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(Topic ID: 283626)

Stern Hot Hand picture needed

By Madmax541

3 years ago

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Latest reply 3 years ago by Madmax541
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#1 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Have a non working Hot Hand project need to verify wiring is correct at three connectors @ voltage regulator assembly are correct.
Issue is 43 volts not getting to coils.

The schematic & J1 wiring pins6 & 8 are different.
Realizing sometimes schematics are wrong
Could someone with hot hand take pictures of J1,J2 & J3

Attached are pictures of wiring on this hot hand

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#2 3 years ago

MJS

schudel5

Pinside member

20y 166K 6,396 27

Is your fuse F4 blown? Sure looks like it and that will prevent 43V from getting to the coils.

FUSE (resized).png

#3 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

I forgot to mention at SDB 43v is present.

Checked F4 it’s not blown

#4 3 years ago

Shredso

Pinside+ Frequent

12y 88,800 3,035 7

I just checked my shop out pics and I only have the playfield, game is long gone. I do remember that board being a PITA though. One of the connectors can be swapped, or upside down. I forget exactly what is was. I think my J3 had 2 connectors. It looks like yours is rebuilt into a single connector. Good luck bump. This is a fun underrated game.

#5 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

Follow the schematics.
The Blue-White 43V coil wire and the Red and White G.I wires are in the wrong positions on your J1 playfield power connector.

Two Stern games (not sure which ones) examples:

https://images.pinside.com/f/83/d6/f83d633697f7c4b3931af03570d049778a61306e.png

https://images.pinside.com/6/56/5c/6565c842cd9d3314b87c6462b0ecccffaea36e12.jpg

Hot Hand doesn't have a 43V wire at J3 pin 13. It was used on their earlier games that had the knocker in the head. Hot Hand has the knocker in the cabinet and gets 43V from J2 pin 2.

Note all the G.I lamps may have potentially blown having received 43 volts.

Quoted from Shredso:
This is a fun underrated game.

#6 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Thanks Quench.

Rebuilt voltage rectifier connectors J1 J2 J3 & replaced all GI bulbs.

Two issues remain:
1) left flipper when engaged blows F4, all other coils work. Weebly MPU & alltek SDB

2) sound board when connected to power locks up game. Pics attached, would like to confirm J1 & J2 are wired correctly. Schematic shows correct pin out but can’t verify wire colors. Could capacitors be shorted out?
Or is there more damage to sound board. Don’t know history game received in this condition.

Thanks for help guys.E701CF4D-8CB4-4F5D-AE7C-9D64D3553F6B (resized).jpeg84B81CCB-1136-4A51-8F85-83AEF53B9536 (resized).jpeg

#7 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
1) left flipper when engaged blows F4, all other coils work. Weebly MPU & alltek SDB

Check if it's wired correctly - use the right flipper as an example.
Check if either diode on the flipper coil is shorted.
Make sure the EOS switch is opening at full stroke. Push the plunger in to check this, don't rotate the flipper as this doesn't take component wear/slack into consideration.

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
2) sound board when connected to power locks up game. Pics attached, would like to confirm J1 & J2 are wired correctly.

You have the ribbon cables for the sound board oriented correctly. Check if either of those ribbon cables are off by one position on each end - I can't quite tell.
J2 looks ok.

#8 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Yup left flipper coil wired incorrectly.
Sound board - I recapped - now it makes a only noise sound no tones.
Sound board Connectors line up correctly.
With all miss wiring wonder if IC on sound board got damaged.

Any thoughts on sound board?

#9 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
Sound board - I recapped - now it makes a only noise sound no tones.

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
Any thoughts on sound board?

When is the sound board making the noise? All the time or only when you're playing a game and the tones are coming out as noise?
The soldering on the long pin header at the top of the sound board often cracks on some pins. Inspect it with a magnifying glass and resolder any suspect looking pin headers joints.

#10 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Cleaned up connectors installed new set of cables . Game boots up and plays tones
Need to get more games on it. After completing a game, it locked up requiring master reset w on off switch.
This happen once out of eight games.

I have other things will be repairing over next couple of weeks.

#11 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
Cleaned up connectors installed new set of cables .

Does that mean sound is working properly now?

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
After completing a game, it locked up requiring master reset w on off switch.

See the below link: I had to do this mod on my game as it had the same intermittent issue.

https://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Bally/Stern#Stern_Hot_Hand_Not_Booting_at_5th_Flash_or_Game_Locks-up_at_Game_Over

#12 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Tones are working w fix, just seems their should be more tones.

Pinwiki fix works.
Will try to take videotape record sounds

#13 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

Make sure you've got DIP switch #8 on the MPU board set to ON for full insert coin/game start melodies.

The Stern SB-100 rev C1 sound board has 6 sounds (four tones and two sound effects):
#20 - 10 point sound
#21 - 100 point sound
#22 - 1000 point sound
#23 - 10000 point sound
#24 - Add bonus sound
#25 - Pop bumper sound chirp

The "add bonus" sound effect is not used on Hot Hand since there's no add bonus feature.

See the second half of this post about how to tune the tones on the sound board:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/stern-sb-100-sound-problems#post-5848806

#14 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Flipped #21 on notice additional sound I was missing.

My game sounds totally different then sounds in videos.

I will definitely tweak some of the pots on sound board.

Appreciate the link.

#15 3 years ago

MAX

pinballshack

Max

Freeport, FL

11y 33,150 56 6

I have a Hot Hand game. Wires missing from 5 bank target assy along with coil. Replaced coil but what color wires go to the leads and which goes to the banded end of the diode? Photos would help

#16 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Looking for Hot hand drop solution.
Short story, I put in new drop targets from PBR. New DT didn’t work, so I put original one back in.
Now when DT bank resets DT don’t stay up.

Looking at my only other classic stern Seawitch, it built a little different. Bally DT are different, more familiar w Bally’s.

Attached are pics let me know if I reassembled it wrong.
Springs are connected to middle hole on lever arm.
Cheers

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#17 3 years ago

237

slochar

Pinside member

7y 86,550 6,907

If you raise the drop manually can you make them stay up? If so is there any slop in the coil plunger to link assembly?

The newer drops in Seawitch have a rod that the (shorter) spring attaches to, so don't look at that one.

Is it all 5 drops that don't stay up or some of them? What didn't work on the PBR replacement? I've found that the new drops brick so I just don't replace original drops any longer, but there was no issue resetting them. The reset stroke has to bring all the drop lips about 1/16" over the ledge they rest on.

did you adjust the switches at all when you had it apart, any excessive drag from the bent actuator leg will prevent a smooth reset (and drop).

#18 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Manually resetting DT bank, DT don’t stay up, this applies to all 5 DT

#19 3 years ago

237

slochar

Pinside member

7y 86,550 6,907

Compared to a spare 3 bank I have here from the same era, your top plate is installed upside down it looks like.

#20 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Could you send pic?

#21 3 years ago

237

slochar

Pinside member

7y 86,550 6,907

Missing parts but you can see the top plate is concave vs. the other way. You can tell if push it up and at their peak, the little rib is no where near the top.

20201223_100850 (resized).jpg

#22 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Got it, will work on it this afternoon.
Appreciate picture

#23 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Yup flipping plate - problem solved

Looking at stern manual it showed plate installed the original way I had it.

Thanks for the help slochar

#24 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

See the below link: I had to do this mod on my game as it had the same intermittent issue.
https://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Bally/Stern#Stern_Hot_Hand_Not_Booting_at_5th_Flash_or_Game_Locks-up_at_Game_Over

Installed capacitor per recommendation 2.2uF 250 v as shown in pic, hot hand does lock up occasionally.
Did I miss something?

61CEDDE1-9CFF-4144-AA1E-5D42F1DB0856 (resized).jpeg

image (resized).jpg

#25 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Quoted from Quench:
When is the sound board making the noise? All the time or only when you're playing a game and the tones are coming out as noise?
The soldering on the long pin header at the top of the sound board often cracks on some pins. Inspect it with a magnifying glass and resolder any suspect looking pin headers joints.

The squelching noise start in middle of game play followed by game resetting and booting up or sometimes requires reset with n and off switch.

#26 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
Installed capacitor per recommendation 2.2uF 250 v as shown in pic, hot hand does lock up occasionally.
Did I miss something?

Is this particular lockup only happening at 5th LED flash or game end when the large flipper motor is switched off?
What voltage varistor did you use? Got a part number?

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
The squelching noise start in middle of game play followed by game resetting and booting up or sometimes requires reset with n and off switch.

Did you reflow the long pin header at the top of the sound board? It sounds like a continuity problem between the MPU board and the sound board.
Disconnect the ribbon cable from the MPU board and play some games to see if it reboots mid game.

#27 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=V130LA20AP

Part number on MOV installed is P130L20 cap is 2.2 uF 250v
Will get some games on it tonight w cables going from sound card to MPU disconnected.
These are new cables.

image (resized).jpg

#28 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Disconnected cables going from sound card to MPU, played @25 games no lock ups or resets.

Assume issue is w sound card, caps replaced and headers resoldered.

Next step?

#29 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

Squelching after power up is usually indicative of a bad connection from the MPU board to the SB-100 sound board. You have a new MPU board and new ribbon cables.
What condition is the long pin header on the sound board in? Corroded/tarnished?
Post clear high res pictures of it.

#30 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Reset and loud squelch happens in middle of game play.
Hasn’t occurred since ribbon cables disconnected, no reset

image (resized).jpg

#31 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

The pin headers don't look too bad.
Post some clear high res pictures from the back of the board including some of the long pin headers soldering.

#32 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Took pics of 0.156 header pins zoomed in to find solder cracks.
Removed old solder & resoldered w new solder, installed sound board.
Played @20 games no issues.

Zooming in with camera really helped see crack in header pins.
Thanks for help in pointing in right direction.

Happy New Year 2021!

#33 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
Took pics of 0.156 header pins zoomed in to find solder cracks.

Happy New Year!

BTW, the new electrolytic capacitor you've got at C47 is polarised. It's supposed to be non-polarised (bipolar). If you look at the original you'll notice it doesn't have a negative "-" leg. A polarised capacitor is going to see reverse voltage in this amplifier output circuit.

1 week later

#34 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

C47 replace with what type of capacitor?

#35 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,036

OP
Quoted from Madmax541:
C47 replace with what type of capacitor?

A bipolar capacitor also known as non-polarised.

https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=CERBP-220uF-35V

#36 3 years ago

Madmax541

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 110K 2,059

Perfect. Thanks Quench

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