Sana'a
Quoted from fosaisu:You know a Boy Named Sue?
I love the song by JC, but honestly, I've never met a boy named Sue either.
(Topic ID: 214129)
Vid, there is no dodge, you called me (and others), Flat-earthers, Pindicks, and now mentally handicapped. I think we should stop responding to one another. I still very much appreciate your repair threads.
Quoted from kvan99:Vid, there is no dodge, you called me (and others), Flat-earthers, Pindicks, and now mentally handicapped. I think we should stop responding to one another. I still very much appreciate your repair threads.
I'm a mean old man that calls 'em as I see 'em.
I'll graciously accept your bow-out and the Cleared Up Different Jody will forever remain a Pinside mystery.
Good day, fine sir!
Quoted from Aurich:Hilton bought me some pretty nice gluten free beers once.
Quoted from Aurich:Wait, it having contact with Jody bad? He didn't buy me any beers.
Torrance, CA
Actually now that Alien is over along with Heighway I'm technically not barred from Stern events anymore. 
Newmarket, ON
Quoted from vid1900:Quoted from SUPERBEE:
I wonder if Steve is following this thread and laughing his ass off !
"I don't know how you do it, man"
"Some people can not be educated"
Listen Vid, I have nothing but the most respect for you here but i call it the way i see it. Just saying... 
Quoted from kvan99:I guess you're upset...watch some porn and fix some machines, it will cheer you up.
That usually works for me. Then I go to sleep. 
Quoted from Astropin:Give it up vid. Clearly steel is not harder than wood. Clearly Stern "cheaped" out on us and used fake Chinese plywood and magnesium magnet protectors.
Clearly the Earth is flat.
Clearly the Easter Bunny went out and purchased name brand candy for my daughter about 3 1/2 weeks ago.
Clearly "opinion" trump's (pun intended) facts.
Clearly. I am still reading.
Now, I know more about dimpling than I ever thought I would. To me this is important information. Also occasionally amusing.
But another point friends. Where else would we find this level of detail paid to our passion?
I love Pinside.
Quoted from Fytr:There is certainly a marketing opportunity here for some young interested pinball company to come up with a none-dimpling playfield
What a novel concept?!
—dT
Quoted from vid1900:I love porn, goshdang do I love it.
Making it, watching it, making it while watching it.
how was this not source noted?
Quoted from Marvin:how was this not source noted?
I though everyone would recognize it instantly. Pinball Wizard Orgy
You can't be a real pinhead and not have it in your collection.
It's got all the greatest games: Time Machine, Funhouse, BOP, TZ, The Shadow
It's kinda R-rated by comparison to today's porn, but back then at least the broads were still skinny.
PWO has fallen into the public domain so you can see all your favorite games for free
Quoted from deeproot:What a novel concept?!
—dT
“Put up or shut up” is a novel concept too. If you’ve got cards then show them.
I know, I know, thread eject.
I've seen a lot of talk in this thread about how older Williams playfields are as soft and dimple as much as some of the newer ones.
But I am yet to see any examples of that on what I would consider an older Williams playfield.
So what I've got here is my 1957 Kings that I have been shopping out for the last couple years and before I put it back together I am going to drop this cup of five balls from six inches under where the slingshot plastic will go, a place that has never or rarely seen a ball, 25 times and see what we end up with. Be back in a while!
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DSCN5795 (resized).JPG
DSCN5794 (resized).JPG
OK, I've added some light to make it easier to see, and yes there is some dimpling. Which is obvious what will happen when you drop a bunch of steel balls on a 60 year old piece of wood without much protection in the first place.
Now let's compare it to that BM66 playfield from earlier in this thread and then everybody can decide for them self.
Quoted from o-din:OK, I've added some light to make it easier to see, and yes there is some dimpling. Which is obvious what will happen when you drop a bunch of steel balls on a 60 year old piece of wood without much protection in the first place.
Now let's compare it to that BM66 playfield from earlier in this thread and then everybody can decide for them self.
"But you didn't use the right equipment to test properly, so what you're seeing can't be right! It just can't! And did you test the water content of that wood before you tested? I'm sure that made the results vary. What about clearcoat? The Batman'66 clear is obviously amplifying the size of the dimples, right?"
Truth is, the newer Sterns are softer, period. Anyone who has bought a lot of NIB Sterns and has been in pinball for any length of time knows this. Whatever excuses are made don't jibe with observed reality and actual tests with calibrated equipment posted earlier.
As long as nobody comments on my crusty nails or slingshot mechs, to tell you the truth, I don't really care. My moon cratered BM66 was sold to a guy that put it in a craft brew place, and now it is doing exactly what it was meant to do. Earning money.
However I will probably set this Kings up to accept dimes like it once did when it was King on location.
Quoted from o-din:As long as nobody comments on my crusty nails
I was going to say, your hand bears a striking resemblance to that BM66 playfield. Time to moisturize.
Quoted from o-din:OK, I've added some light to make it easier to see, and yes there is some dimpling. Which is obvious what will happen when you drop a bunch of steel balls on a 60 year old piece of wood without much protection in the first place.
Now let's compare it to that BM66 playfield from earlier in this thread and then everybody can decide for them self.
If that was meant to be "scientific" I don't know what to tell you.
Quoted from Astropin:If that was meant to be "scientific" I don't know what to tell you.
True. Not many balls are going to drop 6 inches on any play field no matter what era.
Quoted from fosaisu:I was going to say, your hand bears a striking resemblance to that BM66 playfield. Time to moisturize.
It's hot and dry today and my whole body feels a little worse for the wear after last night's adventure, whatever it was, but no extra moisturizer necessary. A little chapstick after a couple weeks of Santa Ana winds, but that's about it.
Quoted from o-din:True. Not many balls are going to drop 6 inches on any play field no matter what era.
Quoted from Astropin:True. Not many balls are going to drop 6 inches on any play field no matter what era.
STTNG does and mine doesn't have a mark. Try that shit with a crappy Stern PF.
Quoted from zr11990:STTNG does and mine doesn't have a mark. Try that shit with a crappy Stern PF.
I didn't say that...o-din did.
Your STTNG (Which I also own) doesn't have a mark becasue over 25 years it got pounded flat. I can assure you that 24 years ago it had dimples-o-plenty.
Quoted from Astropin:I didn't say that...o-din did.
Your STTNG (Which I also own) doesn't have a mark becasue over 25 years it got pounded flat. I can assure you that 24 years ago it had dimples-o-plenty.
Sorry, no offense meant to you personally but bullshit. With the ball hitting from that height over and over again in the same place there would be a ditch there or some sort of uneven area but there isn't.
Quoted from zr11990:Sorry, no offense meant to you personally but bullshit. With the ball hitting from that height over and over again in the same place there would be a ditch there or some sort of uneven area but there isn't.
So your STTNG playfield is harder than a steel ball...interesting.
Quoted from zr11990:Sorry, no offense meant to you personally but bullshit. With the ball hitting from that height over and over again in the same place there would be a ditch there or some sort of uneven area but there isn't.
My Big Guns has some rather large dips where the cannon habitrails dump on to the lower playfield.
Next, Steve richie might discuss cabinet cracking and how normal it is and how it has been around since the invention of pinball cabinets and we didn't even notice..
Quoted from zr11990:Sorry, no offense meant to you personally but bullshit. With the ball hitting from that height over and over again in the same place there would be a ditch there or some sort of uneven area but there isn't.
Have you tried looking up close with the glass off, game lights off, and a more natural lighting source? I'm not saying it's the whole story, but I do think game lighting plays a big part in how noticeable dimpling is on games. Today's LEDs tend to cast a much stronger, harsher glow, so imperfections pop that might have slipped by with incandescents.
If dimples bother you just rainbow puke it purple or red, you can’t see ‘em, let alone, the playfield in general.
Quoted from zr11990:Sorry, no offense meant to you personally but bullshit. With the ball hitting from that height over and over again in the same place there would be a ditch there or some sort of uneven area but there isn't.
Check in your outlanes, where airballs rarely hit. You'll have to do what all the dimple-peepers are doing: you'll need to get just the right glare, and you'll see them. My STTNG has them in the outlines and just behind the flippers, all places where airballs rarely hit.
It appears that the odd stern pf is slightly softer, but all pfs have light dimpling. Every machine I have, including system 11s like whirlwind and millionaire, have dimpling. It is just harder to see on some pfs due to lighting and color of the pf.
Quoted from MrBally:Let's get Steve "the king of flow" to weigh in on this.
It would be totally badass if he could make a video, and tell us once and for all if older playfields dimpled; because no one has seen more brand new playfields than him.
Quoted from metallik:Can't believe this is 13 pages long now and some of you can't grasp the fact that there was, for whatever reason, just a crummy batch of playfields around BM66 production time. It's not like everyone suddenly and simultaneously decided this was a problem - basic visual observation of damage showed those playfields were different, hence the discussion. That BSD dimple looks about half the size of the craters I've seen on BM66.
Just like the GB ghosting issue.. amazing how that's no longer a problem now that Stern (supplier) fixed whatever the hell was wrong with that process.
I'm just glad the F'd up playfields are for shitty games and not the good one (Maiden!)
Someone should do a ball drop test on playfields old and new and measure the difference. I bet you will find there is one. open the skirt area where a ball has never hit and perform a drop test........ measure with a dial gauge.
Quoted from ibjeepin:Someone should do a ball drop test on playfields old and new and measure the difference. I bet you will find there is one. open the skirt area where a ball has never hit and perform a drop test........ measure with a dial gauge.
For sure there would be a slight difference. Newer wood has more moisture, but the difference would be negligible. W/B machines would have had moisture back in the 80s/90s just the same.
I wonder how much the increased awareness of dimples is simply due to games going into a home use environment that don’t get enough plays to level out the playfield in a noticeable time frame?
Back in the day a game was routed for years before a collector picked it up so dimples were everywhere and didn’t stand out as much. Now everyone has these games in their basements and they get stuck in the “highly noticeable” phase of dimpiliation (tm) for long periods of time since the games get so few plays.
My TNA had very noticeable dimples right away but it’s on location and I can already see them flattening out in high traffic areas. By the time I bring it home it should like any other routed 90’s Williams game with a nice uniform pf appearance. 
Quoted from Tranquilize:It appears that the odd stern pf is slightly softer, but all pfs have light dimpling
What you said right there. Yes they all have some but not the huge craters you see on new Sterns and I am using Batman66 as a prime example. Every one of those games I have seen have giant craters that look like they have been beaten by a ball peen hammer. There is no way that game would stand up to the abuse that the older games have taken. But as I said and how it is I don't know but my STTNG and my WH20 is smooth as a cheerleaders ass. The WH20 had the ink rubbed off and a smooth divot at the lost mine kickout but that is all.
Quoted from zr11990:huge craters ...giant craters that look like they have been beaten by a ball peen hammer.
What is the width & depth of a huge crater? What is the width & depth of a giant crater?
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:What is the width & depth of a huge crater? What is the width & depth of a giant crater?
Huge crater has a diameter and circumference of that looks like crap.
Giant crater has a diameter and circumference of that looks like shit.
Quoted from Mike_J:Huge crater has a diameter and circumference of that looks like crap.
Giant crater has a diameter and circumference of that looks like shit.
agreed
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