
1) First remove the 2 screws holding the coil stop in place, remove the coil stop, then slide the coil out of its plunger
2) You should be able to get the plunger out of the coil retaining bracket, if not remove the retaining bracket and spring.
3) Now slide the crank off the shaft, if it doesnt want to come off, just hold the diverter so it cant turn and rotate the crank back and forth while applying upward pressure until it comes off.
4) now just pull the diverter and shaft out of the bushing, if it's stubborn, feel free to smack it with your rubber hammer.

Essentially, it should look like this before you remove the crank and diverter shaft, as you can see in the picture below, I cant recall if I hat to remove the coil retention bracket to get everything free, or if I removed it since everything was coming apart anyway.

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#36 10 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Guy:

Ok. I'm still confused on this as you aren't taking the shaft out of the crank (part that contains the setscrews), you are pulling the crank off the shaft. You should already have the plunger of the coil, if not this is why its difficult.
1) First remove the 2 screws holding the coil stop in place, remove the coil stop, then slide the coil out of its plunger
2) You should be able to get the plunger out of the coil retaining bracket, if not remove the retaining bracket and spring.
3) Now slide the crank off the shaft, if it doesnt want to come off, just hold the diverter so it cant turn and rotate the crank back and forth while applying upward pressure until it comes off.
4) now just pull the diverter and shaft out of the bushing, if it's stubborn, feel free to smack it with your rubber hammer.
Essentially, it should look like this before you remove the crank and diverter shaft, as you can see in the picture below, I cant recall if I hat to remove the coil retention bracket to get everything free, or if I removed it since everything was coming apart anyway.[quoted image]

Ah, okay - I’ll try that when I get back over there.

I was trying to avoid breaking down the entire diverter, just trying to remove the diverter and shaft so I could re-attach everything to the new subway. So in reference to your photo imagine the entire mechanism is still attached - I removed those two black set screws and was trying to remove the diverter + shaft from that bushing with everything else intact

Thank you for all the help!

#37 6 days ago

pin_guy Got it! taking it apart completely helped because then i could use a pry-bar to take out the diverter/shaft from the bushing. Its all back together now and seems to be running correctly, although since I've never played the game before I bought one I don't know all the little nuances so if something goes wrong I may not actually know.

I was able to get those LEDs on opto SW46 in a TINY bit (like 1/2mm) but they still stick out a decent amount. If i have any more issues with that sensor reading "open" when it shouldn't then I'll likely just replace that whole opto switch to make my life a little easier.

The U8 checksum error was gone while I was repairing and now will pop up on startup - the first ball of the first game has no audio and then when the second ball starts all the audio comes back in... It's quirky but it works for now so I'm tempted to leave it alone rather than trying to pull the chip and risk not being able to get it working at all again - eventually I'll just order a replacement set (or just U8) and replace it. I also plan to do the "tie back mod" for that 50V line eventually - as of now its freshly soldered in place and holding strong but I know it can cause huge issues if it ever disconnects so I'd rather take care of it before that happens.

I also had a random error for SW 83 (made left ramp) but checking it in the "test" shows it is working and then the error went away after that. I have a hard time getting it up that ramp in gameplay for the "Picard maneuver" - it'll go 90% up the ramp and then roll back down rather than completing the ramp and come down the wireframe... this machine didn't come with a bubble level so I bought one aftermarket and the pitch seems to be set appropriately for Williams machines of the era but maybe I still have it a touch too steep to make that ramp all the way around? anything else I should check for as to why it may be rolling backwards rather than completing that ramp? The diverter up top there appears to be out of the way when I look but maybe i should watch someone else hit a ball up there and make sure it is extending when it should (whenever the lock light isn't lit it should divert the ball to the wireframe, correct?)

Going over there now to put in the coin mech since nobody carries 500Lira anymore and I want people to pay to play it lol

#38 6 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

I also had a random error for SW 83 (made left ramp) but checking it in the "test" shows it is working and then the error went away after that. I have a hard time getting it up that ramp in gameplay for the "Picard maneuver" - it'll go 90% up the ramp and then roll back down rather than completing the ramp and come down the wireframe... this machine didn't come with a bubble level so I bought one aftermarket and the pitch seems to be set appropriately for Williams machines of the era but maybe I still have it a touch too steep to make that ramp all the way around? anything else I should check for as to why it may be rolling backwards rather than completing that ramp? The diverter up top there appears to be out of the way when I look but maybe i should watch someone else hit a ball up there and make sure it is extending when it should (whenever the lock light isn't lit it should divert the ball to the wireframe, correct?)
Going over there now to put in the coin mech since nobody carries 500Lira anymore and I want people to pay to play it lol

That's the correct operation, it's a tough shot but not as bad as the lock shot as that takes more ball speed. Just make sure the upper flipper is in proper working order, rebuild it if necessary and it should be makeable even with the ball rolling down from the pops.

#39 6 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

pin_guy Got it! taking it apart completely helped because then i could use a pry-bar to take out the diverter/shaft from the bushing. Its all back together now and seems to be running correctly, although since I've never played the game before I bought one I don't know all the little nuances so if something goes wrong I may not actually know.
I was able to get those LEDs on opto SW46 in a TINY bit (like 1/2mm) but they still stick out a decent amount. If i have any more issues with that sensor reading "open" when it shouldn't then I'll likely just replace that whole opto switch to make my life a little easier.
The U8 checksum error was gone while I was repairing and now will pop up on startup - the first ball of the first game has no audio and then when the second ball starts all the audio comes back in... It's quirky but it works for now so I'm tempted to leave it alone rather than trying to pull the chip and risk not being able to get it working at all again - eventually I'll just order a replacement set (or just U8) and replace it. I also plan to do the "tie back mod" for that 50V line eventually - as of now its freshly soldered in place and holding strong but I know it can cause huge issues if it ever disconnects so I'd rather take care of it before that happens.
I also had a random error for SW 83 (made left ramp) but checking it in the "test" shows it is working and then the error went away after that. I have a hard time getting it up that ramp in gameplay for the "Picard maneuver" - it'll go 90% up the ramp and then roll back down rather than completing the ramp and come down the wireframe... this machine didn't come with a bubble level so I bought one aftermarket and the pitch seems to be set appropriately for Williams machines of the era but maybe I still have it a touch too steep to make that ramp all the way around? anything else I should check for as to why it may be rolling backwards rather than completing that ramp? The diverter up top there appears to be out of the way when I look but maybe i should watch someone else hit a ball up there and make sure it is extending when it should (whenever the lock light isn't lit it should divert the ball to the wireframe, correct?)
Going over there now to put in the coin mech since nobody carries 500Lira anymore and I want people to pay to play it lol

You might want to put a stronger coil on the upper flipper to make that ramp.
I also found that the ramp protector takes some speed away from the ball.

#40 6 days ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

That's the correct operation, it's a tough shot but not as bad as the lock shot as that takes more ball speed. Just make sure the upper flipper is in proper working order, rebuild it if necessary and it should be makeable even with the ball rolling down from the pops.

Flipper rebuild for top right and left are on the list. Right had to be rebuilt because it was giving an EOS error, so i figured i should just rebuild it completely if I was gonna mess with it. I have the parts for the left and the top right ready to go, just need a couple hours to sit down and do it.

#41 6 days ago
Quoted from wdennie:

You might want to put a stronger coil on the upper flipper to make that ramp.
I also found that the ramp protector takes some speed away from the ball.

I don't know that I want to upgrade the coil from stock - I'd like the gameplay to be nostalgic (aka as original as possible) for people who have been playing it for the last 26 years, but I guess I'll see how it is after Ii rebuild it.

#42 6 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

I don't know that I want to upgrade the coil from stock - I'd like the gameplay to be nostalgic (aka as original as possible) for people who have been playing it for the last 26 years, but I guess I'll see how it is after Ii rebuild it.

The stock coil should have more than enough power to make the shot. If after the rebuild you are still having issues you may be seeing some ball bounce from the ball guide to flipper transition, there should be none. After your rebuild, put a straight edge against the ball guide and align the flipper bat to it. If the straight edge cannot rest against the entire flipper bat AND the ball guide with zero gaps ... Make it so!

#43 6 days ago

So playing tonight in “rescue” it keeps spitting balls out after a drain... like 10-20 balls...
Or more - it’s still going lol

Any ideas?

Edit: it’s happening outside rescue too. But it seems random. I played a whole game with no issues, next person hit 1.7billioj on ball one and then player two had unlimited balls so they had to reset the machine

#44 5 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

So playing tonight in “rescue” it keeps spitting balls out after a drain... like 10-20 balls...
Or more - it’s still going lol
Any ideas?
Edit: it’s happening outside rescue too. But it seems random. I played a whole game with no issues, next person hit 1.7billioj on ball one and then player two had unlimited balls so they had to reset the machine

Almost certainly an opto problem, possibly one of them in the left VUKs depending on where it's firing balls out from. When it happens put it in switch test and see what the optos are registering and then see if the location of the balls corresponds correctly to that. Could possibly be divots in the trough too but I think that's less likely. I'm assuming it stops for some period of time after you reset it?

#45 5 days ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

Almost certainly an opto problem, possibly one of them in the left VUKs depending on where it's firing balls out from. When it happens put it in switch test and see what the optos are registering and then see if the location of the balls corresponds correctly to that. Could possibly be divots in the trough too but I think that's less likely. I'm assuming it stops for some period of time after you reset it?

It’s firing balls from the main launcher that starts the game. It doesn’t seem to have any level of predictability to it that I can see. Like I said, player 1 had a great normal ball then player two ended up with an endless supply of balls being launched after each drain

#46 5 days ago

Mine did something similar recently and it ended up being the trough opto board. It had a couple of the LED’s out.

They’re easy to troubleshoot if you have a cheap, point and shoot camera laying around.

#47 5 days ago

The connector on the trough opto board is subject to iffyness too.

#48 5 days ago

Must check the trough opto board definitely.
I had this problem too,when it launched balls when it wanted.No matter of the situations.
Replaced it and everything is fine now.

#49 5 days ago
Quoted from r00DVM:

It’s firing balls from the main launcher that starts the game. It doesn’t seem to have any level of predictability to it that I can see. Like I said, player 1 had a great normal ball then player two ended up with an endless supply of balls being launched after each drain

My best advice to you is to become familiar with your switch matrix test (T1)

This is what the switch matrix should look like after castration (balls removed)

STTNG Switch Matrix-no balls (resized).jpg
#50 4 days ago
Quoted from Pin_Guy:

My best advice to you is to become familiar with your switch matrix test (T1)
This is what the switch matrix should look like after castration (balls removed)[quoted image]

yeah... t18 is supposed to empty the lower playfield right? You just go to it and hit enter? Cuz mine doesn’t do shit. I have to just flip up the playfield and get the balls out of the top drop target if I want to empty the lower playfield.

Looked today and I had weird errors on like 36-38 and 41 I think. I didn’t have time to troubleshoot today cuz I had a friend with me but I’ll get to it in the next week

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