(Topic ID: 257038)

Stern Stranger Things


By pinmister

4 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 7,137 posts
  • 642 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 day ago by pinballfan2000
  • Topic is favorited by 103 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Are you interested in a Stern Stranger Things pinball machine?”

  • Yes, I am interested if it plays well and has polished code 481 votes
    39%
  • No, I am not interested 439 votes
    36%
  • Maybe, not a huge fan of the franchise but maybe if it plays well 100 votes
    8%
  • I like pizza 200 votes
    16%

(1220 votes)

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#5651 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

True story and you guys are going to laugh
But after all these posts I can't un-see the demogorgan anymore. It truly does look fucking stupid. I can't stay on board with it lol. Unbelievable because I love this theme too.
There's another LE available from Trent now... Have at it.
Switched it to Jurassic Park LE. I'd rather have that bad ass dinosaur then this flared up vag. It just didn't age well with me.

I have a JPLE and you can't go wrong with that. I think it's one of the best games of all time. That's a sure thing vs a gamble in my opinion.

As far as STH goes, only time will tell. The LE's and premiums haven't even shipped, so anyone declaring it a success or failure at this point, is jumping the gun. (Not saying is you're doing that...just speaking in general) If you don't like the demogorgan...it is what it is.

I'm keeping my STH LE. I think it's all going to come down to code and execution on the projector, but I think it has a lot of potential to be a special game.

#5652 69 days ago
Quoted from mzhulk:

If jurrasic park is so good how are there LE's still available.

There arent any.

My distro told me he "might" be getting one in last month and he finally got it. I think he took it on a trade or bought it, but I did pay a small premium over MSRP to get it.

#5653 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

True story and you guys are going to laugh
But after all these posts I can't un-see the demogorgan anymore. It truly does look fucking stupid. I can't stay on board with it lol. Unbelievable because I love this theme too.
There's another LE available from Trent now... Have at it.
Switched it to Jurassic Park LE. I'd rather have that bad ass dinosaur then this flared up vag. It just didn't age well with me.

OMFG, that is amazing.

Good decision though, JP is awesome.

#5654 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

I'd rather have that bad ass dinosaur then this flared up va

Chipping for air!

#5655 69 days ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

OMFG, that is amazing.
Good decision though, JP is awesome.

Thanks dude I can't wait!

#5656 69 days ago

Seriously though, some modder should take the vag monster and simply make it 10% bigger and every problem would be solved. Bigger glory hole and the pudendas would cover up the crevices where the balls get stuck.

Edit: Balls

#5657 69 days ago
Quoted from dri:

Seriously though, some modder should take the vag monster and simply make it 10% bigger and every problem would be solved. Bigger glory hole and the pudendas would cover up the crevices where the ball get stuck.

For the kind of money these machines are, the demogorgan should have looked like this.. especially since its the only and main toy on the entire machine:

il_794xN.1543384764_ez35 (resized).jpgil_794xN.1543384882_iyza (resized).jpgil_794xN.1543384948_hyqj (resized).jpgil_794xN.1590844215_4t2u (resized).jpg

#5658 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

True story and you guys are going to laugh
But after all these posts I can't un-see the demogorgan anymore. It truly does look fucking stupid. I can't stay on board with it lol. Unbelievable because I love this theme too.
There's another LE available from Trent now... Have at it.
Switched it to Jurassic Park LE. I'd rather have that bad ass dinosaur then this flared up vag. It just didn't age well with me.

Man GTFO KPG!! You cant just do that man WTF?? lol

Wait until I tell iceman about this!

#5659 69 days ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

They generate a lot of heat because of the HOT BULB... which again... do not exist here.

That's fine. As I said before, I just had concerns about the longevity of this device.
I never stated I knew anything about the specific device, just stated what "VERY" little I know from working in my field with projectors. And I've had so many different models of both short throw over the years, and the normal long throw, and the extreme for auditorium use heavy duty long throw projectors.

I'd love to get my hands on one of these projectors and just mess around with it. Wonder what the max distance is, and projection field is.

But, I was actually really impressed with how it handled the light situation in the deadflip stream. Room was well lit. Better than any room in my house would be. And I play pinball with the lights off. Lastly will have to see how friendly the user interface is.

Because for the epsons at my work. A lot of people don't know or realize that there is a quick corner setting to properly frame the projector. And when I see is all eschew I ask them if they'd like it framed up squarely and it BLOWS their minds when I do so and only takes seconds.

#5660 69 days ago

The hype for a possible TMNT machine stopped an impulse purchase of this machine. And I’m glad.

I really want to like this machine. But the bland demogorgan, the problems people are experiencing with this machine currently and the longevity of the projector have given me a lot of pause.

I still want to experience a premium/LE before I make a final judgement, but this to me is definitely a candidate for a HUO purchase after someone else dials it in, code matures and save yourself the depreciation off the bat.

#5661 69 days ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

Man GTFO KPG!! You cant just do that man WTF?? lol
Wait until I tell iceman about this!

HAHAHA

I know right... Iceman, sorry brotha...

#5662 69 days ago
Quoted from NintenBear:

but this to me is definitely a candidate for a HUO purchase after someone else dials it in, code matures and save yourself the depreciation off the bat.

That's my plan.

TMNT coming out will be my next purchase.

This one can simmer on the back burner for a while and i'll re-visit it in a few months.

#5663 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

That's my plan.
TMNT coming out will be my next purchase.
This one can simmer on the back burner for a while and i'll re-visit it in a few months.

But what if they have a giant Vagina Monster Shredder toy in the center of the playfield?

#5664 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

TMNT coming out will be my next purchase.

You may be disappointed. I don't think the TMNT pin will be about them coming out.

#5665 69 days ago
Quoted from vireland:

You may be disappointed. I don't think the TMNT pin will be about them coming out.

Woke Stern?

#5666 69 days ago
Quoted from Zablon:

Woke Stern?

Maybe the Danger effect in action...

#5667 69 days ago
Quoted from vireland:

You may be disappointed. I don't think the TMNT pin will be about them coming out.

post-14251-Eddie-Murphy-I-see-what-you-di-PAQX (resized).jpg
#5668 69 days ago
Quoted from mzhulk:

If jurrasic park is so good how are there LE's still available.

Because premium is the better buy. IMHO the LE model is dead. The only LE models worth a S**T are Music and timeless themes.

#5669 69 days ago
Quoted from mzhulk:

If jurrasic park is so good how are there LE's still available.

Because the vendors have milked the cow dry... higher prices, less differentiation, less reason to have an LE.

Everyone bitched about 'not getting the full game' when there were significant differences.. well now they flatten the model deltas and there is little reason besides image for an LE.

11
#5670 69 days ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

Because the vendors have milked the cow dry... higher prices, less differentiation, less reason to have an LE.
Everyone bitched about 'not getting the full game' when there were significant differences.. well now they flatten the model deltas and there is little reason besides image for an LE.

Stern could still differentiate the LEs enough to make them more desirable, but 2018-2020 Stern is just too lazy/greedy. How about different playfield art variant/color scheme just for the LE? Cool topper included (not a piece of crap plexi) with LEs? Old school B/W-style translite backboard lighting with spot flashers and cool light show? Put a little more effort into their lollipop rails to include lighting effects like STLE? Force feedback flipper buttons? Cushioned flipper mechs to dampen sound? Full RGB insert and GI lighting on all LEs?

Do even half those things and LEs will have long term value again.

#5671 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

HAHAHA
I know right... Iceman, sorry brotha...

That's ok brother! I can't argue with JPLE, its one of the best EVER. And the Trex is an awesome toy.

#5672 69 days ago
Quoted from vireland:

Stern could still differentiate the LEs enough to make them more desirable, but 2018-2020 Stern is just too lazy/greedy. How about different playfield art variant/color scheme just for the LE? Cool topper included (not a piece of crap plexi) with LEs? B/W style translite backboard lighting with spot flashers and cool light show? Put a little more effort into their lollipop rails to include lighting effects like STLE? Force feedback flipper buttons? Cushioned flipper mechs to dampen sound? Full RGB insert and GI lighting on all LEs?
Do even half those things and LEs will have long term value again.

No art variants for the playfield. It was bad enough that i couldn't afford an LE at the time of Iron Maiden and had to settle for the Prem art package. I hate it. I know people love it. But, Iron Maiden is more than powerslave. I actually think the pro is the best art package. The translite reminds me of Derek Rigg's art on Best of the beast their best of album.

But, I wanted the game with the most features. That's why I settled on the Prem... I do think the pro is amazing though. Wouldn't mind both one day, as they are different beasts and have slightly different playstyles.

But, I do think they should include a topper. And probably plastics for the games. Spare plastics(my maiden came with some, but not my LE elvira). And they should do more bling on the machine. I really love the etched lock down bar on my MBr LE. I know stern will have to get away from using that stupid and pointless button on the lockdown bar.
But, I really wish they would.

Black knight sword of rage is a worse game because of it. The stop the wheel of fate in Elvira... Okay... That's fine... Wish it was flippers. But, I understand they want me to be distracted and the ball to drain. Still... If I'm not paying attention I might get a hand of fate that I already cashed in.
There are more ways for Stern to make a buck. Then varied playfield art.

And heres the thing. That wouldn't lead to more money spent designing the game. They'd spend the same amount, and require the artist to do double the work. And that would lead to less quality of art on the playfield.

But, maybe... Maybe... You buy the LE you get to choose your cab and translite art package. That might be worth it for a lot of people.
I'm all for LE's getting good content. I bought the Elvira LE, because I think the prem cab is garbage. If its in a bar. Sure its perfect. In a home where its buried by 3-4 pins... Okay prem is fine. But, mine is exposed and I wanted that side art to look at.

#5673 69 days ago
Quoted from vireland:

Stern could still differentiate the LEs enough to make them more desirable, but 2018-2020 Stern is just too lazy/greedy. How about different playfield art variant/color scheme just for the LE? Cool topper included (not a piece of crap plexi) with LEs? B/W style translite backboard lighting with spot flashers and cool light show? Put a little more effort into their lollipop rails to include lighting effects like STLE? Force feedback flipper buttons? Cushioned flipper mechs to dampen sound? Full RGB insert and GI lighting on all LEs?
Do even half those things and LEs will have long term value again.

By the way...
I like a lot of your ideas. Just not the playfield one.
Some lighting effects on underside of a cab, and the legs would be cool. And not horribly expensive. And maybe. Speakers as stock could have them in it. A lot of people mod their speakers for those lights.

And yeah. That is a bummer that Stern's translites and backglasses are all just backlit. No real light show like in the golden age.

Or maybe also. A real KNOCKER!!!!! I know the kits are actually pretty cheap. But, I am not a tinkerer. But, real knockers are better. You actually can scare people with the knock.

#5674 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

That's my plan.
TMNT coming out will be my next purchase.
This one can simmer on the back burner for a while and i'll re-visit it in a few months.

mElHtHn (resized).jpg
#5675 69 days ago
Quoted from Diospinball:

I really love the etched lock down bar on my MBr LE. I know stern will have to get away from using that stupid and pointless button on the lockdown bar.

No, because the button allows for additional gameplay features.. TWD zombie bombs, JP super tranq, SW multiplier moving. I'd always rather have gameplay features over bling. Why on earth does a lockdown bar need to be etched?

#5676 69 days ago
Quoted from Diospinball:

And heres the thing. That wouldn't lead to more money spent designing the game. They'd spend the same amount, and require the artist to do double the work. And that would lead to less quality of art on the playfield.

The art is done in layers, so they could easily swap out a few areas of the playfield most visible to the player with some extra cool art (or sparkle, like the Mirco Addams PFs) just for the LEs (or do a global color scheme change) and it wouldn't be anywhere near as much work as a whole playfield art re-do, yet would still have impact.

My opinion is that the LE features need to be things that can't be added to the Premium or Pro aftermarket so the LEs are truly desirable and hold their value. Stuff that is not easy or impossible to add-on to make a non-LE an LE should be the focus. So stuff like undercab lighting, matchbox toys, etc are less the idea.

11
#5677 69 days ago
Quoted from mnpinball:Because premium is the better buy. IMHO the LE model is dead. The only LE models worth a S**T are Music and timeless themes.

LE buyer over here

My decision to buy LE's really comes down to these things- some people may not think its worth it, some people do (and that's why they buy them) but here were my justifications, which are simply my personal reasons and opinions as to why the LE price is worth it:

1) Invisiglass/HD Glass. I simply do not like machines with regular glass. To me, this is the best improvement/mod a pinball machine can have. You get a better view of all that expensive shit you just bought.

2) Shaker. Cheap I know, but its factory installed and one last thing I need to mess with (time = money)

3) Upgraded speakers and speaker panel. There's a big audio quality difference to me, and I don't need to buy and mess with the machine to upgrade the speakers.

4) The powdercoated armor. I like that powdercoated smooth lockdown bar instead of the black textured normal ones. I just think it feels higher quality, and it just looks better - including the rest of the metal on the machine

5) Limited quantity. Sure its not really all that limited but I just like the fact its a little more rare and special. Not a huge deciding factor.

6) Art side blades. I love those. And as I learned before, they are a pain in the ass to install correctly! The time and frustration saved is cool with me.

That's all I can think of, but those main reasons definitely justify (to me) the additional cost of an LE.

#5678 69 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

LE buyer over here
My decision to buy LE's really comes down to these things- some people may not think its worth it, some people do (and that's why they buy them) but here were my justifications, which are simply my personal reasons and opinions as to why the LE price is worth it:

1) Available as an add-on for Pro/Prem
2) Available as an add-on for Pro/Prem
3) Half-step since the underpowered on-board Spike 2 amplifier isn't upgraded.
4) Available as an add-on for Pro/Prem
5) Ok
6) Available as an add-on for Pro/Prem with alternate Stern version

The LEs just aren't that special any more, which is why they don't sell out that quickly and many don't hold their value.

#5679 69 days ago

Don’t forget the signed Apron
The BM66 cards are cool though...... so is JB

#5680 69 days ago
Quoted from vireland:

1) Available as an add-on for Pro/Prem
2) Available as an add-on for Pro/Prem
3) Half-step since the underpowered on-board Spike 2 amplifier isn't upgraded.
4) Available as an add-on for Pro/Prem
5) Ok
6) Available as an add-on for Pro/Prem with alternate Stern version
The LEs just aren't that special any more, which is why they don't sell out that quickly and many don't hold their value.

Ok fine one more !

7) It makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside

#5681 68 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

Ok fine one more !
7) It makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside

Don't forget

8 ) Mirrored back glass/translight

9) Get a full featured game before the premiums are available

10) Different art package which is often preferable

#5682 68 days ago
Quoted from vireland:

The art is done in layers, so they could easily swap out a few areas of the playfield most visible to the player with some extra cool art (or sparkle, like the Mirco Addams PFs) just for the LEs (or do a global color scheme change) and it wouldn't be anywhere near as much work as a whole playfield art re-do, yet would still have impact.
My opinion is that the LE features need to be things that can't be added to the Premium or Pro aftermarket so the LEs are truly desirable and hold their value. Stuff that is not easy or impossible to add-on to make a non-LE an LE should be the focus. So stuff like undercab lighting, matchbox toys, etc are less the idea.

Okay... I can see that reason... But, that is not how a company would treat it. All that would lead to is a company spending less on the pros and the pros getting worse. Not just the pros but the prems too. The budgets will not go up, they are like a balloon, you'd just be relocating the same money to a different area at the cost of quality.

And that is how I feel about almost every business. Because, they are only in business if they can make money. And I don't think this would increase LE sales. Most of the hot LE's sell out still. And there will always be flops for every company that makes a product. Stranger Things might be a flop for Stern. Honestly. The one thing I'd like to see more of. Is more code launching in the 90's. Don't tell me about the features. SHOW ME THE FEATURES.

#5683 68 days ago

I love how STH is a "flop" before the code gets off the ground, "Much more coming". I heard the same thing with TWD.

It's WAY too early to bury STH.

Some people say, "theme is everything". At least that's what they use to hypocritically buy Rick & Morty pins after seeing a 60 second video!

Sold out in 4 hours based on theme and Danesi and a 60 second video. Yet its still only 750 games and the FOMO is why it sold out so fast. Stern will sell 4,000 or so STH pins. And all 500 LE's

IF "theme is everything" then STH will be phenomenal when its all said and done coding and integration wise.

People like myself that love the show will only get more excited as updates come out.

LE's and premiums aren't even shipping yet. But they will start in the next week and i don't have to wait a year to get it.

Thank you very much!

11
#5684 68 days ago

Btw, i'm having a blast playing my JPLE and ElviraLE while i wait for STHLE to arrive.

It's a great time for this pinball hobby!

#5685 68 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I love how STH is a "flop" before the code gets off the ground, "Much more coming". I heard the same thing with TWD.
It's WAY too early to bury STH.
Some people say, "theme is everything". At least that's what they use to hypocritically buy Rick & Morty pins after seeing a 60 second video!
Sold out in 4 hours based on theme and Danesi and a 60 second video. Yet its still only 750 games and the FOMO is why it sold out so fast. Stern will sell 4,000 or so STH pins. And all 500 LE's
IF "theme is everything" then STH will be phenomenal when its all said and done coding and integration wise.
People like myself that love the show will only get more excited as updates come out.
LE's and premiums aren't even shipping yet. But they will start in the next week and i don't have to wait a year to get it.
Thank you very much!

Question. And I know none of us here are insiders at stern.
But, in the Bro do you even talk pinball they interviewed Scott D about Rick & Morty. He said something very, very interesting. In fact I was amazed at how candid and how much he could actually say. That was very refreshing. Most of the time you hear people even on reveals when you see the video mode as a reward play coy about it. Because, they can't talk about most of the features of the game...

Anyway... Tangent over, back to my question. He said that they had a contract where they through updates could utilize future clips from future seasons of Rick & Morty.

Does anyone here think that Stern has a similar deal, or is it just locked in at the two seasons or whatever they have so far? I'm not complaining about anything. I'm just curious. It would probably be nice if they had such a deal. Or maybe because of the nature of the show it might not matter?
That was just a thought that went in my mind.

And then lastly. I'm actually kind of excited to see if STh has a video mode and if it does. If it'll be any good.(I know this last point most people will say of course its no good its a video mode!!!!)

#5686 68 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I love how STH is a "flop" before the code gets off the ground

According to you Raza is allready a flop before it even came to market.

Everything is fine.

#5687 68 days ago
Quoted from twenty84:

Don't forget
8 ) Mirrored back glass/translight
9) Get a full featured game before the premiums are available
10) Different art package which is often preferable

+1

Mirrored backglass is definitely a deciding factor. Don't know how I forgot that. You cannot buy that aftermarket either.

-2
#5688 68 days ago
Quoted from twenty84:

Don't forget
8 ) Mirrored back glass/translight
9) Get a full featured game before the premiums are available
10) Different art package which is often preferable

8> FAKE mirrored backglass/translite
9> Extortion
10> Varies widely in desirability, not matched to LE-only playfield art extra touches.

#5689 68 days ago
Quoted from Diospinball:

Okay... I can see that reason... But, that is not how a company would treat it.

Jersey Jack did it. The CE jjPotC has different art from the Standard/LE and it's the best playfield art, by far. It's not impossible, and not even that much more money in the scale we're talking. Just takes the desire to give your customers maximum value for money.

There's no viable excuse not to do that for LEs except lazy/greedy.

#5690 68 days ago

Guess this is just a Stern Bash thread now, and I'm pretty sure all topics have been covered, enjoy...

#5691 68 days ago
Quoted from DS_Nadine:

According to you Raza is allready a flop before it even came to market.
Everything is fine.

"Theme is everything". Lol You made my point. Wtf is RAZA?

Seen enough and that "theme" is not gonna get it done in UNLIMITED production by Deeproot. And btw, the layout sucks, the ramp can't be hit!

And i've waited for YEARS, total letdown for me

#5692 68 days ago
Quoted from Diospinball:

Anyway... Tangent over, back to my question. He said that they had a contract where they through updates could utilize future clips from future seasons of Rick & Morty.

If you love Rick & Morty that would be a great thing. I still haven't seen an episode and could care less about that theme.

I really like South Park so maybe i'd like this show?

Has anyone seen more than a 60 second video?

By comparison, the fact that TWD didn't include future seasons doesn't make any less of a GREAT pin.

I'd love to see a new TWD pin with LCD and new seasons. No brainer for Stern!

#5693 68 days ago

Hardy nails Stranger Things coffin.

#5694 68 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

"Theme is everything". Lol You made my point. Wtf is RAZA?
Seen enough and that "theme" is not gonna get it done in UNLIMITED production by Deeproot. And btw, the layout sucks, the ramp can't be hit!
And i've waited for YEARS, total letdown for me

- You (as most) mix up "theme" and "license"

- The ramp can easily be hit (the question is if you make it up there)

- Stop waiting and holding your breath for Alien, or your brain dies off

#5695 68 days ago
Quoted from Airball:

Hardy nails Stranger Things coffin.

Well, I wouldn't rate all model of the game based on the pro.

The projector wouldn't interact with the ball of course, but lights & sounds are the things that attract people and also make things satisfying.
The projector can potentially add a lot to the "world under glass" with interactive visual elements and that whole switching to the upside down world.

#5696 68 days ago

Well if Cary Hardy thinks it’s bad, I guess I won’t even try it.

#5697 68 days ago
Quoted from vireland:

Jersey Jack did it. The CE jjPotC has different art from the Standard/LE and it's the best playfield art, by far. It's not impossible, and not even that much more money in the scale we're talking. Just takes the desire to give your customers maximum value for money.
There's no viable excuse not to do that for LEs except lazy/greedy.

See I think LE's are an excuse for a company to be greedy and lazy. I don't like them. And I wish the model was back to the original 1 pin, 1 layout. Let people put the addons that they want. Powder Coat. Real backglass, shaker, art blades, topper. Kind of like buying a car. Get the options you want. But, the core of the game should be the same model to model.

But, that won't happen. Can't roll the clock back. I just don't think you should give a company another way to squeeze a dollar, dime, or nickel out of you is all.

#5698 68 days ago
Quoted from DS_Nadine:

- You (as most) mix up "theme" and "license"
- The ramp can easily be hit (the question is if you make it up there)
- Stop waiting and holding your breath for Alien, or your brain dies off

"Theme" means theme. Simple

Alien is a great "theme" and game. I have one. More are coming.

The ramp can't be hit on RAZA. Robert said it was designed to be "challenging" and for better players to get 50% of the time

#5699 68 days ago
Quoted from Diospinball:

See I think LE's are an excuse for a company to be greedy and lazy. I don't like them. And I wish the model was back to the original 1 pin, 1 layout. Let people put the addons that they want. Powder Coat. Real backglass, shaker, art blades, topper. Kind of like buying a car. Get the options you want. But, the core of the game should be the same model to model.
But, that won't happen. Can't roll the clock back. I just don't think you should give a company another way to squeeze a dollar, dime, or nickel out of you is all.

Changing the playfield art somewhat does not change the core of the game, neither does having all-RGB GI and inserts - but they sure make a nicer experience - just what an LE should be. Those kinds of things also make it actually valuable as a collectible. Actual value for money, imagine! The way Stern has fallen into farting out boring uninspired LEs now is mostly via add-ons that can be added to a Premium. That needs to change or LEs actually will continue to subside in popularity and value over time.

#5700 68 days ago
Quoted from kpg:

LE buyer over here
My decision to buy LE's really comes down to these things- some people may not think its worth it, some people do (and that's why they buy them) but here were my justifications, which are simply my personal reasons and opinions as to why the LE price is worth it:
1) Invisiglass/HD Glass. I simply do not like machines with regular glass. To me, this is the best improvement/mod a pinball machine can have. You get a better view of all that expensive shit you just bought.
2) Shaker. Cheap I know, but its factory installed and one last thing I need to mess with (time = money)
3) Upgraded speakers and speaker panel. There's a big audio quality difference to me, and I don't need to buy and mess with the machine to upgrade the speakers.
4) The powdercoated armor. I like that powdercoated smooth lockdown bar instead of the black textured normal ones. I just think it feels higher quality, and it just looks better - including the rest of the metal on the machine
5) Limited quantity. Sure its not really all that limited but I just like the fact its a little more rare and special. Not a huge deciding factor.
6) Art side blades. I love those. And as I learned before, they are a pain in the ass to install correctly! The time and frustration saved is cool with me.
That's all I can think of, but those main reasons definitely justify (to me) the additional cost of an LE.

If you lived near me I'd just let you pay me $300 and I'd do the work and you could save a thousand bucks

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