(Topic ID: 171152)

Stern coffee table book Kickstarter?!?


By MinusWorlds

3 years ago



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    #501 2 years ago
    Quoted from puck:

    The paper flock team has been really good when I reach out. Today was no exception, they have assured me that an update is coming early next week. Happy happy joy joy
    I have no idea what said update entails but it will be good to have some communication!

    See post 495...

    #502 2 years ago

    Update from the backer email list:

    ***************************

    Hello Kickstarter Backers!

    I know we are long overdue for an update and we really appreciate your patience.

    The good news is this book is going to be even better than we planned! As you all might have guessed we were waiting on the announcement before we did this update. We are trying to include as many of the newer machines as we can, but are still trying to lock down which of the new titles we can use.

    So when will we finish this thing? The addition of new machines is such an amazing opportunity, and we want to take advantage of it to the fullest. This means following some of the new titles’ production through to completion sometime in September, which will put our finishing and printing sometime in October! We will of course be working diligently on the writing, photography, layout, and all details of the book up until that time. We believe that including these machines will be a great addition to the book and a great way to look at the process.

    We would also like to reach out to any of you that have historical photos of Stern facilities, people, or machines in the wild you would like to contribute to the project. We have a couple amazing people that are sharing their historical photos with us, but want to open up this opportunity to our backers too!

    ****************************

    There was also a draft of the intro to the book that I didn't copy.

    10
    #503 2 years ago

    I guess the decision is made but the book should have capped at 30 years and batman. There will always be a new game coming and the book will be out of date shortly after publishing so this delay seems unnecessary.

    #504 2 years ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    I guess the decision is made but the book should have capped at 30 years and batman. There will always be a new game coming and the book will be out of date shortly after publishing so this delay seems unnecessary.

    I sort of agree with you there but I think the temptation to have Star Wars featured was just too great, the brand will have a lot of attention this fall with the new movie coming out and they probably hope to tie in with that. Hopefully the retail edition of the book hits stores in time for the holiday gift giving season.

    #505 2 years ago

    They're probably talking about the next game after Star Wars.

    Anyhow, nothing much we can do but wait.

    #506 2 years ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    I guess the decision is made but the book should have capped at 30 years and batman. There will always be a new game coming and the book will be out of date shortly after publishing so this delay seems unnecessary.

    agreed. Sounds like an excuse and lack of accountibility for the missed deadline. Weren't these commited to being in peoples hands by now? done and delivered?

    #507 2 years ago

    I think that the opportunity of "following some of the new titles’ production through to completion" is less about what titles they are following but about documenting the process from conception to the finished product. That is my take on what they meant.

    I guess I can live with it but would like to be compensated by them including the transparent overlay described in their stretch goal

    #508 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    agreed. Sounds like an excuse and lack of accountibility for the missed deadline. Weren't these commited to being in peoples hands by now? done and delivered?

    The estimated delivery date was May 2017, so a projected five month delay.

    #509 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballlew:

    I think that the opportunity of "following some of the new titles’ production through to completion" is less about what titles they are following but about documenting the process from conception to finished progress. That is my take on what they meant.

    Re-reading it I can see what you mean. If they have been documenting the development of Star Wars (and maybe Aerosmith) from the beginning it could be a very interesting chapter in the book with an unique and potentially unprecedented look at the development of a new machine. Fingers crossed.

    #510 2 years ago

    Don't these things always take longer than planned? I'm not surprised about a delay. Better to take some extra time and make an amazing book (rather than being on time but publishing something mediocre).

    The only thing lacking so far is the communication about the project, in all honesty. Some teaser images every now and then would be nice. That normally makes the whole Kickstarter experience a lot more fun for me.

    On a positive note, I did find the book intro text they posted to be pretty well written, and I am very much looking forward to this book.

    #511 2 years ago
    Quoted from robin:

    Don't these things always take longer than planned? I'm not surprised about a delay. Better to take some extra time and make an amazing book (rather than being on time but publishing something mediocre).
    The only thing lacking so far is the communication about the project, in all honesty. Some teaser images every now and then would be nice. That normally makes the whole Kickstarter experience a lot more fun for me.
    On a positive note, I did find the book intro text they posted to be pretty well written, and I am very much looking forward to this book.

    Thats good to know about the intro being well written, I didn't want to read it and will wait for the book in my hand.

    #512 2 years ago
    Quoted from Matesamo:

    We would also like to reach out to any of you that have historical photos of Stern facilities, people, or machines in the wild you would like to contribute to the project.

    So this struck me as odd...isn't Stern collaborating on this so why wouldn't Gary and staff have photos from over the years? It makes me wonder if Stern wanted them to focus on current products and didn't provide them, or how much Stern is contributing if they need backers to pony up photos to have anything. Again, I just found it puzzling but I'm glad to have an update of some kind...

    #513 2 years ago
    Quoted from Matesamo:

    The estimated delivery date was May 2017, so a projected five month delay.

    is this acceptable?

    is this acceptable for a 100% crowd funded project?

    Keep in mind that Joe sold everyone on the commitment for timely delivery and meeting hard deadlines. Playing devils advocate here, but typical pinside fashion would be to string them up and slay them.

    In reality it is not like a complicated pinball machine they are building. We are talking about some pictures, some text, and hiring out the actual manufacturing to a book company.

    They did this crowd funding on the backs of the pinball community, then it came to light they did not even have all the needed players lined up after they got funds, and now they are working on 2x the production schedule and by the sounds of it have almost nothing done.

    #514 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    They did this crowd funding on the backs of the pinball community, then it came to light they did not even have all the needed players lined up after they got funds, and now they are working on 2x the production schedule and by the sounds of it have almost nothing done.

    I see this as no different than the 30th anniversary party that stern threw last year @ expo using the cash paid by customers to access the party. that party was further made even more awesome by the contributions by the patrons at the "cash" bar for food and drinks

    #515 2 years ago
    Quoted from JoeDP:

    The book will be delivered in May of next year as indicated on the pledge level of every reward on the kickstarter page.

    Just a bummer that this was stated clearly, and then the first we hear of a delay is June 2017.

    #516 2 years ago

    Personally the delay doesn't really bother me at all. I guess the older I get the faster time seems to go so five months isn't that big of a deal for a book. Now if this was a NIB pinball machine it would probably bother me.

    #517 2 years ago

    It's just a book but i'm burned out on blown deadlines and "radio silence".

    10
    #518 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    is this acceptable?
    is this acceptable for a 100% crowd funded project?
    Keep in mind that Joe sold everyone on the commitment for timely delivery and meeting hard deadlines. Playing devils advocate here, but typical pinside fashion would be to string them up and slay them.
    In reality it is not like a complicated pinball machine they are building. We are talking about some pictures, some text, and hiring out the actual manufacturing to a book company.
    They did this crowd funding on the backs of the pinball community, then it came to light they did not even have all the needed players lined up after they got funds, and now they are working on 2x the production schedule and by the sounds of it have almost nothing done.

    Yes it is acceptable. Plus I think you're greatly exaggerating. It's just a book, man. Yes, they promised a delivery date. Yes, some things could have been done more professionally. But also keep in mind that it's a two-man operation. This is not exactly going to be a bestseller (in terms of sales generated), so I say cut them some slack. If you can't handle these types of delays, maybe you shouldn't be participating on Kickstarter. Sorry, I don't mean to sound harsh, but really...

    If there's one thing to be bothered with, I'd say it would be with the lack of communication to backers. It would be cool to get glimpses of the "work in progress", be taken on the "journey" of making this book. But I digress.

    #519 2 years ago

    I don't mind a delay....what annoys me was they had plenty of communication prior to the deadline.....then boom! Nothing after that. I have about 20 Kickstarters backed and all of them give constant updates, even if its a quick status. At least the pinball card game came way early, so it makes up for this uber-late book.

    Maybe if they threw in the clear pages that peel away layers of a pinball machine, that would make up for this huge delay (hint hint)

    11
    #520 2 years ago
    Quoted from robin:

    Yes it is acceptable. Plus I think you're greatly exaggerating. It's just a book, man. Yes, they promised a delivery date. Yes, some things could have been done more professionally. But also keep in mind that it's a two-man operation. ...

    I'd say $55,000 gives anyone plenty of room to source out to all the professionals you need to get this done in time. They're not even writing it themselves. I could have done it for less and have it done by now and I'm a one-man operation...

    #521 2 years ago
    Quoted from unigroove:

    I'd say $55,000 gives anyone plenty of room to source out to all the professionals you need to get this done in time. They're not even writing it themselves. I could have done it for less and have it done by now and I'm a one-man operation...

    that was the first thing I thought of!

    Shame that you were not the one doing this and the pinball community bought in to a fly by night company with no ties to the pinball world rather than someone previously vested in the community.

    #522 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    that was the first thing I thought of!
    Shame that you were not the one doing this and the pinball community bought in to a fly by night company with no ties to the pinball world rather than someone previously vested in the community.

    Well I guess the question is why they did not choose Unigrooves proposal over this one.

    #523 2 years ago

    Don't care about all the new Sterns, give me the history of the transition from DE to Sega to Stern. This is where you should be spending a lot of time. Anyone can write a fluff piece using easily obtainable info on new machines. It would take some digging and investigation to start at the beginning--which is the part of the story I'm most interested in. A five month wait for Star Wars isn't acceptable--sounds like an excuse for running behind schedule. That would also tend to explain why there has not been any updates or teasers--nothing to report. However, Joe, if you use this extra time to really get into the history of the company, the wait will very possibly be worthwhile.

    #524 2 years ago

    I think that the backers of this project should have been asked if they were okay with a 5 month delay to allow for the inclusion of new games. We funded this project and it would have been nice to have had a bit more communication of the status and upcoming plans.

    #525 2 years ago
    Quoted from Backyardace:

    I think that the backers of this project should have been asked if they were okay with a 5 month delay to allow for the inclusion of new games. We funded this project and it would have been nice to have had a bit more communication of the status and upcoming plans.

    Thete is a risk the project will not be fulfilled and you will lose 100% of your money. We knew that going in. They have zero obligation to renegotiate. If anyone gave money to this project that they couldn't afford then shame on them.

    For almost everyone this is less than $125. I'm blown away by the outrage and sense of entitlement in this thread. There are people in this thread that are hoping it will fail. Just amazing.

    #526 2 years ago
    Quoted from Rondogg:

    Thete is a risk the project will not be fulfilled and you will lose 100% of your money. We knew that going in. They have zero obligation to renegotiate. If anyone gave money to this project that they couldn't afford then shame on them.
    For almost everyone this is less than $125. I'm blown away by the outrage and sense of entitlement in this thread. There are people in this thread that are hoping it will fail. Just amazing.

    Its just amazing how much acceptance there is of an unknown group taking in $50K plus then reappearing AFTER the original shipping date saying "trust us, 5 more months, we'll have this, don't worry..."

    Where have I seen that story before?

    It is not hoping it will fail, just how many times do you have to see this play out before you take your blinders off? At this point the onus is on them to show they are actually getting stuff done.

    They don't owe ME anything, but they owe their backers the darn book, not excuses. It's not complicated.

    #527 2 years ago

    I am a backer times 2 for the LE book and Zombieyeti artwork package and like I said before this is a book, I don't feel worried that they won't follow through and deliver what's promised. I looked into their track record before I decided to back them and went into this knowing that there is a risk. If you are using kickstarter you should know the risks. Them taking 5 more months for a better overall book I am ok with, I have zero worries that they will fail and not deliver.

    Seems most the people complaining are non backers for what reason besides inciting I have no clue.

    #528 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballlew:

    I am a backer times 2 for the LE book and Zombieyeti artwork package and like I said before this is a book, I don't feel worried that they won't follow through and deliver what's promised. I looked into their track record before I decided to back them and went into this knowing that there is a risk. If you are using kickstarter you should know the risks. Them taking 5 more months for a better overall book I am ok with, I have zero worries that they will fail and not deliver.
    Seems most the people complaining are non backers for what reason besides inciting I have no clue.

    They are the same people who disappear entirely when the project is finished and delivered. Just once I'd like to see one of these keyboard commandos say "I was wrong, sorry for pissing in your punchbowl."

    #529 2 years ago
    Quoted from Rondogg:

    Thete is a risk the project will not be fulfilled and you will lose 100% of your money. We knew that going in. They have zero obligation to renegotiate. If anyone gave money to this project that they couldn't afford then shame on them.
    For almost everyone this is less than $125. I'm blown away by the outrage and sense of entitlement in this thread. There are people in this thread that are hoping it will fail. Just amazing.

    I'm in for $125 and I believe I have the right to post my opinion just like everyone else. I'm not outraged and I don't think it is entitlement to ask for better communication. I pledged my support for this book and they still have that support. If the extra 5 months makes it a better book, that will good for all of us who funded it.

    #530 2 years ago

    I am also a supporter, and I guess my question is--where are they right now with the book? It should be ready to be published, but I'll bet my pre-order to Predator it isn't. Just tell us you are behind, sorry about that, and sorry about the lack of communication, but we will be using (some of the) the extra time to further update the book.

    -3
    #531 2 years ago
    Quoted from Backyardace:

    I'm in for $125 and I believe I have the right to post my opinion just like everyone else. I'm not outraged and I don't think it is entitlement to ask for better communication. I pledged my support for this book and they still have that support. If the extra 5 months makes it a better book, that will good for all of us who funded it.

    You wrote: "the backers of this project should have been asked if they were okay with a 5 month delay". You don't think that's entitlement?

    #532 2 years ago
    Quoted from Rondogg:

    You wrote: "the backers of this project should have been asked if they were okay with a 5 month delay". You don't think that's entitlement?

    Its just common sense it should have been communicated prior to, you know, missing the initial publishing date completely (if that is what happened).

    I may just be a keyboard commando, but I am an interested potential buyer if they can make something worth buying. Crazy that

    #533 2 years ago

    I'm a supporter at one of the higher levels and given my background, I don't have any worries.

    a good writer can easily knock out the framework for a book in a matter of hours and start to have it fleshed out in a couple of days. I used to author video game strategy guides for prima and brady and in some cases we were given less than a week to have the all of the text for the book submitted.

    layout can be another story, but again if you have someone that is good at their job and has a clear "vision" of what they want, most if not all of the pieces of the puzzle tend to fall in place

    I think that joe's only shortcoming is lack of information in a timely manner. anyone who's visited this forum knows how fickle we can be as a group and how quickly support can wane

    #534 2 years ago

    Thanks for helping me get thru a few games I would have never finished...

    #535 2 years ago

    Supporting a Kickstarter (I supported this one at the $125 level) is not like pre-ordering from Amazon. It is a commitment to creative people that provides the funds for a goal that they could not otherwise work towards. The problem with creative people and Kickstarter is that they forget that some people tend to look at it like pre-ordering and not supporting a creative project and they do not communicate as much as they should.

    Believe me this happens often with Kickstarter projects. Shenmue 3 just got delay from this year to Fall 2018; I backed a roll playing book that was supposed to ship last fall that just sent out an email after five months of silence that they were finally done with the book.

    Is it right? It does not bother me personally but when an estimated ship date is May and on June 1st there are people commenting about refunds, potential theft of funds and other such nonsense I can see that perhaps it is not for everyone.

    #536 2 years ago

    Can you blame anyone on Pinside for being a little skittish about people asking for money upfront, getting the money, disappearing from the forum for weeks on end, not posting updates, extending the completion date and having shipping delays?

    #537 2 years ago
    Quoted from Billy16:

    Can you blame anyone on Pinside for being a little skittish about people asking for money upfront, getting the money, disappearing from the forum for weeks on end, not posting updates, extending the completion date and having shipping delays?

    nope, but I am amazed at some of the hypocrites that have Heighway and Dutch on blast but are perfectly fine with this book deal which has all the same symptoms (take money and then issues, missed deadlines, broken promises, lack of communication, excuses).

    Sorry, but if people think the pre-order pinball issue is unacceptable then the pre-order book club is the same. I dont buy the "kickstarter is different" clause. They are both in the same club here.

    #538 2 years ago

    I would say the price point of a preorder pinball versus a preorder book makes comparing the two a lot different.

    #539 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballlew:

    I would say the price point of a preorder pinball versus a preorder book makes comparing the two a lot different.

    ok, so running off with $125 is cool but $250 is not.

    Glad we have a measuring stick for this

    #540 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    ok, so running off with $125 is cool but $250 is not.
    Glad we have a measuring stick for this

    No nothing is cool with running off with any money. I just don't see this kickstarter going that way. I don't have any doubt that they will deliver. I believe they will albeit delayed. I thought that people have thousands deposited with heighway and Dutch? I didn't realize it was $250.

    #541 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballlew:

    I didn't realize it was $250.

    I am not sure about DP.

    With Predator is was anywhere from $250 to full payment
    With Heighway it appears to be anywhere from $250 to $1000 deposit with some in for full on their own request.

    #542 2 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballlew:

    No nothing is cool with running off with any money

    agree 100%.

    My entire point is that currently the symptoms of this book deal nearly mimic that of Predator.

    #543 2 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    agree 100%.
    My entire point is that currently the symptoms of this book deal nearly mimic that of Predator.

    Agree 100%
    At least it does nearly mimic the threads; you have no skin in either but sure love sharing your opinions in them, lol. I'm kidding, at least you aren't accusing Paperflock of a crime.

    Quoted from Whysnow:

    ok, so running off with $125 is cool but $250 is not.
    Glad we have a measuring stick for this

    Oh shoot...

    #544 2 years ago

    I also think the entry point for this kickstarter was $55 or something like that to receive a "pro"

    #545 2 years ago

    I heard that joe is still finalizing the book binding so that it falls apart after a few reads to replicate the current cabinet issues

    I'm joking of course. given that the last 3 kickstarters that I've participated in have run a bit late, this one doesn't surprize me in the least bit.

    #546 2 years ago

    Since the book is delayed, I decided to back a few more things on Kickstarter to keep me busy

    Card and dice games..... lots to choose from

    3 weeks later
    #548 2 years ago

    My guess would be Spring 2018 before it ships. They are so far behind and are not motivated to do the smallest of updates. They also are done taking our money TagerLaw so don't expect a reply here, but they are good about returning eMail I have found. I would imagine by know we would have seen some art from Zombie Yeti. Paperflock if you are reading this, part of the fun is following along on the journey. Ups and downs. So post more, and shorter, updates. Please.

    #549 2 years ago
    Quoted from puck:

    My guess would be Spring 2018 before it ships. They are so far behind and are not motivated to do the smallest of updates. They also are done taking our money TagerLaw so don't expect a reply here, but they are good about returning eMail I have found. I would imagine by know we would have seen some art from Zombie Yeti. Paperflock if you are reading this, part of the fun is following along on the journey. Ups and downs. So post more, and shorter, updates. Please.

    The longer it takes, the more project money is burned, so no idea why people think this being delayed will result in a better product.

    Kickstarter needs a way to slowly release funds as specific milestones are met. This give them all the money at once thing is dumb, hence the countless crowd sourced failures.

    #550 2 years ago
    Quoted from tacshose:

    The longer it takes, the more project money is burned, so no idea why people think this being delayed will result in a better product.

    Agreed, I don't subscribe to the idea that delays = better product.

    Quoted from tacshose:

    Kickstarter needs a way to slowly release funds as specific milestones are met. This give them all the money at once thing is dumb, hence the countless crowd sourced failures.

    Slow release of funds is a good idea, it would prevent some projects from going, but would put the fire under projects like this to move. The other side of the problem is that it's a pre-order system even if Kickstarter maintains that it isn't.

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