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As now stated in Stern's Star Wars manual Cloudy inserts, stress cracks and GHOSTING are often seen on NIB pins. I am curious if the pinside community agrees with this statement. Is the new "normal" going to be accepted by everyone? I vote NO, but others may have different opinions, which I am curious to know. What should be the new "NORMAL" when buying a NIB pin?
Quoted from Shapeshifter:They missed out a paragraph.
'Code may or may not be updated after the release of a game. It is normal for some games to be abandoned.'
Damn you Shapeshifter, I now have to clean pop off of my screen! 
Quoted from hank527:It's sad. It's much safer to buy used
It's funny Spooky games do not have this issue and they have not been at it long.
New sterns
Cabinets pulling apart
Slight adjustments needed
Ghosting
Chipping
Decals peeling
Decals not installed properly
SD cards not installed.
Mech issues
New Spooky game
Sometimes slight adjustments needed out of the box
Do not forget that code may be rewritten to accommodate hardware deficiencies.
Quoted from Who-Dey:JJP is having major problems right now as we speak with the DI playfields chipping. As far as spooky goes......they just don't have anything I'm interested in. JJP also won't send you a new playfield, just a piece of Mylar or a sticker to cover the chipped clear coat. JJP is no better than Stern so don't listen to the JJP "high quality" BS because it's not true.
RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT, gonna have to clarify things for the rest since that blanket statement is really narrowed down to 22 cases on the WOZ machines out of what? Thousands? Even then, most were past one year warranty (something Stern does not offer) and the few cases I know of were taken care of with play field replacement one of which I assisted with. Oh and the replacement was sent first, so no down time. As of now I know of no WOZ or TH issues that were not covered during warranty in the past couple years. I too am also interested in the so called DI issues you are touting and if the buyer is not being taken care of? I doubt they had to beg for warranty fixes or hope and pray they are "allowed" to have a play field replacement. I have FIVE customers as of now who were denied replacements from Stern, and that is just in Ohio. I have NOT heard of play field replacement denials from recent purchases from JJP. Perhaps you can point me to their threads so that I may help them out with JJP and getting their play fields swapped if inside their warranty. No charge I will help any pinsider out on their recent purchase granted it is inside of 75 miles from me or I can defer them to another JJP tech.
Quoted from Who-Dey:Not gonna argue but JJP has playfield issues as well and right now they are sending mylar out to people with chipped playfields from what I'm hearing over in the JJP thread. I also hear that on WOZ they send out stickers to cover bad areas. In my opinion they are no better, maybe your opinion is different and that's fine. You can say what you want about Stern also but they have taken care of most of their customers from what I see....just not in a timely manner.
Now with this new policy. ....we will see. It's my guess that it's for people who have one insert with a sliver of ghosting that want a new playfield. I would hope that anyone with multiple ghosting will get a playfield replacement....we shall see. I'm not ready to throw stern under the bus when they are actually taking care of people's issues. When they stop doing that I will be done with them and I'll bash the hell out of them right along beside you. Until then I'm not going to sorry.
At no point in my thread here did I "bash" Stern. I simply said they have denied 5 of my customers. FACT and furthermore I am still waiting on 6 more cases to either be denied or approved all ranging from 3 months to 6 months. If you take that as a bash then everyone understands how you feel about Stern, good for you and good luck with your next NIB purchase, hope it turns out well for ya.
Please refer any insider with a DI who received a "STICKER" to cover play field damage to me. Or the thread that a insider said they received a sticker for DI play field damage. Or the thread that has as you stated DI play fields having major issues. I have not seen a single one, not to say there art any, just not in my neck of the woods.
Quoted from MapleSyrup:I think what Stern is trying to say with this clause is, "if your playfield is fu@%ed, we're going to take care of you, but can we please stop the nitpicky minutia of searching for imperfections, and demanding museum quality production??!". It's simply not attainable.
That's me reading between the lines. I think they've been inundated with super minor complaints, and simply CAN NOT afford to replace populated playfields over hairline insert ghosting that has zero effect on the machine. They need to bring expectations back down to reality somehow. This is a shot across the bow. Again... it's just a guess.
I'm getting an Aerosmith and and AC/DC VE. You can take me at my word that if either of these machines have ghosting inserts, I will document the cosmetic issue, and alert Stern and my Distro.
I will say something like, "I've noticed a few cosmetic imperfections. As long as they don't progress, or cause premature failure in the clear, I have no issue. Looking forward to enjoying these amazing games!". Beyond that... I will not care. I won't give it another thought as I play the crap out of my incredible new pins.
Pinball production is a massively complicated venture. The machines are incredibly complex in their construction. Production must be a crazy unicycle juggling act, taking place on a tightrope.
I think this is Stern asking people to be reasonable.
People will make the same arguments... "For what they're charging, we DEMAND perfection", "They're charging a Premium price, I demand a Premium Product!", "Theyre selling us "LE" models for stupid price increases, They created this problem!!"
At the end of the day, you're buying a super complicated mechanical amusement device. No matter how much you pay, or how limited the edition, or what steps are taken during production, and distribution... you can't change the fact that you're buying a PINBALL MACHINE. The nature of the product didn't change just because people got more demanding.
Rage on folks, but I'm going to go enjoy my pinball machines both old and new, and the MOMENT Stern announces another pinball machine that I want to own... I'll be buying it. Along with thousands of other people, who's expectations of a pinball machine are "Enjoyment" or "Revenue" or some combination of both.
Happy Flipping everybody
If Stern told you that you will be getting a NIB pin with ghosting inserts with cloudy stress cracks. You would tell them NO WAY. If you said you would be ok with that then I don't think there is a single pinsider here who would believe you. This making your entire post kinda hypocritical in a way, yes? In any case good luck with your purchase, just make sure you divulge in your future for sale threads down the road that your pin has ghosting so some of us do not waste the time driving out to inspect it.
Quoted from MapleSyrup:I think they've been inundated with super minor complaints, and simply CAN NOT afford to replace populated playfields over hairline insert ghosting that has zero effect on the machine. They need to bring expectations back down to reality somehow.
Quoted from MapleSyrup:I'm getting an Aerosmith and and AC/DC VE. You can take me at my word that if either of these machines have ghosting inserts, I will document the cosmetic issue, and alert Stern and my Distro.
Quoted from MapleSyrup:you can't change the fact that you're buying a PINBALL MACHINE. The nature of the product didn't change just because people got more demanding.
Quoted from MapleSyrup:I think you misunderstand the word hypocritical.
Nope. I am pretty sure I got it right. According to you Stern is "inundated with super minor complaints" VS "You can take me at my word that if either of these machines have ghosting inserts, I will document the cosmetic issue, and alert Stern and my Distro" So arn't you adding to the super minor complaint department? The fact of the matter is we are buying a PINBALL MACHINE that in recent past did not have ghosting inserts and now do. So, YES the nature of the product HAS INDEED CHANGED. People are not more demanding, they simply want what they paid for.
Quoted from iceman44:None of this affects my enjoyment of my pins either BUT its the SLIM SHADY way that Stern always seems to handle issues. Slipping in a cya disclaimer is piss poor imo.
The communication on all fronts from them is pure CRAP and always has been. Tell the freaking truth how about that. This is a very SMALL community and hobby and you can't keep operating like that.
Absolutely ZERO info on code updates until they drop is pathetic and frustrating, how about just some honest status reports on pin coding for crying out loud? Not that hard and would go a long ways to satisfying us customers.
On a positive note, I'm gonna go play my ASLE and drink some beer!
On a serious note Ice, If 5 years from now or ten years from now you still own that same pin that had ghosting and it started chipping and affecting game play, wouldn't you be pissed? I mean sure it doesn't affect game play now and maybe not for another 5-10 years but when the guy next to you has the same machine with zero ghosting......you can't honestly tell me you wouldn't be the least bit bitter? I mean if not, hell your a better man than me, but that water won't pass under my bridge.
I think this is one of their first steps in a LOOOOOOOOOOOONG line of disclaimer/clause inserts. The next being something about CODE and how it may or may not be completed, but this is "OFTEN" the case for pinball machines and is normal. 
Quoted from swampfire:The ghosting is more likely due to improper preparation of the playfield than bad clearcoat. Just to add some balance to this thread, over half of the B/W pins I've owned have had issues with inserts cracking, ghosting, separating and even raising. Yes, those games are 10+ years old, so it's to be expected.
Let's quantify the real cost of the problem. If you have a few ghosted inserts, how much does that really knock off the price in the HUO market? I think a reasonable compromise would be for Stern to offer a $200 credit toward Stern Accessories (e.g. upgraded rails), and for home collectors to accept that.
More light, less heat. Treat Stern with respect and they'll respond in kind. Stern is made up of people, just like us.
You could offer me $1000 in credit and I would not take it. People who buy NIB want NIB as advertised. Respect has NOTHING to do with buying an as advertised product. Tree hugging nice guy mentality will get you nowhere in this life. RESPECT IS EARNED. Not given away at MSRP only to find out you received something not as advertised. Take that with a pound of salt dude. I am a bit jaded anyway, the majority of the places I go to, the indigenous population wants to kill me, what do I know.
Quoted from mnpinball:My GB premium was replaced end of April, sadly my populated replacement is ghosting again at the same 2 inserts. Under 3 months. Not happy.
Damn! Did you put in a request for a replacement replacement before the new disclaimer/clause came out?
Quoted from Who-Dey:In my "unprofessional" opinion, the reason that is happening is because of how hard that the ball slams into the shooter lane. The first thing I did when I seen how hard the ball was ejecting from the ball trough to the shooter lane was turn the trough eject power down to the minimum setting. This should have been done in the code before any GB games ever reached the customers. It won't fix your damage that's already been done obviously but if I were you I would turn the trough eject power all the way down and put some Mylar over the damage in the shooter lane. Maybe it will stop it from getting any worse.
In my "professional" opinion that damage has nothing to do with shooter eject power and EVERYTHING to do with clear coat and or wood, maybe a combination of both. I service plenty of sterns and none that do not have the ghosting issues do not have this kind of damage and these are route pins. Damage early on like this will always get worse and NEVER improve. MNPINBALL, I would file another complaint to get ANOTHER play field and let Stern know the replacement was worse than the original. If they defer you to their new policy then ask distributor to step in. Going forward with this kind of product the distributors are going to have to speak up which will only happen when they receive charge backs for returned pins, hopefully it does not come to that. I hope you get ANOTHER replacement MNPINBALL.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:"Ghosting" Isn't an issue for me. It doesn't affect play, it is BARELY noticeable unless someone points it out, and in fact, it looks cool, like old school marbled plastic. The only real problem with "ghosting" is that it potentially hurts the resale value of the machine.
Stern is reaping the rewards of the expanding home market, but they've created a huge problem for themselves by turning commercial pinball machines into a home consumer product. Some of these potential buyers will have drastically differnt expectations for what a machine's cosmetics should look like than their traditional buyer.
The statement is surely a CYA for Stern at this point. It's also an attempt to readjust the expectations of a smaller - but growing - portion of their market.
I'm not sure how it will play out. In the end I doubt this clause in their manual costs them too many sales. Home Pinball buyers are an enthusiastic and habitual segment of their market.
I suppose they've done a cost/benefit analysis and have decided it will cost them less to place this clause in their manual in possible lost sales than it will cost them to replace any playfield that a consumer says is defective. This is a normal part of running any successful business. People shouldn't take it personally.
Just from this 2 day old topic alone I count around 130k loss in sales, factor in GB threads, Hey Stern are you serious threads and many others and most pinsiders will disagree with you as is evident in the poll. Please don't take it personally when some pinsiders will refuse to buy a pin from you because you think ghosting is cool on a game and don't know if you might sell them a super ghosty pin.
Quoted from Who-Dey:Hey I'm just trying to help the guy so get pissed all you want to I don't care. Of course the clear coat sucks on his game, we all know that or he wouldn't have ghosting, but you can't tell me that the ball ejecting out of the eject trough as hard as it does on GB isn't busting up that shitty ass clear coat on his game. I own a GB and YOU don't so maybe I do know what I'm talking about. I mean look at where it's chipping, right where the ball ejects, any idiot can see that.
Yes he should ask for a new playfield, we all know that and I think that he already has. For the time being though just in case they decide to screw him out of one he should do EXACTLY what I told him to do, then like the other person said he should put some cliffy's on there. The second that I booted my game up I knew that eject power IS a problem and that I had to do something. Thankfully there is a trough eject power in the adjustment settings and you can turn it all the way down and it ejects nice and soft into the shooter lane. I realize that you know everything and that you are a pro at all things pinball but maybe you could learn something by listening to other people once in awhile, especially from someone who owns the game. Jesus dude you are amazing I tell ya!
Not pissed at all, it seems you are so, relax man. You offered an "unprofessional" opinion and I offered a professional opinion as I deal with pinball on a day to day basis. Sir, YOU, don't work on multiple GB's and I DO. So for MNPINBALL to do EXACTLY as you say in your "unprofessional" opinion is funny as it is sort of an oxymoron. "HEY, in my "unprofessional" opinion do EXACTLY what I tell you" That is hilarious man, thanks. 
Quoted from Who-Dey:Well I don't know who the guy is sorry, and i was offering him some advice that I thought may be of use to him. If it isn't that is fine and I'm ok with that as I am sure that he is as well. I doubt if he takes offense to someone trying to help him. I will listen to anyone's advice I don't care who they are, doesn't mean that I got to take it. I appreciate anyone trying to help me and I'm certainly not going to be a dick and down vote them for trying to help me.
Oh camon man, there is no need for name calling, be professional in a sense on here. Look I apologize I offended you, water under the bridge and so on. A lot of us on here know MNPINBALL knows his stuff owning 90 pins. So your advice almost sounded to us like you were chiding him sort of like a grown man talking to another grown man like he was a child or something. No worries you dint know.
Quoted from PinballAlley:Hi All,
Anyone who has cancelled orders over this is truly over reacting. It may confirm what I have been preaching for a long time. Make sure you purchase from a reputable dealer. We stand behind what we sell regardless of manufacturer. I also know that there are many dealers who feel the same way. So ask your dealer "What if?". The ultimate correct answer is that you should breathe easy. That we will stand behind what we sell. That our warranty covers A,B, and C. To say potential issues are limited to one manufacturer would be folly. We have seen issues with everyone. It is funny, yesterday we took in a Williams Miss-O to restore, we always go through everything before we begin, it hit me how much more complex the new pinballs are. I know that seems a bit cliché but it really is light years apart. I have over forty years in this industry. It is funny how people look at past eras of pinball as so much better. I can tell you that the 80's and 90's were nightmares as far as manufacturer quality. In those days pinball's major customers were route operators. Most of whom had technicians that would have to deal with quality issues beyond the pale. We would get several "patches" sent to us before the "hot" new pinball worked like it should. It amazes me that we have these wildly sophisticated and wonderful machines and for the most part they come to us right. The issues that have been discussed here have never been widespread.
So after a long trip around the barn, buy from a reputable dealer and you will be just fine!
-J
Sooooooooo I am gonna just ask. Since you say that you will stand behind the product you sell, if I were to purchase a pin from you and a get some ghosting inserts (inside a year per your warranty) and Stern refuses to replace the play field are you going to replace it for us at your expense? If so, I will be asking this of every Distributor I go through or my customers go through. Good on you PinballAlley, you might be setting the standard in the pinball industry with your high standards.
Quoted from iceman44:Last time i checked we live in a country that is based on capitalism, for the most part, thank god.
I don't get what the big deal is.
If Stern keeps raising price and lowering quality then the market for their pins will speak, i.e Star Wars
Then they have to decide how to react. Raise the overall quality, code etc. for the price or keep losing sales and customers.
There is no point in demonizing a successful and profitable company. Don't we all strive for that? That could all turn on a dime as well.
At the end of the day, the beauty of capitalism is we, the consumer has a choice. Nobody has a gun to our heads. If they can make a fortune, good for them.
WHOA WHOA WHOA, Lets not get too political here Ice. Next you will be telling us that, if we don't buy government health care we will be fined...... 
Quoted from iceman44:Well I'm assuming the Stern letter yesterday was partly the result of people dropping out after seeing SW and then they have ghosting issues again?
People are worried they are drinking Jim Jones Kool aid.
I think Stern will react and get it right. We will see
A well informed and well known member from pinside let me know that the letter was largely due in part because of this thread. PINSIDE your voice was heard, if it effects things going forward only time will tell.
Quoted from PW79:The letter wasn't shit.
There was no retraction, no reference to covering ghosting, no... well... nothing.
The letter said their warranty which does not cover the PF issues was still unaffected.
I agree 100% I think it was to pacify the distributors concerns IMHO
Quoted from BC_Gambit:Do you have a link to this letter? I have had trouble keeping up with everything going on, but it seems like several people including myself missed that!
Thank you in advance for any help...
See JJ's post. He has offered to verify it on this thread.
Quoted from Gexchange:I will Confirm the letter is not a fake. I received it from Stern direct. It's the real deal.
If you got any questions feel free to email me at [email protected] and I will forward you the message as it came to me.
JJ
Quoted from Betelgeuse:I had not heard this before and I'm wondering if anyone has a ghosting playfield with this type of sticker. I know my old Metallica had this sticker, but I'm pretty sure the playfield was a Mirco. My TWD Premium has this 'Dinner Time' sticker too. Is this evidence it's made by Churchill? Is Churchill even still making playfields for Stern?
A few of my customers have this stickers on their pins and still have ghosting.
Quoted from skywalker:Any pics to prove this statement please.
LMFAO! Just as soon as the replacement box comes in, I will take a video starting from the sticker to the ghosting just so you can't say they are different pics to different games.
Quoted from skywalker:Any pics to prove this statement please.
Churchill play field
Ghosting inserts and cracking clear in the shooter lane and out hole. This game also sat inside my house for two weeks before being played and a play field protector was installed, untouched by pinballs. the cracked clear happened in less than 200 plays. I went on deployment and after a year of the game not being played I inspected my KISS LE to find more than a few inserts ghosting just from sitting untouched. Sorry for the poor quality of video I also forgot to show the drum insert and super ramps insert ghosting which is under a ramp. Imagine 5 years from now what the game will look like. I hope Stern can figure this issue out because I like their machines, I am just not going to buy something IMHO that should not do what they are claiming now to be normal.
Quoted from skywalker:Ok & thanks,
was hoping & fingers X'd the CH PF were rock solid, Well looks like something has changed in the PF process around KISS
any issues with TWD or Mustang?
I have a TWD pro with 5k++ plays & still looks new,
to see a CH PF like in the Vid is a real kick in the guts, Hopefully they can sort this issues out.
All my TWD's and customers have ZERO play field issues, I only have one customer with a mustang BOSS edition I think it is and it looks like glass, no dimples. He doesn't play it that much so it's not like it has been smoothed out over time. I think he bought it NIB.
Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:Stern could really be hurting soon, people talk, shit spreads like wild fire. My guess is they are hoping this just blows over and they change methods. I really want to see an AC/DC premium next month at my distributor. I will look over the floor model like a freak.
The problem is not initial inspection, issues seem to be happening anywhere from a week to a year. No one wants a pinball that will have multiple ghosting inserts in a years time. I am glad Stern is taking care of my issue now but in less than a years time when ghosting inserts start appearing and people want replacements that are ranging in the hundreds I doubt that most will get replacements. Then again maybe they will. All in all, I would rather not have to deal with the head ache of doing the replacement in the first place as I am sure OP's do not want empty shells sitting on location.
Quoted from iceman44:B/W games absolutely BLOW from a SOUND and LIGHTING perspective compared to the pins today.
So, while i love mine, i don't play them nearly as much because of the above.
So you guys can take those tanks and shove it. Nobody cares.
I don't give a F what the inserts look like (CV, Totan, etc.) I want NEW stuff. Knock yourselves out.
Quoted from bigd1979:Really ? My b/w sound just as good and the lighting in most cases (with leds) is just as good if not better than some of my sterns or prior sterns? Some of the new spike games are stupid bright and very very annoying/destacting imo.
Quoted from chuckwurt:After I had the game for about 2 weeks:
At least 5k plays later:
I can only tell that the lannister one has gotten a bit worse. I hope this helps. Take pics now and let distro know if it gets worse.
Chuck are you getting a replacement?
Quoted from PW79:Power supply is super loud.
clear over a small debris/particle.
PF looks "ribbed".
some weird splitting or separating between the plus of the cabinet plywood.
Hmmmmmm 
CaptainNeo what causes ribbed play fields again?
Particles cleared on wood should be ok. Particles cleared on inserts will cause ghosting. Most ghosting see you see starts at the edge of inserts as you can see from my friends case it has started at the debris. The 1,3,5 and lock have particles under clear on inserts. Next pin manual will most likely include debris under clear ALWAYS happens and is normally often seen......lol
Quoted from scott_freeman:It is very likely that Churchill mastered the art of tweaking the insert opening so that the inserts would not move.
It is common practice a supplier to have a 'tooling-drawing', that is not shared back with the customer. churchill was making playfields for ages, and they honed in on their practices and processes. These are their 'trade-secrets'.
Also, Churhill had learned how to properly 'aged' plywood so moisture-loss would be less of an impact on the insert fit over time. You can find photos of their facility with stacks of crates holding plywood, and you might find the video where they mention aging.
The timing of 'Ghosting' issues coincides with the change to Stern's new playfield supplier.
The new supplier just
Not true at all, the last part anyway. I have 5 play fields less than a year old, 1 being mine that are churchill and ghosting one was just replaced
Just installed my replacement KISS LE play field and the quality is noticeably different, not for better. I am hoping not to catch anymore ghosting as well. Now if I can just get Stern to replace the Game of thrones drop target they put on the kiss machine for the correct one, that would be swell
Kiss of Thrones anyone?
Quoted from Doctor6:My star trek from earlier this year is already ghosting in a few few spots. It's frustrating for sure.
pictures? Man that sucks.
Quoted from colonel_caverne:Did you receive a LE playfield?
Yes my LE Play field was replaced
Quoted from colonel_caverne:It was a LE playfield with sign and not a premium?
Correct?
LE #151 SIGNED
Quoted from CaptainNeo:a lot has to do where you live and where you keep your games. Someone that leaves the game sit in the garage is going to ghost faster. Higher humidity areas, more ghosting. The more expanding and contracting the wood goes through, the faster it happens. We all live in different regions. Games move around totally different climate conditions. Really hard to judge which climates are speeding this process up.
Your logic would be sound 2-3 years ago and in the form of maybe a couple of dozen or so with route games and fewer with HUO games. As it stands now your formula would not affect so many games without an additional variable such as cheaper wood, cheaper clear coat, less cure time and horrible QC. There is a reason why Stern has put out a NEW policy/disclaimer or whatever you want to call it addition to their new manuals now. No need to muddy waters here with excuses for ghosting I seriously doubt there are more than a few people here that keep their NIB HUO machines in high humidity garages as you stated.
Quoted from GorillaBiscuits:Yup pretty simple. They send you an empty box. You disconnect a couple cables from the backbox, remove the playfield... stick in the box and drop off at UPS. Looks like you cover the cost of shipping it back to them and they cover the cost of shipping the new one to you.
In my case I reached out to my distributer and they handled all the back and forth. Best of luck!
I would check the box for a return mailer. I had a return mailer for my KISS LE. My take is this. If you were told up front that your NIB would only have one ghosting sliver, there is no way the majority of people would purchase it. I only want what is advertised as that is what I paid for.
Quoted from Chambahz:There's nothing to prove that Stern cares less about customers. They included a clause in their warranty about ghosting playfields but the warranty already stated that play fields weren't covered at all. In my opinion, it's something their lawyer suggested, so that the next time a customer decides to be an asshole, Stern can simply tell them where to go.
GuerillaBiscuit just had a StarWars playfield replaced, because he had ghosted inserts, so they definitely have not simply decided to turn their backs on the customer.
To summarize this thread so far, 1 customer had a crappy shooter lane on his Metallica that maybe should have been replaced. The operator in Vegas appears to have numerous ghosted inserts on various machines. And there's a TWD on route, somewhere with a playfield that's sketchy. Maybe a problem, maybe not. Seems undetermined.
There are other problems that Pinsiders have reported, make no mistake. But when a thread like this is created and there are so few confirmations of current existing unresolved issues, I'm feeling pretty safe with my pin-dollars being spent at Stern.
You're welcome to your own opinion of course.
Flawed analysis as the majority of pinball owners are NOT on pinside let alone voicing their issues. This thread is HARDLY a summary of issues and was only created to bring awareness to Sterns new manuals. No need for smoke and mirrors, read first post to get back on topic.
Quoted from Chambahz:So then your argument is that many pinball machines produced by Stern are flawed, but not owned by Pinsiders, and THAT'S your argument?
Give me a break.
Again, you are entitled to whatever opinion you want. Buy or don't buy. But if you're going to make statements that Stern warrants bashing, MAYBE you could provide some evidence?
I read about your KISS playfield being replaced, and it's unfortunate that your drop target has the wrong stickers on them.
It's not what I would consider bash-worthy.
Nor is the dusty playfield comment that you complained about.
For what it's worth, GuerillaBiscuit received a replacement StarWars playfield from Stern, replacing the one he had with ghosting inserts. That speaks volumes to me and provides an indication of where they stand on customer service, despite the added paragraph. Lastly, the playfield was never warrantied in the first place.
So what we need to find is an owner (or owners) who have ghosted inserts, that Stern won't replace.
Then determine what their replacement threshold is. THEN determine if that's acceptable or not.
Until then, you're just stirring the drama pot.
Soooooooo, me stating what I received from Stern is bashing? Me putting out awareness of Sterns new clause in manuals is Bashing? GOT IT! You are in the Stern Army, good for you. I in no way am bashing Stern, the fact that you think so because of my fact reporting lets everyone here know Stern can do no wrong! AGAIN READ TOP POST. Also read the rest of the thread for evidence instead of accusing me of bashing, heck I even did a video along with pics. I am not going to list the pics of my customers pins that were rejected for swaps because I am sure you will make excuses or say its not to bad and so on and so on and so on. Seriously though are pinsiders going to have to make an example out of you again? Last time you lost a bet and had to make a pinside donation. This time I am going to make you donate $100 to the Hurricane relief. PUT UP OR DRAIN THIS THREAD. $100 hurricane Harvey relief donation. What say you?
Quoted from TigerLaw:Hey gang:
Please tone down the personal attacks and rhetoric against each other. You can disagree with each other without name calling.
This is a tough subject addressed in this thread with strong feelings on all sides. Let's stay respectfully and civil.
I make this post in lieu of any moderations for broken record or personal attacks. I or another mod will issue moderations if we must return to this thread. Thank you.
Thanks! It will be nice to get back on topic without the annoying personal attacks.
Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:Just found a ghosting insert on my new in box ST pro. Produced in May 2016. 165 plays, three weeks since purchase
Where there is one there will be more. My Kiss LE was untouched for the better part of a year and upon my return from deployment I had four ghosting inserts, add the chipping shooter lane and chipping out hole, then it becomes a problem for most everyone. So you can either don't worry about it now, or worry about it down the road when more appear. You can take the "advice" of people here on what you should do, but at the end of the day you are the one who owns it. That said, if it were my game I would start a dialogue with your distributor.
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