Yup it's sad. It's like they just knew star wars would sell them selves. I hope they lose alot if customers and rethink their issues. I don't want them to fail but I want them to go in timeout for a few minutes and think about what they did

We are all confused. I thought you weren't supposed to bite the hand that feeds you........

But if that hand is full of cash, it's so yummy!

Until that hand full of cash stops coming back.....oh wait

No. The book was not written or published by Stern.

Well this isnt good.

Im thinking of my distributor, and how we have a relationship, like Im sure many of us do.
This falls now on their shoulders.

I would, and others might request the game to be showroom played and free of defects.

What are they going to do if hit with complaints that are below Sterns threshold?

Seems like used, HUO, with some mileage is the only way....

That or a different print method, and a plastic sheet layer.....no clearcoat....???

Or they could just stop being lowering their standards and costs and resort back to their processes that where problem free a couple years ago??

I think there are changes chemically made, due to environmental....is this true?

Well I had ghosting on my smve. Sent in pictures got the box for replacement this week. That being said I'm probably not going though the replacement process.

Why ? I'm a mechanical nitwit, I see all those wires
No way I'm dealing with that. So I can pay someone to deal with that then pay to replace? Probably not because I love the game and probably won't sell. So I'm not so worried about resale. In the final analysis my ghosting is not as bad as I've seen in pictures. My smve still looks killer and is a dream to play.

P.S. if they come out with Tron VE I'm in.

No idea, when where those regulations enforced in the US? was it the last year or so?

Take photos and a good tip is do little videos tracing each wire/connection from backbox to playfield, you will be surprised how simple a swap will be if you take enough photos for reference and vids help if you loose track, also handy to mark them up.

I stopped buying from Stern in protest to code (XMLE and STLE) prior to had bought 4 NIB in 2 years but none since ST. I have all Stern currently, but my later purchases have been complete code (SM, TWD, Met, LotR and Tspp).

Plus Stern quality has been very suspect for $5-8K pins.

It was part of the discussion last year with GB. Some posts shared that there was not only a vendor change, but a clear coat chemical change.

Sorry I dont remember more, or if this was accurate.

Then wouldn't every manufacturer be having the same problem?

STERN! Are you listening. I will buy SW, but all future purchases will be determined on your response in the near future to problems...and I have a Met Pro with ghosting of 6+ inserts...I'm reasonable about small defects, but wake up...there are companies willing and ready to replace you...your move.

This!! Blaming the changing clearcoat technology is BS, car manufacturers and paint suppliers have been dealing with this for years, and today's clearcoat paints when formulated correctly are stronger and more durable than ever before. The key is using the right, i.e. the more expensive, formula of clearcoat.

The other thing that may be affecting this ghosting is the rest time of the inserts versus wood. If the playfield is painted too quickly after the inserts are set into the playfield the epoxy or whatever used to glue the inserts may not have time to set correctly.

Either way, if Stern wanted to seriously fix this ghosting issue it is well within their powers to do so....

You have a Met Pro with multiple ghosted inserts and your still buying a SW Pro, if they are listening and you want them to wake up, your kind of sending them the wrong message

Mate, it's 3 connections then pull the playfield out.
Same to go back in.
Had this with my early release GBLE.
Do it!

Agree...but I hope that there is an in field fix coming from a 3rd party...or I get lucky and have a good playfield...sorry, criticize me, yell at me, say I'm wrong...but this is my grail pinball...even with the ghosted inserts my wife and I have played about 4000 games in 1 year. We usually have a tournament going. Love playing it. This is not an investment, but a form of entertainment. Some people buy boats...we buy pins. I think we will have a blast with Star Wars. I agree, we shouldn't buy Stern because of the QC probs and them cheapening the quality...but this is my weak point...sorry, but I will enjoy it...that's the way it is.

For a moment today, watching the Pinburgh finals, I actually considered ditching my SWLE order and getting DILE. It was a fleeting thought, but that was the first time it happened since either game was announced. That feeling is only going to get stronger for me when it comes to JJP/Stern decisions in the future if Stern continues with their shenanigans.

Remember when we were getting pissed at JJP 2-3 years ago for their BS? My, how the tables have turned...

They used di in the finals?

Oh no way, I don't think we should stop buying pins, I want to be able to continue supporting Stern for years to come, but not at present, what we can all do is not buy now blind, premiums will be in production for years so we can sit back and wait for Stern to wake up.

Once Stern relise we won't just all go out and buy blind regardless of all their cost cutting related defects, they have to make changes, until then they will unfortunately continue on this downward spiral, I just hope they don't get so deep in this hole of poor quality and cost cutting that they get to a point where they can't get back out.

They will all have have problems. Stern should know better...fix your sh@! Or risk losing the lead. Competition is good. Spooky, JJP, etc. are coming for Stern and they should be worried. After this one ( because it has a huge following) they are done, unless they get their sh@! together.

I honestly think that Stern sees we are at the pinnacle of the pinball resurgence. The only way to go from here is down. We are the last people around to keep this hobby alive. The market is oversaturated with new pins and will remain flooded for many years to come. Stern's on one final cash grab and then they're gone. They don't give a shit because they don't have to. Just my two cents.

Yep. First of four games. And when you see what the game is telling you to do and how the lights interact with everything you're doing, it's simply brilliant. I thought it's been really fun every time I've played, and I didn't know what I was doing. Watching these guys play that game was a real treat.

This is spot on. They're getting away with it (with me and others) because it's Star Wars. But they're doing real damage to their customer base going forward. I'm really bitter about that company now, and taking a much closer look at DI (or the JJP POTC) and Houdini as my next machine. I don't even care what Stern's next 5 games are...and I can't be the only one that feels that way.

Here is whats clear in my view.

Stern have not fixed this problem.

If you have a machine made since March 2016 then you are on a ticking time bomb.

My GB was made in August 2016. Just over a week ago I noticed two of the inserts are ghosting. Didn't start happening until this month. So all those with GB's, Aerosmiths, Batman66s, Star Wars etc eventually I believe you will suffer this problem. My distributer is taking this up with Stern who I'm sure will make this right.

Neil.

keith Elwin had a JAWS cap on at pin burgh today

FWIW to state the obvious, SMVE is SAM, GB is Spike.

It's not as bad as you think. If you want help, pm me and if you are close enough I will come and help you. But I will warn yoi, it might cost you a beer or two..lol

I bought nib ST premium a few years ago, that was my last nib from stern, and that most likely goes for all of us in the know in west Texas. It's sick and sad. I really like some of sterns pins, but this new policy is unacceptable.

This sounds like the excuse of most millennial kids I know; only wanting to get paid and not take responsibility for sub par work or damage they cause.

I feel sorry for the ignorant in this matter.

Nice i will have to check it out....so i can learn what to do if i ever get a undamaged one lol.

It's ANOTHER HINT that Jaws is next!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

*hears the record buzz and everything in the room stops*

Wait a minute....

yet.....

Well, not yelling AT you, but I will say:

This....RIGHT HERE.... is exactly why Stern will not address their issues. They are putting out sub-par crap at insane prices, and some people cannot eat that shit sandwich fast enough. They are actually pulling a CYA method to KEEP people that "can't help themselves" buying games with the mentality of "oh, this is normal...." What a load of MFing bs.

Can you imagine if hospital equipment that keeps people on life support was being put out at Stern's quality level? Morgues wouldn't be able to keep up....

Perhaps Stern's new slogan for their company should be "MAKING PINBALL GREAT AGAIN!"

If they use that to hide from replacements, the picky collector will be done buying NIB.

GBLE was my last NIB Stern game. It's not worth the headaches or hassle anymore.

Seriously, you are comparing life saving treatment to pinaball...that is disturbing.

No major issues with Spooky bought a used AMH , any questions or concerns were handled exceptionally well with personal emails from Charlie and Ben , plus the code was (IMO) very complete and yet they still updated these units!
Keep in mind that only 150 units made. The play field was like a piece of glass and performed solidly!

Thanks. Helpful quote. I'm very excited about Spooky. Will give Stern good competition!

Hahahahahahahahahahaha. Funniest part of this is you guys will keep buying these. I quit buying sterns 6 yrs ago when I went in to a distributer to buy tron. They were like you have to pay more for all features. I flipped stern off and never returned. But now a days is a fucking joke, 10- 15k nib lol. Good luck getting raped by stern.

Exactly what it means

I did not realize they substantially changed the clear coating formula and possibly methods. Interesting. When did this change occur?

Ok. this is bull siht and the final straw.
With the addition of that clause to Stern's manuals... I'm now steadfastly against anything Stern now sells.
Stern has made a past customer, an enemy with this addition to their manual.
I will now be recommending people NOT buy NIB Stern machines.

Congrats on loosing this customer, Stern. Even if I won the lottery tomorrow; I'll never own another NIB Stern... even if they do a Star Trek: Discovery pin.

Whoops, my bad.

Times have changed

Gary[1] (resized).jpg

How old are the words dimpling and ghosting here? Do the ball heavier than 10 years ago?

Stern means that when pinball machines were used for location, distributors were less picky than collectors?

Truth is elsewhere. Stern is cutting building cost. As the market is destined now for collectors stern thinks playfield are less stressed in an home use environment and so build them in a less qualitative way.

Have a deposit on my next SW Premium so I will to go to complete it but enough is enough, never preordering another one as this new policy is a shame.

I had ordered an ac/dc premium, and well I will cancel it, hoping to find a solution with my dealer...
I am all the more disappointed, that was for me my first nib...

I just saw a near perfect "No Good Gophers" a few days ago; not a damn thing wrong with it. No ghosting. No issues whatsoever. Then it took me a moment to realize that I hadn't played the game (in person) in TWENTY YEARS. So, the year is 2017, and it appears with Stern that their tech hasn't progressed as much as it should have and are seemingly going backwards if they can't produce a playfield that's not f'ed up out the box, or chips away a few months later.

I saw this guy's youtube video about his replacement GB playfield that he finally got through his very persistent local dealer and it only took Stern NINE MONTHS to ship out a replacement.