Okay I think the TRON Premium conversation has run its course can we speculate/talk about something else now?

What about a SM re run? Not sure they'd have any luck renewing the license but it sure is one bad ass pin!

I do! Didn't you see the post by Lordloss?

Sure. I want to see Stern pull this one out of the vault.
th-1-674.jpeg

I could totally see SM coming back, Disney/Marvel own the non movie license now and Disney/Marvel are pumping out the Marvel material so I could really see it happening.

"Well folks TronLE is a $4K game"

Would it be considered insider info if I had guessed they would make a premium the day I bought my LE?

Here is the line quoted from the last Chicago Gaming open house thread https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/mmr-home-run-my-visit-to-chicago-gaming-on-517

"Stacks of cut but unscreened Stern playfields. (Family Guy, Spider Man, Iron Man, LOTR, etc.)"
Tick IM off now I guess

Also, recently a Stern disty in my part of the world had an innocuous comment in a SM FS post that just happened to mention and I quote "before they are rerun" I didn't pay too much attention to it at the time thinking it was just an aid to sell the one he had. I do remember checking the Stern website just in case lol........(no I can't find the link so no evidence what-so-ever).

x 10, SM is possibly the best pin eva!…………..New lights, audio, art and you get the ultimate wow factor!

I think SM is Stern's best pin, right along with Ac/dc……very close 2nd

SIMPSON V2

stern's last pin was a mustang pin... good frickin' grief. that's right up there with the Rollin Stones pin (gack-o-rama)

think about where their heads are at right now...

probably going to be something like:
a) Madonna the pin
b) Beyonce the pin
c) Homogenized Milk the pin
d) Clear Channel Top 10 the pin
e) Bland Man Brand the pin
f) The Beatles pin
g) Generic Bread the pin
h) Soccer Mom's Light Blue Minivan the pin
i) Payless Shoe Store the pin
j) Dry White Toast the pin



(....but there is something cool coming very soon)

toast-1.jpeg

Fixed it for you.

yuuuup. you're right. it's a madonna pin

kiss-2.jpg

The point is that If NIB pros command 6k now, it is likely that Stern could make even more money by selling premiums. Not sure they could sell a big run of pros at 6k. They are at 6k bc of scarcity.

Why do a run of pros at at pro or pro plus price, when you can "I love Lucy" it and and tag on another grand or two. Stern nailed the model with Metallica and ACDC in my opinion. Sell an unlimited number of premiums with the premium gameplay. = more happy pinball enthusiasts.

It could upset LE owners a bit I guess, but at most that is only 300 unhappy people. And a lot of them wouldn't care.

Sorry, didn't see this. Posted last night and then went to bed!

PM sent.

Fme! My wife would make me buy that instantly. And if had that translite I would go kicking and screaming..... and maybe moaning and smiling a bit.

Lotr would be epic.

On the off chance that voting would work I vote for:

1) TSPP
2) LOTR
3) SM

Assume that improvements can and would be made where appropriate.

POTC would be awesome if they were able to remake it using actual movie sounds and music.

That didn't happen the first time...the licensor isn't going to change their mind about it.

What would be awesome is a new stern platform in full color LCD...then remake TSPP, Tron, LOTR with full color and/or actual movie clips in case of Tron.

Man I don't know what I would do if that happened. I'd prolly sell my old ones & get the new ones.

Dogh!

We actually have the ability to do that ourselves now, that's one game (along with X-Men) that sorely needs the help in that department.

Late to this thread....has Stern EVER reran an LE title, period? I don't think so ( but I could be wrong)....yes, I just bought a TRON LE w 0 regrets.....just seems like a line that wouldn't be crossed for several ( including fiscal) reasons. Also given how protective Disney is with it's collectibles, period......happy dreaming/ speculating......

They wouldn't be rerunning an LE, they'd just be making a premium. There has been precedence for doing something not planned originally well after the game was run (LOTR LE). I doubt if they make a premium though unless they get hard up for money in a couple years. I doubt if it would effect the LE market overall that much (although it would kill Tron LE prices temporarily) because almost all games have premium models anyways now, might torque a few people off temporarily but only from a financial standpoint...and if you're never selling it, it doesn't really make any difference. Like I have IM, the remake probably dropped mine $1k in 'theoretical' cash, but it doesn't make any difference because I'm never selling it.

I'm not sure how making a premium of a 3 year old game screws up their LE thing. They make premiums with every game now basically. So if they announce KISS LE or Walking Dead LE or Game of Thrones LE (along with premiums for all three, which is standard now) people aren't going to buy the LE's because they made a premium for a 3 year old game? They still bought AC/DC, Metallica, Star Trek, etc LE's when there were premiums. The ONLY reason anybody cares is the fact that it's a 10k game, other than that nobody would really care if they like made a rolling Stones premium now. Is there a rule somewhere that says that they can't make a premium later of a game that had an LE because there's demand for it? Making LOTR LE made some LOTR owners mad but they still did it, didn't seem to really hurt anything long term, this would be the same thing...next time a killer theme is announced, people will open their wallets again. If you start seeing a bunch of Tron LE's for sale, you know it's coming, just watch for the sign of people in the know trying to get out.

You keep saying that, but premium editions of LE models are now the norm. If they made a premium Tron, it would be no different than making a premium Met, ST, Mustang or whatever. Unless they made some kind of guarantee back in the day that the Tron LE features would never show up on another pinball machine. I don't care if it happens, because I like the one I have and don't care about relative value like so many others.

I played both the LE and the Pro when they were new at the same place and it was more than just features. The LE played better.

The ones that might have a problem with it is the ones that sunk all that extra money into a pro just trying to emulate an LE, but that never happened. It made it better, but not even close.

If they do a premium then maybe they might be able to improve the sound, but there is not much more you can do to improve perfection.

No Tron LE owners are going to get butt hurt if Stern makes a Premium, because most of them plan on keeping it.

Go Spurs!

Was that the reason? Either way, you can't deny that it would be an improvement. The original tune is starting to grow on me though...

If the ACDC premiums don't affect the value of the ACDC LE , then why would Tron Premium affect the value of Tron LE ? I do not think it would. Tron premium - yes please. But one day I still want an LE .

That could have been a limitation on royalties or timing of availability.. Not just denied

Because the games were produced and purchased with a different set of expectations of rarity of features

Changing that by undercutting that LATER erodes future buying confidence. People would be less willing to pay more for uniqueness when that uniqueness is questionable. This is what happened when stern first did tiering yet was not up front with what editions would be made for a title. People got burned the first time around...

Stop thinking about labels and look at what the games offered vs the editions offered.

Right. Avatar owners were really not happy when the LE was announced months later, and many people said they would wait until all models were announced to buy.

Today, some models are announced with an unlimited number of premiums with the same features. Others aren't. If they just start having new trim models appear, it will erode some serious buying from people initially.

How many people do you think would have ordered either Xmen or Transformers knowing what happened to the resale market if they also had no chance of the games appreciating in value? I know I'd never think about buying angle again.

Oh, and I don't own Tron LE, so protecting the value there makes no difference to me.

Spider-Man
TRON
Simpsons

Let's be real, with their new model structure nothing is special. You can get the exact LE game in the premium version. Moving forward, no LE is all that special, except for art. Did LUCI erode ACDC.......No. I say run a Tron premium and to hell with collectors hoarding NIB and treating this hobby like they are a corporation..........I would rather see my money go to Stern in helping it survive.

I think it has already happened so Stern may as well cash in big time with a Tron Premium. They make premiums for every game now. Nothing, nothing is safe from being re-made!

I bought XM LE with no chance of appreciation , or at least that is what I thought. The issue was being able to get one in my case.

IMHO, which is all it is, Tron LE would not suffer if a Tron premium were offered. Personally, I would still rather have the one with the numbered plaque limited to 250. But until such time as I can get one of those, the premium would fill the gap.

Unless they ran more with numbered plaques and increased the actual LE production I don't think the uniqueness is in question. Tron LE is iconic to pinheads. It will always represent an interesting moment and I don't think the premium detracts from that. Tron LE holds it's over 10k valuation until the real crash, that is my speculation regardless of a premium should Stern go that way.

I got in 2/2012 , so could not buy ACDC LE at preorder prices but did get in on XM LE and ACDC premium, just for reference. Can't sell XM ever as it was my first NIB Stern. Has to stay forever just due to that.

It would only erode future buying confidence if there was a game play differential in a limited edition - exclusive only to the LE. That model is now done. This isn't and never should have been a beanie baby or Franklin Mint type hobby (my opinion).

The new model keeps game play the same between LE and premium. The only differences are design elements. So, while I understand this move might upset some Tron LE owners that don't want me to have that gameplay in my machine, I think it makes a lot of sense for Stern and for pinball enthusiasts.

I won't/didn't buy a Tron pro because I've played the LE. I won't buy an existing LE because it isn't worth 10k to me. Bring out a premium at $6500ish and I am in.

I assume that anytime I buy a pin NIB that it will depreciate in value the moment I open it.

You might have not been around at the time.

Imagine stern announced ac/dc as the pro and said nothing about other editions. You jump because you love acdc... Then a month later they announced the premium version with more stuff and a better game. Would you be pissed you didn't wait or feel burned that stern didn't tell you that that edition was coming? You betcha... And that is exactly what happened with games like avatar

Then look at woz.... They promote a le edition as this exclusive, top if the line edition that will only be available if you buy NOW. They up-sell you on exclusivity and that this is the best edition you can buy. You buy in those expectations. Then later they announce the ruby edition... Your le is no longer the 'best edition'

JJP sucked you in to buy early... And then after the fact changed the game. Those kinds if moves cause people to add more caution into buying decisions.

Similar with mmr - in day one you are willing to pay a premium because this may the only way to get one. Then they announce the standard. Now there is effectively unlimited supply... Now you are only paying for the features and some story... Vs availability at all.

Buyers learn that what you know right now... May change tommorrow... So they can be more cautious before jumping in quick and early.

And remember... The factory wants to sell up front as much as possible. They don't want to sit in inventory

Not just gameplay but what the game offers. Tron is a great example if this... The huge differentiators were the ramps and tranlights ( the extra mb is not huge )

But when Eli's kit comes out... And the other mods... The feature exclusivity of the le is undercut. Now it's extra value is purely in the labeled le nature... And not really about looks or game play.

The less differentiation there is... The less value divide.

The x of y numbering if titles is of limited value in the pin hobby because it's still more if a playing hobby than it is a display my collection hobby.

Le numbering still plays second fiddle to game play and presentation

That is exactly what happened with AC/DC Luci edition, yet I did not see the villagers lighting any torches.

Why? Because it's only pinball.

I think WOZ people were more angry that JJP was building Ruby editions, instead of finish up the already paid in full WOZLEs.

Every Ruby, even the prototypes, is time wasted from finishing the LEs.

Of course that's not true, because those models were all announced AT THE TIME OF RELEASE. Obviously not the case with Tron if they come out years later with a so called Premium.

Luci was just another variant - it's not an upgraded game nor were premium buyers buying thinking they had the highest level game. There were no pretenses for premium buyers compromised by luci. Just another alternative that wasn't available when they bought. Plus luci is more expensive than earlier runs.

Not tell if serious?

In case you are, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that the release of a Tron Premium would have a negative impact on the value of Tron LE. Is this really a point of contention? Let's see: Tron Premium at $6k or Tron LE at $10k? I think it's pretty obvious that the majority of people will go for the Tron Premium, resulting in lower demand for Tron LE. I can't believe that I actually had to type that out!

And again with the stupid ACDC Premium not affecting the value of the BIBLE: it was impossible for it to have a negative impact BECAUSE IT WAS ANNOUNCED AT THE SAME TIME. IT ALREADY EXISTED. How can something that already existed have a negative impact on the value of something else??

Why? Because it was simply another version of the already existing (and non-limited) Premium edition.

Luci is the best version of AC/DC.

It's window is clear (unlike the LEs), and it has the best artwork by far.

If course there is that too... But if production was not so far behind the stated would still be true. The ruby had to be about fresh cash flow at the expense of preorders.