Since I have the thread about potentially trading my STTNG for a stern let me play devil's advocate.

STTNG is a ranked 15 on here for a reason. It has more on it than any stern ever made. Stern doesn't use subways. They have never had more than 1 cannon on a game. Compare STTNG to the new Star Trek Premium. There is more to it.

To compare the new Star Trek vs STTNG. STTNG has longer shots due to being a wide body. On the new the delta ramp was made easier to hit, but I don't find that to be better. With STTNG when you hit the warp it feels like an accomplishment vs a gimme.

The new one and new sterns for that matter have deeper code. STTNG is a brutal game. There is plenty to do, but it is not incredibly deep. There is enough there to give you a few strategies for scoring points. It just is not going to have you holding the flipper in the middle of the game trying to remember 10 pages of rules to figure out the best way to points. Instead you will play, lose in under 2 minutes, play again, and again and again until you have one monster game you won't believe happened.

Why are they 4k+? They are a pita to shop. There are a lot of expensive items to replace. Cannon wiring harness, cannon covers crack, ramps crack, playfield wear, teal inserts can get melted from the flashers beneath, head decals are blue when scratched, borg ship warps, 5v reset, etc etc

Why then would I debate trading mine? I've owned it twice now and am always looking to try something new.

They aren't, but the older B/W titles are ranked high for various reasons. Shot layouts, toys, light shows, sound, etc.

I have an STTNG and I've played the new trek. New trek is meh. Yes, ruleset is deeper and the shot layout is very similar. It is not as good. STTNG had the original cast doing custom callouts, the new one meh. Also, superpins are 50lbs heavier than standard. They have more stuff and they are going to weigh more. As for not believing how heavy it is perhaps you should hit the gym. Does wonders for your health and those super heavy widebodies don't feel nearly as heavy.

Because you are whining that a machine that remains stationary while you use it is heavy. As an argument it contains no substance. As for defending a machine I own? I have a topic in the market asking if I should trade it. No one said to trade it for a stern. Not one said oh yes, get rid of the old B/W title because new sterns are superior. Nada, the only one hurt here is you. Now go lift that 500kg

Look at the average age of collectors. If nostalgia was the driving factor system 11's and early ss would rank higher / bring more money. You are more likely to see the titles drop if LCDs become big and make those nostalgic B/W titles dated.

Easier != better. Yes, you can rape the delta ramp in ST. You also don't get any feeling of accomplishment from it. If you like it great, but it doesn't make it superior.

None of the stern games are widebodies nor do they have near the amount of shit that sits on STTNG. A modern argument would be WOZ, not anything Stern has put out. The game is physically larger and has more features, it is going to weigh more. If you want to make a point then show us why Superpins or WOZ for that matter are unnecessarily heavy.

Kiss probably isn't a fair comparison. The code is incomplete and could take another 2.5 years before we know where it ends up. Stern and williams both had their fair share of abandoned games codewise anyways so WCS vs Monopoly maybe? They run in the same price range, they are both complete.

LOTR was on sale for a long time and was developed because the programmer made it a pet project. B/W code was not done 1 year after it came out. Go on RGP and do some digging. It took time for them to become the polished games we love today.
Mind you some could still use some polishing.

Stern IJ vs Williams IJ is not exactly a fair comparison. Stern IJ is just not a good game and sold poorly. B/W had its fair share of duds too.