Looks very safe from a layout perspective, but I'm sure it will shoot and flow like a dream. Nothing really overly creative or innovative, just fast and flowy.
The art though...that art is terrible. It looks like a homebrew game where the only tool available was Photoshop.
The premium looks the best. If it plays as well as I expect it to, I could be in the market for a premium on the secondhand market in a few months to a year.
Let's shut down this nonsense talk that either Heighway game flows anywhere near as well as a middle-of-the-road Ritchie game. I've played both of their games enough to know that's a silly claim.
Quoted from iceman44:
It exceeds my expectations art wise because I was expecting crap
It is crap. It looks like lunchbox art at best. But...it looks like a great layout and will probably shoot like a dream. Just like GoT, the art sort of fades away as you focus on your shots. The sounds, I expect, will be excellent and a lot of fun.
My favorite part of the reveal is in the video when they say, "Stern Pinball has announced..." Well, no, they didn't get any sort of announcement out. How does this keep happening?
Jody...JODY! Wake up and get a few things in order.
That said, can't wait to see the full reveal with feature matrices, pricing, and detailed images on June 6th.
The small LCD might do some really neat stuff. I'd LOVE if they put the trench run targeting computer graphic on there and you had to hit shots to advance down the trench. Final shot switches to the image of the proton torpedoes firing as the Death Star toy blows up. Could be great.
Quoted from pinmister:
WTF-I just noticed no lolli-pop rails? Are you kidding me, with that light cabinet color, it will get finger wear quickly. The only thing I can think of why Stern would omit them is so they force people to buy their arfter-market shit.
On a side note the LE backglass would look stellar with pulsating white LED's fading from center to outer edge, to make it appear like they are traveling in light speed. Modders-get started
Bill of materials must have been very low on this game, for some reason. It really doesn't have a lot going on. Seems to lean heavily on flow, which I like, but it's really sparse.
Quoted from Sinestro:
Definitive opinions....for looking at a few grainy photos.
And this is why Stern needs to do better with their announcements. You only get one first impression. JJP is still trying to rally back from a bad unveiling of Dialed In (so many people think it's a game about a phone still). Technically Stern still hasn't announced this. The Star Wars Facebook page announced it through a video that claims that Stern announced it. So clearly Stern messed up and fell behind schedule. They keep doing this. TWD was "announced" by a DVD paper slip. Ghostbusters was leaked all over the place and by an ad that ran ahead of announcement. If they don't want to be nitpicked, they need to put out more prepared content.
The game will sell. Don't panic. It's a flubbed announcement (again), but things will be set right once people get to play it. It looks like a fun shooter and Dwight comes up with really neat code.
It's worth pointing out that the TIE Fighter toy isn't in those playfield pics. The video mentions and shows it. There may be more to show in regards to the playfield.
Quoted from PanzerFreak:
In regards to rules I hope the inserts in the screen grab below represent a deep objective based ruleset. Looks like there are 4 quadrants of modes, each containing 3 modes and a multiball / mini wizard mode. That would be 16 modes right there! Fingers crossed.
I wouldn't expect that many modes. I would think it's going to be more like Star Trek where they're repeatable but harder on the second or third pass. I hope you're right though!
Quoted from ChanceKJ:
Marketing and communications is what i do for a living. This is just bad form. Where do i apply?...
Jody would have to fire himself. He clearly deserves to be fired, but he's part owner, so they're stuck with him. His side of the house is always a mess, licensing aside. The marketing strategy at Stern though...it's real bad. I mean, wow.
Strong licenses can overcome a lot of bungling idiocy in marketing though, so it's not like it really matters all that much in the long run. It just annoys the fan base. I guess sometimes it threatens the fan base too on live streams, but I doubt that ever pays off.
Chewie Frenzy. D'oh Frenzy replaced by constant growls.
I do wish that Luke was a larger part of the art. Should have swapped him with Obi-Wan. Yoda and Palpatine needed much more love too.
Quoted from J85M:
The art really does seem kind of thrown together, none of the 3 models feel very cohesive they all feel and look a little random. Premium so far is my favourite but that LE translite could be awesome "if" it's a real backglass and has a animated Hyperspace back box effect.
Premium is the best, I agree.
If it plays like I think it will, I'll be interested in buying one in the secondhand market, most likely a premium. It's Star Wars, the game is going to sound amazing, and Dwight seems to know how to do really cool stuff with lighting. Just wondering if it's going to play too close to AC/DC to really make it feel that different. It's never been an issue to play Spider-Man and Star Trek. They feel pretty different despite the layout recycling.
It's literally a tweaked AC/DC Pro. It's far more similar to that than anything else.
Quoted from smassa:
It's a fan layout. You'll find similarities to many games. I'm not seeing a scoop shot on the right of AC/DC. Also there is only one orbit shot to the left of the left ramp on AC/DC.
Come on, man. It's obviously a modified AC/DC pro, just as Star Trek is a modified Spider-Man. That doesn't necessarily equate to a bad thing. It will shoot well, and the code will make all the biggest differences in making it feel different. But there's no denying that he's re-using concepts.
Quoted from smassa:
I guess you were looking for something new and different then the flow style layout that SR usually puts out? Something like avengers??? Lol
Never Avengers. Blah.
No, I'm not using this as a way to diss Star Wars. I'm just pointing it out. I don't know why you're so defensive about something that is pretty plain to see. It will remind you of AC/DC, I'm sure, but it will probably feel quite a bit different, especially on the Premium/LE models.
The Star Wars miniatures are GREAT models right out of the box. I have a ton of them. The game is a blast to play. There's definitely a lot you could do with them for mods, but they might be pricey unless you can score them used. Wouldn't be hard to add in stuff like X-Wings, Y-Wings, B-Wings, A-Wings, all sorts of TIEs, Millenium Falcon (for the pro), the Slave I, transport ships, etc.. It's all there. Just don't go too far overboard...
I also wouldn't get too hung up on the game not being fully RGB. Ghostbusters only has a handful of RGB inserts, and it's one of my favorite light shows in modern pinball.
Quoted from T-800:
Oh, and I gotta love all the critics of STERN's marketing techniques - maybe they did this for a reason, they already know that WHATEVER they show, the pinside cry babies are going to be on here bitching about it, Ghostbusters was no different, even though most thought the art package was incredible it didn't stop the vocal minority from coming online and spewing their opinions everywhere, even down to as petty as bitching about the fonts on the inserts. The insensitivity is astounding - hundreds of people are working their asses off to do the best job they can and here hundreds of people are reaming them based on very limited info. When STERN does release the high res pics they'll be an improvement over what's out and be going the right direction.
You never, EVER want to put out a bad impression first. Ever. That's literally the worst thing you can do in marketing.
They gave Disney terrible assets to use in the video. They should have used the pic with Jerry, Steve, and Dwight as the main image, and then maybe showed a small clip of the ball in action. CAD drawings and 3D renders aren't really fit for a reveal. Now, it'll be next week when it all comes out the way it should have originally, and that will smooth things out quite a bit. But still, the initial disappointment can never be taken back.
The game will be fun. I don't think anybody should be expecting a snooze fest. And while it's possible to like the art package, it's objectively weak compared to what we're used to seeing lately in pinball. That's somewhat acceptable with lesser themes, but this is Star Wars. They really should have put an extra bit of effort into it.
I have an AC/DC. I think it's the best Stern machine ever created. It's also one of the ugliest. That's ok. I think Star Wars will be just fine and possibly even great, but it will always look worse than it deserves to look.
My 16" LX200 telescope does fine by me. I can't transport anything much bigger, and I'm too casual to go more hardcore.
Quoted from yuriijos:
Wait wait, that's a low res picture wait until a high res picture comes out and you might change your mind. What a frickin joke this place has become.
Even in gorgeous high resolution, it's going to be a bit goofy. It'll look better, but the composition is just odd for a translite.
Hand-drawn art, but it's just a hand-drawn version of the same lunchbox, DVD case, and coloring book figures we've seen for 40 years now. We've seen that image of Han or Luke holding out that blaster since the very first merchandise started coming out. If they were going to draw something, why not draw anything new? I'm super confused by that.
The game looks fun, but it's still a massive disappointment on the art front. Premium looks the way to go still. Pro is lacking too much. The pro is really stripped down by comparison from what is already a fairly lean package.
In Steve Ritchie we trust, but man, can't someone give the guy a decent art package?
I would love if they could get Anthony Daniels to do custom speech, but they would have mentioned that by now. Imagine how cool it would be for C-3PO to narrate and comment as you play. Lots of potential with something like that.
Dimples are ok, deep pits aren't. Without some level of dimpling, cracking is possible. There has to be some amount of give in the clear.
Quoted from beelzeboob:
Here are the things I'm disappointed in:
No light-up rails on the LE.
No shaker on the LE.
No magnets anywhere except on the hyperspace accelerator.
No glass translite.
Not enough toys and everything is on the left side. (You're welcome, Panzer!)
Slow-motion video makes it look like you're playing The Hobbit.
No multi-color RGB on each insert as in previous games.
Exploding death star looks like a light-up mushroom.
And NO PLATE ON THE LOCKDOWN BUTTON!!! (I mean...REALLY???)
The things I like:
The hyperspace thing looks pretty awesome.
Let me get back to you on the rest...
Star Wars is pretty bare bones. I don't think anybody could possibly look at it and say that it is anything but. I'm still excited about the Steve/Dwight combo, but the bill of materials is laughably small, even at the premium/LE level. Unless it was REALLY expensive to use the Star Wars license, I just don't understand why they've skimped out so much on features.
Quoted from pinchamp:
I am guessing a ton of bugs to still be worked out with the code and perhaps even some of the playfield features. Doubt we will see a real video of gameplay for at least a month. That is likely why Stern provided the limited and very crappy video. Just showing what they actually have done which seems like not a lot.
We're getting some gameplay tomorrow night.
Quoted from Aurich:
Uh, you might want to put your glasses on, those aren't filter jobs.
Close enough. They're re-drawn from existing images. They might as well be. If they're going to go through the effort to draw "new" art, why not use new poses? It makes no sense to trace old images again.
Quoted from pinchamp:
Real gameplay video?? I mean like when someone actually plays and reviews the game from the frost plunge to the end of the 3rd ball... I am doubting it but would be great if we do.
Tim Sexton is going to be playing it, yes. It sounds like it's pre-recorded, but it will be actual gameplay.
Yeah, if you Google "Han Solo," the first result is literally that image of him above the flippers.
Ah, well. Gameplay tomorrow night should help forget about some of this nonsense.
Quoted from Dragon36:
Not sure if this has been posted before, at the 8 minute mark they discuss rumors that the art would be photo shopped due to the license not allowing them to alter the appearance of the characters. Unsure if it's true but it makes sense.
» YouTube video
It doesn't though. Why would Stern find themselves under restrictions that are clearly not applied to other mediums? I think Stern hides behind that excuse. We see wildly varying versions of Star Wars art that involves the original characters on lots of different products.
Quoted from iceman44:
When we start seeing balls flying around, HD movie clips, lots of modes and multi balls, sound etc. That's when it gets real.
All of the foreplay so far doesn't mean diddly squat to me. I'm in unless the above sucks.
I don't think it'll suck. Just like Game of Thrones, the focus will shift completely into how it plays once we see that. I expect it to be a real winner, but I wish we could have had nice art on top of it is all.
Quoted from kermit24:
That sucks! Any USA based shows coming up that it will be at? Assuming it is too late for Southern Fried in Atlanta this weekend?
My guess would be ReplayFX for the first showing, but I'd need to look at the schedule. There could be a sooner date, but I don't think any of the events this upcoming weekend will have Star Wars.
Quoted from libtech:
Looks like the pro does have a physical ball lock as well? Just looks like the fork stly like on xmen or st eather than the nifty one on the prem?
Have to say with the high rez photos the art doesnt look that bad, just not as good as it could have been, the cabs and translites are all very nice.
This just holds the ball momentarily. It's not a ball lock.
I don't know that magnets would improve a Ritchie design unless he designed with them in mind, to be honest. The game is going to be fast and heavily reliant on combos (which magnets would work against), much like Game of Thrones. This is one of those sorts of layouts that needs space to breathe. Sure, I would have loved a design that gave us a bit more meat on the bones, but I still think the game will be fun. I love Game of Thrones (the pro, anyway), and we're dealing with the same designer/programmer team here.
The wait to see more on this game has been pretty rough. Here's hoping it gets shown off better fairly soon.
Quoted from robotron:
many of you forget, this is not a old dmd game. i think it takes a ton more work to edit videos and audio and make a game with the new color dmd. this is why i think bm66 code taking so long. i dont expect a good code on release just my .02 cents worth
Clipping video is much easier than creating dot art. It is way faster.
This is why LE should be limited to a time frame, not a set number of orders. People don't have the "luxury" to wait for video if they want an LE, because they are often sold out very quickly after announcement. Give a hard cutoff date where you can choose pro, premium, or LE. Once the date passes, only premium and pro are available. It's still limited over the pros and premiums, but it gets rid of a lot of the preorder circus.
Could be that the Death Star is packed for installation when it arrives for some reason, but I doubt it.
The fact that they haven't shown gameplay is still asinine.
Quoted from pinghetto:
That is really weird. I don't see it there either. It had like a 20 second game at the very end of it. I swear it happened. Unless it was old, but I got the live notification on my phone and watched it just a bit ago. It was basically a factory tour thing that Judy does every once in awhile.
It happened. It ended rather abruptly and hasn't been available since it finished.
Quoted from Rando:
I'm leaning towards the Pro based on cost, trying to figure out if I'm losing game-play by doing so. If the play is the exact same, and the Premium just has more flash with the cracking Deathstar and ball holding Hyperloop, I think I'm fine with the Pro. If game-play is different/lacking because of these 2 omissions, I'm not sure what to do.
Would love to see more info!
Yeah, we really need to see video to see what sort of interactivity is there. Maybe it's all just show. If there's a change to scoring or the rules, that really complicates the decision.
Quoted from Hazoff:
I don't even count Spooky games yet, they all look like class projects thus far, JJP has 3 games in what 8 years sorry man but you need to let this defense rest. I'm happy we have all these boutiques and start up companies too but Stern is still the only real pinball manufacturer, not saying that won't change I hope it does.
You really do live in your own little bubble, don't you?
This practice of showing video live with no heads up and then not archiving it up is stupid.
It's both. It's good that it's not just a straight photo clip, but it's still the same dang images you've seen on lunchboxes and toy packaging for 40 years now. It's real bummer they didn't get custom art.
The game looks very fun to shoot, the scoring looks wonky as all get out though.
Video clips look great, but Stern's "animations" are brutally weak. Static pictures that drag across the screen are rough. TIE Fighters shouldn't wiggle in space. The Slave I going across the screen looked like cheeseball stuff every time, especially during that hyperspace mode. The fonts, especially the ones that say things like "parry successful" all look horribly out of place with the Star Wars theme.
Aside from that, the video clips and most of the presentation with the menus, the actual playfield layout, and THE SOUND seem to be really good.
This should be a fun one to play, and I expect it to be all over the place.
Oh, and clean this up.
Quoted from Aurich:
No video was going to change that, probably why after a bit I got bored and closed the stream. I was just watching the LCD screen, the actual ball play wasn't compelling.
I watched the entire stream, but I feel the same as you that it wasn't the most fun game to watch. I feel that way about Game of Thrones though, but I think it's a blast to play. I really hope that's what is going on here.
Quoted from iceman44:
Compared to DI or ANYTHING else out there, including the premium and LE its a bargain.
There's no bargain in pinball in the NIB market, no matter where you look. Everything is overpriced. And no way you can stretch the definition of bargain to apply to a Star Wars premium or LE. Come on now. The game is barren and they have stripped out even more than usual on these things.
I mean, I do too, but I still feel like they're overpriced. GBLE, WOZ Ruby, and DILE aren't exactly what I would call my best days of bargain hunting.
Honestly, depreciation is a good thing. It makes for a more healthy secondary market. I think it's great if waiting a year or two can save you a couple of thousand dollars.
Quoted from Jojo1111:
I suspect that hyperspace loop is exactly that. Just a visual gimmick that will not affect gameplay in any way. You heard it here, Pro and Prem will play identically, more closely than any previous SR game since he came back to Stern.
If that's the case, it makes going pro the logical choice and you don't lose much. We'll have to see though.
Quoted from TheLaw:
One of the most overblown tear fests on Pinside...and that's saying something.
I have an 8-year old and a 4-year old that could only turn on GBLE with it at the end of the pinball row. My wife, who is 5'3" struggled as well. So while it was no big deal to put it at the end, it becomes an issue when you start having multiple games with the switch there. It's a bad spot. It's ridiculous.
Quoted from smassa:
You do understand that working with such a strict licensee can lead to things taking longer then originally hoped. It's a shame Stern couldn't get it out in your timetable.
Delay the game a few weeks then. For those that are planning to pass on it for home ownership, it sucks that many operators do not update their code regularly or even at all. They really should be sending games out with 1.0+ code on them. And I really think that the license holder would prefer that games go out in a manner that best reflects the license.
Quoted from smassa:
Lol delay the game you say. All the majority of Pinside has been doing is bitching and moaning for weeks about no game play video. So Stern finally puts one out with some good players too on obvious very early code and now more Pinsiders bitch and moan about some things that look off. God I wish someone at Stern had big enough balls to tell the majority of you to F off.
Do you know what being an apologist gets you? A worse product. Stop defending incompetence and start expecting better. It's the only way to make Stern improve.
You don't owe Stern anything. Chill with the white knight stuff and realize that critics just want a better product.
Also, if you've ever launched a product professionally, you would be appalled at how shoddy Stern's releases are handled. They want to talk about how they are the most legit and professional outfit in pinball, but they don't want to act like it. That shouldn't be defended nor excused away.
We pay for better than we get. It's a shame.
Quoted from Eskaybee:
How should stern make their games better? Add more toys that'll klunk up play and breakdown making less money for operators? Slow down gameplay so we can take naps instead of drink and have fun? What am I missing? IM TRON MET AC/DC TWD GOT are some of the best pins made and can all be had in the $5k range (when they were available NIB - pro version. And $6k prem). Way better than the $8k and 9k pins out there. Plus location pinball has blown up in the last 5 years compared to what was happening 10 years ago. Buy a $9k tank and watch it out of order or buy a $5k quarter sucker with speed beyond belief? And home use - want a heavy tank paper weight where it's tough as nails to fix or lightweight easy maintainable game? Again, what is stern doing wrong again?
How about they at least play test something before they ship it? My GBLE was unplayable upon arrival. Obvious things were wrong due to it not being tested that I spent hours fixing. If a casual buyer had received that game, it would have had to be sent back. Then when I get my replacement playfield, I did it all over again, because that hadn't been tested either. Not shipping causing adjustment needs, actually incorrectly assembled or installed stuff.
You think those Star Wars games that arrived without an SD card and code were play tested? Obviously not. That's the easiest thing in the world to catch. "Hey, this game doesn't boot. Ship it!"
What are they doing wrong? They're cutting every corner possible. We get to beta test their stuff and act as their QC department. That's not how this is supposed to work.
I'm as hopeful as anybody for Star Wars, but I'm sure not ever giving Stern the benefit of the doubt anymore. That used to be a reasonable risk, when you only worried about whether the game would be fun or not. Now there are a whole host of possible issues, and people want to apologize for them. Why? Why not admit that they're issues and expect better? What do any of us gain by defending a game being shipped to a customer in a non-playable state?
I've said that Star Wars looks to be fun, and I expected a warmer batch of initial impressions. But if there are issues, why not call them out? What is gained by swallowing a valid complaint?
To be fair, I waited a LONG time to buy a WoZ due to concerns over maintenance. It's not like my skepticism only applies to a single manufacturer. Obviously JJP had to prove their WoZ issues were behind them.
I know of at least 4 that shipped without the SD card with code.
Seriously, how does this happen? The only way it happens is if the game isn't given a play test at final inspection. Because without code, it's not booting. Garbage. I would be livid if my game showed without code, because that would mean that it was up to me to do the final inspection. My GBLE wasn't inspected and I spent the first couple of days owning it with the glass off.
Quoted from Dragon36:
This stuff is interesting. Maybe in 20 years they'll write a book with all these restrictions they had to work through, and then talk about how all the complainers on pinside misdirected their frustrations....
I don't think having a game shipped to you that was totally unplayable is a bad reason for being upset. I literally couldn't play my GBLE due to it being in such a rough build state.
I bought the license approval excuse, but is that legit? If the code is on the website, then why wasn't it in the games? And why was it only some games? Even some early games had code while later shipped games didn't? It all won't matter in a week or two when everything is coming out complete though. It's just such a weird thing.
I was hoping to play one locally this weekend, but it arrived without code as well. Looks like I'll have to find a time next week to pop in, but if not that, California Extreme will be my first real shot at playing. I'm dying to get some good time on the game.
Quoted from Dr-Willy:
The code hasn't been on the website. .83 (code that was loaded on SD cards from stern) was never on the website, the small update to .84 was put on the website yesterday due to release, also the manual was uploaded to sterns website yesterday as well. I was checking the website daily for the upload of the manual prior to getting my game (which showed up tuesday) and as of end of day tuesday there was no code or manual up. With the release of .84 yesterday, now both are up.
Ok, that makes more sense then. People were saying it was up, but maybe they didn't know for how long.
Very cool. Checking the video out now. I'll be able to play it in a few days, and I'm getting really excited.
Yeesh, that's surprisingly unfinished. Still looks fun, but it might be a little while before that game is ready to be called complete.
I like moving multipliers as a concept, but it looks insane in action. Maybe they should dial that back and you can set them up during times when the ball is stopped (mode select, before the plunge, etc.). The action button is just way, way overused, especially for how fast the game plays in the first place. All that can be tweaked though.
Quoted from MikeS:
Since there doesn't appear to be any valid reason to turn multipliers off (except for when you move them), wouldn't it just make sense to leave them "on" all of the time and just use the lockdown button to shift them over one spot to the right with every press? -it would greatly simplify the process.
That seems to be a better idea and could easily be integrated. They could just lock out the ability to move the multiplier while hitting the button for TIE Fighters so it doesn't send the multiplier all over the place during that sequence.
Quoted from Eskaybee:
I think it was Chuckwurt and a few others suggested that multipliers can only increase in value when turned off, and hold the multiplier value when it's 'locked in'. This would make more sense.
Looked like they kept growing regardless of whether or not they were locked in during Tim's video. I didn't pay close enough attention, but he was getting to 28x and I didn't see him locking/moving during those multiballs.
I'll adjust, I just don't like this as a new direction for pinball. It was fine with GoT, but took a while to figure out. Star Wars can be learned fine, sure, but it's going to have an even longer learning curve. They're just asking you to take your hands off the flippers so often. Feels weird.
Still the same pinball jail after 20 minutes though. They need to let the modes reset after you complete them (and also get the wizard mode in there). But if they can't get the wizard mode in now, at least let the game keep going.
So...I'm super bummed about this game. It's, uh, bad. It absolutely breaks my heart to say that about another Star Wars game. The action button nonsense is dumb. New doesn't mean good, and this is a prime example of that.
I'm so down about this game. I was excited about picking up a secondhand one at some point, but that desire is flat dead now. The shots can be fun, but the breakneck speed is totally at odds with the design of the game in regards to code. The skill shot is mindless and stupid too. What a garbage plunge.
I would never have guessed that I would prefer Aerosmith to Star Wars, but man, here we are.
Ok, it's not ALL bad with Star Wars, but I don't like the sum of its parts when it comes right down to it. I just wanted so much more from the Star Wars theme than we got here. It feels like they cranked the speed up to distract you from the fact that it's a pretty bare game.
The playfield shots are smooth as silk, and shots, when made, just feel right. The geometry of a game is something that Steve Ritchie just seems to understand better than most anybody. Some shots are tight, some are easy, but they all feel pretty much where they should be. It's hard thing to put into words, but you feel it when you play. Compared to something like Aerosmith or Batman '66, Star Wars just has a more refined feel to its geometry.
The sounds on the game are pretty cool. That spinner sound is the best since Metallica. Lots of neat little sounds are found throughout the game. Stern usually does a pretty solid job on sound packages, and Star Wars is definitely no exception.
I'm really not digging the code on the game. Bugs aside (and holy jeez there are plenty), it is totally the wrong type of game progression for how fast it plays. Shots get back to the flipper so quickly, that it's hard to keep up with what you're doing in the game. It's a bummer, because while the game has TONS of modes, they all end up feeling so samey because the ball is just flying around and you're fighting to keep control. Game of Thrones is also very fast, but the modes feel better differentiated, and it doesn't feel like a constant race against ticking timers. Star Wars gets in your face with too many hurry ups, too many timers, and too many dang layers of things going on. And you better like multiballs, because they are to be had at every turn.
Then you have the action button. It's way overused, and there's nothing fun about having to constantly babysit that thing. You have to use it to unlock, move, and lock in your multipliers, you have to blow up TIE fighters with it, you need to hold it down to add a ball in multiball, and you have to unlock and move your multipliers again. Don't forget to lock them or else you'll make your shots but they'll be worth, literally, a 40th of what they could. The game barely gives you a chance to breathe, but you're expected to keep up with slapping that action button so often? That was not even close to fun.
There are also some real head scratchers with Star Wars. Why do they even have pop bumpers in this thing? The ball rarely goes in there, and when it does, it's completely hidden from view. You can't see the pop action at all, because the mini LCD screen blocks it. They feel like they're in there simply because "a game should have pop bumpers." The mini LCD is nothing special either. It helps you on the "skill" shot, and then it's used fairly sparingly from there. You barely have time to check it for indicators anyway, because the ball is always at top speed. The kind-of-a-scoop is a bummer. I've played on 7 different machines now, and all of them had reject issues. Stern could have spent an extra buck and put a proper scoop in there. The eject from that shot is wild too. Blah.
The plunge on this game is terrible. By ball 2 of your first game, you already know the exact timing to get the max skill shot reward, but it sends the ball into an out-of-control state in the lower half of the playfield. Not a fun way to start a ball. Less fun when the ball saver just throws the ball back into chaos again. I would prefer the option to short plunge for the stand ups or to full plunge to the pops. Make it so you can risk chaos for a multiplier or play safe if you want to. But no, Star Wars never takes its foot off the pedal.
The game is always teetering on the edge of control. That can be fun in bursts, but to always have every shot leading to a blazing fast return is just too much. All the stand ups cause a lot of airballs. Bad ones. I think the flippers are overpowered here. It's just one speed to experience: maximum. The Star Wars films aren't some adrenaline-fueled spaz fest. They are very measured in how they dole out action, and the speed of the game just doesn't feel like a good match to the franchise at all.
And that's really my biggest disappointment here. It doesn't feel like Star Wars at all. It looks like Star Wars, but once you start playing, it just melts away. Stacking up Hoth and Tatooine stuff seems so strange. It's like an extreme over reaction to people not liking the Ghostbusters ladder system, so they just let you throw everything in a blender. Makes for a weird use of the theme.
The game is still very much in development, so things can evolve on the code front quite a bit, but I doubt it's going to dramatically change how the game feels to play. It's always going to be too fast for all the layers it's trying to put into the experience. Once the rush of the game's speed wears off, it just feels overwhelming. It's really hard to parse out why a shot scored the way it did, because some shots will have so many things stacked on them beyond what the game can adequately indicate.
I have a feeling that this game will have a hot moment of popularity and then people will get fatigued by it. Once you start getting dialed into the shots, you start having these insanely long ball times of super fast play. Multiball rolls into multiball, modes sit on top of modes, and it all just blurs into a samey hot mess. Almost all the games you play start feeling so alike. Even Ghostbusters, as linear as it is, has games that feel very different from one another. I can't seem to find out how to do that in Star Wars.
I was cold on Aerosmith out of the gate, but I am liking it more and more these days. I hope Star Wars goes through a similar process for me.
Quoted from TheLaw:
Oh no you mean you have to *gasp* learn the rules?
The issue isn't about learning the rules, which actually aren't that complicated. The problem is that they're the wrong set of rules for the layout. Total disconnect. The layout does not lend itself well to a game that has that many layers of things going on in the software or mechanically with the action button.
Quoted from alveolus:
I am actually pleasantly surprised with the custom animation/graphics so early in the evolution of this platform. I'm sure their full resolution 3D graphics design will get better over time, but it seems ridiculous to expect visuals on par with big budget applications at this point.
It's not complicated to create decent 3D graphics these days. A lot of TV shows meant for kids went 3D graphics due to the lower production cost and that it's faster.
Maybe Stern will improve what they do with the screens going forward, but some of it looks pretty weak right now.
I like Metallica a lot more, but they are VERY different in feel. Star Wars isn't really a bash game. Metallica has Sparky and the coffin which do focus on bashing often. Star Wars asks you to hit stand ups often enough, but they don't feel anything like hitting the bash toys on Metallica.
Nobody is a sucker for buying the game that they want if they have the means to afford it.
Quoted from Dr-Willy:
its just .85 i havent had one reset with .87
Yeah, but .87 has bugs that break the game in the other direction. There are a lot of bad bugs still in the code.
I think Dwight is a fantastic coder, but he is known for a lot of bugs that take quite some time to get worked out. Ghostbusters still has a lot that need to be fixed.
Quoted from TheLaw:
It's really how much you want to use that button and move shots around...which can be extensive.
Star Wars is actually more mechanically complex than it is complex in its rules.
Star Wars isn't as much deep as it just has a lot happening at once. The only stuff that might be confusing is how and what you get from the drop targets, the Boba Fett hurry up trigger, and the add-a-ball mechanic. It's more about just trying to track everything that's happening, because a lot of stuff stacks real deep. Mechanically though, it's pretty intense if you are really going to maximize the score.
I finally got some good time on a premium model. WTF?! That jump ramp is hot garbage. The ball gets stuck behind it several times a ball and you're left waiting for a ball search while your multiplier slowly expires. Then when you hit it, it rejects often. Ugh, that was pissing me off. I still hate the mystery hole too. Rocket return that sometimes goes straight down the middle.
Go pro on this game all the way. The fork ramp is a joke. The hyperloop is awful. I had balls fall out of it when I was lucky enough to actually make the shot and not have it reject. To think that they charge extra for problems is insane. Very poor testing on this.
Code is still not where it needs to be, either. I don't know that they're ever going to get there and I just need to make peace with the fact that I won't ever like this game. It's got too many flaws and it's even worse at the premium/LE level. And before anybody just thinks that I need to "play better" to enjoy it...
Quoted from beelzeboob:
The one you played couldn't possibly have been set up properly. When everything works as designed, the premium and LE are far more fun than the pro
Man, there's no way any tweaks in setup is keeping the ball from hanging up on those forks. It's a bad design. I'll buy adjustments fixing the loop returns or even the mystery kickout, but that jump ramp is just sloppy. The game I played was set up perfectly by an owner that knows pinball well. 2-3 times a ball it would settle behind the forks.
It also introduces a degree of unreliability into the Death Star shot. Shot too hard? Reject. Too soft but clean, SDTM.
I do not own one. I play it regularly, however. I'm stubbornly trying to like it.
I didn't like Aerosmith much at all at release, but it really grew on me. It's no classic, but I think it's a good game now. I can't stand the theme, but it's a good player. I would REALLY love to learn to like Star Wars, because it's the theme I most want to be good in pinball.
Quoted from fosaisu:
I respect that, and I also respect your right to just straight up not like SW. If you don't like the bonus multiplier mechanic (and you care about your scores, which I think you do) then you're probably just never going to enjoy the game all that much. At least you played it a number of times before reaching a final judgment, which is more than many people commenting negatively on the game bothered to do.
At the same time, I can see why people would really like it. I can understand that side, which is why it's bumming me out that I can't click with it so far. But hey, games I thought much less of ended up being stuff I liked, so there's hope.
Quoted from TimberOne:
When i shoot the death star ramp and the mission option holds the ball and then after mission select, the ball releases down the forks and right down between the flippers. It is an impossible save and nothing to do with timing or a nudge will help...SOL. I checked and the cabinet and its dead level. I did not check the playfield, wonder if that might be off even though cabinet level. Any suggestions on an adjustment? I am sure its not designed that way.
The fork ramp is a mess. I hate it. I've played several premiums and an LE. It never fails to be dumb for a variety of reasons.
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