(Topic ID: 186114)

Sterns new cabinets...

By daddyxxx

6 years ago


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    There are 2,136 posts in this topic. You are on page 23 of 43.
    #1101 6 years ago

    im putting L brackets on all 3 of my newer stern games this weekend I have them painted black with the screws ready to go

    #1102 6 years ago
    Quoted from arcademojo:

    Just got the HD mounts in the mail yesterday. Putting them on before my league buddies come over to play.

    It sure looks split to me. Maybe I'm just nervous and the little rip in the decal happened when the game slid in my minivan. Believe me, I've beet myself up a dozen times for not strapping it down.

    Black sharpie to blend the wood on the little burn area. Won't even remember it's there eventually.

    -1
    #1103 6 years ago

    Humm intersting picture of a HEP MM restrotation take notice of the front joints.
    Maybe pinball cabinet joinery hasn't changed all that much?

    IMG_3871 (resized).JPGIMG_3871 (resized).JPG

    #1104 6 years ago
    Quoted from Turboderf:

    im putting L brackets on all 3 of my newer stern games this weekend I have them painted black with the screws ready to go

    get some #8 1/2 " screws, the ones that come with the bracket are too long

    #1105 6 years ago
    Quoted from kuelman:

    Humm intersting picture of a HEP MM restrotation take notice of the front joints.
    Maybe pinball cabinet joinery hasn't changed all that much?

    Am I missing something? How do you even see the Front joints? The closest part of that pic shows the rear joints...........

    #1106 6 years ago
    Quoted from arcademojo:

    My MET Pro June 2014 HUO
    You can see it just starting to to crack and the decal is ripped a little. I'm the third owner. The brush burn on the corner was from game sliding into my van set when brining it home. So don't know if that contributed to the crack or not.

    I see a very small tear at the top of the decal, but that does not appear to be in the same area of the seam where the front and back meet where the splits are occurring. I might see a little bit of unpainted wood at the top of the joint indicating possibly a very small movement here, but not for sure. Both possibly from the un-strapped ride in the minivan. I would do as other say- install the brackets and it would more than likely never get any worse.

    #1107 6 years ago
    Quoted from kuelman:

    Humm intersting picture of a HEP MM restrotation take notice of the front joints.
    Maybe pinball cabinet joinery hasn't changed all that much?

    If the rumor of a new cabinet maker (or a second cabinet maker) is true... perhaps the glues are different?

    Has anyone measure the thickness of 2017 cabs versus, say, 2014 cabs?

    #1108 6 years ago
    Quoted from arcademojo:

    Maybe I'm just nervous and the little rip in the decal happened when the game slid in my minivan. Believe me, I've beet myself up a dozen times for not strapping it down.

    That's the burden of buying HUO or NIB, brother. Don't sweat it. We've all been there.

    It will never stay 100 percent mint.

    These machines are made for entertainment and fun...don't beat yourself up. i honestly think your cab is fine. Enjoy the game, play the hell out of it... don't look back!

    #1109 6 years ago
    Quoted from 27dnast:

    That's the burden of buying HUO or NIB, brother. Don't sweat it. We've all been there.
    It will never stay 100 percent mint.
    These machines are made for entertainment and fun...don't beat yourself up. i honestly think your cab is fine. Enjoy the game, play the hell out of it... don't look back!

    I love that time when a new game becomes... just one of your games. You stop babying it and just play the snot out of it. It gets dirty, shop it, and play on. Good times.

    #1110 6 years ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    I love that time when a new game becomes... just one of your games. You stop babying it and just play the snot out of it. It gets dirty, shop it, and play on. Good times.

    Usually that's about the time another new game comes through the door.

    #1111 6 years ago
    Quoted from Manimal:

    Am I missing something? How do you even see the Front joints? The closest part of that pic shows the rear joints...........

    I think he means the joints on this original MM are the same as what Stern is currently using.

    #1112 6 years ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    I love that time when a new game becomes... just one of your games. You stop babying it and just play the snot out of it. It gets dirty, shop it, and play on. Good times.

    So cabinets splitting down the seams on a 3 year old game is normal?

    #1113 6 years ago
    Quoted from Roostking:

    So cabinets splitting down the seams on a 3 year old game is normal?

    No! Right out of the box for me!!

    IMG_2297 (resized).JPGIMG_2297 (resized).JPG

    #1114 6 years ago
    Quoted from Rock914:

    No! Right out of the box for me!!

    Are you going any assistance from Stern, or your distributor?

    #1115 6 years ago

    I'm waiting to see how many buy star wars when released and see what damage exists then. The force may not be with them

    #1116 6 years ago
    Quoted from kuelman:

    Humm intersting picture of a HEP MM restrotation take notice of the front joints.
    Maybe pinball cabinet joinery hasn't changed all that much?

    The short non-technical answer of current Stern cabinet design is that it is different in multiple ways. Their are hollow sections in the joint grooves as an example starting point. It looks sloppy from the standpoint of construction. I do not know why it was changed.

    The long answer is that photo represents an offset tongue and groove joint you are looking at regarding the rear of the MM cabinet, but only shows a small part of the overall construction. Pinball cabinet construction is not always unilateral for weight displacement front and back. That photo is not the exclusivity of construction of the entire WMS cabinet joints. You also need to see photos of the topside, front, and back of the cabinet so people understand how WMS cabinets were constructed, not to mention the inside cabinet corners, leg bolt plates, and wood support reinforcements and crossbars, which none is shown in this photo and completely absent from many modern Stern games made in the past 5 years. I don't remember offhand what my 2000s Stern cabinets looked like.

    Other manufacturers were better construction than WMS such as GTB.
    A few were worse such AGC and BLY/MDY.
    Some was based on materials as much as the construction methods.

    I provided people solutions to solve almost all cabinet problems, or at least arrest those that have started, offline, and explained some of the observations during a pinball interview. People do not need to spend a fortune, make the inside of cabinet look atrocious, require master carpentry skills, or potentially short out their games either to fix it. If a person installs reinforcements improperly they can actually weaken joints further instead of improving them.

    Good fortune.

    20
    #1117 6 years ago
    Quoted from Rock914:

    No! Right out of the box for me!!

    Regardless of any repair recommendations posted in this thread, opening a box on a brand new game and seeing what Rock914 did is.....fucking ridiculous. That is a game that hasn't been set up, nudged, no rubber casters on the feet, etc. Sorry, but there is no excuse that can justify that or make me think it's ok.

    -20
    #1118 6 years ago
    Quoted from Colsond3:

    Regardless of any repair recommendations posted in this thread, opening a box on a brand new game and seeing what Rock914 did is.....fucking ridiculous. That is a game that hasn't been set up, nudged, no rubber casters on the feet, etc. Sorry, but there is no excuse that can justify that or make me think it's ok.

    I dont think anybody thinks that is acceptable, but new items can and do get damaged during transport which is obviously what happened. He should get a brand new game immediately iMO.

    13
    #1119 6 years ago
    Quoted from Who-Dey:

    I dont think anybody thinks that is acceptable, but new items can and do get damaged during transport which is obviously what happened. He should get a brand new game immediately iMO.

    Obviously what happened??? I am sorry but these are shipped on their backs and I opened the perfect undamaged box. So I respectfully disagree with you 100%!

    Oh I thought this was funny. I got a shot of the QC stamp.

    IMG_2296 (resized).JPGIMG_2296 (resized).JPG

    #1120 6 years ago
    Quoted from Roostking:

    So cabinets splitting down the seams on a 3 year old game is normal?

    Let me know how you interpreted that from what I said.

    #1121 6 years ago
    Quoted from Who-Dey:

    I dont think anybody thinks that is acceptable, but new items can and do get damaged during transport which is obviously what happened. He should get a brand new game immediately iMO.

    I don't think these issues are happening from transport but rather due to a flaw during the build process. Either something with the joint is different then before, different quality of wood is being used or a different type of glue (or not enough) is being applied.

    Games are packed with the front end sticking up so it's not even possible for the corners that are splitting to be dropped on by a shipper.

    I just heard about another NIB Aerosmith pro opened last weekend and one of the corner seams was popped out of the box...The issue is certainly not affecting all NIB games but still enough to be a concern as a NIB buyer.

    I bet one of the two cabinet manufactures Stern is using is the cause of the problem and that is why some cabinets are perfect and others are having this issue.

    #1122 6 years ago

    I can only speak from my cabinet but it is not a problem with the glue that holds the joint together. It is a problem with the ply used to make the cabinets and the lack of reinforcement used.

    If you have a newer game MET or Kiss or something, I would like to see the inside corner if someone could post a pic or 2.

    #1123 6 years ago
    Quoted from kuelman:

    Humm intersting picture of a HEP MM restrotation take notice of the front joints.
    Maybe pinball cabinet joinery hasn't changed all that much?

    Its a 20 year old game thats been on its feet for all that time!!!!

    NOT NIB!!!!

    Horrible analogy.

    Quoted from Rock914:the ply used to make the cabinets and the lack of reinforcement used.

    Its the 'cheapening" of pinball building the Gary Stern has been implementing since he monopolized pinball in 2001.

    "Let them eat cake."

    #1124 6 years ago
    Quoted from jackofdiamonds:

    since he monopolized pinball in 2001.

    Really? I believed he saved pinball from disappearing. Wasn't aware he did anything to take over the market and become a monopoly.

    Maybe some of these cost savings help the industry survive.

    I'm not apologizing for QC issues but show me one other industry or product that hasn't implemented cost savings.

    13
    #1125 6 years ago
    Quoted from jackofdiamonds:

    Its the 'cheapening" of pinball building the Gary Stern has been implementing since he monopolized pinball in 2001.

    Say what you will, but Gary Stern kept pinball manufacturing alive when everyone else had quit. He kept making new antiquated coin-op games for a dying market. As a pinball fan I'm grateful that he stuck it out as some of my favorite games came from the "pinball is dying" years. That being said - they're riding a new wave of growth and profit - so what's happening currently with QC is absolutely disconcerting, especially if it's happening to save money.

    #1126 6 years ago

    I just installed the B/W corner supports on my AS and GB and wanted to add a few things. The upper angle brackets are a pain and not really worth it. I think the B/W brackets will do fine all by themselves. You can flip the plunger side bracket upside down to cover more upper space if you want - the cracks appear to start from the top down. You'll need to move a wire harness loop on the left side bracket but it's pretty easy. Screws are not included with the brackets so buy some 1/2" screws - 6 per corner. Install is pretty easy and you don't need to drill pilot holes.

    If you haven't done any modifications check the tightness of your legs after a week or so. The Stern metal supports dig into the wood no matter how tight it is originally. Mine were not loose but not as tight as I usually have them which may contribute to cracking.

    If you have a corner cracked already you'll have to pull the corners together before installing the B/W brackets. Use clamps or a turnbuckle will do it. PM me on how if you need and don't have access to clamps

    Here's a pic of the Stern vs B/W support. Of course you have to remove the old Stern support first.

    20170429_092850 (resized).jpg20170429_092850 (resized).jpg

    #1127 6 years ago
    Quoted from wtatumjr:

    I just installed the B/W corner supports on my AS and GB and wanted to add a few things. The upper angle brackets are a pain and not really worth it. I think the B/W brackets will do fine all by themselves. You can flip the plunger side bracket upside down to cover more upper space if you want - the cracks appear to start from the top down. You'll need to move a wire harness loop on the left side bracket but it's pretty easy. Screws are not included with the brackets so buy some 1/2" screws - 6 per corner. Install is pretty easy and you don't need to drill pilot holes.

    Might have been my imagination, but on the AS Pre I put these brackets on, it didn't seem like the screws were able to grab the wood on the cabinet as tightly as I expected. Didn't feel "loose" but didn't feel nice and tight, either. I wonder if Stern is using cheaper, less dense plywood now, too.

    #1128 6 years ago
    Quoted from PinMonk:

    I wonder if Stern is using cheaper, less dense plywood now, too

    If their QC is more dense, I'm sure the plywood is too.

    #1129 6 years ago
    Quoted from PinMonk:

    Might have been my imagination, but on the AS Pre I put these brackets on, it didn't seem like the screws were able to grab the wood on the cabinet as tightly as I expected. Didn't feel "loose" but didn't feel nice and tight, either. I wonder if Stern is using cheaper, less dense plywood now, too.

    I agree - use the fatest 1/2" screws that still fit the bracket hole

    -2
    #1130 6 years ago

    My new nickname for Gary is G Eazy!

    He ain't stressing no more rolling up to the Bentley store

    Stacking blue faces straight up to da ceiling

    G easy puttin the Good in the in the Good Life

    Put the Bad in the past and now we alright !!!!

    I said the Good life M fers

    #1131 6 years ago

    Very sad to say, but I won't be buying any more NIB Sterns until they address their various quality issues, and prove they have addressed them.

    Price up, quality down, greed way up.

    #1132 6 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballs:

    Very sad to say, but I won't be buying any more NIB Sterns

    Exactly.

    Just quit buying them and there will be nothing to worry about.

    -2
    #1133 6 years ago

    Wow I say Rocks cabinet being split when he unboxed it is unacceptable and that he should get a new game immediately and I get 8 down votes, are you F'ing kidding me?? What a bunch of assholes you people are!

    #1134 6 years ago
    Quoted from Who-Dey:

    Wow I say Rocks cabinet being split when he unboxed it is unacceptable and that he should get a new game immediately and I get 8 down votes, are you F'ing kidding me?? What a bunch of assholes you people are!

    Membership in the Church of the Secret Starfish is widespread. You're just waking up to this?

    15
    #1135 6 years ago
    Quoted from Who-Dey:

    Wow I say Rocks cabinet being split when he unboxed it is unacceptable and that he should get a new game immediately and I get 8 down votes, are you F'ing kidding me?? What a bunch of assholes you people are!

    You were probably down voted because no one believes the damage was the result of shipping/transport.

    However, you probably knew that already.

    #1136 6 years ago
    Quoted from wtatumjr:

    If you haven't done any modifications check the tightness of your legs after a week or so. The Stern metal supports dig into the wood no matter how tight it is originally. Mine were not loose but not as tight as I usually have them which may contribute to cracking.

    That little leg plate could crack the corner wooden brace if overtightened and offers no support at all other than that of a fender washer and a nut.

    Im curious if anyone has cracked wooden corner braces, when the cabinet cracks all the way down, or if they are just unglued.

    It would seem that if the cabinet cracks open you would see something happen to the corner brace.

    B/W leg plates really are the way to go from the start, JJP is using them.

    #1137 6 years ago

    Wasn't CG using these plates in the cabs for the remakes as well?
    Maybe MMR owners could confirm.

    #1138 6 years ago
    Quoted from wtatumjr:

    I just installed the B/W corner supports on my AS and GB and wanted to add a few things. The upper angle brackets are a pain and not really worth it. I think the B/W brackets will do fine all by themselves. You can flip the plunger side bracket upside down to cover more upper space if you want - the cracks appear to start from the top down. You'll need to move a wire harness loop on the left side bracket but it's pretty easy. Screws are not included with the brackets so buy some 1/2" screws - 6 per corner. Install is pretty easy and you don't need to drill pilot holes.
    If you haven't done any modifications check the tightness of your legs after a week or so. The Stern metal supports dig into the wood no matter how tight it is originally. Mine were not loose but not as tight as I usually have them which may contribute to cracking.
    If you have a corner cracked already you'll have to pull the corners together before installing the B/W brackets. Use clamps or a turnbuckle will do it. PM me on how if you need and don't have access to clamps
    Here's a pic of the Stern vs B/W support. Of course you have to remove the old Stern support first.

    #10 screws fit perfect with no slop. Another thing to think about, the stock Stern leg plate has only 3 screw threads per hole and one of them is questionable while the B/W plate has 5 good and solid threads per hole. The only downside to the B/W plate is that the threaded hole "plugs" are pressed in so there's a chance of it spinning. I know because I've spun one. The trick is to put a couple of spot welds on each of the pressed in threaded bolt plugs.

    #1139 6 years ago
    Quoted from Vino:

    Wasn't CG using these plates in the cabs for the remakes as well?
    Maybe MMR owners could confirm.

    The MMr and AFMr are built to the same specs as the original.
    Same parts, same cab builder, same playfield builder.

    They should be as good as the originals in most cases.

    -10
    #1140 6 years ago
    Quoted from Mike_J:

    You were probably down voted because no one believes the damage was the result of shipping/transport.
    However, you probably knew that already.

    High probability that game was damaged during transport. Just because the box wasn't damaged doesn't mean some idiot on a lift truck didn't bounce the game around or something. Oh well, people can be that way if they want I could care less. Just goes to show you what kind of people they are.

    12
    #1141 6 years ago
    Quoted from Who-Dey:

    High probability that game was damaged during transport. Just because the box wasn't damaged doesn't mean some idiot on a lift truck didn't bounce the game around or something. Oh well, people can be that way if they want I could care less. Just goes to show you what kind of people they are.

    Calm down man! I appreciate what you said I just disagree that shipping is the issue. FYI a down vote is just someone disagreeing with something you said, don't know how that makes us A-holes. Bottom line these should at least be built well enough to weather a bump in the road. If this had been dropped the back would be damages at least slightly.

    #1142 6 years ago

    I don't remember anyone complaining of this kind of cracking prior to the last however many months... if you read through the thread, then you'll find some owners saying their cab came fine but cracking has begun. Not easy to see a $5K plus wooden box develop cracks...

    Has anyone reached to Stern on this and gotten a response?

    12
    #1143 6 years ago
    Quoted from Rock914:

    Calm down man! I appreciate what you said I just disagree that shipping is the issue. FYI a down vote is just someone disagreeing with something you said, don't know how that makes us A-holes. Bottom line these should at least be built well enough to weather a bump in the road. If this had been dropped the back would be damages at least slightly.

    Yup. I recall moving a Stern Pirates once and the seller had the entire game up on plastic sawhorses.... Well both saw horses collapsed and the entire game dropped onto the ground (carpeted thankfully) from nearly 3 feet. The cabinet was still perfect, no cracks at all. If new Stern games cannot handle being moved around during trucking with padding while in a card board box then I don't know what to say.

    #1144 6 years ago
    Quoted from Black_Knight:

    Really? I believed he saved pinball from disappearing. Wasn't aware he did anything to take over the market and become a monopoly.
    Maybe some of these cost savings help the industry survive.
    I'm not apologizing for QC issues but show me one other industry or product that hasn't implemented cost savings.

    Stern is cannibalising the current market though there is no doubt about that. The boutiques that have popped up over the last few years are finding/going to find that out the hard way through lack of incoming cash flow.

    Personally I wouldn't have minded if Stern had moved on to other ventures back in 2008 when their back was to the wall. The core pinball consumer base will always be there and it would have made it much easier for some of these new entrants to get a foothold with the spinoff is that pinball would have seen much more innovation over the last 10 years with genuine competition between companies trying to gain market dominance. And those companies would have in their own best interests been actively trying to expand the consumer base rather than taking the easy option and simply tailoring their product releases to the existing one for a quick cash grab.

    The pinball landscape would have been much different in 2017 had Stern not been around with I predict at least half a dozen flourishing manufacturers who would have filled the vacuum created by Stern's departure rather than one dominant player and half a dozen floundering companies currently fighting over Stern's table scraps.

    -9
    #1145 6 years ago
    Quoted from Rock914:

    Calm down man! I appreciate what you said I just disagree that shipping is the issue. FYI a down vote is just someone disagreeing with something you said, don't know how that makes us A-holes. Bottom line these should at least be built well enough to weather a bump in the road. If this had been dropped the back would be damages at least slightly.

    I am calm, I just get sick of the same individuals chasing me around down voting every post I make even when they shouldn't be down voted. I could care less about down votes but I hate Azzholes.

    #1146 6 years ago

    Yes I agree that sterns cost cutting is causing more harm than good when it comes to quality control, the fact that the prices have risen to the point where a premium luxary item's build quality doesn't match the price tag that is commends is getting out of hand. However aslong as stern knows that their current practises are making them more profit than in the past which by the looks of it that is correct ; in their eyes why should they change if it only affects a small majority.

    #1147 6 years ago
    Quoted from pinsanity:

    Personally I wouldn't have minded if Stern had moved on to other ventures back in 2008 when their back was to the wall.

    A world without Tron? Bah.

    But don't worry. Stern is moving in the direction of not being around long. They kept new pinball alive for years when others couldn't. And now they are cost cutting that goose until it dies.

    18
    #1148 6 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    Exactly.
    Just quit buying them and there will be nothing to worry about.

    That's exactly what's wrong with this situation. That's a lose/lose proposition. Collector doesn't buy a pin, business doesn't sell a pin. Not exactly the best result.

    As the owner of multiple businesses, I'm always looking for the win/win, or in this case, win/win/win. Operator/Collector/Stern

    The win/win/win is simply that Stern fixes their blatantly obvious QC & greed problems, and poor customer relations. Once that's accomplished, then operators will route more Stern pins, Collectors will "happily" hand over cash, and Stern will sell many more high quality games, to satisfied customers, at a fair market price. Win/Win/Win.

    The problem is that Stern is still looking to be the only winner, like so many other businesses, and the end result is ultimately that everybody loses.

    So what's it gonna be Stern?

    -7
    #1149 6 years ago

    So Stern is attempting to sell less pins and F everybody?

    The PF issue is fixed. My BM66LE and ASLE have a beauty of a clear coat

    What's the default rate of cab splitting? 1%

    I'm sure they will figure out the issue and remedy it too

    Never thought I'd buy an AS, love it, now I'm on the list for a SW if it looks good

    It's a win win for me

    Some people can live with certain things and enjoy pinball, others can't

    I get the outrage if that is how you look at it

    Stern will have to reconcile losing customers over it, it won't be me though

    -6
    #1150 6 years ago

    Extreme, what has your experience been with JJP?

    Is it just Stern that blows in your opinion?

    There are 2,136 posts in this topic. You are on page 23 of 43.

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