(Topic ID: 276728)

Stern price increase on ALL machines 1/1/2021

By Wanimal

1 year ago


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  • 128 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 72 days ago by pinballaddicted
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    There are 358 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 8.
    #251 1 year ago
    Quoted from Extraballz:

    Lord of the Rings was 2003. You two were saying....[quoted image]

    An all-time great game. But I’m not sure I’d point to it as a high point of Stern component quality. Many playfields have slightly offset colors like an 80s comic book. Cabinet art has a blurry look from sparse dots used for photo-style art. Plastics have the same low-quality printer look. If Stern pulled any of that shit today Pinside would be up in arms.

    #252 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Are pinball people really that stupid they can't understand what is going on here?

    I actually think pinball people are very educated and sharp. They certainly aren’t stupid. I’m continually impressed by how articulate the vast majority of the Pinsiders are. You must interpret a lot of posts through a different lens than I do.

    #253 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Everything goes up in price every year.

    This statement is not accurate.

    Some goods cost more. Some prices stay the same. And some actually get cheaper. Here are three examples.

    Your pinball machine has gone up in price over the last 30 years.

    A cost of a gallon of gas has basically stayed the same from 1929 until 2015, in constant dollar terms. https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/fact-915-march-7-2016-average-historical-annual-gasoline-pump-price-1929-2015

    And the cost of many electronics has fallen dramatically. See the Radio Shack ad from 1991 and just compare it to the cost of your smart phone.

    AE61C7EF-3DB6-43B3-A3DE-8313F7416A4A (resized).jpeg
    #254 1 year ago
    Quoted from LukyDuck:

    This statement is not accurate.

    Some goods cost more. Some prices stay the same. And some actually get cheaper. Here are three examples.

    A can of tennis balls is the same price today as it was back in 1980.

    #255 1 year ago

    I don't know where the post is at but someone talked 2 x 4s. Several months back I bought 4 2 x4s for about $2.50 each. With a table saw and cheap 2x 4s you can make a lot of different things---cheap.

    Today, I need a 2x4. The plan was go to the big box store and by four 2x4s. but today, after tax they are $6.00 each. I bought only one and called it a day. That is a 140% increase in price !! In less than 6 months !

    They are playing with the measurement numbers, though. That always gets my antenna to quivering. The first 2x4 in the line was $5.86 for one that was 96" long; I did not get a picture of that.

    Next in line was the 2x6 at 92 5/8" for $7.78.

    IMG_4461 (resized).JPG

    Next up was the 2x4 measuring 104 5/8" for $7.55

    IMG_4463 (resized).JPG

    And then, and then there was this gem. A 2x4 84" long for only $5.36.

    IMG_4459 (resized).JPG

    So, my question is when I see measurement changes, I figure someone is trying to sneak something by me. Lets see.

    A 96" long 2x4 is an 8 foot long 2x4. Why couldn't the store just say the sucker was 8 feet long as has been the practice since time began. Let's see.

    A 92 5/8" long 2x6 is 7 feet and 5/8" or 7.75" WTF happened to 8 feet? You just got raped for a measly little 1/4". And you did not even know it.

    And then there is this gem a little farther down the line this is only $5.36 each. What a bargain. Cheapest 2x4 on the shelf until you get it home and figure out that 84" is only 7 feet.

    WTF happened to 8 feet? Why sneak around with this inches measurement BS?
    =================================================

    Over the years a 2x4 has been whittled down to 1 1/2 x 3 1/2. They really cannot go down to 1 1/4 to 3 1/4 because that would be too close to the 1x3s. So, what do they do? Make it shorter, change the measurements and fail to include the price for board foot.
    .....................................................................................................==========================

    It is just a continuation of smaller packages. A 50 lb. of dog food is now a 40 lb. of dog food. Cat food went from 20 lb. sacks to 16 lb. sacks. A gallon of bleach has been 128 oz. since forever. But more an more you see bleach in 121 oz. jugs but the container is so cleverly designed that you will not notice if you don't see the two sizes side by side.

    Prices are going up. But the package stays the same price while contents are reduced. People don't "feel" it so bad when the price does not change. That is why it is done. Sneak. Sneak. Sneak.
    -----------------------------------------------

    You guys that bitch about Stern raising its prices need to pay more attention to what is happening around you. Bitch about the price of food all you want; Everybody has to eat.

    Bitch about the price of medicine that is higher than a cat's back (Epipen). We need medicine.

    Nobody needs a pinball machine. If you don't like the price, don't buy. If you think the quality stinks, don't buy.

    Simple.

    At least Stern in not making 3/4 size pinball machines and leaving the price untouched.

    Bastards.
    ==========================

    Here is one more to pay attention to. Whenever the candy bar companies put out a bigger candy bar for a little more money and get you used to paying for the extra larger size, in the next few moths the "new" larger bar will slowly shrink back down to the smaller size the price stay up.

    #256 1 year ago
    Quoted from LukyDuck:

    This statement is not accurate.
    Some goods cost more. Some prices stay the same. And some actually get cheaper. Here are three examples.
    Your pinball machine has gone up in price over the last 30 years.
    A cost of a gallon of gas has basically stayed the same from 1929 until 2015, in constant dollar terms. https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/fact-915-march-7-2016-average-historical-annual-gasoline-pump-price-1929-2015
    And the cost of many electronics has fallen dramatically. See the Radio Shack ad from 1991 and just compare it to the cost of your smart phone.[quoted image]

    its funny that almost all of the items on that page have been replaced by something that fits into your pocket

    some people do try and replicate the 15" woofer via their mobiles! lol!

    Quoted from cottonm4:

    At least Stern in not making 3/4 size pinball machines and leaving the price untouched.

    wasn't that just a variation of the method uses for the starwars home?
    Keep the same size, take out the contents and see if anyone notices? It's the LE model but at the other end of the spectrum.

    The "pay the same for less" package downsizing has been going on across the board, as you said, in everything!
    People are generally are more likely to notice the physical size of something changing vs writing on the size that says 375g instead of 415g.

    A 3/4 size pin would stick out. A full size, but with almost no coils pin? less so.

    #257 1 year ago
    Quoted from LukyDuck:

    This statement is not accurate.
    Some goods cost more. Some prices stay the same. And some actually get cheaper. Here are three examples.
    Your pinball machine has gone up in price over the last 30 years.
    A cost of a gallon of gas has basically stayed the same from 1929 until 2015, in constant dollar terms. https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/fact-915-march-7-2016-average-historical-annual-gasoline-pump-price-1929-2015
    And the cost of many electronics has fallen dramatically. See the Radio Shack ad from 1991 and just compare it to the cost of your smart phone.[quoted image]

    Electronics is about the only product that happens to. Some of it can be attributed to Moore's Law.

    #258 1 year ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    There are some big pro's to Stern's made 15+ years ago. Direct printed cabinets versus cheap decals, the head being made entirely out of wood versus sheet metal + wood, a proper lock down bar mech, proper head latch, higher playfield quality, and features not being limited to only premium / LE games.
    I'll agree that Stern's themes, code, and fun factor are generally all better then what they were 15-20 years ago. However, the quality isn't what it once was, features once included on the standard game are now only on premium / LE models, and there's been a wealth of cost cutting features (above) and price increases along the way.
    Stern is making some incredibly fun titles but the point myself and others are trying to make is that they are not worth the price considering what you get with the quality being offered. Hell if money was no option I would buy every game they put out. For $6k - $9k+ for a pinball machine of all things playfield quality should be among the best in the industry...not the worst.

    Yep.

    #259 1 year ago
    Quoted from LukyDuck:

    This statement is not accurate.
    Some goods cost more. Some prices stay the same. And some actually get cheaper. Here are three examples.
    Your pinball machine has gone up in price over the last 30 years.
    A cost of a gallon of gas has basically stayed the same from 1929 until 2015, in constant dollar terms. https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/fact-915-march-7-2016-average-historical-annual-gasoline-pump-price-1929-2015
    And the cost of many electronics has fallen dramatically. See the Radio Shack ad from 1991 and just compare it to the cost of your smart phone.[quoted image]

    Iphone was $500 a decade ago. Now prices up to $1500. But yeah, cheaper than a vhs camcorder and touch dial phone so I guess you are right - prices rarely go up on anything besides pinball machines.

    #260 1 year ago
    Quoted from jawjaw:

    Iphone was $500 a decade ago. Now prices up to $1500. But yeah, cheaper than a vhs camcorder and touch dial phone so I guess you are right - prices rarely go up on anything besides pinball machines.

    Because apple is a business much like Stern... if people will pay up then charge them.

    They have the industry leading product and plenty of demand why not see what the market will bear?

    #261 1 year ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    WTF happened to 8 feet? Why sneak around with this inches measurement BS?

    Obviously you have never built anything but bird houses out of 2 x 4s.

    Those are studs.

    #262 1 year ago
    Quoted from LukyDuck:

    This statement is not accurate.
    Some goods cost more. Some prices stay the same. And some actually get cheaper. Here are three examples.
    Your pinball machine has gone up in price over the last 30 years.
    A cost of a gallon of gas has basically stayed the same from 1929 until 2015, in constant dollar terms. https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/fact-915-march-7-2016-average-historical-annual-gasoline-pump-price-1929-2015
    And the cost of many electronics has fallen dramatically. See the Radio Shack ad from 1991 and just compare it to the cost of your smart phone.[quoted image]

    Much of the price drops have to do in unit sales. The last time I bought a dishwasher the small dishwashers for apartments were twice the price of the full size dishwashers this is because of the small numbers they sell. Pinball will never see the unit sale numbers needed to push prices down

    #263 1 year ago
    Quoted from guitarded:

    Obviously you have never built anything but bird houses out of 2 x 4s.
    Those are studs.

    You have found me out. 2x4s have a lot of uses. Building buildings is not something I have done. Not sure how this is relevant to talk about prices in feet or in inches.

    So what's up with changing the measurements to inches? Why not 8 ft? Or 7 ft.? Should I get the 96" 2x4s or the 84" 2x4s ?

    #264 1 year ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    So what's up with changing the measurements to inches? Why not 8 ft? Or 7 ft.? Should I get the 96" 2x4s or the 84" 2x4s ?

    Buildings, generally have 8 foot ceilings.

    If you use 8 foot studs, how would you keep them in place?

    Pre-Cut Studs are that length to allow for Top and Bottom plates. Without them, you would have to cut 3" off of each 8' stud you used.

    #265 1 year ago
    Quoted from guitarded:

    Buildings, generally have 8 foot ceilings.

    This I know.

    Quoted from guitarded:

    If you use 8 foot studs, how would you keep them in place?

    Beats me. I don't build buildings.

    Quoted from guitarded:

    Pre-Cut Studs are that length to allow for Top and Bottom plates. Without them, you would have to cut 3" off of each 8' stud you used.

    I don't know what a top and bottom plates are?

    I know what 8ft. is. But I had to dig out my calculator to figure out that 96" = 8ft.

    I am used buying board feet, not board inches. I am already having to calculate gallons to liters in the grocery store.

    But since the U.S. has not bothered to make the full switch to the metric system, why is Home Depot bothering me with me having to convert inches to feet just so I can know what I am buying, especially since 2x4 went from 2.50 ea. to $6.00 ea. ?

    #266 1 year ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    But I had to dig out my calculator to figure out that 96" = 8ft.

    And you just upvoted this post...

    Quoted from Krupps4:

    I actually think pinball people are very educated and sharp. They certainly aren’t stupid.

    for shame

    #267 1 year ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Stern is making some incredibly fun titles but the point myself and others are trying to make is that they are not worth the price considering what you get with the quality being offered.

    More JJP fanboy crap about quality.

    #268 1 year ago

    As frustrating as it might be some .... if I was on Sterns board I would tell them to raise the prices even more.....LE's sell out in hours at current pricing (which is crazy)...seems to me Stern is leaving money on the table....people should be thankful their not higher.

    #269 1 year ago
    Quoted from PtownPin:

    seems to me Stern is leaving money on the table....people should be thankful their not higher.

    Some of u guys don't get it. They know exactly what they can get away with. Theres a fine line and not always but for the most part they are well aware of what to charge where in as it won't kill the sales but maximize profits. If u think its just a quick BOM and price set to make some money ur way off.

    #270 1 year ago
    Quoted from Hazoff:

    Some of u guys don't get it. They know exactly what they can get away with. Theres a fine line and not always but for the most they are well aware of what to charge where in as it won't kill the sales but maximize profits. If u think its just a quick BOM and price set to make some money ur way off.

    Educate me....what am I not getting? what I said was Stern continues to raise prices, because they can, and the simple fact that games sell out in hours clearly means that money was left on the table.

    #271 1 year ago

    In the remember when department...

    When I was a kid, it took me a while to realize my marvel comic books that said “STILL ONLY 25 CENTS” meant that in a couple of issues the price was going to increase to 30 cents.

    #272 1 year ago
    Quoted from PtownPin:

    what am I not getting? what I said was Stern continues to raise prices, because they can, and the simple fact that games sell out in hours clearly means that money was left on the table.

    Ok, Stern raises prices to cover their costs and make a profit not just because they can, they aren't about to make less and eat up the increase in production costs. Now if ur talking an extra c note on each LE then ok they might have been able to get away with but its not a guarantee, the price they set this time wasn't a known guarantee that it would sell out. As I said a lot more goes into coming up with price than "lets see what we can get a way with" there's been a fair share of uproar over the 100$ increase as it is. Leaving money on the table? well thats part of doing business. They are making good money with this game. Anything else.

    #273 1 year ago
    Quoted from Hazoff:

    More JJP fanboy crap about quality.

    LOL The funny part it this have been on the top ten of JJP subjects for the last year https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/jjpirates-of-the-caribbean-troubleshooting-tips-issues

    #274 1 year ago
    Quoted from PtownPin:

    As frustrating as it might be some .... if I was on Sterns board I would tell them to raise the prices even more.....LE's sell out in hours at current pricing (which is crazy)...seems to me Stern is leaving money on the table....people should be thankful their not higher.

    Why leave money on the table for flippers

    #275 1 year ago

    Help me understand something here: why do people care what the backbox is made of? I've seen a number of people in this thread complaining about the metal backboxes and wishing that they were made entirely of wood. Why?

    Having the backbox made at least partially of sheet metal makes it lighter. And with as much as these things weigh, I'm all for making them as light as possible. I tend to change my lineup often, and so I put a lot of value in my pins being lighter and easier to move.

    #276 1 year ago
    Quoted from JY64:

    Why leave money on the table for flippers

    There are very few dollars left on the table for flippers these days. With a few exceptions, that stopped after Tron LE.

    #277 1 year ago
    Quoted from DakotaMike:

    Help me understand something here: why do people care what the backbox is made of? .

    I've had at least 1 metal back box, and I didn't notice or give a shit. I'd dip my toe in and say the on switch doesnt bother me but I don't want to be murdered

    #278 1 year ago
    Quoted from DakotaMike:

    Help me understand something here: why do people care what the backbox is made of? I've seen a number of people in this thread complaining about the metal backboxes and wishing that they were made entirely of wood. Why?
    Having the backbox made at least partially of sheet metal makes it lighter. And with as much as these things weigh, I'm all for making them as light as possible. I tend to change my lineup often, and so I put a lot of value in my pins being lighter and easier to move.

    Because people just have to cry about something. Metal won't delam, or warp so I like metal

    #279 1 year ago

    At least the games have been pretty good as of late. Stern tried to get 8K minimum for the worst game/best theme of all time, The Beatles.

    #280 1 year ago
    Quoted from DakotaMike:

    Help me understand something here: why do people care what the backbox is made of?

    Its called fuckfacitis. Some pinsiders are highly infected. Then tend to dwell on meaningless crap, its one of the symptoms. They will say things like "Its built like a tank" or "I needed 3 people to get it in the house" if u encounter this run away and don't look back. Its rare but it can be contagious especially if ur already a little bit of a douche bag.

    #281 1 year ago
    Quoted from usandthem:

    Stern tried to get 8K minimum for the worst game/best theme of all time, The Beatles.

    "The Beatles" is the best theme of all time.

    #282 1 year ago
    Quoted from Hazoff:

    "The Beatles" is the best theme of all time.

    Don't fall into his trap!

    #283 1 year ago
    Quoted from Hazoff:

    "The Beatles" is the best theme of all time.

    Well...it WAS.

    I'm still so bummed because I had a deposit down on one. Just couldn't pull the trigger on a reskin.

    #284 1 year ago
    Quoted from DakotaMike:

    I've seen a number of people in this thread complaining about the metal backboxes and wishing that they were made entirely of wood. Why?

    E71B0527-1F4F-4C58-9FA4-30BEBDEF7C71.gif
    #285 1 year ago

    I like wood. Wood is good....

    #286 1 year ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Don't fall into his trap!

    You stay out of this kind sir.
    Friday is only a day away and the drinks start early, I need to start a few shit storms for a post-a-thon and eventual nap.

    #287 1 year ago
    Quoted from Extraballz:

    I like wood. Wood is good....

    I see.

    #288 1 year ago
    Quoted from DakotaMike:

    Help me understand something here: why do people care what the backbox is made of? I've seen a number of people in this thread complaining about the metal backboxes and wishing that they were made entirely of wood. Why?
    Having the backbox made at least partially of sheet metal makes it lighter. And with as much as these things weigh, I'm all for making them as light as possible. I tend to change my lineup often, and so I put a lot of value in my pins being lighter and easier to move.

    People want heavier pins and associate that with quality. They think it's a sign of cheapness even though it functions just as well or better.

    #289 1 year ago

    I actually much prefer the look of the metal backboxes. They added the pitched speaker panel with graphics too. The old backboxes with that awful battered chrome trim just look cheap to me, even if they were a little heavier.

    #290 1 year ago
    Quoted from jawjaw:

    People want heavier pins and associate that with quality. They think it's a sign of cheapness even though it functions just as well or better.

    purists....I could care less about the back box material....

    #291 1 year ago
    Quoted from Extraballz:

    I like wood. Wood is good....

    As Ren and Stimpy would say...

    It's Log...It's Log...It's big - It's heavy - It's Wood.
    It's Log...It's Log...It's better than bad, It's good!

    #292 1 year ago
    Quoted from beelzeboob:

    Well...it WAS.
    I'm still so bummed because I had a deposit down on one. Just couldn't pull the trigger on a reskin.

    Have you played one? You might be surprised just how irrelevant the 'reskin' tag is.

    #293 1 year ago
    Quoted from Aussiepinwiz:

    Have you played one? You might be surprised just how irrelevant the 'reskin' tag is.

    Great game but overpriced, looks, & sounds like shit. Man I wish they'd re-skin it again!

    #294 1 year ago

    I love Stern's new metal backbox design. I'm stealing it for my next homebrew.

    #295 1 year ago
    Quoted from beelzeboob:

    Well...it WAS.
    I'm still so bummed because I had a deposit down on one. Just couldn't pull the trigger on a reskin.

    It was not the reskin it was the price that killed it for me

    #296 1 year ago
    Quoted from Hazoff:

    "The Beatles" is the best theme of all time.

    here is my theory on this... the license for vintage vs. in their prime Beatles is different.

    They were either not offered the license for the later songs and images or they were way too expensive to work.

    They did the early Beatles and cut dev costs and do a reskin to make it work financially.

    There is no way if they had access to everything the Beatles could offer they would do what they did... be the dumbest move in pinball history.

    Pretty sure thats all they were offered or could afford license wise.

    #297 1 year ago
    Quoted from Aussiepinwiz:

    Have you played one? You might be surprised just how irrelevant the 'reskin' tag is.

    Many times. I mastered the upper loop pretty easily (not trying to sound like a dick, btw), and it was just not much of a challenge for me. That aside, I hated the design, the colors, the fact that it was focused more on Beatlemania rather than the band, and focused on only the first few albums. IMO, a complete waste of an amazing license. And yes...WAY overpriced.

    But other than that, I thought it was a great game.

    #298 1 year ago
    Quoted from Elvishasleft:

    They did the early Beatles and cut dev costs and do a reskin to make it work financially.

    Your theory - like most here about Stern and their business practices - is terrible and not related to reality.

    Stern saved no money "reskinning" a game designed in the 1970s. It's not like they just popped in an old floppy disk and slapped new art on an old game called it a day.

    Every single post in Beatles is in a different position than the seawitch game. It's a different layout, and it had to be designed fresh just like any other new game.

    People were begging Stern for YEARS to "update" old layouts. They finally did it and there was a meltdown here. SHOCKER!

    -1
    #299 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Your theory - like most here about Stern and their business practices - is terrible and not related to reality.
    Stern saved no money "reskinning" a game designed in the 1970s. It's not like they just popped in an old floppy disk and slapped new art on an old game called it a day.
    Every single post in Beatles is in a different position than the seawitch game. It's a different layout, and it had to be designed fresh just like any other new game.
    People were begging Stern for YEARS to "update" old layouts. They finally did it and there was a meltdown here. SHOCKER!

    Just guessing. There was something going on....

    Either they completely blew one of the best licenses they will ever get or their hands were tied as to what they could do.

    Hard for me to believe they had access to the entire Beatles song catalog and visuals and thats what they would do... would be idiotic.

    #300 1 year ago
    Quoted from Elvishasleft:

    here is my theory on this... the license for vintage vs. in their prime Beatles is different.

    Some would say they were " in their prime" during 1964.

    There are 358 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 8.

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