with the new vault editions coming out this will have quite a dampening effect on many stern titles? it's like throwing cold water on many games. who wants to pay 4800+ for a used sm, lotr, or tspp when it may be rerun with leds nib? i have these games but sure would like them nib with leds installed. who feels confident ponying up 10k for a tronle when a premium might be run for 5-6k? pinball is alive and well with more affordability and this might be what is needed to keep a lid on nib machines sitting in a flippers garage. bbbr, afmr, mbr, mmr , ccr potential from pps has put a damper on those machines as well. great time for pinball!

Let me stop you right there for 2 reasons.

1.) There's no guarantee there is going to be a flood of "new vault editions". Again, I think Stern is just saying "we reserve the right to make more Pros & Premiums if there's demand, so don't cry about it if you thought you were gonna flip yours for 10k"

2.) Stern always has multiple games in production...if AC/DC and Metallica can survive on the line together, it's fine. People may not want any of the new games in production...but they might want an older title. It's a product line. Coke makes Coke, Diet Coke, Coke Zero, etc...does Coke Zero take sales away from Diet Coke? Who cares, they get your money anyway. More choice = more customers = more sales.

Vault LOTR would be my first NIB, no question. If LOTR is NOT going the Vault route (no pun intended), Vault Tron would be my first NIB.

After IM, LOTR and Tron have to be the most likely, I would think. Other than LEs, what else has more "buzz" and has consistently been in demand at higher than new prices???

Anything older than LOTR would be pretty difficult/expensive to manufacture, IMHO.

At any rate, I was trying to sell/trade my STTNG for a LOTR, now I'm going to wait until a Vault edition is confirmed as a go/no go.

right there. nobody knows what will/won't be next. that will put a damper on consumers eager to pay top dollar for titles that might be made at some point. when consumer confidence falls so do prices in the secondary market. at least thats how i see this

And lower prices is good for the players in the hobby.

I agree. It's too bad though, because I think it would be very cool to revisit those few classics. Frankly, those are probably the only titles I'd consider buying as I go through the list of possibilities:

IM: already own

LOTR: already owned three of them

SM: already owned

Tron: already own

FGY: not interested (it has a mini PF! )

TSPP: already owned and not interested (it has a mini PF! )

RBION: seriously?

BDK: is this even a possibility?

yes, and maybe make the hobby a little more accessible for the newcomers to our wonderful hobby.

just got this leaked photo of what's popping from the vault.
not suitable for all eyes. you may want to scroll past quickly

the belief is, that this will open up the market very broadly due to excellent entry price point.
mods not included.

i'm in for the LE.

pirates-zizzle-1.jpg

Very cool!

This will be more affordable, and maybe make the hobby a little more accessible for the newcomers to our wonderful hobby.

Classic Sterns were unlicensed and unramped games.

Should be relatively easy to manufacture.

If a complicated game like "The Pin" with ramps, speech, multiball, licenses, and flashers can be sold at a profit for $2500, a much simpler Seawitch should be money.

Good point.

I take back my agreement with Rarehero!!

dam you! now that is clever.

Ripley's fan here.. what's wrong with Ripley's?

It's a great game. That lower right flipper shot up through the left pops around the orbit and then whacked with the upper right flipper ... and then with this momentum keep the upper loop going with again the upper right flipper... is one of the most satisfying shots in pinball. Folks that originally complained about the upper flipper coil being too weak and started replacing it to simulate BK2000 just did not get the design. It upper flipper coil was only designed to bring the ball up to the pops... awesome! But you can get also the looping going with using the lower right flipper as described.

If the theme of the game was 'Strawberry Shortcake Plants a Garden' and there was a cardboard Mick Jagger going back and forth across the playfield, that shot alone sells the game.

So... that's just one shot mapping... the overall whole game is brilliant. Pinball and learning.. a great combination. And the idol doing its whip the ball around thing is also great fun....

Potc with a completely new rulseset. (+the old, so you can switch and have 2 different gamecodes)

That would be awesome!

I think they should do that with all their vault pins. Add a new game to it.

Sorry I should have expanded. I don't think RBION sucks I just don't like it enough to want a NIB one when you can get a nice huo version for $3k, which is about $2k less than NIB would be

Zactly. I own one and don't begrudge them to anyone who wants one; but you can get them for around 3K... and it is doubtful Stern would go that low price-wise (plus it is Whitestar).

Fair point, but I wasn't thinking that era. I would LOVE to see a cheap NIB Seawitch, but I can't imagine there would be a big enough market outside of Pinside.

Something new and different like Hypnox would be cool ...

Wouldn't happen though.

Unless there is a new movie or band named Hypnox they can licence.

rd.

Mark my words .... (Write in in your diary...)

Wait for the LOTR premium to be released around the same time as the Hobbit pin/movie comes out.

That's what I'd do.

You heard it here first ....

rd.

Most ops I know don't buy pinball machines, because they remember the days when a machine paid itself off in 2-3 months and then started to EARN.

$5000 for a Pro is just too much money when a crane out-earns a pin 10 to 1.

But $2500 for a game means an op could deploy 2 for the price of a Pro.

A simple game like Nine Ball would also attract new players who would otherwise be intimidated by a complicated game like AC/DC. (James deployed a bunch of pins at at 20something bar and Comet out-earned all the DMD titles. Why? Probably because everything else looked too complicated).

LED lighting would make the game look fresh and not like the 1980s.

Or LAZERLORD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lazor12.JPG

I would think lotr would be next years vault rerun, but its not a sam game. Would it be possible for stern to make it a sam or sam2 game? How difficult would that be?

I am thinking from an op's point of view, but you make a valid point. It's nearly impossible to earn with a $5k game, but that's a whole other discussion.

In my mind, I guess there's two schools of thought- one says newbies are attracted to the fancy light/sound show of LED pins like Star Trek. The other says newbies want a simple game.

Who knows, it's hard for me to go back to that mindset. Both schools are probably right in some ways.

I wouldn't think a game like Seawitch would earn unless it was REALLY shiny and impressive. Hardcore pinheads would want it close to original, ops would likely want it flashy and attractive.

Having said that, I think LoTR is the easiest no-brainer. Pinheads love it, and it still earns on a route.

Tie in with The Hobbit is an attractive bonus, and I can't imagine JJP has an exclusive license for all of Tolkein.

Then again, maybe I'm just completely biased- I REALLY want a NIB LoTR!!!!

It would take some sales away from JJP sales, so that would be a plus for Gary.

When the thread was posted about the tour, and it was mentioned about the stacks of playfields, I knew reruns were coming. Why else would they be making so many extra playfields?

Stern has a history of doing this. TSPP, LOTR, SM and LOTR had many runs. Some runs were better than others. The armor for SM, the apron for TDK, the coloring for TSPP play fields, different Tron translites, so this isn't any different except for the VE label and that some of these titles have appreciated.

All of these reruns/remakes prove that pinball manufacturers are keeping a better eye on the collector market.

I just bought a secondhand Family Guy in great shape and that was always my dream re-run machine. Now I'm hoping for a LOTR or TSPP Vault Edition. Time to start saving!

Cheers!
Adam.

They'd still have to start from scratch and re-tool & re-imagine the guts...just like Retro did with King of Diamonds and PPS is doing with MMr. It would have to be built on modern hardware. I doubt there'd be enough interest from the classic collectors and zero from operators. Any speculation on "vault" releases should be DMD "modern" Stern games.

What if the Vault machines shipped with updated code that current owners could also use? Win for everyone, right?

Hmmm...

Hopefully they can get to where they can run 15-20 titles in small runs. That would be awesome.

Stern could try but I bet they would have to charge north of $6.5k due to LOTR's features and toys which top nearly every LE they make today. I once owned a LOTR, amazing pin, and its so good not only due to its layout but the amazing ruleset that Keith Johnson created for the game. Without the deep quest based ruleset that Keith created for the game I doubt it would even be in the top 25. JJP has a lot going for them with Keith Jonhson on their staff and doing the rules for The Hobbit.

With JJP making the Hobbit, having Two Steps From Hell doing the music, having a wide body layout with hopefully even more toys / features (ex. LCD) then LOTR and Keith Johnson onboard to produce another epic deep ruleset I think there's a good chance the game will stand toe to toe if not surpass LOTR.

I think they were spot on w IM.....sadly, all my pin money definitely gone w the TRON LE purchase, so it doesn't matter what comes out of the vault, I'm out of the buying market for awhile.....happy speculating!!!....mark

you bought well

Thanks labnip......had the opportunity and went for it....0 regrets.....mark

I wonder if they could get all of the figures for LOTR still? I would sell my players and buy this NIB in a second . LOTR is a game that is not leaving the collection.

I'd be OK without the figures. Just need the Balrog toy.

The biggest fear for all of us should be that manufacturers ultimately cannot stay afloat. All the game-specific noise pales into insignificance against an outcome where the last factory shuts its doors. I'm all for these guys doing whatever they can to stay in business. I own a Tron LE, and if they ever announced a premium I would smile from ear to ear at the excitement it would generate. I can't tell you how happy I am to be able to get a new IM, and I'm all for as many people as possible to enjoy that feeling. We are all trying to keep the child in us alive here, and the death of that would be a sad day indeed.

Tron Legacy was a very good movie, and Disney as well as director Kosinski have said they are planning on a sequel in the future.

The game is awesome but not really more mechanism rich than any other game. Main toy is balrog, 2 flippers, 2 metal ramps, 2 wireforms, 1 ring magnet, barad dur tower. Other tower and path of dead are just flat plastics. Sword ramp is just a flat metal plate.

sneak peak of the new tron pin for tron 3 movie...
(you didn't get this from me)

Tron3pin.jpg

No, they didn't even have them for the le

I would buy both a nib LOTR and Tron Premium. I emailed Stern last year about chances of either being remade and they responded that both licenses had expired and were not going to be renewed. Of course, that could change and they wouldn't necessarily reveal plans to some random dude but I do think the licencing side of it could be what prevents these happening.

Nothing to admit. Being a fan of the original doesn't slavishly make you have to like the sequel. I like the sequel because it was good. Very good.

My rebuke to you would be, just because it's "hip" to dislike the sequel doesn't mean you need to jump on the bandwagon.

Yeah, I don't know what there is to "admit" regarding Tron Legacy either. It's better than the original for sure.

I like it enough to actually own it on Blu-ray.

I was 10 when Tron came out. With me being into video games and computers at that age, Tron made a huge impact on my childhood.

That being said, the film hasn't aged all that well. Some of the dialog is cringe-worthy. I still enjoy it, but at a sentimental level.

Tron Legacy, however, was a much deeper film, that explored more ideas than just being trapped inside a computer. It's really Flynn's story of watching his creation run amok because of his own shortsightedness, and not realizing he had everything he needed (Sam) right in front of him the whole time. That's an ageless story, not one stuck in early 80's computer jargon (Bring in the logic probe! No, null unit!)

Do I think Tron Legacy is perfect? No. It's stupid that Sam had his street clothes on when he got zapped inside the system, and that the Sirens had to give him that outfit. As shown by the original movie, the costume is part of you being a program. They are inseparable. Also, don't get me started on Sam bleeding.....

I thought it was great. I was a big fan of the father son driving plot line over a romance driven plot line. The action was good. I hope the franchise has some legs now.

+1

See my post above yours for the cringe-worthy dialog from the original, and the superior plot of the sequel.

I was also impressed that Sam and Quarra don't have any kind of romance or even a kiss. Very unusual for a Hollywood movie. They stuck to the story that mattered; a father and son reconciling while facing down a ghost from his past that represented everything that was wrong with him at one time.