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(Topic ID: 281867)

Stern "PINBALL" odd switch behavior issues


By wawhite92025

12 days ago



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  • 22 posts
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  • Latest reply 4 days ago by atariaction
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left drops b.jpg
Pinbal_SwitchMatrix_Playfield(1).gif
3 Alltek boards in Stern PINBALL backbox.png

#1 12 days ago

I have a 1977 Stern solid state PINBALL. The game is in good cosmetic shape and has all original components on the playfield and in the cabinet. The 3 ss boards are all Alltek. The game has very odd issues with some of the switches and these problems occur with the new Alltek MPU or with the old (but working) Stern MPU.
Here is what is happening: 1)left outlane switch fires the left pop bumper and turns off the game, but when ball returns to the outhole the game does reboot, acts as if the power switch was cycled but with the addition of energizing the left pop. 2) right outlane activates the right pop bumper, tilt light come on, but on going to the outhole the game continues as if nothing happened, 3) left center drop target is supposed to be switch #25, but in switch test it shows 01, 4) left top inside drop target supposed to be switch #27, but shows as 03, 5) right outside drop target supposed to be switch #29, but shows as 05, 6) right out lane is supposed to be switch 31 but shows as 07 (which is the tilt switch), 7) left outlane is supposed to be switch #32, but shows as 08 (which is the outhole switch).
All the other switches show correctly in the switch test and all the lights work, score displays work, all the solenoids work and the scoring is correctly added. I have traced all the circuits and the correct wiring goes to the correct pins on the MPU. Cannot imagine this is an MPU issue since both old and new boards have the same problems.

So, the game can be played (mostly), but occasionally the upper kickout saucer stops working, so the ball is stuck there, and if the ball goes down the left out lane that's the end of the game. The tilt light coming on as it goes through the right outlane is wrong, but the game keeps playing.

Does anyone have any experience with a problem like this in an early Stern or Bally solid state and what is the cure? Thanks.

3 Alltek boards in Stern PINBALL backbox.png
#2 12 days ago
Quoted from wawhite92025:

Does anyone have any experience with a problem like this in an early Stern or Bally solid state and what is the cure?

The cause is a shorted diode/switch somewhere, the cure is finding and fixing it

Put the game in switch test. Does it report "0" in the Ball in Play display?
Then remove the J3 connector (cabinet switch harness) off the MPU board and check your drop target switches again - do you still get incorrect switches being reported?

You mention the top saucer sometimes not responding - have you determined if this is switch or coil related? Is the switch gapped properly?

You might find this recent switch matrix problem thread useful reading:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/eight-ball-deluxe-3rd-player-jumps-to-4th-player-while-ball-in-play

#3 12 days ago

Failing ceramic capacitors on switches can cause erratic behavior as well. Clip one lead of the capacitor and see if that fixes the issue. Replace if bad, resolder if good.

#4 10 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

The cause is a shorted diode/switch somewhere, the cure is finding and fixing it
Put the game in switch test. Does it report "0" in the Ball in Play display?
Then remove the J3 connector (cabinet switch harness) off the MPU board and check your drop target switches again - do you still get incorrect switches being reported?
You mention the top saucer sometimes not responding - have you determined if this is switch or coil related? Is the switch gapped properly?
You might find this recent switch matrix problem thread useful reading:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/eight-ball-deluxe-3rd-player-jumps-to-4th-player-while-ball-in-play

Thanks. I'll check this tomorrow. My switch test works, just reports incorrect info for five switches. The top saucer problem is a mystery because with the ball sitting in the saucer if I restart the game the saucer/kick out works immediately without any change to the switch, but I'll study it again.
I may eventually have to check all the diodes, although the ones for the left and right outlane are good (have been replaced).
Thanks for the advice.

#5 10 days ago
Quoted from Eric_S:

Failing ceramic capacitors on switches can cause erratic behavior as well. Clip one lead of the capacitor and see if that fixes the issue. Replace if bad, resolder if good.

Thanks. This game has a capacitor on only one switch, the one for the tilt rolling ball switch and I disconnected that circuit while testing. But thanks for the suggestion. All advice appreciated.

#6 10 days ago
Quoted from wawhite92025:

The top saucer problem is a mystery because with the ball sitting in the saucer if I restart the game the saucer/kick out works immediately without any change to the switch, but I'll study it again.

The game will always activate the saucer coils after power-up irrespective if there's balls sitting in them or not.
The fact this is happening is telling you the coil is working and it's a switch related problem.

Next time the ball gets stuck in the top saucer, go immediately to switch test mode and see if the game is recognising that saucer switch as being closed.

#7 10 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

The game will always activate the saucer coils after power-up irrespective if there's balls sitting in them or not.
The fact this is happening is telling you the coil is working and it's a switch related problem.
Next time the ball gets stuck in the top saucer, go immediately to switch test mode and see if the game is recognising that saucer switch as being closed.

Thanks. I will check that switch.

#8 10 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

The cause is a shorted diode/switch somewhere, the cure is finding and fixing it
Put the game in switch test. Does it report "0" in the Ball in Play display?
Then remove the J3 connector (cabinet switch harness) off the MPU board and check your drop target switches again - do you still get incorrect switches being reported?
You mention the top saucer sometimes not responding - have you determined if this is switch or coil related? Is the switch gapped properly?
You might find this recent switch matrix problem thread useful reading:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/eight-ball-deluxe-3rd-player-jumps-to-4th-player-while-ball-in-play

Quench,
I removed the J3 connector when in switch test mode and the switch errors are the same, wrong switch numbers for L & R outlanes and three of the drop targets. I reckon I should start by testing the diodes on all of those switches. I'll report back....... So far I have checked and verified the diodes on all of the drop targets and the outlane switches they are all good and correctly wired. Any idea what is the reason the left outlane switch fires the left pop bumper and shuts of the power to the MPU, and why the right outlane lights the tilt light, fires the right bumper, but does not turn off the game? I suppose if I can find the solution to one of these problems it may cure all the others?

Your help greatly appreciated.

#9 9 days ago
Quoted from wawhite92025:

I removed the J3 connector when in switch test mode and the switch errors are the same

Ok, so it's not a cabinet/front door switch causing an issue within the switch matrix.

Quoted from wawhite92025:

Any idea what is the reason the left outlane switch fires the left pop bumper and shuts of the power to the MPU, and why the right outlane lights the tilt light, fires the right bumper, but does not turn off the game?

If you look at the switch matrix diagram below, the left outlane, left pop bumper and slam switches are all on the same "I7" row switch return line. A short somewhere in your switch matrix is causing a switch on that line to shadow across other switches. Ditto the right outlane, right pop bumper and tilt on the "I6" row switch return line.

If you can, perform this procedure I mentioned in the thread above and let me know the results:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/eight-ball-deluxe-3rd-player-jumps-to-4th-player-while-ball-in-play#post-5954054

Pinbal_SwitchMatrix_Playfield(1).gif

#10 7 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

Ok, so it's not a cabinet/front door switch causing an issue within the switch matrix.

If you look at the switch matrix diagram below, the left outlane, left pop bumper and slam switches are all on the same "I7" row switch return line. A short somewhere in your switch matrix is causing a switch on that line to shadow across other switches. Ditto the right outlane, right pop bumper and tilt on the "I6" row switch return line.
If you can, perform this procedure I mentioned in the thread above and let me know the results:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/eight-ball-deluxe-3rd-player-jumps-to-4th-player-while-ball-in-play#post-5954054
[quoted image]

Is this the procedure you refer to?:
Unfortunately, switch test mode only reports the lowest number switch that's closed. Imagine if you could close every single switch in the game at the same time, switch test mode will only report switch "01" as being closed giving you no idea about the state of any other switch.

This means you need to run the switch test in a special way to make it useful with matrix issues.

You need to test switches in reverse number order starting from switch 40 and work your way back to switch 01.
When you activate drop targets, leave them down and move to the next switch. Same goes for the saucer and outhole, leave a ball in them when testing (obviously you'll need to find a spare ball) and move to the next switch. Matrix problems usually occur when switches stay closed (drop targets and saucers help create the scenario).

Note, test all three tilt switches (roll cage, plump bob and under playfield switch), both slam tilt switches (coin door and next to the tilt plumb bob) and both 30 point rebound switches. Make sure your other hand is not touching anything grounded (i.e side rails, coin door, etc), otherwise you will get phantom switches tripping through the resistance of your body.

What you're looking for is any switch that reports the wrong number (lower than what it should) because a matrix issue will cause a phantom switch to appear closed.

I do not fully understand this, but I do understand the matrix and how switches share the same path. Perhaps if I can concentrate on just one of the problems it will help solve the others. If I start with figuring out how the left outlane is showing incorrectly as switch #8 (the outhole) instead as switch #32 and why it shuts off the game, then I'm sure I can solve the right outlane and 3 drop targets issue. Even though all the wiring in the game appears to be the way the factory built it, obviously some wire(s) are not going where they should. On very close inspection I do not see (or even meter) any shorts in the connections, but apparently the way some wires are routed must be wrong. Since I don't need the playfield slam switch in my home I have removed it from the circuit just to eliminate that as a cause of trouble. I did also temporarily remove the circuit to the tilt switches, but that did not fix anything, the right outlane still showed as switch #7 even with no wires connected to the tilt switches.

Thanks. Really appreciate your effort and patience in helping.

#11 6 days ago
Quoted from wawhite92025:

Is this the procedure you refer to?:

Yes, that's the procedure. Which part(s) don't you understand? (so I can make it more clear)

Can you post some pictures showing the wire connections on all the drop targets and the outlane switches?
Oh please post a clear picture of the J2 connector on the MPU board so I can see each of the wire colors and where they're positioned.

Can you lastly clarify if switch test mode reports "0" in the Ball in Play display when no switches are closed (i.e. all drop targets are raised and the ball removed from the machine)?

#12 5 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

Yes, that's the procedure. Which part(s) don't you understand? (so I can make it more clear)
Can you post some pictures showing the wire connections on all the drop targets and the outlane switches?
Oh please post a clear picture of the J2 connector on the MPU board so I can see each of the wire colors and where they're positioned.
Can you lastly clarify if switch test mode reports "0" in the Ball in Play display when no switches are closed (i.e. all drop targets are raised and the ball removed from the machine)?

Connectors photos linked. Note, the soldering ain't beautiful because I had disconnected the diodes to test them and then resoldered. Also on the left upper drops I added some wire extensions to the solenoids because two of the wires to the solenoid were too short. Even though it may look like it in the photos none of the switch connections are shorted, but if better photos will help please let me know what you would like to see. https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt4tNexfRpeRVHBu7

As to testing the switches, yes the Ball In Play shows a 0 (zero) when no switches are closed. What I don't understand is how the MPU can show switch numbers 1, 3, 5 for three of the drop targets when there are no such switch numbers? And why does the right outlane register as #7 and the left as #8? All the other switches register correctly. Here are the colors of the wires in the J2: (photos not always as easy to see colors)
1) white-red stripe
2) brown-white squares
3) white-blue stripe
4) white-yellow squares
5) yellow-red stripe
6) key
7) not in use
8) dark brown (goes to lower drop target)
9) gray (goes to top left outside drop target)
10)white-orange stripe
11)white-black stripe
12)white-green stripe
13)white- brown stripe
14)brown-yellow blocks
15)orange

I know that some of these colors do not match the schematic/matrix. A) J2-2 is supposed to be Gray-Yellow (there is no gray and yellow wire in my game) but in my game they used a light brown (tan) with white squares that goes to both saucers, the 4 bonus advance rollovers. Those switches behave correctly and score correctly.
B) The lower left drop target on J2-8 is supposed to be white and green, but the original looking pin connector and wire laced through the wiring bundle is the dark brown wire.
C) J2-9 is supposed to be white-brown, but in my game a grey wire goes to left top outside drop target and sure looks original
D) J2-12 is supposed to be a brown wire, but a white-green wire goes to the top saucer, the four 10 points switches, the right top outside drop target and the left slingshot. The drop target is supposed to be #29, but shows as 05.
E) J2-13 is supposed to be brown-yellow but in my game it is a brown wire with a white stripe and goes to the bonus rollovers, 50 points switches, spinner, bottom bumper. These switches score correctly.
F) J2-14 is supposed to be brown-white, but in my game it is brown-yellow blocks. That wire goes to the tilt, right inlane, right outlane, right bumper. The right outlane registers tilt and fires the right bumper, but does not actually tilt the game (does not skip a ball in play)

To make sure there is nothing wrong with J3 wire order here is how they are set up:
1) red
2) red-yellow blocks
3) red-green blocks
4, 5, 6, 7, 8 not used
9)red-white blocks
10) brown-white blocks
11) blue
12, 13 not used
14) blue-white blocks
15) blue-orange stripe
16) yellow

I have heard from other sources that the early Stern schematics did not always match how the game had been wired. So even though the colors may not match I have traced where the wires go. It does seem strange that 3 of the drop targets are not using return wire colors as are listed in the schematic, and maybe how those wires are being used is a key to the problem. The fact that J2-8 and J2-12 have their wire colors switched is interesting but then why is there a brown wire from J2-8 that only goes to the lower drop target?

#13 5 days ago

Hey Will. Here is my 2 cents. May only be worth 1 cent...
I do believe it is a switch matrix issue and not the CPU as you have ruled that out by installing the old MPU and get the same issues.
So that boils down to something incorrect with the wiring. Double checking wire colors on ALL connectors is good (sounds like you are on that).
Make sure you are mindful of correct diode orientation. This will cause matrix issues if one is backwards.
I also wonder if there is a short. It appears that part of the switch matrix is getting solenoid voltage which is no good!!!!
Maybe you should measure the voltages on the various matrix lines and see if you are getting solenoid voltage on any of them and if you are then you must find where the matrix is getting that voltage from.
I dont think you have any bad switch caps as you are not getting any locked on switches and you can get a zero on the display in switch test.
It is possible you have a bad diode. Lots of this is mentioned above so I apologize for any redundancy.
Also if you have a known working solenoid driver you could swap that in for fun.
Good luck! You may need some!!

#14 5 days ago
Quoted from atariaction:

Hey Will. Here is my 2 cents. May only be worth 1 cent...
I do believe it is a switch matrix issue and not the CPU as you have ruled that out by installing the old MPU and get the same issues.
So that boils down to something incorrect with the wiring. Double checking wire colors on ALL connectors is good (sounds like you are on that).
Make sure you are mindful of correct diode orientation. This will cause matrix issues if one is backwards.
I also wonder if there is a short. It appears that part of the switch matrix is getting solenoid voltage which is no good!!!!
Maybe you should measure the voltages on the various matrix lines and see if you are getting solenoid voltage on any of them and if you are then you must find where the matrix is getting that voltage from.
I dont think you have any bad switch caps as you are not getting any locked on switches and you can get a zero on the display in switch test.
It is possible you have a bad diode. Lots of this is mentioned above so I apologize for any redundancy.
Also if you have a known working solenoid driver you could swap that in for fun.
Good luck! You may need some!!

Thanks. I have checked all the diodes on switches that are misbehaving including the tilt and outhole and the diodes on the solenoids, plus I have made sure all the other diodes are in the correct orientation. The solenoid driver board is new from Alltek and all the solenoids work correctly. The idea that solenoid voltage is getting to the switch matrix is interesting, I need to check that. I have carefully chased all the wires from the MPU J2 and J3 to the switches, especially since the wire colors in my game do not all match the schematic. None of the wires going to the solenoids are contacting any switches but it is odd how the outlanes activate a pop bumper, but I thought that was caused by a pulse from the MPU getting a wrong signal and not the switch directly sending current to the solenoid, but I'll start looking for high voltage in the switch matrix.

I ain't giving up on this game, it actually is fun to play.
I appreciate the suggestions.

#15 5 days ago
Quoted from wawhite92025:

Thanks. I have checked all the diodes on switches that are misbehaving including the tilt and outhole and the diodes on the solenoids, plus I have made sure all the other diodes are in the correct orientation. The solenoid driver board is new from Alltek and all the solenoids work correctly. The idea that solenoid voltage is getting to the switch matrix is interesting, I need to check that. I have carefully chased all the wires from the MPU J2 and J3 to the switches, especially since the wire colors in my game do not all match the schematic. None of the wires going to the solenoids are contacting any switches but it is odd how the outlanes activate a pop bumper, but I thought that was caused by a pulse from the MPU getting a wrong signal and not the switch directly sending current to the solenoid, but I'll start looking for high voltage in the switch matrix.
I ain't giving up on this game, it actually is fun to play.
I appreciate the suggestions.

After thinking about it I take that back. I don't think solenoid voltage is hitting the switch Matrix otherwise it would cause some pretty serious issues I would think. But if your out lane switch is causing the pop bumper switch to believe it is closed then that would in turn activate the solenoid so I retract that theory.

#16 5 days ago
Quoted from wawhite92025:

Connectors photos linked.

Cheers, nothing stands out on a first look.

Quoted from wawhite92025:

I know that some of these colors do not match the schematic/matrix.

Use the playfield schematic I posted above, it has the correct wire colors listed.

Quoted from wawhite92025:

What I don't understand is how the MPU can show switch numbers 1, 3, 5 for three of the drop targets when there are no such switch numbers?

The switch test mode on these early Stern/Bally games is flawed, it only displays the lowest number closed switch. i.e. when you press that left outlane switch, because of your particular fault you're not seeing the game telling you that it's also seeing switches #40, #32, #24, #16 as well as #8 being closed. So when you press that left outlane switch all these other switches I just mentioned are being seen as closed aswell. This is a phantom effect with your fault and how switch matrix's work. This is the reason I asked if you could run the switch test mode and press the switches in reverse order of the switch ID numbers listed in the manual.

The switch matrix is made up of columns and rows. Referencing the matrix picture above, when the game wants to read the switches, it first raises strobe #4 line from zero to 5 volts. It then reads all the eight switch return lines at the same time. Any of the switches on those return lines that are closed with respect to strobe #4 will report 5 volts, open switches will report zero volts.
Strobe #4 is then released back to zero volts and then strobe #3 is raised from zero to 5 volts. Again all the eight return lines are read at the same time. Any of the switches on those return lines that are closed with respect to strobe #3 will report 5 volts, open switches will report zero volts.
Ditto strobe #2, #1 and then #0.
The diodes on all switches is what separates the return line signals from the strobe lines to prevent phantom reads.

Now in your scenario, all the wrong switch readings you're getting are coming from the strobe #3 line (white-yellow wire).
The errors you're getting suggest the strobe #3 is shorted to something. The moment you close a switch on strobe #3 the switch return line is getting stuck such that it's reported as closed on every strobe line read.
But this doesn't explain why two switches on that strobe #3 line are apparently ok (drop targets B and D). Can you confirm this?

BTW, when you're pressing switches with your hand, make sure no other part of you body is touching ground.

Can you comment on the below:

left drops b.jpg

#17 5 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

Cheers, nothing stands out on a first look.

Use the playfield schematic I posted above, it has the correct wire colors listed.

The switch test mode on these early Stern/Bally games is flawed, it only displays the lowest number closed switch. i.e. when you press that left outlane switch, because of your particular fault you're not seeing the game telling you that it's also seeing switches #40, #32, #24, #16 as well as #8 being closed. So when you press that left outlane switch all these other switches I just mentioned are being seen as closed aswell. This is a phantom effect with your fault and how switch matrix's work. This is the reason I asked if you could run the switch test mode and press the switches in reverse order of the switch ID numbers listed in the manual.
The switch matrix is made up of columns and rows. Referencing the matrix picture above, when the game wants to read the switches, it first raises strobe #4 line from zero to 5 volts. It then reads all the eight switch return lines at the same time. Any of the switches on those return lines that are closed with respect to strobe #4 will report 5 volts, open switches will report zero volts.
Strobe #4 is then released back to zero volts and then strobe #3 is raised from zero to 5 volts. Again all the eight return lines are read at the same time. Any of the switches on those return lines that are closed with respect to strobe #3 will report 5 volts, open switches will report zero volts.
Ditto strobe #2, #1 and then #0.
The diodes on all switches is what separates the return line signals from the strobe lines to prevent phantom reads.
Now in your scenario, all the wrong switch readings you're getting are coming from the strobe #3 line (white-yellow wire).
The errors you're getting suggest the strobe #3 is shorted to something. The moment you close a switch on strobe #3 the switch return line is getting stuck such that it's reported as closed on every strobe line read.
But this doesn't explain why two switches on that strobe #3 line are apparently ok (drop targets B and D). Can you confirm this?
BTW, when you're pressing switches with your hand, make sure no other part of you body is touching ground.
Can you comment on the below:
[quoted image]

Quench and atariaction:
You experienced SS fixers were 100% correct. The AH HA moment was sending me back the photo of the wiring by the upper left drop targets. Sometime (about a month ago) when I was trying to determine if the drop solenoids were an issue with causing an error on the Q14 driver I found a white-yellow wire not attached to anything and mistakenly attached it to the common yellow that goes to the solenoids. Very dumb. So all the problems were due to solenoid voltage going into the switch matrix from the upper inside drop solenoid. The game now works perfectly!!! The white-yellow is now attached to the outside drop switch. The wire is at least 5 inches longer than it needs to be so that was part of the confusion. BTW, the solenoid connection tabs on the inside drop are way too close to the metal frame/cage of the outside drop so I put in a piece of insulation rubber to make sure the tabs and wiring could not touch the metal.

Thank you very much for the accurate matrix diagram. I have been using the one that is in the Stern manual and on Pinwiki and it is clearly not correct for my game. Where did you find a correct matrix or did you create it yourself? I have made a copy and will attach to the inside of the cabinet.
Thank you all so much for sticking with this issue. I hope this can be a learning experience for anyone else working on early SS games. Also a big thanks to Dave of Alltek for making great boards that have voltage protection so this dumb error of mine did not destroy anything. Also I have installed the PinScore LED displays and no longer need the high voltage circuit, so if you are considering an upgrade from your original displays the PinScore are very nice.
Pinside has become a great resource for the pinball community.
Sincerely appreciate your help and patience.
Now I can get on to cleaning the playfield and putting the shine back on that big pinball rolling down Michigan Avenue.
Happy and safe Thanksgiving to you all. I am very thankful for all the good folks I have met in the pinball hobby.
wawhite92025

#18 5 days ago
Quoted from wawhite92025:

Quench and atariaction:
You experienced SS fixers were 100% correct. The AH HA moment was sending me back the photo of the wiring by the upper left drop targets. Sometime (about a month ago) when I was trying to determine if the drop solenoids were an issue with causing an error on the Q14 driver I found a white-yellow wire not attached to anything and mistakenly attached it to the common yellow that goes to the solenoids. Very dumb. So all the problems were due to solenoid voltage going into the switch matrix from the upper inside drop solenoid. The game now works perfectly!!! The white-yellow is now attached to the outside drop switch. The wire is at least 5 inches longer than it needs to be so that was part of the confusion. BTW, the solenoid connection tabs on the inside drop are way too close to the metal frame/cage of the outside drop so I put in a piece of insulation rubber to make sure the tabs and wiring could not touch the metal.
Thank you very much for the accurate matrix diagram. I have been using the one that is in the Stern manual and on Pinwiki and it is clearly not correct for my game. Where did you find a correct matrix or did you create it yourself? I have made a copy and will attach to the inside of the cabinet.
Thank you all so much for sticking with this issue. I hope this can be a learning experience for anyone else working on early SS games. Also a big thanks to Dave of Alltek for making great boards that have voltage protection so this dumb error of mine did not destroy anything. Also I have installed the PinScore LED displays and no longer need the high voltage circuit, so if you are considering an upgrade from your original displays the PinScore are very nice.
Pinside has become a great resource for the pinball community.
Sincerely appreciate your help and patience.
Now I can get on to cleaning the playfield and putting the shine back on that big pinball rolling down Michigan Avenue.
Happy and safe Thanksgiving to you all. I am very thankful for all the good folks I have met in the pinball hobby.
wawhite92025

Wow nice job!!! So glad you were able to find the issue...yourself haha I kid of course!!!! Super happy that you have that issue resolved! I was wishy washy on the solenoid voltage assuming that it could fry the CPU or Driver but glad that did not happen. Enjoy your pinball machine, as in your stern pinball machine, I mean stern electronic's pinball machine. Why did they have to call it pinball lol. So hard to google it

#19 4 days ago
Quoted from wawhite92025:

Where did you find a correct matrix or did you create it yourself?

Glad you got it going!

The switch matrix diagram in the online "Pinball" schematics is too blurry to use so I borrowed the playfield schematics from Sterns next game called Stingray. It actually runs the exact same software and is just a playfield re-arrangement. It was a cheap way for Stern to produce new games without having to write new code for each game - they did this with some other early games too.
I had to make some modifications to the switch names in that diagram as you might have noticed but the wire colors matched what you listed is in your game.

#20 4 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

Glad you got it going!
The switch matrix diagram in the online "Pinball" schematics is too blurry to use so I borrowed the playfield schematics from Sterns next game called Stingray. It actually runs the exact same software and is just a playfield re-arrangement. It was a cheap way for Stern to produce new games without having to write new code for each game - they did this with some other early games too.
I had to make some modifications to the switch names in that diagram as you might have noticed but the wire colors matched what you listed is in your game.

Ha, good old Stern, out with the old and in with the old, just move the playfield elements around....of course Gottlieb did that on dozens of EMs. Well, I am glad to have the correct Matrix now and some future owner in the 22nd Century will be glad I attached it to the inside of the cabinet. I even got out my big box of colored pencils to add color to the printed copy.
Thanks so much for your help. I hope some other soul may someday benefit from this lesson.
Happy Holidays

#21 4 days ago
Quoted from atariaction:

....... Why did they have to call it pinball lol. So hard to google it

So much fun searching for bits on flebay, too.

#22 4 days ago
Quoted from balzofsteel:

So much fun searching for bits on flebay, too.

Haha exactly!

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Eproms
Matt's Basement Arcade
$ 15.00
Playfield - Other
Arcade Upkeep
$ 98.00
Playfield - Other
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 6.50
Electronics
Yorktown Arcade Supply
$ 1,000.00
Playfields
Pinball Playfields
$ 115.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ModFather Pinball Mods

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