Quoted from drfrightner:

What are they doing to Elvira. I like Halloween so I'd be interested in the title but I have to admit I'm getting tired of buying the same thing over and over again... waiting to be wowed by Stern is like waiting for Trump and Pelosi to get along. I hope Elvira is good.

People aren't buying that game now that they see pros have dropped as low as 4k used, and LE a buddy of mine bought one for $6800 who wants to take that kind of bath. If you really want one be patience and buy a used one. Someone mentioned Deadpool, I like the game personally but it has no tie in to the popular movie. For that reason along its not going to sell as good as a Ghostbusters. I'm not sure Stern is going to have another ACDC or METALLICA or Ghostbusters mover and shaker.

Wrong. I'm just offering some insight about Stern not going to some tradeshows, and pointing out their sales are down. How is that saying someones opinion suck... I've never ever said someones opinions sucked. I think its the other way around you are a person who doesn't like a person who thinks for themself, offers facts, or just has an opinion different from your own.
I think its time to face reality pinball is slowing down, could be way to many companies and to few buyers. I'm sorry if you don't get out of the house more, but I was just talking to a MAJOR arcade dist the other day. He told me venues do not like buying pinballs anymore because they're too hard to fix and don't make money. This could be why Stern has decided not to attend IAAPA this coming year. Maybe they'll start to focus more on the consumer market and give people what they want... Black Knight is a disaster game. They put almost nothing in the game but still want nearly 9k for an LE. That is a joke!
When buyers stop giving them 9k for next to nothing they'll start to put more effort into the games they make. That is my opinion and if you have a different one share it.

Quoted from Whysnow:

Don’t let up!!! Keep in mind that they were not doing shit for code updates until the “where is the code” online movement started.
It is pathetic how GB has sat this long. First the game has some critical physical flaws, then the ghosting pfs, and toss on the stagnant code.

Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:

I am on the fence on getting back into nib purchases. I had 4 games but sold them for various reasons over a years time.
Just so dang expensive or I am just too cheap now.

Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:

All reasons why I never bought it, but freakin love the theme. It was one of my favorite movies.

Quoted from JodyG:

Absolutely not. If anything, people should get louder. If you let them get away with it, your favorite new release could be the next one to get "forgotten" about.

Quoted from Whysnow:

Don’t let up!!! Keep in mind that they were not doing shit for code updates until the “where is the code” online movement started.
It is pathetic how GB has sat this long. First the game has some critical physical flaws, then the ghosting pfs, and toss on the stagnant code.

Quoted from drfrightner:

I have some interesting news... the biggest show for the amusement industry (IAAPA) doesn't show Stern as an exhibitor this coming November. JJP has a booth but no Chicago Gaming or Stern that I can see. I wonder if they have given up on trying to promote their products to amusement operators and let their dealers do the work instead.
I think Stern has a serious sales slow down... Beatles did not sell, Deadpool didn't sell, Munsters is a disaster and this Black Knight is a boat anchor.
I think you might see a new direction for Stern, where they pick their titles more carefully, produce fewer new tittes and hopefully put more into the titles they do produce.
If I was Stern I'd probably be thinking going back to a Music pin but that's just me. I'm sure Stern is going to be concerned with JJP doing Guns N Roses. The next title Stern releases needs to be a home run or the wheels might come off.
Personally I think Stern should restructure their pricing, if you're going to put next to nothing into a game like Black Knight the game should be cheaper! With JJP if you love what they do you can almost always buy sight on unseen, with Stern now its like you never know because it appears they sit around and just figure out ways to make the games cheaper... less toys, less effort, less everything.
I'm sorry Black Knight is a very uninspiring game I think its their worst ever. Beatles I think is fun but c'mon its a copy of another game. Deadpool wasn't based on the movie which was a bummer. Munsters was bigger than Adams Family ever was on TV, why not try to make that game better than Adams Family? Why didn't you go all out to try and create the next Adams Family pinball?
These designers at Stern just don't seem to have anymore imagination. They need to look for some new blood.

Quoted from drfrightner:

I have some interesting news... the biggest show for the amusement industry (IAAPA) doesn't show Stern as an exhibitor this coming November. JJP has a booth but no Chicago Gaming or Stern that I can see. I wonder if they have given up on trying to promote their products to amusement operators and let their dealers do the work instead.
I think Stern has a serious sales slow down... Beatles did not sell, Deadpool didn't sell, Munsters is a disaster and this Black Knight is a boat anchor.
I think you might see a new direction for Stern, where they pick their titles more carefully, produce fewer new tittes and hopefully put more into the titles they do produce.
If I was Stern I'd probably be thinking going back to a Music pin but that's just me. I'm sure Stern is going to be concerned with JJP doing Guns N Roses. The next title Stern releases needs to be a home run or the wheels might come off.
Personally I think Stern should restructure their pricing, if you're going to put next to nothing into a game like Black Knight the game should be cheaper! With JJP if you love what they do you can almost always buy sight on unseen, with Stern now its like you never know because it appears they sit around and just figure out ways to make the games cheaper... less toys, less effort, less everything.
I'm sorry Black Knight is a very uninspiring game I think its their worst ever. Beatles I think is fun but c'mon its a copy of another game. Deadpool wasn't based on the movie which was a bummer. Munsters was bigger than Adams Family ever was on TV, why not try to make that game better than Adams Family? Why didn't you go all out to try and create the next Adams Family pinball?
These designers at Stern just don't seem to have anymore imagination. They need to look for some new blood.

Quoted from PanzerFreak:

If Stern goes into Expo 19 with code for Ghostbusters not completed it will be beyond the embarrassment that this fiasco already is considering George Gomez at last years Expo said GB code is delayed... 29 months, that's nearly 2 1/2 years owners have been waiting. It was October of 2017 that Stern said in their first Stern of the Union address that a Ghostbusters code update would be coming after a Star Wars update...
Kaneda was right "Stern has passionate people but they are driven by money, not by passion". If Stern was driven by passion Ghostbusters code would have been properly completed months ago. I'm sure some people will disagree but this is the image Stern is portraying with the way they have chosen to handle code for Ghostbusters.

Quoted from drfrightner:

People aren't buying that game now that they see pros have dropped as low as 4k used, and LE a buddy of mine bought one for $6800

Quoted from Who-Dey:

I will buy all the 4K Munsters Pros and all of the 6800 dollar Munsters LE’s out there. Please point me in the right direction and im a buyer on every one of them.

Quoted from drfrightner:

Maybe Stern should SLOW DOWN and get the next game RIGHT... do something new, something original, add something special and give their fans their monies worth. Release a game with good code out of the box like JJP does.

Quoted from drfrightner:

How many do you want to own? I own a Munsters LE and I'm never selling mine, I've already invested heavy in mods and just added that sewer pipe yesterday. The reason I'm never selling is because I own all the cool Halloween themes, I have a pincade at my escape rooms, and at the exit of my haunted house I have a gift store. Inside that gift store we have Creature, Dracula, Walking Dead, Monster Bash, Freddy, Scared Stiff, Tales, etc. So Munsters which I don't think is very much fun will get moved out of my basement to that area. I don't need the money so I don't plan on selling it.
I bought the game sight unseen I was stoked about Munsters. With all that being said its almost like you think I'm lying. I have a friend who owns haunted houses in Denver he bought one in Denver for $6800.00 with less than 100 plays. A munsters was just sold here near St Louis a pro for 4k.
Why is this so hard for you to believe. I bought my Beatles Gold for $6800.00 are you going to say that is a lie as well? Yeah someone took a $1200 bath.
Munsters is a bomb as was Beatles and so will Black Knight. Deadpool didn't sell well probably because its not tied to the film... good game though.
Stern has missed sales numbers I'm sure 4 games in a row. They probably need to go back to music pins but who could be bigger than ACDC. I think Beatles proved fans of the Beatles don't love them enough to shell out 25k and pinball fans proved they don't' want to play pinball to Beatles songs.
Rock sells... or family friendly movies like Ghostbusters.
I think the biggest thing is Stern games all seem the same now and the only company trying to do something original with each game is JJP. When you look at the time it takes JJP to release a game well north of a year, while Stern has them coming out every three months.
Maybe Stern should SLOW DOWN and get the next game RIGHT... do something new, something original, add something special and give their fans their monies worth. Release a game with good code out of the box like JJP does.
I've learned the hard way I'll wait to play the game at a pincade first. I saw Black Knight LE played it and made the call to CANCEL my order. The game is not worth 9000 not by any stretch of the imagination.
Its a 4500 game tops!
They should have went all out because there was no real license involved, they should have made the second coming of MM, with castles, pop up monsters, something anything... c'mon Stern is slipping and the resell values are proving that.

Quoted from PW79:

I bought an unfinished Stern once.
Never again.
I got lucky they updated it. Not gonna press my luck again. No way I can be that lucky twice.

Quoted from Willy39:

why they abandoned one of their games that still is a top earner on route.

Quoted from Shapeshifter:

I wouldn't say losing $1200 on selling a Beatles is taking a bath.

Quoted from drfrightner:

Let me rephrase that... I bought a brand new in box for $6800.00. Yeah I'd call that taking a bath.

Quoted from drfrightner:

The point is they couldn't sell it so they dumped it. I know a place here in my town that has one on display and have had it since day one and can't get rid of it. They have it for sale for $8500 but still 8k 8500 whats the difference nobody wants the game for that price.
Don't get me wrong I think Beatles is super fun game, because it seems like its so easy but yet so hard. I like the game I just refused to pay the absurd $8k for the game.

Quoted from Whysnow:

Don’t let up!!! Keep in mind that they were not doing shit for code updates until the “where is the code” online movement started.
It is pathetic how GB has sat this long. First the game has some critical physical flaws, then the ghosting pfs, and toss on the stagnant code.

Quoted from drfrightner:

Let me rephrase that... I bought a brand new in box for $6800.00. Yeah I'd call that taking a bath. To be totally truthful it was brand new out of the box display that got put back into a box. LOL
The point is they couldn't sell it so they dumped it. I know a place here in my town that has one on display and have had it since day one and can't get rid of it. They have it for sale for $8500 but still 8k 8500 whats the difference nobody wants the game for that price.
Don't get me wrong I think Beatles is super fun game, because it seems like its so easy but yet so hard. I like the game I just refused to pay the absurd $8k for the game.
For those who don't know KAPOW I think gets $1000 for every game sold, which is why on Batman 66 and Beatles there is no PRO.
That company makes slot machines, and they give assets to Stern, and Stern pays them for every machine sold which obviously jacks up the price.

Quoted from drfrightner:

Why is this so hard for you to believe. I bought my Beatles Gold for $6800.00 are you going to say that is a lie as well? Yeah someone took a $1200 bath.
Munsters is a bomb as was Beatles and so will Black Knight. Deadpool didn't sell well probably because its not tied to the film... good game though.
Stern has missed sales numbers I'm sure 4 games in a row. They probably need to go back to music pins but who could be bigger than ACDC. I think Beatles proved fans of the Beatles don't love them enough to shell out 25k and pinball fans proved they don't' want to play pinball to Beatles songs.
Rock sells... or family friendly movies like Ghostbusters.

Quoted from PinMonk:

That's not even the lowest I've heard NIB Beatles Golds being dumped for. If Stern ever wants to make the remaining 900 and something golds to get to their stated 1964 unit run, the price will have to be in the $6000 area. But I really think they're going to just move on and try to forget about it.

Quoted from TreyBo69:

I wonder how much the playfield issues ate into their profits on the title. The money to fix the physical game for customers might have eaten up a lot of the money that they would have budgeted for long term software support.
Stern certainly isn't going into the red for a game that they no longer manufacture and might not ever run again. (Not worth the Trudeau association and the playfield layout is polarizing)

Quoted from Aussiepinwiz:

You are probably correct, or they may delay production of the remaining 900 for another year or two, but a price reduction will be unprecedented for Stern and unlikely.
The Australian distributor sold out a while ago and has been taking orders for the next production run.

Quoted from Whysnow:

Good points. I will say, I am much more concerned with the steady increase in Playfield issues over lacking code.
Is this the new acceptable quality on an 8k game?[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Quoted from PinMonk:

Seems to be. Iron Maiden we got has this to a lesser extent. I sent a pic to Chas and got a shrug. Beatles DOES seem to be worse, though. I've seen some worse than yours.
But it's not a Stern-only thing as jjPotC has similar clear (or maybe adhesion) issues.

Quoted from Whysnow:

This is BY FAR worse than anything I have seen from others!

Quoted from kermit24:

Isn’t Spooky having similar playfield issues with TNA? harryhoudini

Quoted from kermit24:

Isn’t Spooky having similar playfield issues with TNA? harryhoudini

Quoted from desertT1:

I was reading or heard it on a podcast that they figured out what the cause was and that they should be able to avoid it in the future.
It's interesting that 3 companies have similar issues within the span of several months. These playfields also come from at least 2 different suppliers. Bottom line is hopefully everyone figures it out and can avoid it down the line. Seeing as Iron Maiden had similar issues to the one shown above with Beatles, it seems the issue there is still a thing. Maybe everyone needs to turn down their powered drivers.

Quoted from kermit24:

Isn’t Spooky having similar playfield issues with TNA? harryhoudini

Quoted from Psw757:

Stern may have not hit the target number of machines sold on Beatles but only they know how many the Really needed to sell.
Despite the high license cost I’m going to guess this game had a much healthier margin than most.
Likely didn’t need to sell or make them all to not take a bath but if they did then it would be a cash cow.
Only they know the truth

Quoted from desertT1:

Black Knight 3 is a ton of fun. It might not be a deep game for the home buyers, but conveniently enough I have some locations and it would be great at my main location. I also love Iron Maiden, and would really like to have that be my next game, but it probably won't be. Oh well. This is not small time OP tough talk, just the reality. Stern makes games I want, but don't feel like supporting a company who has a hard time coming through on their self-stated promised update.

Quoted from Rondogg:

BK3 pro is not a good location game. Unless you play a lot then the average game time is going to be about 45 seconds with a ball saver that will work about 5% of the time for a good player, 0% for a bad player. I like watching the pros blow it up but even an incredible game lasts less than 5 minutes. No, this one was designed for tournament finals.

Quoted from DS_Nadine:

Guessing from Kaminkows Sports Car Collection and that he still/ again works with Stern hint that they are able to make good and lucrative licensing contracts.

Quoted from Whysnow:

do you have one on location?
Just curious if this is a WAG or real life experience on how BK3 does on route?

Quoted from Whysnow:

do you have one on location?
Just curious if this is a WAG or real life experience on how BK3 does on route?

Quoted from Whysnow:

Good points. I will say, I am much more concerned with the steady increase in Playfield issues over lacking code.
Is this the new acceptable quality on an 8k game?[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Quoted from twenty84:

A friend of mine has one on location and said it was his best earning game last month. Of course any new game will earn well, and time will tell if that holds up.

You've posted these details of a Beatles playfield in multiple threads now and talk about it frequently. I agree this isn't acceptable, but what is the story here? Whose game is this? Did they try to get a new playfield? Although Stern is no stranger to playfield issues, they are also very good about replacing them.

Quoted from kermit24:

That didn't come from Batman and Beatles sales. Pretty sure his day job paid for that!

Quoted from Whysnow:

do you have one on location?
Just curious if this is a WAG or real life experience on how BK3 does on route?

Quoted from LesManley:

BK3 here is not a great earner at the location I help out at maintaining games. Munsters is even worse. Both games were never #1 earners even when they were the newest games like usual...hell BK3 is still the newest game. Guardians of the Galaxy and Deadpool by far out earn both. The other games this location has are...
AC/DC (Pro) (Stern, 2012)
Beatles (Stern, 2018)
Black Knight: Sword of Rage (Pro) (Stern, 2019)
Deadpool (Pro) (Stern, 2018)
Ghostbusters (Pro) (Stern, 2016)
Guardians of the Galaxy (Pro) (Stern, 2017)
Iron Maiden: Legacy of the Beast (Pro) (Stern, 2018)
Kiss (Stern, 2015)
The Munsters (Pro) (Stern, 2019)
Star Wars (Pro) (Stern, 2017)

Quoted from Jimmyapple:

Ok- I understand the definition of insanity but here’s hoping there’s ANYTHING other than a rinse and repeat of GB code. For the love of God, please tell me something different. And go...