(Topic ID: 258935)

Stern Led Zeppelin v.s. JJP Guns N' Roses

By pinmister

4 years ago


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  • 2,078 posts
  • 224 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 months ago by Stevemoerke
  • Topic is favorited by 14 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Stern Led Zeppelin or JJP Guns N' Roses?”

  • I am interested in a Stern Led Zeppelin 177 votes
    21%
  • I am interested in a JJP Guns N' Roses 300 votes
    36%
  • I am interested in both 131 votes
    16%
  • Neither-not interested 152 votes
    18%
  • I love Philly Cheesesteaks 68 votes
    8%

(828 votes)

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#60 4 years ago

Sweet Madame Blue does rock!

#63 4 years ago

I feel GnR’s music and art style are more suited to pinball,but Led Zeppelin is a better band by far as a matter of fact they are the best rock band in the world !
Actually I think Poison would be the best music for a music pin.

-1
#65 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

I usually like to think I'm up on things, but I had no idea they were still together.

It doesn't matter they are still #1 This is my opinion and will never change!

#67 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

I get it. Kinda like George Washington is still the #1 president of the United States.

What the hell are you smoking the morning?

#70 4 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

I saw them in 1977 and they were dead to me after that. Too long ago to care now.

Hey I think I understand,your saying your not stuck in the past.I'm really not either,I have a friend who still puts on REO and Eddie Money when we hang out.I'm like more progressive 2000 to now but my Zeppelin albums get played all the time by my two musician sons

#92 4 years ago

It's funny because that time frame is exactly where I been the last couple of summers with my Muse
mix on free pandora

-1
#108 4 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

Is this is a joke?
JJP doing Zepplin would be the best all around choice here. Depending on the gameplay and style it would be my first JJP. Now JJP doing Sabbath and it 100% becomes my first JJP.

Your first JJP lol

#109 4 years ago

Muse live in Roma Wow!
Best live show I’ve ever seen tons of energy and cool tech

8 months later
#198 3 years ago
Quoted from AUKraut:

Hopefully after seeing JJP GnR Gary will loosen his pursestrings for Steve Ritchie to go back to the drawing board and go crazy!!!

The Zep pin is probably too far along to make any design changes.I guess you could still work in some lighting and some 3D models.Also better throw in Bluetooth Wifi capabilities

#229 3 years ago
Quoted from dmieczko:

True, for code updates it would be a good thing. But, in one of the GnR videos I saw, there was a picture of the player on the LCD. I just don't need that. If I ever get a text from someone, and it shows up on my pinball screen, I'm dumping that game the next day...

You can dump that bad mother fucker on my porch brother!

#272 3 years ago

I love Zeppelin!!! My buddies and me grew up with their music.we cried when Bonham died and whey buddy Billy’s girlfriend died we played Over the hills and far away in my 70 Chevy van on the way to the funeral.But getting back on track I can’t wrap my mind around Led Zep pinball?

#286 3 years ago
Quoted from RayGun:

Wrap it brother - it can be EPIC. Live concert footage with matching live music on the lcd, I'd say put another lcd of live btw/ the flippers, matched crowd noise to game play w/ lift as you get ta killin it, f'n lights, a fish, increase the volume as you kick ass thru, shake it - turn on, tune in, & drop out

I don’t know why but that reminded me of the night me and a girl were supposed to go see The Wiz movie with Michael Jackson.I made a fake phone call and informed her the movie was sold out (liar)I took her to see The Song Remains the same
We’re fell in love and I married her!

#288 3 years ago
Quoted from zaki:

I played g n r le, honest opinion, its just ok. Long ball times, way to easy to get extra balls, slings and shooter rod too soft. Plays 'light' like other jjp games. Not sure concert video adds anything. I think led zeppelin could be better.

What a shock!

1 week later
#343 3 years ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

Trust me I know that....LZ is in the same boat as GNR....both have some great music, but I don't care for all their stuff....I jus hope they actually license more than 10 songs

11 songs is my guess

#352 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

I’m expecting Stern to be shipping these before xmas.

Nobody’s going to have any money left after purchasing GnR?

#359 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

Yeah I'm sure Zeppelin fans decided not to wait and grab GnR instead. Like that's a lateral move music wise. GnR is OK but they are not even close to being in the same league as Zeppelin. Please try to remove u know what from we know what kind sir.

Ok I know you have a tough time listening because you like to hear yourself,but like I said Led Zeppelin is the greatest band ever!
That being said I think bands like AC/DC and GnR’s music lends itself better to pumped up pinball.
Now you go sit in the corner and behave yourself!

#379 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

[Comment removed]
I listen, its hard sometimes cause of all the horseshit but I try. Zeppelin is not the greatest band ever, what r u fuckin kidding me. I think are a great band and like some of their music but greatest, nah. "GnR lends itself better to pumped up pinball" Wow

Nananana

1 week later
#395 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

-Stairway to Heaven mode-you need to keep the ball from draining for over ten minutes to end of song. If you try and cradle the song pauses.

What a brilliant idea,where did you get that?

#401 3 years ago

Zeppelin is the best music!
GnR best pin!

#408 3 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

God whom is, Fucking awfull.
BUT, a perfectly done machine you didn't even care.

Perfect Really first time I stepped up and played it my first ball 5minutes long by the time I was done I had extra balls and walked away bored!

-4
#410 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

And yet Wonka gets the blood pumping, speaks volumes.
I get not liking Maiden as a band although the first 5 albums were great but u know we all get old there's no shame in that, however to find the pin boring is just plain ridiculous.

That’s my story and I’m sticking to it!And yeah Wonka kicks ass with a lot of depth and smooth as shit.Go to the Wonka forums and see what owners have to say about it.I’m aware how popular IM is but man that music and stripped down playfield to each his own man

#413 3 years ago
Quoted from PinFever:

If you were alive at that time and just went out and bought that first Led Zeppelin album at the record store and brought it home and played it , it would have been the equivalent of seeing a UFO landing as you have never heard something so ahead of its time , Blew your socks off

Hell yes man they changed everything!

#414 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

Stripped down PF? never heard that before.
The music. A Zeppelin fan doesn't like this. Interesting.

I don’t get it but I do get Led Zeppelin and I hope Stern does them justice

#438 3 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

Yes, I always found it interesting that in the competition to see who would be "The Bally Table King", they were both playing Gottliebs.

All I remember is Tommy’s mommy!

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#441 3 years ago
Quoted from sunnRAT:

You grew up in the 70s, yet you lump Sabbath into the '80s metal band compilation' idea? C'mon man!
Zeppelin wished they could write music and lyrics like Tony and Geezer did.

Quoted from o-din:

Her swimming around in a bunch of beans is what I remember.

I looked and couldn’t find a good pic!I was 12 and her nipples were hard!

#460 3 years ago
Quoted from Guinnesstime:

Steve Ritchie's first pinball game with Williams was Flash. It sold 19,505 units in 1979.
There are literally less than 400 pinball machines in the wild that have been designed by Eric.

That 400 number is rising rapidly!We don't have to belittle Eric to praise Steve or visa versa

#463 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

This started the way they all start with some JJP fuckface comment. Go back a few posts prior and u will see that, wouldn't have come up otherwise. Laughable Man
[quoted image]

What did you say?

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-3
#470 3 years ago
Quoted from HEAD_boss_HOG:

How so??
Does anyone still believe Ritchie is the better designer ??

Kind of aggressive dont u think ???
Are u devoted to Ritchie? Dont get me wrong he made some greats, but not since star trek...

Devoted to Stern is more like it!

#500 3 years ago
Quoted from John_I:

Well I got to have a session on GnR LE this weekend and now I'm even more certain that it is LZ or nothing for me when it comes to these two. Right up front I will point out that I am not even close to being a GnR fan, so the pin would have had to totally blow me away for me to ever buy one. Unlike the really spiffy professional JJP release videos and glamor shots, the game doesn't look as impressive in person. Even still, GnR is certainly complete and full featured looking with a lot of attention to detail in the art and toys. Right away I noticed pooling in the clearcoat in a few places despite the Oct 2020 build date. The gameplay was not great but not bad. Not like the satisfying butter smooth shots in AIQ and the upper playfield looks cool as hell but doesn't really add much IMO. Still there is a ton there for those who want the world under the glass as you would expect for the steep prices. What I don't expect for the high price is the crappy sound system; especially on a music pin. The way JJP turned the mid speakers facing upwards instead of toward the player when they moved the boards out of the cabinet and into the back box makes them sound really poorly equalized and tinny at times. Beauty is in the ear of the beholder, but even a Stern Pro sounds better (in my opinion) because the speakers are pointed directly at the player. Also Stern uses a 2.1 amp so the cabinet speaker is its own separate adjustable channel rather than the old fixed crossover. So even the GnR LE is yearning for the sound bar that is on the CE. I've seen this discussed on a few threads and have to agree what others have posted. A final note is the JJP flippers are not bad, but not as precise and crisp feeling or powerful as I am used to with Sterns.
So on a whole, no real surprise as I have been leaning hard toward the LZ side of this question since day one of this thread. LZ is one of my all time favorite bands and GnR has about four songs that I like. Also, I love Steve Ritchie - even his recent games that others turn their noses up at.

Wow that's a surprise I really thought you were getting GnR!

#501 3 years ago
Quoted from HEAD_boss_HOG:

I thought Canadians were peaceful people.
maybe youre the exception...

No I don't think so more of the know it all rule!

#507 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

The fuckface comments continue. U asked and I told ya. Its the truth. This guy can say it better than me.
go to 1:25

What the fuck is wrong with the right side of fuckface's face?

#513 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

probably best to ask another fuckface.
What do ya think?

So what’s wrong with his face Jacoff?

#516 3 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

Well Romulick others men's balls. Only another fuckface knows so again, what's wrong with it?

You seem angry you need to calm down brother.

1 month later
-3
#612 3 years ago
Quoted from fnosm:

Both games are going to be legendary. Sure LZ is getting lots of hate for the art, but that is a typical Stern failing. This game is gonna be fun as all hell. And I for one never need to hear Stairway again or Free Bird for that matter. Glad they left both off the machine. (Yeah I know LS wouldn't be on an LZ machine, but PM&W is on the GnR.)

I don’t mean to seem like I’m correcting you but I think GnR own Live and let die!

#614 3 years ago
Quoted from Elvishasleft:

Could be... I do play the things and not just mod them and rub them with a diaper once a week.
The freakout over the art just shows how many people buy these as a trophy and dont actually play them.
Same people that put up their machine for sale they bought NIB a year ago and it only has 25 plays.
Not sure what they do... turn it on stare at the lights and turn it back off?

You keep saying that all JJP pins are just a box of lights and pretty shiny things.This makes your argument weak because it’s simply not even close to the truth!Their games have plenty of variety and depth.If you like Sterns which you clearly do just buy the LZ and I’ll enjoy my GnR when I get it.

-3
#617 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

How does GNR own Live and Let Die when Eric and Slash himself had to literally call Paul and the licensor to get permission to allow it when the licensor initially shot JJP down?

I was bullshitting I was really meaning their rendition of the song is so good who even wants to hear Macartney sing it.The song was first used in the Bond movie of the same name

#624 3 years ago
Quoted from romulusx:

I was bullshitting I was really meaning their rendition of the song is so good who even wants to hear Macartney sing it.The song was first used in the Bond movie of the same name

Quoted from Psw757:

Lol...yeah GNR does it good and great Bond movie. If you’ve never seen Paul perform Live and Let Die live, I’m sure there is a video on YouTube. Paul definitely likes his Pyro!

Quoted from Psw757:

Lol...yeah GNR does it good and great Bond movie. If you’ve never seen Paul perform Live and Let Die live, I’m sure there is a video on YouTube. Paul definitely likes his Pyro!

I saw Paul on his Trip the light fantastic tour at Market Square Arena Feb 1990!It was a magical concert they played Beatles 1964 to Paul’s current Pieces of Eight.But the night GnR ripped into the song on a MTV award show I was blown away!

#639 3 years ago
Quoted from Methos:

This is so full of shit.

Ok thank you for your opinion?

#652 3 years ago
Quoted from John_I:

These are both music themes and one thing a lot of people are overlooking is the sound system. The Stern SPIKE system sounds better than JJP. The CE does add a sound bar to the top and I haven't heard one yet. Sterns have three channel 2.1 sound and full range speaker directed at the player instead of pointing upward in the backbox. It simply sounds better, fuller and richer. Playing GnR LE and Avengers Premium side by side in a quiet room the difference is undeniable. This makes a big difference to me. I have a Beatles that is on loan in my game room and it sounds fantastic without even connecting the external sub. The Stern LEs get upgraded speakers and amp too.
So it comes down to what most of use knew would be the case. Basically JJP games look better, packed playfield and weigh more and Stern games have better shots and are more fun to play. JJP had Slash support and help which is awesome because they had a lot more leeway on both artwork a depth of license. Stern was handed a pre-selected bunch of artwork from which to chose and not to deviate. GnR looks like a world under glass with fancy guitar necks and drum sticks everywhere, but after playing many games the shots were just not really satisfying shots IMHO. LZ Premium and LE playfields are more open and fast looking with some awesome looking new ramp designs, SR upper flipper ramp a cool spinner toy. It is not for everyone, but obviously more of a player's game than GnR. It is not hard to see some Keith Elwin influence in this new Ritchie playfield design.
GnR is the best JJP game yet with an amazing looking playfield, but a theme that I can't put out money for other than location. Good for everyone who has one and enjoys it. To me this choice has always been a no brainer because I don't like GnR aside from maybe three songs. LZ is an all time favorite for me and I also much prefer the Steve Ritchie designs and the Stern platform and sound system. Value is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to pinball. I value fun and dream theme much more than I do a few extra coils or some drum sticks and mods that I can surely add later if I want. LZLE is still on order and I can't wait to get it!

If I want to listen to Zeppelin I’ll crank up that big Yamaha and kick those sound waves out those sweet Polk Audio LSI speakers I assembled in my HT room.oh yeah on vinyl of course!

#674 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

This one made me laugh
It needs to be "Take me down to the multi-ball city where the balls are plenty and the lights are pretty"
[quoted image]

Keep laughing! LZ’s artwork is still the worst art since AC/DC pro Angus face edition.At least the cabinets and translite looked better then these new Zeppelins.

#676 3 years ago

Artwork GnR > LZ

#680 3 years ago

I realize the restraints the property holders placed on them,but like some many art knowledgeable folks have already stated here they did a crap job using what was given them to work with!

#820 3 years ago
Quoted from thechakapakuni:

You pay $3k extra for this
[quoted image]

Nevermind

#835 3 years ago
Quoted from screaminr:

This is nothing to do with the game but that was a crap reveal compared to GNR .
I can't find any gameplay video , you'd think they'd want to build up the hype and get some footage out there to distract people from talking about how ugly it looks .

How ugly is it??

#842 3 years ago
Quoted from thechakapakuni:

If you’re a Stern fan, you should send a thank you letter to Jersey Jack. He is literally making Stern make better pinball games. This is a fact Jack!

That is a fact!

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#855 3 years ago
Quoted from manadams:

So I just traded my JJP GNR SE and the theme integration, light show and song risk/reward is fabulous. However there is no motivation to play any other modes on the game because the scoring is peanuts compared to playing the songs. Hopefully this is addressed in future code updates but didn't have a whole lot of faith it would. LZ looks promising and can't wait to play a premium, don't think the pro has enough to be considered at least for me.

Wow that was pretty quick to get rid of that SE.You can count on that code being perfected by the way,they did that with DI for better balance.You might as well add another Stern to your collection.

#884 3 years ago

How old are you beevis?

#889 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

What are you taking about Willis? You have been trolling every thread with stupid bs questions? Even trolling owners thread which is really tacky bro. Keep on trolling
[quoted image]

I'm talking about the dumb pictures of Axel your using to deride Slashes GnR pin.By the way Captain Stern this thread is Led Zeppelin vs GnR's pinball !

#894 3 years ago
Quoted from thechakapakuni:

Oh and BTW, the other LZ poll about the Artwork. Take the double L Pinsister
How are you even still talking with that broken glass jaw?
“Down goes Led Zeppelin Down goes Led Zeppelin”
[quoted image]

Burn!

#901 3 years ago
Quoted from thechakapakuni:

Mystery solved! For the record, I like Steve Richie as well so sick burn!

Love Steve he’s a cool cat!!!

#915 3 years ago
Quoted from Jaybird815:

Interesting you’d pick a Gordon Ramsay burger, over priced and mediocre tasting. Ramsay’s a douche.

Ramsey’s a douche see that proves that LZ is way better then GnR!!!

#929 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

I am trying to figure out some of the 'psychological' aspects of being a pinball collector. One correlation I have made is how pride in ownership often takes over rational thinking and the need to try and 'defend' purchases and commitments leads to delusional thinking. Moving up to a CE may be dangerous-and make you clinch those pearls even tighter to make up for appearances sake.
The other correlation I have found is called the 'Pinside Parrots'. Typically these parrots have been around Pinside for less than a year(fresh off the boat) or have just a few of the latest games made(just getting started). I was once a parrot myself. What these 'Parrots' do is listen to other peoples opinions and then hours/days later repeat the same comments without really knowing anything. It has gotten so bad that I now look at how long someone has been around and what kind of collection they have. I have to now screen for who's opinion means anything to me. The best is when the PP start to troll, at least get your feet wet first before jumping in the pool.
Also Skyemont and Panzer-I respect both of the JJP leaders but the thumbs down is getting old. I personally never give thumbs down-but respond with conversation. May try it sometime

Mostly this forum is older 30 to 65 year old guys so you can drop the clutching your pearl thing you been repeating! Most of the argument LZ vs GnR is about the artwork which in my opinion is a silly argument.And now your jumping on the repetitive comment someone made referring to JJP games is ridiculous.I own DI and Wonka and neither are repetitive,far from it.Enjoy you Stern pinball machines and quit making silly arguments like LZ has better artwork then GnR

-2
#951 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

Another one of the 'Psychological' aspects is the need for attention and recognition. What some of these trolls do for a thumbs up has me shaking my head. Meanwhile in parent's basement-another keyboard commando is born. Oh Vey!

Quoted from pinmister:

Do not write off LZ as just another one. Best to actually play the game first. Everyone of Stern's games is different. I bashed the shit out of GOTG upon release-this is just a Metallica rehashed turd! Oh the similarity! Just another cookie-cutter Stern! Then I actually played it, and then I bought it. It is unique and plays nothing like my Metallica sitting right next to it.
Come on guys-at least play the game first-then make up your OWN mind. Do NOT follow the sheep or listen to the pinside parrots.

Parrots & Pearls damn dude do you get a % of each one sold?

#961 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

What about the fact that some of us buy for what the game is and not the perceived value? I buy games that are fun and I want to own. The price or value doesn’t matter to me. I know when I sell I’ll get a good chunk of my money back. Good enough for me.
GNR is super fun, but at 7500, I need more time on it to see if it’s for me or not. Too much money to have tied up in a game I don’t absolutely have to have. Could be the best value in pinball, it’s still 7500.
It’s easier to jump in on a stern pro at under 6k as I know it will shoot well, and if it’s not for me I’ll move it on for close to what I paid.

Actually a GnR SE is $6750

-1
#963 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

Exactly, they're toys, like my kids playdough. After 6 months to a year, time to move on to another. Luckily NIB machines don't depreciate much. I find it funny when people say machines have no soul, lol, it's a toy.

Plus shipping

Oh for god sake Chuckie baby probably has his delivered from Zack

#965 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

Whos Chuckie and Zack? Kids TV show?

Yup kids show with Chuckwurt & Zach Meny

#968 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

You sound upset

Over what I was just saying Chuckwurt was incorrect when he stated GnR was $7500

-2
#976 3 years ago
Quoted from wackenhut:

So I have been thinking about the art that everyone is complaining about, and the truth is that Led Zeppelin didn't have any really amazing art to work with. GNR is a totally different band. Stern used two album covers for the pro and premium. The only thing that would have made the LE Version amazing would be the Mothership cover with black, red, and tan. Anyone think otherwise?

Thanks for this information we hadn’t considered this yet.

#982 3 years ago
Quoted from benheck:

GNR is awesome. The light show during Live and Let Die is epic. Changes as the song does. It's like the "you are at a concert" feel of AC/DC cranked up to 11. Maybe even 12. It's also nice to see JJP drop the kiddie themes and make something raw and vulgar for the grown ups.
Haven't played Zep but judging by how, Um, "light" it appears can't imagine it being as cool.

Mr Heck has spoken!!!

#1006 3 years ago
Quoted from Elvishasleft:

Yah but he is referring to a light show as to what makes it great... a light show during a cover tune no less.
So its heavy on the fluff.. seems allot of you like fluff in the cold November rain (whatever the fuck that is)
Not a ton of comments that its awesome for its gameplay that I can find.

Dude you are delusional

#1010 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

What the "HECK" are you talking about?
It is so empty and bare-without actually flipping it makes it sound you are an armchair quarterback sitting back in your LAZY-Boy like your Avatar.
The "ART" is "ug"- you as a designer should know about what assets are available for certain licenses and how difficult things can be to get signed off on for "creative art". and yes the albums are great for "Fans".
"GNR" is an execution of a fantastic repetitive light show-it will really wow the newbie players for years to come!
Yes 007 is a fantastic "copied" song best performed by Paul and probably is the best part of the entire game
I do agree with your comments about it playing like Guitar Hero(actually a great analogy) It does just that-shoot for the next blinking light in sequence for song, now do that 20+ times in a row-again repetitive to many.
I also agree with your saying it is weird. To me it just feels off and does play weird-(great light show though).
I value your opinion as a designer and can say when America's Most Haunted was released, I shrugged it off and thought it was a turd. You know what happened next? I actually played and I ended up loving it! Do not judge a book by it's cover

Back up bro he already said GnR’s kicks ass!!!Give it up Capt.Stern

#1028 3 years ago
Quoted from Rolls-Royce:

I’m just grateful with my own personal and material dreams, thank you.
[quoted image][quoted image]

More power to you my Capitalist brother!

#1033 3 years ago
Quoted from Shapeshifter:

GnR has way more 'wow' than LZ but code will decide which has longevity in the home, especially if not a fan of either band.
GnR song jackpots seem real fun, just like ACDC.
But, reading other posts, scoring on album modes and progression is disappointing.......so far.
Hope it improves, as that is all that is stopping me from buying one.

You can bet your Benjamin’s the code will be a lot better on album modes and any other issues.
I owned DI for a long time and then out of the blue came theatre multiball and other polish.The game was done (I thought so)but damn Keith and crew slid another layer on the cake!I can assure they are listening and looking at the benefits of their audiences suggestions.

#1038 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

No it is not as it is the only game the local distributor has ever charged shipping

That is the MSRP

#1047 3 years ago

He sounds full of resentment for the iceman!

#1050 3 years ago

Watching IEpinball stream on twitch
GnR’s will keep us busy for months if not years so much going on

#1052 3 years ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

Stream was awesome...he's a good player...I'm surprised people say the game has no flow....

Yea me too and your right he's a good player you can tell he was getting pumped up when the encore was building up!

-1
#1057 3 years ago
Quoted from Lamberger:

I've made a ton of money from Ice tips, very much appreciated... Pretty cool that he's willing to spend the time and pass out info on his latest stock move... the more profits made, the more time we have to enjoy the finer things in life like playing pinball.

Ok,but it’s not fair that I don’t have as many pinball machines as you do.
Your all equal why should you have more?

-1
#1072 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

Anyone who pays tax on a machine is a moron and Sterns price includes shipping, not too mention you can get Sterns for $400-$500 under MSRP depending on the model.

Get another Stern then you and JY64 can hang out and talk about JJP sucks all day long!

#1077 3 years ago
Quoted from CaptainNeo:

these threads are always stupid, because nobody can really vote on a game they have never played extensively or seen in person. But it has a philly Cheesesteak option which is good, so you have something to vote on, before you can make a real decision down the road.

Totally agree with above.I jumped into argument when the artwork was brought up and who’s was better.

-1
#1082 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

LOL you agree with "these threads are always stupid, because nobody can really vote on a game they have never played extensively or seen in person. But it has a philly Cheesesteak option which is good, so you have something to vote on, before you can make a real decision down the road." you have 71 post in this thread hell I only have 7 you are the problem

I don’t know what your trying to say here it’s rather senseless but whatever I’m happy. I got another album on vinyl from my son!

D0F863EF-4745-4765-95B0-0E1831BC92A1 (resized).pngD0F863EF-4745-4765-95B0-0E1831BC92A1 (resized).png
-2
#1118 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

How much more could it have cost JJP to have the full color hot rails on an SE? Same install etc..
The bean counters at JJP cut maybe a $100 of Chinese made bulbs out of the machine.
Just doesn’t make sense as they would sell more SE if they had them or maybe that was really the agenda, wow people with the light show to force them up to the LE.

How much would it have cost Stern to hire an artist to do the Zeppelin line up!

#1122 3 years ago
Quoted from John_I:

Not sure why this question has to be answered a hundred times? You read all these threads and I know you have read the answer and are simply trolling at this point.
Certain licenses come with a set folder of art work and the company is not allowed to draw their own. I'm sure Stern would have loved to have generated something new, but they were not allowed to.

Now John you know would would be on JJP like stink on shit over that lazy artwork. What I said was a rebuttal to Paw757's comment about JJP being cheap with the lighting on the SE.

#1137 3 years ago
Quoted from Skyemont:

Could be cost cutting sure. Even when JJP did this, their pins are still better than the Zizzles.

Better then the Zizzles,I like that!

#1138 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

So you believe that they could not get the chest to open lets not forget the missing monkey they are cutting cost

Seriously these are the post that prove your just a troll!Stern has nothing even vaguely close to POTC BOM.You sit and wait for someone to make a comment and then pounce like it’s a competitive sport.I think your just trying to make yourself bigger then you are in reality.Just be happy with your little self and your Sterns

#1146 3 years ago
Quoted from Rolls-Royce:

JY, but in that one, a beautiful wood apron was added, amazing radcals, also a nice touch with the art blades included, and in my POV an impressive new art in the back glass, so they didn’t cut much I think...

It's going to be difficult to convince him,he actually thinks LZ is a better pin then GnR!

#1152 3 years ago

Wtf where did you see that monstrosity?

#1174 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

I was thinking more about this while driving. But I really think I'm right here. 4 ramps versus 2, and they're metal vs plastic. 2 spinners vs none. There's a lot more in LZ. But I think we've been spoiled with a lot of the games that have come out and expect a packed playfield every time. Otherwise we feel ripped off.
Were people arguing over this stuff in the 90s? I can just imagine them A/B'ing two games like TZ and AFM and saying how much more value you were getting from TZ.
The argument would have been ridiculous then and it's ridiculous now. Both are great games for different reasons. It's just that now games are so expensive, everybody's suddenly become an accountant when it comes to getting your money's worth. At the end of the day, you're still purchasing fun and entertainment. Nothing else. And it certainly shouldn't be viewed as an investment, or you're just a fool.

LZ may end up being more fun to some people but you got to admit that it’s an ugly sombitch!

#1186 3 years ago
Quoted from Chuckwebster:

And this Dirty Donnie/Rat Fink rip off isn't? all I've been reading is how bad LZ art is, but GNR has its issues too. With that said great art is just the icing on the cake of a good machine. How it plays and holds up is the most important things to me.
[quoted image]

GnR pro >LZ pro

#1191 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

+100
I've never seen a website--one that purports to be full of enthusiasts of a hobby--shit all over the joy and excitement people have in getting a new game and supporting the hobby.
I actually hate GnR--mostly because I can't stand the band--but I don't go into those threads trashing the game. The game looks great to look at, but I'm not interested in even playing it (although I will when shows start up again). You people continue judging games on early code and without even shooting the damn thing in a home setting. It's fucking moronic.
Don't like the game? Great. Say your piece and move on. I can't tell you how many people I've seen here change their minds about games within a year. Some people will never learn.

Dude the thread is LZ vs GnR is going to create some combative posting!

#1199 3 years ago
Quoted from pinballaddicted:

Dr pin has posted that he does not like either game. Also calling the games uninspiring and people that have bought the games suckers. Combative posting is fun. Negativity is not.

I was specifically talking about boobz comments above not someone else’s!

#1205 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

Thats why he said "I actually hate GnR--mostly because I can't stand the band"

That’s after he complains about threads that criticize pins that other people like.You must have short read that thread!

#1208 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

Read my post again. That's not what I said at all. I don't mind people criticizing pins others like. It's the constant bashing by the same people over and over as if you're trying to convince yourself of something. That kind of negativity is what drives people from this site and even from the hobby. State your opinion without being demeaning and condescending.

Oh cmon man you know you’ve done your share of bashing other people’s opinions.It’s ridiculous some of the things that are said here but I get this is a LZ vs GnR thread.I know it’s been hard to defend what Stern has done with this license but we can stop reaching for everything to convince people it’s better then GnR!It’s laughable to compare them

#1230 3 years ago
Quoted from thechakapakuni:

Meanwhile this is Gary Stern & Steve Ritchie showing up to repo a pin streaming and breaking their bogus EULA[quoted image]

Oh shit wtf was that!

#1247 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

I want to apologize for creating a VS thread that really is unbalanced. I thought about it and it really is no comparison. An epic band 'LED ZEPPELIN' with iconic timeless music, and the fabulously famous number one designer-'Steve Ritchie' with his signature fun, fast game design VS Guns N Roses-a band struggling to keep their relevance from the late 80's with Fat Axl running around stage way past his prime(lip-syncing), and another over-packed JJP game design with repetitive modes and unbalanced scoring. A game that actually has a great theme-plays well and has monster flow vs a box of pretty lights with Fat Axl running around on LCD screen?
Again my apologies for the un-balanced VS thread. In hindsight I should have made the thread name "Stern Heavy Metal vs. JJP Guns N Roses" Sorry guys-next time I will try and compare games in the same category. I would still take a Stern Heavy Metal over a JJP Guns N Roses. Now for the same 10 JJP trolls to thumbs down-rinse and repeat.

DELUSIONAL!!!!!!!
You guys seem even more defensive and defiant since the gameplay videos came out.

#1263 3 years ago
Quoted from John_I:

Actually four complete metal ramps, but who is counting?

Do you hear yourself,your actually bragging that the highlight of the game are metal ramps.

#1274 3 years ago
Quoted from Chuckwebster:

What toy does GnR have in it? a static top hat? clapping cymbals? On the other hand the Electric Magic mech is the most unique device made in a long time. A pop up optical spinner that is also a ball lock, and functions as a diverter and bi-directional kickback all while taking up zero playfield space, not obstructing the players view and allowing the game to be a flow monster.

There’s rumours that it also functions as a pretty decent flesh light ?

#1276 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Nah that would be the coin door on GNR for all the fluffers and puffers.

Definitely want a GnR now really just commenting on the very detailed grandiose assessment of that LZ mystery machine.I’ve got a feeling LZ will win best toy of the year for that one!

#1280 3 years ago
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

LZ LE four ramps to two flippers
GnR LE Two ramps to four flippers.

Do you really want to argue about what each pin has on its playfield?
GnR game of the year awards LZ best band ever but no game of the year!

#1282 3 years ago
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

What's the point of doing that? I know which one is coming to my house,
I watched the LZ streams.... after 30 mins I had to mute the sound...

Those all outs are pretty bad.

#1286 3 years ago
Quoted from Chuckwebster:

is that the best comeback you got? you never answered the question of what toy GnR has, other than your desire for it to include a fleshlight.
Lets compare features ------
Flippers: GNR 3 full size 1 mini --- LZ 4 full size
Pops: Both have 3
Magnets: GNR 1 --- LZ 2
Ramps: GNR 3 plastic -- LZ 4 Stainless steel (as a restoration guy fully metal ramps are a huge upgrade)
Spinners: GNR 2 mechanical switch -- LZ 1 mechanical, 1 optical
Special feature: GNR spinning disc (same basic design used in the 70's) -- LZ new Electric Magic multifunction pop up spinner/ ball lock, kickback etc...
Scoop/Saucer: both have 1
Side rail lighting - both have it
Ball Diverter/gate: GNR -- 1 LZ 1
Drop targets: GNR 0 -- LZ 1
Leaper target: GNR 0 -- LZ 1
Upper playfield: GNR yes -- LZ no
Playfield ball lock: GNR 6ball passive -- LZ 1 ball motorized
When you actually break it down the games are similarly equipped mechanically with devices that interact with the ball.
Personally i think GNR and LZ look good and more than likely ill own both. Not everyone has the same tastes in games and thats fine, however If you're gonna say a game "sucks" at least back up your statement with some kind of facts.

Man your working way too hard to be right!Enjoy playing your LZ pinball machine!

#1287 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

Yeah...you should hear the callouts in Wonka.

You too enjoy your new LZ pin!

#1304 3 years ago
Quoted from Squizz:

Don't know why you would feel Honored? More like a fool tbh!

Wow,Keefer comes in kicks ass drops the mic and the thread is dead!!!!!!

#1307 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Who was Keefer replying to?

Chuckwebstet

12
#1311 3 years ago
Quoted from BC_Gambit:

Fair; I don't think that anybody should be "hating" LZ at this point; how many people have actually played it enough to even form an educated opinion? People can be unimpressed all they want though.
And if you said "make room in your collection, buy one of the music themed pins from this year" it would be GnR for me (from what I have seen so far). Then LZ, then Heavy Metal. Others are free to spend nearly as much as a GnR on a Heavy Metal; if/when they do, I hope they enjoy it as much as I would enjoy a GnR.
Having this many choices is crazy compared to where the hobby was 10-20 years ago.

Quoted from Elvishasleft:

If you say so...
Pretty surprised someone from a manufacturer feels the need to chime in on these dumpster fire threads.
Not the most professional thing in the world IMO.

He has every right and I’m glad he does speak up when someone has misspoken about the technical points of a game he worked on!
Right on Keefer!!!

#1333 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

I was actually really surprised he would attempt rebuttal in a total troll thread-where nobody has actually played the other game and cant make a comparison. This thread is comical and everyone clinching their pearls has me laughing out loud.
Keefer is the 'King' for JJP
He is the 'King of Rainbow Shows With No Flow'

You really don’t listen do you?
He is not talking about LZ at all he’s correcting misrepresentation from Chuckwebster.

#1336 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

Clean that ear wax out bro-he is talking about Keefer coming into troll thread-now catch up

Ok Capt Stern we’re done

#1380 3 years ago
Quoted from Elvishasleft:

Whatever man... I play the stupid things and when they dont play great its disappointing.
Its not like I had my fingers crossed I wouldnt like it, I was looking forward to it.
Srry I cant jump on the game of the century bandwagon.

Thank you very much uh huh now leave the building!

#1387 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

Yes all you JJP FB's can stand in front of your machines and stare at them-they are pretty. You may even pop-up that collar and take some pics of you standing in front of your box of lights and then go to your Facebook page and post about it. Meanwhile I will be actually playing my games-not just looking at them.

Just two points here!
Have you played Wonka?The game plays smoother and faster then 85% of pins out there.Dialed In is another fast pin,if you know what your doing and their both deep which means a lot of replay value.
Question What the hell is with you and Pearl clutching did you mother wear pearls and beat you with a metal clothes hanger?

#1398 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

I know how to tweak and rebuild flippers. Since it's a pretty common complaint, it must be their system.
There is clearly a difference in flipper strength/response between JJP and every other manufacturer.

Complaint by people that don’t own them.When I play Stern’s they feel and sound cheap but I realized that work fine they just feel different.This is a fall back argument when fanboys have nothing else!Just admit that GnR at least looks better then LZ and we’ll figure out how better one plays then the other later

#1419 3 years ago

Ramps&Loops Loops&Ramp faster faster faster oh spinner the best spinner ever created spinner faster faster faster!!!

#1441 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

I think it is a great game for newbies or people with a larger collection-adds variety. I do see people with smaller collections getting it for the dazzle and then quickly learn the gameplay is so so and want something different. Time will tell-we have a ways to go for the honeymoon stage to wear off.

Damn Capt Stern you are having a breakdown!Fucking relax man it’s ok if some people like GnR.

#1453 3 years ago
Quoted from Elvishasleft:

You guys are funny...
You cant say anything negative about GNR without getting piled on as a JJP hater.
In the same way people were disappointed in LZ art I was disappointed in GNRs game play.
Thats all.. I have owned a few of their games and have one still so how I am a JJP "hater" I have no idea.
Sorry that I actually played it before calling it game of the century unlike most of you.

Ok we know how you feel now.Now take your boyfriend pin mister and hit the road!

#1454 3 years ago
Quoted from TaTa:

[quoted image]

A picture worth a thousand words!!! You

#1464 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

Yes not only do JJP flippers suck-their plungers really suck!
Not even in the same ball park as Stern's snappy one's?
I cannot stand JJP flipper plunges! Weak sauce

You like that Stern sauce!!!!

#1471 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

I don't know I was playing Wonka last week and I seriously had to plunge 3 times on a particular ball? I was like-am I doing something wrong? Put a real spring in there or something?

Bullshit I have Wonka and I nail the skill shot 85% of the time and you can plunge easily thru the pops to start.This is when you know someone on Pinside is full of shit.
When they don’t have facts to prove their argument they just make shit up.

#1494 3 years ago
Quoted from Elvishasleft:

If I had one on order I would want someone who actually played it to give me an honest opinion but whatever.
If you guys are happier saying its game of the year before even playing it more power to you.
Ill give you that one.. the pictures look great.
Ill keep an eye out for all the for sales once you get the game home and realize I am right... maybe I can get a cheap used one later.

What the hell are you yammering on about plenty of people own this game LE and se and it’s getting great reveiws.Bless your heart I guess you just didn’t know?

#1496 3 years ago
Quoted from TaTa:

I couldn't give you more then one up vote, so hopefully this helps...
[quoted image]

Thank you sir!

#1502 3 years ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I'm curious as to what game u give high praise?....u hide your collection so hard to tell

Just a guess?

A7602977-8A06-4B54-BBF3-E9F49B8C9C0A (resized).pngA7602977-8A06-4B54-BBF3-E9F49B8C9C0A (resized).png
#1519 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

Well I was private messaged by a JJP fanboy that- "you are being antagonistic". He then went into a storybook about why JJP was better.
Look guys, I realize we are all passionate about pinball and we all have our own opinions, but that is what makes this hobby great. I do not like JJP games, several of my closest friends love them. It is all good and we all can love different things. I started this thread as a hype thread and it quickly turned into a troll thread. I started to really troll as some pinsiders claimed JJP is better than Stern without any real basis(you must play the game to have a true opinion).
While I was trolling-I was really just poking and having fun. I feel some people are taking my comments personal and it really is getting under their skin. I want to apologize(for real) to anyone that was offended by any of my comments. I was trolling and it was just for fun, so please do not take it seriously. I value everyone's opinion-good or bad.

So you’re saying you give up?

#1522 3 years ago
Quoted from pinmister:

No just that the back and forth trolling is starting to offend people and that is not my intent. As much as I would like to circle jerk with you and Panzer all day- I will chill out-light some incense, and wait for LZ to arrive

Wasn’t serious just wolfin man!

#1527 3 years ago
Quoted from TJG81296:

Best porn star maybe....
Chad Smith is up there....
I, being a newbie, have played GNR and ordered it. Did I make a weak flippin mistake?

You have chosen wisely

#1530 3 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

The decision was made long before either of these games were announced, just in case they were announced.
That decision being I am not part of whatever demographic these companies are trying to suck money out of, and I try not to be some useless old fart living in the past.

Just who the hell are you stranger?

#1545 3 years ago
Quoted from Doctor6:

Most of which was sight unseen.

So what are you implying?

#1547 3 years ago

Seems obvious (what jorant is implying).
It doesn't matter what the title/BOM/gameplay is, the home collector market is red hot and ANY LE will sell out. The fact that a game sells out doesn't mean the game compelling or any good. Just means there is plenty of money sloshing around and demand (for new games) is way higher than supply.<

I know I was just being a shit stirrer!

#1549 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

The irony is LZ will sell twice the games as G&R if for no other reason as the fact if Jack wants to put out TS he has only 12 months to manufacture games and even after ten years they still are struggling to put games out

I’m curious did Jack come over to your house one morning and piss in your corn flakes?Just be happy with the fucking pins you like.I will practices what I’m preaching this Sega vs Nintendo shit is stupid.

-1
#1553 3 years ago
Quoted from Lamberger:

Not 5000 sold out, lol. Tons of flippers buying LZLE(they might loose $$$. lmao), I don't think anyone is flipping GNRLE

I realize he’s in a different country,but the the hell did he just say?

#1569 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

They really do. I'm buying $10k pins on a music teacher's salary...this isn't some hedge fund money I've got lying around. And when you have a dream theme that you're excited for and a bunch of people are shitting on your excitement repeatedly and saying the same thing over and over--without even having played the damn thing or waited for mature code--well...it wears on you a bit.
But I went through all of this when Star Wars came out, and Game of Thrones. The most recent was the trashing of Stranger Things, which I was really excited for and had on order. That was supposedly the biggest piece of shit ever made. Now people are finally coming around to seeing it's a really fun and addictive game.
I wish people would approach these games with a little more restraint and patience, that's all.

I think Steve had said LZ was his dream theme.AC/DC Luci rocks it’s what pinball and rock should be.When you have two rock games come out at approximately the same time like LZ and GnR did you can’t help compare them.GnR has a shit ton of personality when you see the drumsticks,guitar headstocks and a ton of rock band references everywhere and then the best rock band in history comes out and your stunned how bland it looks.It’s a damn shame it has nothing to do with Stern bashing.Believe me I know unfair bashing I was an early buyer of Wonka.I thought the gameplay was genius and all I heard was Kaneda and Stern fans criticizing it

#1601 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

If you like to play pinball, LZ. If you like to look at lights, GNR.

Check with the man at IEPinball twitch stream and see how much fun GnR’s box of lights is.
Magic Girl = box of lights
GnR =box of hyper fun
LZ=box

#1628 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

That has to be some kind of record if true. How many have they built? Even a quarter of that? Going to take forever for them to catch up on that backlog. Good problem to have though.

A very good problem to have and even better if they follow it up with an ass kicking Toy Story the money will be flowin!What I’m curious about is the following titles they can really turn things around

#1637 3 years ago

I think the original argument was just the artwork and then it morphed into Stern vs JJP battle.
And the other obvious criticism from most was how empty the LZ looked
Better art and vacant playfield are obvious the gameplay was argumentative

#1653 3 years ago
Quoted from snaroff:

I'm the same way...that's why my only LE is Tron LE...the king of LE's! Pre-Premium. I much prefer the GNR LE art package over the CE.

I thought I preferred the GnR LE too until people started posting pics of the CE’s unboxed.Damn that pin is badass!

#1668 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

My guess is the heavy emphasis on multi-ball was very intentional as the chaos makes the game have a rock and roll feel to it. Also, maybe Slash loves multi-ball (who doesn’t) so it was loaded up with multi-ball modes?
I think it is really “fun” especially for novice players, but good players will not enjoy it over time because it doesn’t test shotmaking enough (although if it is part of a collection, that variety could be a plus too).
P.s. I love the variable ball lock on the guitar head. Really cool idea and works well, but specially with the light inserts on the head.

I’ve talked to and seen some very good players play GnR and the general feedback is great with an emphasis on One more game!

#1670 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

I think it is far harder to remove things from the rule set than to add so the multiball will stay. I fell there should be atleast one easy to start multiball but G&R does go overboard

You’ve never played it,but you are an expert?

#1674 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

The hell I would I have bashed Stern LE prices many times

You weren't bashing pricing you were saying how GnR doesn't play the way you think it should

#1675 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

Thats the thing about watching game play streams good players make it look so bloody easy

GnR > LZ

#1683 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

Thats because he knows the fun games vs where the money is at.

Now this is a very stupid observation!Cmon man you saw the interview with Eric from SDTM

#1688 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

Post the link

I'm pretty sure everyone has seen

Quoted from JY64:

Post the link

You can find it at You Tube Guns and Roses featurette from SDTM.
Great job Zach Meny!

#1701 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

JJP is ten years old stop acting as if they are a startup

JJP is a new company in some respects!Brett is taken them in a new direction of continuing quality and profit.Move to Chicago area closer to the suppliers and centrally located.Unleash the beast that GnR is and follow with knock out Toy Story with first three movies toys and artwork.Another 500 CE’s sold out and then a surprise title for once

#1703 3 years ago
Quoted from Hayfarmer:

Wish I was in business 10 years before I was concerned about being profitable

The owners made statements saying there had been profits , they were looking to grow of course.

#1706 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

This is true. They'll start building the next title in about 2-3 months. Don't care as long as they make my LZLE first.

If anything has come out of this thread I’m still not interested in buying a LZ but I’m sure listening to their library of songs.Still the greatest rock band of all time!

#1712 3 years ago

JY64 is taking my statement about JJP out of context

#1722 3 years ago

Cary Hardy just posted a reveiw of LZ pro on You Tube!A jukebox with flippers. Wow

#1735 3 years ago
Quoted from Hayfarmer:

Or, enjoy what you have and don't feel the need to trash others.

I think your friend Pinmister named his thread GnR vs LZ?

#1744 3 years ago

A jukebox with flippers.

#1751 3 years ago
Quoted from DrJoe:

Have you played either game? Extensively? Serious question.

No just responding to the often used Stern fans that GnR’s is just a box of lights.

#1755 3 years ago
Quoted from DrJoe:

So you've played neither game, but posted 140 posts in a single thread that compares two games? Maybe you should lead with that (I've never played either but I'm a fanboy trying to sound like an expert). I realize pinside chases away most people that actually play pinball (due to the noise vs. signal ratio), but man it's gotten way worse lately. Nothing of substance. Enjoy your podcasts, I'm gonna go play some pinball......

The majority of my post were referring how GnR was so much better in the artwork department which has become an accepted moot point after a long period of denial.
I’ve never claimed to play either game but like Tommy’s dad said
You don’t have to stick your head up a bulls ass to see if it’s a good steak I’d rather just take the opinion of folks I trust that have played both.

#1779 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Unless you have names or proof it’s nothing more than straw man talk.
LZ is one that doesn’t license very much unlike some others that are whores for $$$ and the stuff they do license is in the game art in one way or another.
It is what is is and I’m appreciative of what we got as a fan of the band.

It’s a shame that the licensing folks for Zeppelin wouldn’t let them be more creative with their property.
But calling Slash and GnR properties money whores is not very fair.In other words that statement is bullshit.The reason this pin has so much authenticity is Slash loves pinball!Can you imagine the coolest pinball machine ever with you in the credits and born from your band!
I would be proud!

#1784 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Huh? Didn’t say anything about GNR or Slash in my post or even a pinball mfg, it was more of a shot at bands like the Beatles who license just about any kind of merchandise from underwear to lamps, jukeboxes, lunchboxes etc... I can go on and on. LZ just doesn’t do that with their brand.
Some of you guys really jump to some crazy conclusions and twist words.

Your kidding. Right?

#1795 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

Which is totally fine. You are allowed to prefer packed playfields over better flow.

How about decent playfield,cabinet and translite artwork?Come on man you just keep screaming flow like Carrie in the shower after gym class

#1798 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

I guess I was just assuming all would agree that things like artwork are highly subjective aspects of the game to which people may have a difference of opinion? If you love the look of one versus the other, great. I wasn't taking a position on that as everyone can see the photos of the games and judge for themselves, but most have not played either or both of them so my focus was on gameplay.
Not sure what you are so defensive about? I have rated both games and rate GNR LE an 8.5 and LZ Pro an 8.0.
That doesn't change the fact that LZ Pro shoots better. If you disagree, its either because you haven't played them or you are in denial.

Quoted from Hayfarmer:

Which game did you order?

I will definitely be getting a GnR LE as soon as they start back on production line

#1800 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

I guess I was just assuming all would agree that things like artwork are highly subjective aspects of the game to which people may have a difference of opinion? If you love the look of one versus the other, great. I wasn't taking a position on that as everyone can see the photos of the games and judge for themselves, but most have not played either or both of them so my focus was on gameplay.
Not sure what you are so defensive about? I have rated both games and rate GNR LE an 8.5 and LZ Pro an 8.0.
That doesn't change the fact that LZ Pro shoots better. If you disagree, its either because you haven't played them or you are in denial.

Enjoy your LZ I couldn’t convince you that the sun was shining here today if your were standing here

#1805 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

What are you talking about? I’ve played them both and I didn’t even say I preferred LZ. In fact, I said I rated GNR higher, but I guess you only read what you want to see...
If you like bombing the flipper buttons to smack endless multiball modes into a center scoop (while listening to worse music), GNR is definitely the way to go!

Alright Carrie you made your point!
You say,hey man I’m open minded and then you make the statements above! Full of shit!

#1808 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

Not at all. You just aren’t listening. Still.
If I was to rank the 5 most satisfying shots between the two games, they would rank like this:
1. LZ Left Ramp
2. LZ Right Ramp
3. LZ Center Ramp
4. GNR Right (“drum sticks”) Ramp
5. LZ Left Orbit
Did you know that GNR has only one shot that always goes back to the flippers? Only the right (drum sticks) ramp goes back to the flipper every time. The left ramp goes back to the left flipper only when the diverter is up (but it is usually down).
So when I talk about flow, I am talking about how almost every shot in LZ goes back to the flipper (only the dead-end shot and the right orbit do not), and almost none of the GNR shots come back to the flippers.
So in LZ, you are constantly hitting the ball with your flippers. In GNR, you hit it, and then wait for it to go through the pops, or the upper playfield, or in the scoop. GNR has a ton more going on than LZ, but it doesn’t have any consistent flow to the shots (but it also isn’t a sniper game like JP or AIQ).
Combine that with A TON of multiball modes and you are either hitting the ball and waiting for it to bounce around before coming back to the flippers, or are just spamming the flippers to keep up with the regular 4 and 5 ball multiballs. It also has the worst plunge in pinball (but don’t worry, because LZ has the second worst plunge). It’s also worth noting that for all of the cool stuff on the playfield, GNR doesn’t really have any toys (other than the bad-ass Gibson guitar head ball-lock that I absolutely love).
I’ve said all along that different people like different things, but trying to argue that these two are on the same level in terms of shots is like arguing they are on the same level in terms of packed playfield. It is no contest in both cases. Now which of those two things you prefer is up to each person to decide.
You seem to want to decide for everyone that GNR is better and then insist on arguing about things that are not arguable. GNR may be better, but the shots aren’t...
You’ll see what I mean once you play them.

I’m sorry,did you say something?

#1811 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

How was the flow?

Not near as good as Star Wars!

#1819 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

Truer words have never been spoken...

I really need to remember the little sarcasm emoji!

#1830 3 years ago

God damn the whole front line of the Stern Army is here today!

#1833 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

It doesn’t need to be a safe return to the flipper to have flow, but it does need to go back to the flippers in some manner (orbits and horseshoes aren’t technically safe but still promote flow). But in general, in my opinion, if you execute a shot cleanly, it should be a relatively “safe” result.

Man you can quit with the flow lessons most people here already know.

#1835 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

If you played either of the games, then you might have something relevant to say.

I may have not played either one but one things for sure GnR will be game of the year and LZ will not because it’s so fucking stripped down ugly!

#1841 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

This is the thing that I'm really curious about. The GnR crowd...many of whom don't even own the machine and have no vested interest in it...see fit to consistantly rag on LZ. I wonder what a licensed psychologist would say about this...

They would say you obsessed with trying to convince us of liking what you do!
I don't give a shit what you buy.This all started with the disappointing introduction of this Zeppelin pin.Most people were shocked how bare playfield and how bad the artwork was,many of them well known artist on pinside.And then Stern fans started getting overly defensive about LZ .Lets all agree to disagree and buy the pin we want!

#1846 3 years ago

I guess I’m not getting much back up today.Oh that’s right they’re all playing their GnR’s today!Adios Bitches!

#1856 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

GNR and LZ aren’t even competing for game of the year in 2020. LZ isn’t eligible for the 2020 ballot so it will be game of the year in 2021!

I bet you a Benjamin right here and now that this is not chosen as the game of the year 2021!

#1857 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

Damn, I got screwed, too flat.
[quoted image]

I guess you got lucky.

7A8C6886-12ED-4297-9F21-69975F7A8C50 (resized).png7A8C6886-12ED-4297-9F21-69975F7A8C50 (resized).pngE3B29EE6-72A9-45D7-972B-8B475A635212 (resized).pngE3B29EE6-72A9-45D7-972B-8B475A635212 (resized).png
#1866 3 years ago
Quoted from PokerJake:

How would you know? Stern has been much more accommodating than JJP when it comes to fixing issues.

I don’t think Stern has made a statement concerning this matter.
I don’t JJP did either but the company (Mirco) has.JJP and crew have been very helpful concerning any issues I’ve had.

#1869 3 years ago
Quoted from Lamberger:

Anybody else get there reverse Orbiter 1 Jukebox yet?

With flippers!

#1873 3 years ago
Quoted from SWfan:

You two are so cute! Any idea how long the drive is from Indiana to Ontario?

No idea but it’s only 28 hours for you and poker jake

1 week later
#1887 3 years ago

Damn I think Eric and the JJP crew are going to need a wheelbarrow to carry all those awards they won tonight!

#1896 3 years ago
Quoted from Lamberger:

That's shocking... hmm, I can see non pin head Led Zeppelin fans getting suckered.

I took him to mean that after people where able to see Led Zeppelin they got off the fence and ordered GnR?

#1900 3 years ago

Wow did anybody watch The Pinball Network awards show?Damn looks like Guns n Fuckin Roses cleaned up last night!I actually kept count for awhile but then .......

#1940 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

In toys, artwork, and lightshow. Not necessarily in fun. If I was hanging the game on my wall to look at, I'd be in for GnR all the way.

Running around the same old ground!Must be tiring to continue to piss on our legs and tell us it’s raining.I would find something else to compare your Stern too instead of GnR (game of the year)

#1946 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Come on now let’s be fair here not every game has this and GNR has its issues as well.
Just saw the photos of all the raised inserts this week on a GNR. Not good!

You can fix those inserts if they were high I couldn’t tell from photos and no more was said about it.But one thing I know from being a carpenter contractor for 30 years that bowed LZ is trash!

#1952 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

Thank you...you beat me to it. If it's an opposing opinion, it's the same old ground. If it's his opinion, it's fact. And what some people are too narrow-minded to see is that I just gave a bunch of complements to the game they keep creaming their jeans over. But I complement LZ and I'm clearly an idiot.
You learn quickly what kind of people you're dealing with around here.

This is a vs thread so this is war boy!The compliments are gas lighting bullshit.This thread is over and GnR won !Maybe next year Stern will win?

FB848D4B-47E4-499C-8E2A-A0E60845D49A (resized).pngFB848D4B-47E4-499C-8E2A-A0E60845D49A (resized).png
#1956 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

Thank you for marginalizing my opinion; by doing so you've really opened my eyes to what is important in life. You are truly the best of what Pinside has to offer and I so appreciate your wisdom and insight into what I should like. Clearly I'm not paying enough attention to the professionals in this hobby that vote on toys for an invented awards show. (There's an invented holiday as well, but I suppose I'm wrong in not paying attention to that, either.) I'll have to put more of my valuable time aside and give the opinions of others some serious consideration going forward.
I am deeply chastened, humbled, and more apologetic than you'll ever know. Thank you so much for setting me straight.

Glad I could help.

#1963 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Your description is very accurate of JJP games and that is part of the problem. For the average person, super deep rules is a major turn off.
For a die hard at home it’s fantastic.

And we’re die hard at home so yeah they’re fantastic.I loved High Speed 2 and I had a beautiful example but it got repetitive pretty quick.That’s why games like Wonka JP and GnR appeal to me.

-5
#1972 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

No. It's nearing time for another year-long break.

See you later alligator!

#1980 3 years ago
Quoted from Chisox:

Yeah let’s get rid of one of the funniest and most respected guys on this forum. And a guy who opens his wallet and supports the forum I might add.

Oh so now it’s my fault?

#1985 3 years ago

Here’s the funny one!

#1987 3 years ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Quote of 2021 right here, f’ing hilarious!

Well the year is young but actually his quote is really pretty childish so I don’t think it will hold up!

#1991 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

I think that was a game I restored. And all along I thought that was just wax buildup...

Oh god she can probably hear you coming!

#2000 3 years ago
Quoted from screaminr:

Ha , for $14,500 thousand dollars I think decals should be included but they have sold out , so what do I know .
[quoted image]

Led Zeppelin music is loved by many

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