To be Captain Obvious here, Stern is a large company with huge expenses compared to the other pinball manufacturers. They have an entrenched network of operators and vendors who put most (if not all) of their games on location/or for sale to customers as soon as they are available. So, a large network of what are essentially pre-sales who have a hunger to obtain new games and the cash to pay for them. "Here, take my money!"

Stern simply *must* release product to keep cash flow and keep the company running. It's similar to the tech industry, where they release something with buggy software but fix it as they go.

The sin of no cashflow/sudden turning off of the $$$ faucet for a company of Stern's size would far outweigh the positives of keeping things back until they are "polished".

IMO, they have no choice but to release games on schedule and shore up the code as they go.

To be fair to Stern, all the other pinball manufacturers do this too. Perhaps their initial release models aren't as "code empty" as Sterns...but still, all the others are guilty of the same thing.

Yeah this is just the gaming industry as a whole these days. Turn on any modern console and see how many updates there are today.

You're obviously not a Tesla buyer.

I don't mind the console getting an update, but if you buy a ps4 game and you reach a certain level, the game doesn't say... 'placeholder come back soon' no?

The only thing Stern needs to do is get ahead of their own constant backlog schedule on development level they can release games with complete hardware, why not put the same effort in releasing games with complete software, just start early enough with enough resources..

If not then their dev model for a new game is not ok, and they just start to late organizing everything in function of the release date..
Perfect example .. elvira 3.

Ive never built a pinball machine, but I assume you need all the physical aspects figured out before software can begin. Much in the same way video games arent all released at the launch of the video game console.

I agree that the software has to be written after the hardware is sorted out but if you’re selling games - the hardware is ‘ready’ enough and has been for some time.

Unfortunately, Stern seems to be following the Microsoft model of making the consumer the beta tester. And I’m not bashing Stern alone (I own and love JP2) but more manufactures need to take a few extra weeks and nail down some decent code before turning these machines over to customers. It’s a terrible business model.

It’s Lyman. 100% of his games come out bare to the bone. Maybe they leave it up to each team to roll out software as they please? They give them a timeline of release, then it’s on the team to have their release date code ready then a plan for when the rest will be implemented after release. Not sure. But certainly seems the various teams have their own cadence that they consistently stick to.

Yeah each game definitely has a deadline on code as I would think the previous game is due when you’re supposed to start developing your next game. So if the game still needs help, it can sit until the coder can revisit it.

Revisiting code has gotten better, but years ago it seemed it was on the coder and their spare time to do it. I seem to remember Lyman had to buy TWD and rework the code at home in his spare time.

But the GoT and GB updates were Stern giving Dwight time to get them massive updates.

Would be cool to have a team of coders that are tasked with the flesh out of each game. When the lead designer is moving onto the next game, the game is usually at least feature complete.

This separate team could be raked to take the game to the finish line by polishing the code with a general guideline provided by the lead programmer. Then the lead programmer could Use beta testers to help get notes on the code and fix things before the code goes live.

Just random thoughts. I don’t know the first thing about development of a pinball machine.

It's early but leading candidate for "Worst Cargument of the Year."

The WCOTY is always competitive but congrats on the early lead!

I'm not. the projector is not positioned exactly in the center under the apron, but rather above the left flipper so the metal portion of the ramp and the stand-up target in front is going obstruct the projector's ability to [map] the areas behind those. if they had move the projector a bit further to center, it would have decreased this [dead zone] area.

alternatively, they could have had 2 projectors working in tandem. however, that would have increased costs and the alignment would have be more finely tuned.

there are a couple of arcade games (darius I, II and burst) that come to mind where they are using 3 monitors and mirrors to create a display that equates to roughly a 40:9 aspect ratio (2 monitors positioned directly facing the player and a 3rd between them that is directed upwards towards a mirror to create a seamless image between the 3 displays)
darius (resized).jpg

It’s location ready. Location players don’t need complete code. Some want it. Some care. But largely you don’t know what’s running anyway. You just play it anyway.

Don’t Stern have engineers designing the mechs etc? Shouldn’t one of those guys in house known a pressure fitted post sleeve would eventually work loose from continuous ball impact/vibration?

Not really something that should require beta testing, plenty of pinsiders with engineering/mechanical backgrounds pointed it out early doors, why didn’t Stern know this from the get go?

Yeah not sure why it wasn’t a roll pin design to begin with. Those have issues too but much less.

Some of these are fine, but it appears this got lots that weren’t worth a damn.

If you know him, better tell him to fix or completely remove the one way gate underneath the left ramp/demogorgon while he is there or he will be back down there within a couple days when it fails. The ball will hang on it after a successful demogorgon shot and a ball search won't free it.

The pressure fit design is a complete joke and whoever designed it should have a good talking too. It’s literally a problem that will occur on every machine out there that gets play. If this game has been in development for 2 years, how on earth did this not get found during their testing....seriously! I’ve seen these posts fly out within a day on location.

The same goes for that post on JP below the middle right flipper. The day I got my JP I looked underneath and laughed that it didn’t have a nut on it. That’s the first thing I did before routing it.

These issues are really just ‘common sense’ to anyone with a bit of mechanical knowledge. It’s totally insane that Stern can’t catch these issues before they roll out. Customers shouldn’t be the QC team. It only gives stern less credibility and less people will buy them over time (including myself who’s bought nearly every new stern since avengers)

should have been a metal post, like it should have been on metallica. these games are rushed out so fast with incomplete code and mechs not properly tested. None of us should be having to mess with flipper settings and incline settings to find a sweet spot to hit the main shot in the game, that's really ridiculous. and the amount of airballs in this game because the flippers are too strong on stock settings should have easily been picked up by someone at Stern. the game will dimple much less with lower flipper settings, and actually is much more enjoyable to play.

Most people don’t know the amount of work route ops have to do on new sterns when they arrive, before putting them out. Firstly we need to throw out the buttons and defective coil stops.

For the JP, I probably spent 6 hours on it stripping the game, going over every post, as most were so loose they would fall out or cause major damage to the PF with eventual chipping. Then I had to add a post and nut and reposition the flipper bracket and also remove the left gate that breaks on all location machines.

I never used to have to do this on older sterns like TWD, ST. Clear coats were much harder, posts were tight, coil stops weren’t defective, things seemed much less rushed and quality was better.

I know it sucks, but thanks for doing this before it’s on route. Makes the experience way better for us. For the buttons, I’ve had good experiences with putting an eclip on the stock buttons. Should keep them from ever popping out.

The QC is really starting to show. I have three older sterns that are rock solid. Make Stern Great Again

Where do you put the clip exactly?

My fix is to take the button (after it falls out), use a Phillips screwdriver and jam it into the hole until the hole widens. Then I just smack it back into the game. Never comes out again.

It effectively replaces the the crappy plastic notch. So just clip it onto the nipple on the inside of the button. Make sure it’s the right size so it’s nice and tight right between the plastic notch and and the cabinet.

Monster bash was pretty complete at launch. Didn't change much after that.

The forever solution for route flipper buttons. Works great.

The 48V notice on the display for stranger things is normal right now - all the games do it. JP2 does not.. something in this game's code so far.

For the guy with the broken ramp... make sure it's not just binding. We've seen that too where the motor runs, but it slips due to the ramp binding with the side walls.

And I've looked through the ROMs... I sure hope there is a ton of new voice over work coming.. because there isn't anything great waiting in the rom to be used..

I thought someone mentioned at least 15-20 callouts from all the characters no?

There are lots of callouts in there... but they are bland, boring, and frankly suck. Just things like "super pop bumpers"... very dry stuff that isn't really creative writing at all.

There are more show clips of audio.. but in terms of David H callouts... there aren't any hidden gems in there waiting to come out. They need more than what is in shipping code...

Not talking about the custom ones. The ones from characters from the show. Heard there are approximately 15-20 for all the main characters.

I hope I'll win!! I can bring in the clearcoat issue too (car paint flaking on the edges) and coilstops (car brakes) failing within the first month.

But it's actually what we are facing with. Time for people to step out of this bubble. 6-10k isn't some money.
They seemed to be able to release complete code and rules in the 90ties on game release. Why wouldn't they be able to do it now?
And you can program 75% of the game without having actual hardware.

The "Ball Lock" Post can be disabled in the service menu. Don't have to worry about it falling out if it never goes up. Sadly, this seems to really be the only fool-proof solution. Some people even prefer how the pro plays with the ball-stop disabled. Game is a little faster/smoother since you're not waiting for the post to go back down.

Either David H mailed it in or Stern didn't convey well how to come across with the callouts as like you said they are rather bland. I'm sure it can be hard to tell an actor to add some more enthusiasm but hey they are getting paid for a job. I remember Eric from JJP telling a story of how he asked Kevin McNally on Pirates callouts if he could add a little more "arrrrr" to some callouts lol. Ernie Hudson seemed really into recording Ghostbusters callouts and it shows.

The entire vibe for Stranger Things seems to be dark which makes me wonder if the way callouts were recorded is intentional. There's very little sense of comedy currently being conveyed in the game that the show regularly exhibits so well. As soon as you start the game it has a dark vibe and the Christmas light animation is already being shown despite that event happening later in the first season. There's no build up or setup to all hell breaking loose and as a result the game doesn't seem to have a narrative.

and they aren't that interesting or fun. They are literally just the clips to go along with the videos for the most part. And there aren't that many unless you count every video scene too.

If you are into interactive DVD pinball - yes, there is a lot of audio in the game for you. If you are looking for show audio tied to pinball... or new writing. Almost zero... except the 'jackpot' 'you lit double scoring' etc droning stuff.

I sum it up as 'flat'. Little inflexion, little emotion to convey things like excitement, movement, speed, etc.

I can only hope there is a ton more to come.. because what is there is.. bleh

I think it was made by peeps that weren't fans of the show, so they went and watched it, and the dark parts stood out to them. And here we are.

It's laughable, really. So much for experience in making pinball machines.

Every now and again, Stern seems to suddenly forget how to do the most basic things. In this game, it's a pop-up post. With Avengers, I believe, they forgot how to make a plunger hit the ball squarely. The resulting off-center hit didn't have enough gusto to get the ball out of the shooter lane.

What else could they have besides what the actors say in the show? They only had custom callouts from one character. But I agree his stuff sounds like he was really bored when recording the callouts. Haha

They also forgot how to design sling switch holes. They’re smaller on Avengers than usual, so the switch bends against the wood behind it, resulting in a game with poor switch sensitivity & crappy sling play after a few plays.

Ok I’ve had my Pro for a couple of days and have put in about 50 games.
The first mechanical issue was the lock post popped out onto the left ramp.
As people have mentioned it’s only held in place by pressure. Basically it plugs into the coil rod. I’ve applied a small amount of non permanent locktite to give it a bit of help.
I’m not at all experiencing the issues of hitting the demo on my game. Most shots will go straight in the hole. Even if the shot is slightly off the vagina parts will help guide the ball in.
However, balls kicking out of the mystery scoop don’t seem to guide down onto the left flipper without hitting the left sling.
This causes a problem in catching the ball.
A catch attempt see’s the ball bounce off the left flip onto the corner of the left sling which throws it across for a full contact hit on the right sling at which point you loose control of the ball momentarily.
My game is perfectly level and this happens 9/10. I’ve found striking the ball as it comes onto the left flip less risky than trying to catch it, even if it’s an uncontrolled shot.
Could someone confirm where the left scoop kick out is supposed to be aiming at? Is it supposed to hit the drops?
Mine fires the ball into the entry of the inner right orbit. Balls rattle around but generally roll onto right flip.
Callouts are pretty non existent at the moment apart from some guy that sounds very much like the TWD. Ideally this voice should go and be replaced by the voices or likeness of the shows cast. Callouts should include some form of guidance as there’s not always the time to look up at the screen.
The above aside, I think this is going to be an incredible game when polished.
It’s fast, great flow and the haunting theme music really sets the mood.
I’ve got DP and JP2, this is as good already.
Upside Down scoring does seem wildly disproportionate though. I’m getting 25m from this yet only getting 5m on average for completing chapters....

.

You must not have a Jurassic park Pre/LE this game is not even close.

Quick someone make a kit with this as a mod

I'm not the one who brought up the other characters as should be there or not.. you brought up their content :p AFAIK none of that stuff is used outside the video clips. But there may be some examples.. none of it really is direct pinball stuff.

Really.. the 'okayyy' quick drain clip is probably the most creative in the entire game. Followed only by the 'easy there..' tilt callout.

The irony is I originally called the game a mashup of AFM and GOTG... and going through the game code, wouldn't you know it.. there is lots of leftover GOTG video/graphics in there! No lie...

You’re not understanding what I’m saying. Haha. Eddy says there’s lots more to come. I’m excited to see what’s down the pipe.

Compared to JP pro it’s as good.

At least Lonnie didn't leave GotG-labeled adjustments in the Stranger Things code system menu where they could be easily seen, like he did for Aerosmith with KISS-labeled adjustments accidentally left on the Aerosmith system menu that was released. Or did he?

One thing's for sure, Lonnie is definitely *consistently* lazy.

Losing $1100 is cheap fun?!

Hell yeah!!

I tend to agree. Mike and Brian are the reason I'm hopeful here that the code on this game will be great. I think Brian cares about his pinball legacy and reputation...I think he make sure it is a great experience for the players.

Lol.

When your other hobby costs you a shit ton more than that it's really not a big deal.

Check out my Instagram @xkpgx you'll see my other hobby haha.. pinball is cheap fun.