(Topic ID: 239218)

Black Knight Sword of Rage!!! - Sterns next machine!!!

By Blacksun

6 months ago

Topic Stats

  • 3,998 posts
  • 616 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 33 days ago by Chalkey
  • Topic is favorited by 99 Pinsiders


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Topic index (key posts)

11 key posts have been marked in this topic

Post #1 Key posted, but no summary given Posted by Blacksun (6 months ago)

Post #139 Info about legal entities - licensing Posted by PPS (6 months ago)

Post #425 Link to pictures and interview of SR Posted by ASOA (6 months ago)

Post #449 Pictures of the game Posted by NeilMcRae (6 months ago)

Post #482 High resolution cabinet pictures Posted by BoJo (6 months ago)

Post #505 Rule card Posted by PinB (6 months ago)

Post #517 Gameplay videos Posted by PinB (6 months ago)

Post #521 Link to interviews Posted by PinB (6 months ago)

Post #647 Feature matrix Posted by ovfdfireman (6 months ago)

Post #3606 Explains how the upper PK is mounted Posted by swilson143 (4 months ago)

Post #3758 A message from God Posted by newtoit (3 months ago)

Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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#829 6 months ago

My initial reaction was "outstanding" and started trying to justify an LE. I've never been an LE buyer, but own and like BK and BK2K, so this might be the one to get me there. Would love to hear if anyone else tries to justify it logically. I tried to quantify it like this...

+$100 Mirrored Backglass
+$100 Art blades
+$100 3-channel amp
+$250 HD glass
+$150 Shaker
+$250 Armor

About $950. Anyone else try this approach and come up with different numbers? Then there's intangibles like exclusivity and artwork preference.

I wish I could consider the pro, but it's not BK without upper playfield in my opinion. I wish they differentiated elsewhere. I think a better way would have been have the full RGB lighting only on premium and LE. Still give the pro an upper playfield, but keep it simple: maybe virtual lock instead of mechanical one.

As I'm analyzing the gameplay I'm starting to question some of the choices.

I really think the upper playfield orbit shot should have a spinner, which would be great to rip. Don't like that pro has 2 spinners and Prem/LE only 1.

There doesn't look like there's any flow-shot to the upper flipper. It would be great if you could chain lower shot into upper orbit path then to upper flipper and directly chain into ripping orbit shots and through a spinner. Maybe the upper transition shots are landing to the upper flipper, but doesn't look certain to me.

I think the VUK to upper playfield would be better behind the mace (or what weapon is BK holding?). As it is, both transition shots to upper playfield are more stop/go with either VUK or mace-block, although you can miss the mace. I just think it would be better if the far outer shot would be an uninterrupted flow shot to the upper playfield. The VUK seems like it would make more sense behind the mace as that's already a potential stop/go shot anyway.

Lightning wheel looks really plain and cheap to me: just some solid colors. It makes me feel like I'm looking at a Sega. That could really use some more sophisticated design or graphic.

Basically, first thought was outstanding and take-my-money but beginning to talk myself out of it or at least take a wait-and-see approach instead.

I do like there's only 600 LEs, should help keep the value better.

#843 6 months ago
Quoted from KozMckPinball:

The original Black Knight was done in 1980. I think they were trying to keep some art consistency, so it makes sense that it looks dated somewhat.

You're more forgiving than me on this one. The lightning bolts in a circle are plenty enough to make the historical connection. I'm more cynical about the surrounding art: it looks more like laziness.

#869 6 months ago
Quoted from Fytr:

The biggest regret I would have if I didn't get the LE would be the lack of a real mirrored backglass. Stupid, but on a game like BK where all the previous ones had such amazing mirrored backglasses it would bother me forever.

Yeah, and I agree, and starting to think I'm undervaluing that one and maybe also the armor: perhaps the gold flake looks sharper in person than in pics. Bumping value up to $1100 now. I might yet debate myself into an LE...

#892 6 months ago

Topper sounds awesome, but should be standard on the LE model: it should be the full package like CGC does.

I don't even want to speculate on what they'll ask for that. What's been the most expensive topper so far?

#955 6 months ago
Quoted from DS_Nadine:

I thought about this and I think, while not be the thing we want them to do, it is the respectful thing to do for all vendors that bring lots of existing machines for play and sale. Like the shitload of Munsters Premiums Marco brought.

That's not the reason. Revealing a new machine at the show has no effect on vendor sales at the show: all the Sterns brought by Marco are all pre-sold well before the show starts.

#1060 6 months ago
Quoted from kermit24:

There were 17 Munsters Premium games at TPF. Of course the show games are pre-sold, but the reason why there are show games is so that OTHER people can play them and hopefully buy them. Stern subsidizes the show discount. This show was the Munsters coming out party for pinball with the cars, actors there, etc. Revealing Black Knight at the show wouldn't have been the right move and WOULD have absolutely soften interest in Munsters and take the spotlight away. MGC is the BK3 show.

That explanation appears to make sense, but Stern announced a day after the show. So there's a 1-day buffer for sales generated by interest from the show, and that's when you think all these sales happen that an announcement might affect? That "hopefully buy them" suggestion is fantasy: everyone who wanted one, bought the show demos. Anyone that was waiting to try before purchasing, isn't going to lock in the sale in that 1-day buffer.

From a strict, "stealing the thunder" of Munsters, I'd agree with, but just from a psychology perspective though it would look bad: not from a sales perspective, which is what the poster I replied to was suggesting.

#1084 6 months ago
Quoted from RustyLizard:

Has anyone considered that MGC had something like 31 Iron Maidens on the floor last year and it was the biggest launch ever? Maybe the people of that show are being rewarded.

No, I hadn't, but I know it doesn't have to do with Munsters sales, so I corrected that poster.

I haven't speculated, but it is fun to, so I like your postulate. But maybe only Stern knows the real reason.

#1088 6 months ago

Some people say we don't need another Black Knight. As someone who finds charm in DMD animations, I feel a gaping hole in my pinball heart that there was not a BK incarnation in the DMD era, which likely would have been my favorite.

After initial excitement, I've decided to take a wait-and-see approach for the new one.

#1123 6 months ago

Lost me after this. I'm sure there are other Christians who are equally offended by this. This happens way too often on here.

If you don't like the following response, then refrain from using my savior's name in vain.

These people are proud and arrogant, daring even to scoff at supernatural beings without so much as trembling

The LORD will not let you go unpunished if you misuse his name.

#1134 6 months ago
Quoted from JodyG:

Protip: Not everybody believes in the same special imaginary friends as you.

Protip: We're here to discuss pinball, so slandering anyone's religion is out of order. If you do, don't be surprised to get an equally off-topic response.

#1142 6 months ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

what did he save u from? what a crock of shit thats a fairy tale.

Quoted from JodyG:

Your evangelism is offensive to many other religions...if you are offended, use the ignore button. Save the preaching for church.

I didn't bring up the topic, but some can't let it go. I didn't do any evangelizing either, but if you're interested I can. I'd rather just return to the topic of pinball on here though.

#1144 6 months ago

We obviously need that Bible Adventures pin, or Fire & Brimstone, then we can take it out with the silver ball!

Now, how about back to BK...

#1148 6 months ago
Quoted from Sandeep:

I agree with you. Some have no fear. (edit)

An upvote would suffice, let's move on...

#1159 6 months ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

So, people should not speak their minds so as to not offend you? Guess what, if you choose not to let it offend you, you take away its power to offend.

If someone brings up religion into a pinball forum in an offensive way, I'm glad you support my right to speak my mind and respond, regardless if it offends the likes of you. Thank you.

Can we move on now?

2 weeks later
#2673 6 months ago
Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

I find it pretty funny how so many of you were initially knocking the Pro and knocking Stern for making it and now you're changing your tunes.
After photo reveal:
"It's not BK without an upper pf."
"Shame on Stern for not putting the upper pf on the Pro. Stern is so f*ing cheap."
"Pro sucks. Looks so stripped. Who is going to buy that?"
After gameplay reveal:
"Pro looks great."
"Upper pf looks lame."
"Pro is the way to go!"
[quoted image]

Synopsis is good, but conclusion is bad...

The problem is the pro has no upper playfield, and the premium has a bland upper playfield. It's not that the pro is better, it's that the upper playfield doesn't add enough.

The proper conclusion is that both need some kind of upper playfield that add more value:

Pro would be okay with an unsophisticated upper: maybe just a cool orbit shot with a spinner and a cheap virtual lock.

Premium/LE would add a lot more value with small additions: a spinner on the orbit shot, and at least a 3-bank of stand ups.

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