Good ol Stern’s “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” mentality.

Capcom had an amazing adjustment/audit menu. Scrolling with flippers and automatically going into the menu when the door opened is just smart.

My insight is this: redesigning the adjustments menu would help them sell zero more pinball machines, so why bother?

Works fine. I find it comforting it’s the exact same menu I’ve been using for 20 years. Super easy to use and intuitive and I don’t go into the adjustments / test menu looking to get wowed by style.

Except they keep changing the #s.
They need to standardize the standard ones and just add new adjustments to the end so they are uniform across machines and stop changing with updates.

Just a guess, but I bet it's because they are still creating their pinball rules on ancient code that is running under emulation on their current boards.

Wouldn't surprise me. Godzilla always seems to be two animations behind current game play. Probably a result of slow emulation processing time.

I think we’ve cracked the code!

It’s almost like a portal to the past.

I hated their original shitty 3 button portal system, but once stern went 4 like the big boys I was a happy camper!

I don't think there's a service menu that I've used that I've actually *liked*. They all kind of have their pain points.

However, I will say that pin2000's audit screens were kind of neat with all the graphs and charts shown over time, rather than just totals.

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It's a pretty darn good mentality to have in practice, most of the time. Making the menu more user-friendly ain't going to let you do anything you can't do with the old one, just make it a little quicker to use and prettier.

"Engineers. They just LOVE to change things." - 'Bones' McCoy

The JJP menu screen is great. Uses the full display well, shows graphics to help you troubleshoot, etc

I wouldn't take that bet, sounds like a really weird way to write software.

Spike 1 did not have LCD support, it still used DMDs, so they just ported the service menu stuff over to Spike. Still there for Spike 2 with the LCD because, as others have said, it is a low priority. It works, most people never see it or only ever see it when they setup their machine the first time.

Yes, the old SAM hardware had full video processing capability and had hardware capabilities similar to Spike, so Stern went to Spike just so they could emulate SAM systems as inefficiently as possible.

I think it’s important to note that stern HAS put some effort into this: they’ve created an awesome menu to help out “first time out of the box” users.

When you boot up the game for the first time or after a reset it loads up a pretty, user friendly menu screen which allows the game to put on free play without even opening the coin door.

Very useful for noobs.

Nobody threw them a parade for this, in fact I think this is the first time anybody has ever mentioned this on Pinside. Which shows why updating their “outdated menu” - which works fine and is easy to use - is kind of a waste of time and resources.

Yeah, the quick setup menu is pretty helpful for noobs and addresses everything a noob is going to care about initially.

I think I mentioned it positively once before in one of these threads where you go on and on about how the menu system doesn’t need to be changed.

It’s fine to say it technically functions. But there is room for improvement. Would it affect sales? No. Does that change the fact it can be better? No

I was talking to a noob yesterday who was convinced they found a bug because their Metallica kept giving out 500k as the first mystery award. He had no idea what competition mode meant, why would he? The menu has an accessibility issue and uses the screen real estate very poorly in general

Defending the existing menu is dumb

True.

But so is whining about it.

So here we are.

Crazy thing is THAT way better system was Gomez's doing - 20+ years ago.

Also, there's some indication a better, more modern system is coming that also communicates the node diagnostics better. When is anyone's guess.

At least they went with 4 buttons. Hated the 3 button portals with a passion.

I'd just like most used adjustments to float to the top of each section.

Whitestar. I still get pissed navigating my sopranos, and it’s been in my possession a long time.

I will add that the current system may be dated, it’s totally serviceable for it’s intended use.

I doubt they ported all the 6809 assembly code when they switched from SAM to Whitestar or Spike 1 (I can't remember which one switched to ARM cpus). I suspect when they switched to Spike 2, they are triggering outside code for the animations, but the main operating system is still running the original code under an emulated 6809.

Says a lot when we nit pick adjustment menus for Stern when most companies can’t even get out a manual, let alone a code complete game.

Obviously spending 3 dollars isn't in the budget. New CEO probably even 2 is too much. Yeah, I'm pessimistic and can't afford new games. Frustrated.

Seeing all the adjustments in a list like every other electronic device on the planet would be a good start. (That’s hyperbole before someone brings up an example of their remote controlled lawnmower that still runs on DOS and uses archaic menus).

JJP switch map is helpful.

But yeh, I can see it from Sterns POV - a million other projects fighting for resources, this goes in the “we know it should be done but it still works, let’s think about it later” basket. I’d definitely prefer they bump IC to the next level, and start on Bond code for example.

I’d also guess it would be pretty disruptive when you’ve got 3 or 4 teams already mid way working on game code.

Maybe I'm in the minority but I like their system. Easy to use and consistent. It's not a gameplay feature and functions as expected.

Yeah - my main dream here would be different setting profiles that could also be tied to different IC logins. I think that could be slapped on top of their current system for settings.

A rewrite of the adjustments/diag system is surely a large effort. I wonder how long they’re sticking with Spike 2 - it might only make sense to be included when they go to a new platform.

I think Whitestar was the last to use 6809, and that was like 17 years ago. After that I believe all Stern games have been coded in C/C++.

Don't see how in that length of time anything that was in 6809 assembly hasn't been ported over into C/C++ with the decision instead being made to waste processor resources in running an emulation of an obsolete platform that wouldn't even have considered things like the Spike node board communication protocol.

I can definitely see them re-using some bedrock C/C++ code, like the service menu stuff, and carrying it forward recompiling it for the newer platforms but running an emulation? I would be gobsmacked.

remember when serviceability and tools were part of the sales pitch of why to buy from one vendor vs another?

Yeah, now Stern just takes it for granted.

Hopefully the 10gig updates on Rush will finally force them to figure out how to do delta upgrades too.