Well Roman that's all fine and dandy. Your glass might be the best on the market.....heck even if it was the ONLY anti reflective glass on the market....it's still not worth $300 (to many of us). I would start buying at half that....and I think many, many others would as well (far, far more than are willing to drop $300). I don't know what your profit margins are or how much more you would need to sell at $150 to make the same profit but I have a feeling you might be surprised at how much volume you could get at that price point.

I paid close to $300 for mine feel it was money well spent. But if it were available in the US for ~$150 a sheet, I'd put it on every game instead of just my two favorites.

I have it on every game, but I've a feeling that Joey makes >$100 per sheet (even though the packaging has to cost him a ton). If Roman shipped a batch here, I'm sure it would be $200 per sheet or less...but who's going to sell them without a profit margin. I don't think you're ever looking at less than $250 per sheet for stuff from Europe.

Anyone put the bent plastic between the head and base of the game so you do not have to mess with it when taking out the glass?

I understand that the pricepoint in the US is a very sensitive topic, but I´m not setting the prices for the US and
I´m not telling those who sell it at which price level they have to sell.
Maybe this will change with more competition.

Have you asked yourself why those who produce the glass in the US sell their glass at the same or nearly the same price level ?
They don`t have to import the glass. No customs, no additional fees and no currency exchange charges apply here.
So why is it so expensive ?
Please ask those who sell it.

I have the impression since more and more anti reflective glass sellers show up that a reasonable price/quality ratio needs to be found
and we are in the middle of this process.
I`d be really happy if those main questions from this thread could be answered on how Stern´s new glass performs in comparison to the
existing and to help those who´d like to know to make a decision.

I'm virtually positive it is US sourced.

Nearly every pinhead/collector person I have EVER had in my gameroom did not know they were there until I pointed at it..And even then a few didn't see it until I physically removed it and they were like 'oh sh#$!"

But that's not the point here. He said he is returning 14 sheets of expensive to make and ship glass because he doesn't like how it looks at the top of the playfield where he sees reflection from DMD/LCD/speaker lights that the glare guard will completely eliminate and the other products NEVER will.

That's where I put it for my TWDPrem... perfect little gap where it sits. Thought that was where it was supposed to go lol... doesn't affect the glass coming out or in at all.

The top plastic glass channel guide is tight... and they like to crack over time so I wouldn't want to try to wedge it there.

Is that where others put it?

Wonder why we're not offered it at $140 a sheet then? That would be closer to my "justifiable" benchmark.

Before I moved I pulled down the head and stuck them betwixed head & body. After the move I just stuck them over glass under channel...why? I don't know, don't remember Just a laziness thing I would assume.

Yeah you can't notice them. If you like to play in dim lighting (or the dark) you WILL forget you even put them in... except they do a perfect job eliminating the DMD reflection. Then you simply dim your backbox to a tasteful amount (remove a third of the LED's or cover Stern's garish bulb) and you're done.

I get it. On TWD there is a gap already in the front between the head and the body so I didn't even bother tilting the head to "permanently" install it. I wasn't even sure I would need/like it so I just set it in the gap to test it... now I can't imagine playing in the dark without it.

I can understand you finding yours down in the cab too... you do forget they are even there. Imagine if you sold it... the new owner would find it and think "what the hell is THIS thing"??

I sorta like the fact it is a low tech "thrown in for free with your next order" kinda thing that actually works 100%.

Yes

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/invisiglass-vs-pdi-glass-comparison/page/3#post-1264759

OK,I put the new Stern glass on my TAFG! it sits between my ST/PRE,and my B66LE,witch both have P.D.I.glass on them!No one yet has been able to tell the difference! SO,thats about it,fans! anymore comparisons are your eyes only!!!

Maybe you should?

Two questions:

Did the Stern glass come with any special handling or cleaning instructions?

Does the Stern glass have a watermark on it to identify it? If so, hopefully it is small and or hidden?

That's where I have always put mine on my pins--always thought that was how to install them!

Would you be able to take a picture of the two glasses over a playfield? It'll definitely help some of us have a better understanding of how good/bad it is. TAF might just have less glare than b66 and ST

Unfortunately, it's really hard to judge the difference with photos. You are spot on w TAF, however, as it's a much darker game than the other 2 mentioned.

Suspect it will come down to price vs. perceived value of the purchaser. Like most mods, some care less, while a " must have" for others. I believe eventually, someone will display the " science" difference between the 3, and there will still be personal preference. Choice is always good, and those of us that appreciate this mod will benefit, period ( hopefully with competitive pricing).

No instructions or documentation for cleaning and zero watermark or product branding anywhere on Stern HD.

All we need is one vendor to have a "sale"...

Yes, yes!!!

I guess my friends have better eyes than your friends do.

No kidding. The distributor needs to get control of his own product

The price combined with the wait is a no go

For the minuscule amount of difference, put a f ing microscope on it, I'd rather pay less and have it now with Stern glass

I will not buy invisiglass from JJP

Hey iceman I'll tell you what. I've been observing this glass for days now (comparison between Stern HD and Invisiglass). The only difference I can see is that with very bright overhead lighting the Invisiglass gives a slight greenish hue where the Stern HD presents with a slight purple hue reflection of the light. They seem like identical glass with different hues. They both perform well but for the price I'm going Stern HD all the way. I don't have PDI Glass here so I can't compare it to Stern HD. All I can say is that I'm happy with my purchase.

Yea in the end it's seeing is believing and what ever works best on our own machines. But that video Roman made comparing invisaglass and his glass completely convinced me to get his glass over Jacks when I decide to pull the trigger. Which sucks cause Jacks within driving distance from me lol.

It's all pretty damn good right? I should be getting my Stern sheets next week

Throw it on the pin and have fun!

That's where I'm at....for me the PDI is noticeably better, but just me.....hopping the Stern is somewhere in the mix, so Roman can get more people to try his stuff if completion brings all the price down. He will sell more PDI, period, if the price gap narrows.....business......

If he wants to sell more of his product, kind of a no brainer

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/invisiglass-vs-pdi-glass-comparison#post-221540

Maybe, but it´s not working that way.
The buyer regulates if a product is purchased or not. The reseller does the same with the supplier.
The question is: Who should start to pass on their margin while the customer is waiting with a knife
to cut the margin at some point ?
If you want a product then buy it, if not then leave it. The market will regulate itself and this takes time.
Today we don´t have time, don´t want to wait and we behave like little children if we don´t get it.
This is an intrapersonal conflict or simply a dilemma.

True enough. I'm not a buyer right now and I can wait for the inevitable. I just thought it might be a "win,win" for you and your customers if you took an active role in it.

I think the PDI is much nicer than Invisiglass, but I don't find glare to be that much of a problem in my game room. I have great controls on the all of the lighting in the room which really work well.

However, as other have sad, at $150-$199 including delivery, I am probably a buyer.

Who´s the winner and who feels like a loser ?

I just made a short overview with available data on pricing (not quality).
No sales tax, no packing and shipping charges or any other charges included.

AR Glass (resized).JPG

So Invisiglass is made in the US but costs half the price in Europe, nice.

When will a domestic glass company see what's happening and offer a $140 sheet of glass and basically take over 100% of this market?

Wow. What is the reasoning behind that? I would love to know

Talk about proving my point. Be a price leader in America and win this game! Sounds like most people want your product.....now all we need is the right incentive.

Why undercut your competition by a lot, when you can cut by a little and make more money.

Same reason for sterns pricing.

I'll spell out where I'm coming from. I'm a fairly average pinball hobbyists. I'll need like 4-6 sheets of this stuff......ever! Then I'm done. Sell a machine I keep the glass (unless they pay for it).

First company to hit my price point (which is probably THE price point in America..... $150) will get my sales (and everyone else waiting) and then many of us are done.

So it will be A LOT of sales in a short period of time (relatively speaking) a windfall.....and then the whole market will likely slow down after that. New games will be 90% of sales after the massive wave of "collection purchases".

Who wants to be FIRST to grab that wave?

Yeah I would feel like a SUCKER paying 300 bucks for this when they are paying $140 elsewhere (regardless of where the glass is made).

It's a non-essential purchase so I'd like to not feel like a dummy in the process.

If I take my crystal ball out of my trunk and I take a brief look then I can see that

- JJP will lower their price soon
- Stern will adapt if needed
- PDI ... it´s getting blurred... I can´t tell
- others might follow

As soon as every pinball manufacturer starts to sell anti reflective glass then it´s GAME OVER for after market sales

What you want are people's current collection sales......and you want/need to be first.

Not if the Pinball Mfrs price is $200+, but the aftermarket product is $150

I might add that if the manufacturer sell their glass with their games, people wont change it anymore.

Exactly. Jack is no fool. Why sell something for $150 when people will pay you double that. The only competition here at the time was Joey who was charging $295 a sheet. Jack matched Joey's single sheet price and undercut him by a little on the bulk discount. In Europe it was a different story. Since Roman's glass is so much cheaper over there, Jack had no choice but to price his product competitively.

All of this just goes to show how insane the markup is on this stuff! The fact that Jack can ship his glass over there, sell it for $144, and still make money proves this. Now that Stern has entered the fray, we will hopefully start to see some better prices over here. I don't think Joey or Jack will be selling much product if they don't drop their prices. That being said, I doubt we'll see $150 a sheet anytime soon. In order for that to happen, we would probably need a new player to enter the market. I'm surprised someone like Terry hasn't looked into it. He already has the infrastructure in place to package and ship the product. It's just a matter of sourcing it.