Stern Pinball to go online in 2019

(Topic ID: 227763)

Stern Pinball to go online in 2019


By FalconPunch

29 days ago



Topic Stats

  • 108 posts
  • 75 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 26 days ago by FalconPunch
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    There are 108 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
    #1 29 days ago

    So I was watching the George Gomez talk @ expo on the pinball news YouTube page.

    George mentions next year machines will be able to go online and update themselves if you let it.

    But he mentions that's just the start of it.

    So my question is.... What does everyone want machines to do online?

    Online leader boards?
    Online only modes versus other players?

    11
    #2 29 days ago

    Weekly tournies for similar machines running similar code. Create virtual leagues for those who aren’t in an area where there are leagues close by.

    18
    #3 29 days ago

    But people will set angles different and tilts looser so it won't be a fair game.

    #4 29 days ago

    Online leaderboards are the obvious one.

    They could have "weekly challenges" that add custom rules and report scores back to the leaderboard. That would be pretty cool.

    10
    #5 29 days ago
    Quoted from FalconPunch:

    So my question is.... What does everyone want machines to do online?

    Nothing.

    Well....maybe code updates. That’ll do.

    #6 29 days ago

    Finally online. Welcome to 2006 Stern. Being a little sarcastic, I’ve been playing games online since the mid 90s. Used to play Doom online on dial up. If implemented correctly, online could offer up a new way to play and enjoy pinball, definitely looking forward to it

    11
    #7 29 days ago

    Stern is the only company right now I would trust to even attempt this.

    This costs money, and a decent chunk of it, to do it correctly and securely. Setting up some code in a pin to download an update is easy. Making it secure is hard. They will also need to ensure the update source can't be poisoned or impersonated. The update service will also need to be high availability (HA) for something like this.

    #8 29 days ago
    Quoted from Tomass:

    But people will set angles different and tilts looser so it won't be a fair game.

    That’s assuming no advancements are made at the same time to account for these.

    Level sensors and a modern replacement of the traditional tilt bob (some sort of piezoelectric sensors perhaps) can provide real time feedback that a game would need to make sure it’s properly pitched on both axis, and whether it’s subject to large forces from nudging.

    10
    #9 29 days ago

    I'd like to see automatic reporting of issues, etc while on route. No need to go check your games if they can tell you when they detect an issue, or give you a reminder after 1k plays to come clean it

    Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

    Making it secure is hard. They will also need to ensure the update source can't be poisoned or impersonated. The update service will also need to be high availability (HA) for something like this.

    Pinball viruses!

    I'd rather they weren't secure at all so I can hack them myself...

    Quoted from Yoko2una:

    Level sensors and a modern replacement of the traditional tilt bob (some sort of piezoelectric sensors perhaps) can provide real time feedback that a game would need to make sure it’s properly pitched on both axis, and whether it’s subject to large forces from nudging

    I think there's a patent on the virtual tilt bob, iirc. I'd rather not have checks that a game is pitched correctly. My 'correctly' isn't another person's 'correctly'.

    -1
    #10 29 days ago

    You really think hackers are going to spend time hacking a pinball machine? I think they would rather focus on other platforms.

    #11 29 days ago

    Global leaderboards are always cheated, you can’t stop that. Having a list of friends that have similar games would be fun to play against though.
    Lifetime achievements, updates and troubleshooting notifications would also be nice.

    #12 29 days ago

    For machines on route:
    Geolocation - Stern can put out their own version of a pinball map to show you locations of machines. Heard this was in the works before. Would need an opt-out for anyone who does not want to broadcast the location of their games.
    Online payment options? Some type of virtual wallet account system for people to credit up machines without carrying cash/quarters.

    15
    #13 29 days ago
    Quoted from jeffgoldstein2:

    You really think hackers are going to spend time hacking a pinball machine? I think they would rather focus on other platforms.

    You are underestimating the number of bored kids in the world.

    A large chunk of my job is cyber security, you'd be terrified to know the real truth of what is out there and what is going on.

    #14 29 days ago

    It's a nice novelty but not one that is going to help much on location. Most of the locations I Know have either dodgy wi-fi, or ops who will never make sure this is actually working properly.

    Probably differen't in Wisconsin.

    As far as online tournaments or head to head...we all know this is BEYOND novelty with no value. It's been covered ad nasaeum and rightfully so that you can't compare different games due to tilt settings, setup, etc.

    #15 29 days ago

    Be careful what you ask for. Tech support, why are there pop up ads for adult friend-finder on my pinball machine?

    #16 29 days ago
    Quoted from jeffgoldstein2:

    You really think hackers are going to spend time hacking a pinball machine? I think they would rather focus on other platforms.

    You mean like when 2 hackers took control of a Jeep from another state and controlled the steering wheel, messed with the HVAC and radio volumes, and even turned the engine off while the driver was on the highway?

    #17 29 days ago
    Quoted from jeffgoldstein2:

    You really think hackers are going to spend time hacking a pinball machine? I think they would rather focus on other platforms.

    They take whatever low hanging fruit there is. If they can hack and and use it in a botnet, its open season.

    #18 29 days ago

    Not really interested in online tbh. If it was a video game sure, because outside of switches sticking/wearing out the games play the same. On a pin? They play differently machine to machine. So much so that you need to play each one to get a feel for what it will/won't let you get away with. Part of the reason that this showed up with pinball 2000 and disappeared for so long.

    #19 29 days ago

    Don't underestimate the hardening of the OS as well. They can't just leave the OS the way it is if it's connected to Wifi. There will have to be regular security patches applied to the OS to keep it secure.

    #20 29 days ago
    Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

    Don't underestimate the hardening of the OS as well. They can't just leave the OS the way it is if it's connected to Wifi. There will have to be regular security patches applied to the OS to keep it secure.

    Yeah - I think online is just a bad idea for this very reason... Have they not read about IOT? Is it that hard to update code with a USB drive?

    #21 29 days ago

    this is going to be a fun and expensive vector for attack! Looking forward to threads about hacked and infected machines.

    #22 29 days ago

    Can't compare scores from 2 different machines, but you could probably come up with Loyalty system, achievements, etc. Motivate the player to play more, track their progress, share it.

    #23 29 days ago
    Quoted from Fezmid:

    Yeah - I think online is just a bad idea for this very reason... Have they not read about IOT? Is it that hard to update code with a USB drive?

    I think Stern can pull it off, because they have the budget to hire the right kind of people and foot the monthly Azure bill. Aside from that, this would require more support people and put some pressure on distributors to understand/troubleshoot wifi systems in people's homes.

    #24 29 days ago

    Use a system like the keypad on the old San Fransico Rush games, enter your code (usually phone number) before the game starts to track you game, progress and scores.

    #25 29 days ago

    I don't see having virtual tournaments or any online gameplay. No two machines play alike and every game can be setup to be hard or easy. It would be cool to change settings and download updates with an app. However, it's not like you do that sort of thing very often. It would be move convenient for operators. You could update games at certain times like in the middle of the night, check game stats, and see if there are any faults without having to visit a location.

    #26 29 days ago
    Quoted from TimeBandit:

    Nothing.
    Well....maybe code updates. That’ll do.

    That’ll do as long as it doesn’t mean charging for them.

    #27 29 days ago

    Stern doing online code updates...thanks for the laugh! Because they would actually have to have a code update for Ghostbusters to download first.

    11
    #28 29 days ago

    I see no reason for this...code update takes just minutes with a flash drive and does not have to be done very often....I would prefer to keep the prices lower rather than have a wifi pinball machine

    #29 29 days ago
    Quoted from cosmokramer:

    I see no reason for this...code update takes just minutes with a flash drive and does not have to be done very often....I would prefer to keep the prices lower rather than have a wifi pinball machine

    Yeah I honestly can't see where this makes business sense for Stern. It's a time/money sink with not a lot of payoff unless they saw a breakthrough opportunity in some kind of online profile system.

    #30 29 days ago
    Quoted from Matesamo:

    Use a system like the keypad on the old San Fransico Rush games, enter your code (usually phone number) before the game starts to track you game, progress and scores.

    That's one of the uses for the Bluetooth interface in DI.

    #31 29 days ago
    Quoted from cosmokramer:

    I see no reason for this...code update takes just minutes with a flash drive and does not have to be done very often....I would prefer to keep the prices lower rather than have a wifi pinball machine

    It might mean that Stern will have a more real time addressment of code updates, more frequent and less massive updates. Isn't there a lot of complaining about Stern here on Pinside about code updates? Not just the delivery but it might re-vamp the way that they address getting the code written in a more timely manner. I see this as positive.

    #32 29 days ago

    I think we are all overlooking something. Stern won't do this for just updates/support, there has to be a revenue stream in it somewhere.....

    #33 29 days ago
    Quoted from luvthatapex2:

    I think we are all overlooking something. Stern won't do this for just updates/support, there has to be a revenue stream in it somewhere.....

    or some way to reduce costs for themselves, while raising the prices we pay

    #34 29 days ago
    Quoted from luvthatapex2:

    I think we are all overlooking something. Stern won't do this for just updates/support, there has to be a revenue stream in it somewhere.....

    Creating a way for operators to see more ROI on each pinball which means selling more pinball machines? If pinball can earn more, then Stern is a big winner. That's enough motivation without getting all cynical about it.

    #35 29 days ago
    Quoted from luvthatapex2:

    I think we are all overlooking something. Stern won't do this for just updates/support, there has to be a revenue stream in it somewhere.....

    Maybe they'll charge for the service? Something ops might like, but home users would probably pass on.

    #36 29 days ago
    Quoted from NPO:

    You mean like when 2 hackers took control of a Jeep from another state and controlled the steering wheel, messed with the HVAC and radio volumes, and even turned the engine off while the driver was on the highway?

    Never happened. Go re-read the story in Wired. You're mis-remembering many details.

    #37 29 days ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    Creating a way for operators to see more ROI on each pinball which means selling more pinball machines? If pinball can earn more, then Stern is a big winner. That's enough motivation without getting all cynical about it.

    People seem to forget that Stern's not only in the business to sell to 'collectors', but ops. And operators, have real-time bookeeping, errors, and notices available? Hell yes. Of course, they'd charge for it. You would need to log into Stern's portal.. but still.

    #38 29 days ago

    I'm guessing in some states some ops wouldn't want a digital record of their profits

    I think player profiles would be cool. Stats on your scores , game time, wizard mode achieved, etc

    If multiplayer games , you all had your profile logged in, showing head to head stats against your friends would be neat

    -2
    #39 29 days ago

    "We noticed your location has changed. Congratulations on purchasing your used game, or for moving. Please send $100 to Stern to unlock this game! Happy playing!"

    #40 29 days ago
    Quoted from Rondogg:

    "We noticed your location has changed. Congratulations on purchasing your used game, or for moving. Please send $100 to Stern to unlock this game! Happy playing!"

    Thats nothing......wait til it becomes self aware......

    terminator (resized).jpg
    #41 29 days ago

    There's a reason in tech we call the Internet of Things the Internet of Shit, putting your devices online tends to turn into a mess.

    Stern isn't a big company, they're a little pinball shop. They don't know anything more about putting their game online than the people making 'smart' TVs or toasters, the things that are constantly having stupid headline issues.

    There's the added cost of the hardware, the need to maintain the infrastructure and security, it's not just throw a switch, game updates itself. And you're going to do what? Pair your phone with your pinball to access features? Painfully enter your wifi password with the buttons inside the coin door? Get frustrated when your router gives your pin an IPV6 instead of IPV4 address and nothing works?

    Just sounds like giant headache and something that will raise costs. And for what? Stern isn't exactly rolling out the weekly code updates.

    Leaderboards to virtually compete are always going to be stupid, because someone will always cheat. And it's not like you have to work hard to cheat. And yes, it's stupid, and no, it doesn't matter, because people will do it anyways.

    #42 29 days ago

    It’s just a way for stern to cash in on charging you a monthly fee to use the pinball.

    #43 29 days ago

    Perhaps advertising on the games like TouchTunes has.

    #44 29 days ago

    Sounds great until someone figures out how to crack the OS and add credits from their phone...

    #45 29 days ago

    I would love the ability to create groups with specific users. Global leaderboards are nice and all, but they don't translate well. Friend leaderboards or group leaderboards would be nice, however. I'd still want both.

    But group tournaments, the ability to update over the air, diagnostics and audit sharing with Stern, and anything that improves maintenance would be great.

    #46 29 days ago

    Paid DLC ... ?

    #47 29 days ago

    Man, what a bunch of Debbie Downers!

    I have BoP 2.0 and I love the online features. I love the simplicity of code updates. I love the achievement tracking and score history and stats.

    I think it would be fun to share data from a location with your friends. There would be opportunities for unique competitions like say an objective based pin golf in which the software would verify the completion of certain objectives or target scores, maybe even time stamp the completion for speed-run gauntlet-style competitions.

    I would especially be excited to see all the ideas that I’m not clever enough to come up with.

    -2
    #48 29 days ago
    Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

    Stern is the only company right now I would trust to even attempt this.
    This costs money, and a decent chunk of it, to do it correctly and securely. Setting up some code in a pin to download an update is easy. Making it secure is hard. They will also need to ensure the update source can't be poisoned or impersonated. The update service will also need to be high availability (HA) for something like this.

    I still get hijacked emails—seemingly from Stern employees—asking me to pay some phony invoice, so these guys have some work to do security-wise before even thinking about doing something like this.

    #49 29 days ago
    Quoted from Spelunk71:

    I still get hijacked emails—seemingly from Stern—asking me to pay some phony invoice, so these guys have some work to do security-wise.

    I believe you are referring to a spoofed email, and Stern's security or lack thereof has nothing to do with those.

    #50 29 days ago
    Quoted from snakesnsparklers:

    I believe you are referring to a spoofed email, and Stern's security or lack thereof has nothing to do with those.

    Not true at all. A published SPF and DMARC record would go a long way to stop spoofing. They have neither.

    There are 108 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
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