(Topic ID: 299309)

Stern Insider Connected

By anathematize

3 months ago


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    There are 1,852 posts in this topic. You are on page 26 of 38.
    #1251 54 days ago
    Quoted from Sprudeldudel:

    Plus there's always going to be that glass-off idiot, wo Ruins the leaderboard for everyone.

    Gotta get those achievements on location if you’re trying to compare with others and compete. Achievements at home won’t be officially verified. Those will just be for bragging rights.

    There’s no value to be seen. Every new game will have these whether it’s your cup of tea or not.

    But if you’re deciding for legacy games, yeah that’s gonna need to be pretty cheap or have incredible value for people to adopt it on a large basis.

    #1252 54 days ago
    Quoted from Rum-Z:

    From what I understand, achievements will only be "verified" if done at a coin drop locations, to try to thwart the glass-off idiots. I don't know how this will exactly work for hobbyist/at home owners of these games when we get an achievement. Is the achievement worth less points? Is there two totals for achievements "Verified" and "Non-Verified"? I dunno. Even at coin drop locations, you could have some ne'er do well tech stay after hours and "glass-off" the achievements. Not that I know or have ever known any ne'er do well techs of course.

    Dwight talked about this the other day on the flipnout twitch stream. It looks like verified achievements earned on location will earn twice the points as an unverified achievement earned at home. You can still earn all the achievements at home, they’re just not worth as many “points”

    The points are like the Xbox live gamer score where each achievement has a special point value.

    A lot of insider connected talk during this stream. Fun discussion

    #1253 54 days ago
    Quoted from chuckwurt:

    Gotta get those achievements on location if you’re trying to compare with others and compete. Achievements at home won’t be officially verified. Those will just be for bragging rights.
    There’s no value to be seen. Every new game will have these whether it’s your cup of tea or not.

    The way I see it, if someone is so hung up on being validated by high scores/achievement points/etc then they will most likely find a way to game the system. It's not always that difficult. (Ha, I know the guy collecting and he let me play after hours with the glass off at the sub shop)

    In general, the cost to close all the various edge cases can be prohibitive. For example, consider just the man hours/time required for the design/engineering/test of this one feature. In this case, I'm convinced this was a choice Stern made because there are bigger problems to solve up front and they need to actually deliver a product.

    That being said, there are plenty of "big data" ways to shore up the validation of a persons play that doesn't require it to be on location. The most simple solution that comes to mind is to simply log each switch activation with a timestamp and to save that history with each score. So this is going to give flipper activation and time of flight info. In the early stages this is a LOT of data, and sorting this manually is probably prohibitive but it can be examined if there are questions. Later, machine learning algorithms can be used to compare and contrast this info to all the other scores that are logged and provide some measure of guarantee that the player actually played the game, rather than manipulated it. I'm suspicious that they probably log all this info already simply for the software/game development engineering. So uploading would be pretty basic. It becomes a storage problem at first, and a ML problem later. But having the data up front means more than validating it right away.

    Can someone scam this, yes but it's definitely going to require more effort. Most of these "security" devices are more about making it difficult and keeping honest people honest.

    Anyway, just my thoughts. YMMV.

    #1254 54 days ago
    Quoted from chuckwurt:

    $149 or under and everyone will get it.

    Speak for yourself…..

    #1256 54 days ago

    I would love for the insider connected kit to be $99 or less. That way more home owners and operators will be able to add the kit.

    #1257 54 days ago
    Quoted from Coz:

    I would love for the insider connected kit to be $99 or less. That way more home owners and operators will be able to add the kit.

    I barely care about putting my name up on location, let alone paying for the privilege of competing with randoms from the internet. Who knows though, maybe they will somehow make it fun. Knowing stern, this 110% about sucking in more cash, and if it is, that will likely suck out the fun.

    #1258 54 days ago

    Earned a few on location last night, but nothing is showing as verified in my profile. Is this something that has to be enabled by operator? It def was popping them on the lcd during the game

    #1259 54 days ago
    Quoted from TonLoc777:

    Earned a few on location last night, but nothing is showing as verified in my profile. Is this something that has to be enabled by operator? It def was popping them on the lcd during the game

    Was this at Padavan's? We were able to register the game yesterday, but i had no luck changing my account to a Pro account. Probably something I am doing wrong or Stern needs to vet it out first. It didn't help that I was having phone problems. I'll be reaching out to Stern to sort it out.

    #1260 54 days ago
    Quoted from BrianBannon:

    Was this at Padavan's? We were able to register the game yesterday, but i had no luck changing my account to a Pro account. Probably something I am doing wrong or Stern needs to vet it out first. It didn't help that I was having phone problems. I'll be reaching out to Stern to sort it out.

    I don’t think the pro accounts are live yet.

    #1261 54 days ago
    Quoted from chuckwurt:

    I don’t think the pro accounts are live yet.

    The games at Pin-Go-Go are verified. Pro accounts are live.

    #1262 54 days ago
    Quoted from scootss:

    - Current way: Pay $40 and get access to exclusive content. No stuff sent to you. (definitely not worth it)

    The current way still gets the yearly swag, just like before.

    #1263 54 days ago
    Quoted from chuckwurt:

    I don’t think the pro accounts are live yet.

    They are - but you must manually get it done by contacts at stern

    #1264 54 days ago

    I only see two locations listed with connected games.

    #1265 54 days ago
    Quoted from chuckwurt:

    $149 or under and everyone will get it.

    Pretty sure it is $279, based on what a distributor told me

    #1266 54 days ago
    Quoted from herbertbsharp:

    Pretty sure it is $279, based on what a distributor told me

    I’m out at that price unless I can write it off. I’m sure lots are in the same boat.

    #1267 54 days ago
    Quoted from herbertbsharp:

    Pretty sure it is $279, based on what a distributor told me

    If true, big fail by Stern.

    #1268 54 days ago

    If they're gonna make money from subscriptions they should sell at cost... making a profit on the device risks success of the subscription IMO.

    #1269 54 days ago

    IC devs need to have a clear scan response when these games are not connected IE “Game Offline” Would also be nice if it’s not connected, it could send the update later once it does connect or send the update through your phone app. That might solve the inconsistencies of locations not being connected

    #1270 54 days ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    IC devs need to have a clear scan response when these games are not connected IE “Game Offline” Would also be nice if it’s not connected, it could send the update later once it does connect or send the update through your phone app. That might solve the inconsistencies of locations not being connected

    If not connected - you just don't get to scan in. This isn't hard

    The funky state is if the game was previously registered, but isn't valid now.. then when you scan in, it rejects you and doesn't let you badge in, tho badging in is offered.

    #1271 54 days ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    or send the update through your phone app

    That is a clever workaround. Why not use everyone's connectivity instead of having a single point of failure?

    #1272 54 days ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    That is a clever workaround. Why not use everyone's connectivity instead of having a single point of failure?

    There are more important questions... like why is the latency and throughput to their service point so bad.

    Our game was reporting over 1000ms latency and 500kb/sec throughput.. where other devices on same network were getting over 4meg down and 1meg up to public speed test sites. 1000ms latency is crazzzzy for anything domestic. Someone do some traffic inspection and see where their service point is. I gotta imagine this is pure application stuff at this point, those numbers are just pathetic for anything sitting on a normal datacenter site.

    4gig downloads at 500kb/sec? ouch...

    #1273 54 days ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    There are more important questions... like why is the latency and throughput to their service point so bad.
    Our game was reporting over 1000ms latency and 500kb/sec throughput.. where other devices on same network were getting over 4meg down and 1meg up to public speed test sites. 1000ms latency is crazzzzy for anything domestic. Someone do some traffic inspection and see where their service point is. I gotta imagine this is pure application stuff at this point, those numbers are just pathetic for anything sitting on a normal datacenter site.
    4gig downloads at 500kb/sec? ouch...

    I hope that they don't need to download full update images to update. and do the SD cards have room for an 4G download file anyways?

    #1274 54 days ago
    Quoted from Tranquilize:

    I barely care about putting my name up on location, let alone paying for the privilege of competing with randoms from the internet. Who knows though, maybe they will somehow make it fun. Knowing stern, this 110% about sucking in more cash, and if it is, that will likely suck out the fun.

    Agree. I have been on the fence about Godzilla only because of pricing and the interconnect feature. To be honest I think having the interconnect in pins going forward and having to pay for it irks me the most. $700 price increase on the Pro with a more than gratuitous portion of that is portioned into the Purchase price of the game. And for something I have no interest in having. Revenue stream and compiling data off users. George Gomez also said Stern will "partner" with other interests. How will they share the data and with whom ? Will we see ads at some point if not a paid subscriber ?

    I surely will not retrofit any game I own and I am leaning to being done spending my pin dollars with Stern going forward. Normally I would have been in on the new game even prior to day 1. Not this time. I may not even purchase this time.

    Not adopting this for any of my Stern games. Owner of 14 of the 17 games this can be meant for. Not happening. Questioning future purchases.

    This may be for some - but not for me. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I do not think I am alone in my thinking.

    #1275 54 days ago

    Lol. Just disable it. It’s not stealing your pearls.

    #1276 54 days ago
    Quoted from Joe_Blasi:

    I hope that they don't need to download full update images to update. and do the SD cards have room for an 4G download file anyways?

    While JJP has done delta updates, Stern hasn't done those for prior updates.. and no tip offs of changes yet.

    I haven't looked at the cards, but I bet they are at least 16gig... hard to find smaller these days. Doubt space is much of an issue.

    #1277 54 days ago
    Quoted from Rum-Z:

    From what I understand, achievements will only be "verified" if done at a coin drop locations, to try to thwart the glass-off idiots. I don't know how this will exactly work for hobbyist/at home owners of these games when we get an achievement. Is the achievement worth less points? Is there two totals for achievements "Verified" and "Non-Verified"? I dunno. Even at coin drop locations, you could have some ne'er do well tech stay after hours and "glass-off" the achievements. Not that I know or have ever known any ne'er do well techs of course.

    It’s a wonder why the glass off morons find it satisfying to cheat the system we could all have such fun with. What’s happened to integrity?

    #1278 54 days ago

    Yeah on Pindigo this wasn’t an issue, but I’m sure somebody did it. With everything going online it seems like (sadly) maybe it’s time to have a glass out sensor? Again lame but hopefully this doesn’t become a thing

    #1279 54 days ago
    Quoted from BrianBannon:

    Was this at Padavan's? We were able to register the game yesterday, but i had no luck changing my account to a Pro account. Probably something I am doing wrong or Stern needs to vet it out first. It didn't help that I was having phone problems. I'll be reaching out to Stern to sort it out.

    Yes, this was at padavans. All good and we will def be back out soon. Really like Godzilla and Halloween and thanks again for always getting the new games in early

    #1280 54 days ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    maybe it’s time to have a glass out sensor?

    How would a glass out sensor even work though? Surely it would be difficult to do or create something that could just as easily bypass it if you have access to the internals of the machine.

    #1281 54 days ago
    Quoted from shaub:

    How would a glass out sensor even work though? Surely it would be difficult to do or create something that could just as easily bypass it if you have access to the internals of the machine.

    I think Doctor Who had a glass off sensor actually.

    #1282 54 days ago
    Quoted from RoyalJack:

    I think Doctor Who had a glass off sensor actually.

    Right. It’s a switch. That anybody with a piece of tape could easily “defeat” if they were pathetic enough to want to cheat on their “achievements.”

    #1283 54 days ago
    Quoted from RC_like_the_cola:

    The current way still gets the yearly swag, just like before.

    I think the merch box is already gone. I believe I heard it / read it somewhere and the page to sign up is now a 404 error. https://sternpinball.com/stern-insider/

    So perhaps I should have said...now you can't sign up anymore...

    #1284 54 days ago
    Quoted from scootss:

    I think the merch box is already gone. I believe Iheard it / read it somewhere and the page to sign up is now a 404 error. https://sternpinball.com/stern-insider/
    So perhaps I should have said...now you can't sign up anymore...

    I chose the upgrade now option on Wednesday when I got into Insider Connected. The checkout page showed the merch in the pics and I better be receiving that stuff.

    #1285 54 days ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Right. It’s a switch. That anybody with a piece of tape could easily “defeat” if they were pathetic enough to want to cheat on their “achievements.”

    I definitely can't argue that. I was just stating its been done before.

    #1286 54 days ago
    Quoted from RoyalJack:

    I definitely can't argue that. I was just stating its been done before.

    yeah but for completely different reasons and goals.

    Dr Who was simply a safety feature to avoid chopping fingers off. It had no ambitions to keep the dishonest under control.

    It's all rubbish anyways. Just wait till we have 'verified events' or achievements based on doing it at certain locations under certain conditions, etc. This can go on and on and on. People getting worked up over digital trophies now will have a field day when this actually matures to where the rest of the world already is.

    Think IFPA Championship verified achievements, etc etc etc

    #1287 54 days ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    With everything going online it seems like (sadly) maybe it’s time to have a glass out sensor?

    As long as the owners are gods of their machines -- any effort here is pointless. It's not meant to be a fool proof system, it's meant to be for fun.

    In the future I'm sure there will be things that can only be earned under other conditions too.. don't sweat it.

    #1288 53 days ago
    Quoted from scootss:

    I think the merch box is already gone. I believe I heard it / read it somewhere and the page to sign up is now a 404 error. https://sternpinball.com/stern-insider/
    So perhaps I should have said...now you can't sign up anymore...

    The merch box isn't gone. I'm sure the page will be up shortly too. A lot of things getting switched around for the new system.

    Quoted from RC_like_the_cola:

    I chose the upgrade now option on Wednesday when I got into Insider Connected. The checkout page showed the merch in the pics and I better be receiving that stuff.

    You will.

    #1289 53 days ago

    So just logged in and locations are popping up (three). I see you flynnibus! Sadly your game is 854 miles away.

    I hope there is an API that something like Pinball map can hook into. Would help them augment their database with verified games on location. Also think the locations should be filterable and listed in order of closest to your home location (or even current location). Stern are you listening?

    insider_locations (resized).JPG
    #1290 53 days ago
    Quoted from GoodOmens:

    Sadly your game is 854 miles away.

    Godzilla is worth the trip!

    Stern has gotten their initial batch of operator pros out... hopefully by Expo Stern will have the pro setup more streamlined and location maps start populating quicker.

    #1291 53 days ago

    So far 4 Godzilla Pros are connected out of 26 on location (Pinball Map). Wonder what the ratio ends up being? I do like being able to see if the game has the most recent code, etc.

    Weather or not the features have staying power beyond the initial novelty really depends on how Stern implements it.

    #1292 53 days ago

    Stern really need to roll out retrofit kits for this takes off and see a big uptake of locations, at the minute if you don’t have a Godzilla you can’t roll this out at your location.

    And get an APP out ASAP! No one wants to use a web browser link especially kids, my misses little brother has previously had no interest in my pins at all the idea of achievements finally has his interest but the lack of an APP “is not cool and makes for hard work!” not my words but the thoughts of the younger generation.

    #1293 53 days ago
    Quoted from J85M:

    Stern really need to roll out retrofit kits for this takes off and see a big uptake of locations, at the minute if you don’t have a Godzilla you can’t roll this out at your location.
    And get an APP out ASAP! No one wants to use a web browser link especially kids, my misses little brother has previously had no interest in my pins at all the idea of achievements finally has his interest but the lack of an APP “is not cool and makes for hard work!” not my words but the thoughts of the younger generation.

    I can appreciate the complaint. However, I don't know if Apple's stance has changed from my prior experience. A company I used to work for had a problem trying to make a free utility app that could leverage built-in cameras for barcode scanning. We gave up trying to get it certified by Apple and went with a web UI and Bluetooth wedge scanners.

    They might kick back Stern's app since it requires external hardware to function (i.e. IC enabled pinball machines) and subscription fee options outside of Apple's ability to take a percentage cut.

    -1
    #1294 53 days ago
    Quoted from Flipstream:

    I can appreciate the complaint. However, I don't know if Apple's stance has changed from my prior experience. A company I used to work for had a problem trying to make a free utility app that could leverage built-in cameras for barcode scanning. We gave up trying to get it certified by Apple and went with a web UI and Bluetooth wedge scanners.
    They might kick back Stern's app since it requires external hardware to function (i.e. IC enabled pinball machines) and subscription fee options outside of Apple's ability to take a percentage cut.

    worse case is that apple wants 30% of the coin drop + 30% of the MSRP of the pinball game.

    #1295 53 days ago

    This is pretty slick. I like how it shows your name on the screen and the achievements that pop up during the game.

    BCFinsider (resized).jpg
    #1296 53 days ago

    Is there an android app for this? I can't find it in the google play store.

    No idea if this will be good or not - but willing to try it out before making that decision.

    #1297 53 days ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Is there an android app for this? I can't find it in the google play store.
    No idea if this will be good or not - but willing to try it out before making that decision.

    just the website insider.sternpinball.com

    #1298 53 days ago
    Quoted from buttcheekflipper:

    just the website insider.sternpinball.com

    Then this is a really dumb question - How do you get your QR code on your phone in order to scan it?

    #1299 53 days ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Then this is a really dumb question - How do you get your QR code on your phone in order to scan it?

    There's an icon at the bottom center of the web page that opens a window with your unique QR code. It only shows up when the browser width matches the responsive page layout limit for a mobile device:

    pasted_image (resized).png

    #1300 53 days ago
    Quoted from Flipstream:

    There's an icon at the bottom center of the page that slides opens a window with your unique QR code.

    Got it - thank you. Viewing the website on a desktop versus a cell phone browser is different. I had to use my cell in order to see the QR code option at the bottom.

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