I bet with enough research you could round up all the stock pictures given to stern and used on birthday plates

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I wish I had some of those for my birthday party! I'll add them to the list for next year. Thanks.

Yes this^^^^

This is a forum(or message board)- an online discussion site where people can hold conversations in the form of posted messages. When someone post is it all supposed to be positive and one sided? Nothing but rainbows on Pinside with positive remarks-please. Why do you log onto Pinside Forum? Is it to read about other people's opinions and perhaps to comment with your own opinions. Pinside is a pinball forum not a disease. If you don't like it and think it is too negative, then do not participate- simple as that. For me Pinside is awesome and I enjoy reading comments that are both positive and negative. If you get offended easily or have thin skin then you should probably not participate. Your own opinion at the end is what counts. Make decisions and base opinions on what you think, not what others think-that's what makes Pinside great.

Grainy photos or high definition photos-who cares? If people have an opinion then they are free to express that opinion. It may change when they get a chance to play it in person-yes captain obvious. All of these comments whether positive or negative are based on the initial impressions of these leaked photos. Steve can say Pinside is a disease and I can say I think Stern's Marketing department is a joke and my 7 year old daughter could do a better job.

oh snap this thread is somewhat puzzling... 1500 posts already !

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Looks like you've just found a pack of 10 disposable toppers

Can anyone link Steve Ritchie's comments about Pinside? Not sure what you guys are mentioning. I think the right decision was made on the art, drawn semi-photo realistic stuff. What else could be expected? Unfortunately Illustrator\Photoshop can do a hand drawn look so who knows if it was hand drawn or computer generated. I can see having a hard opinion about the art content though it is an endless argument of possibilities. I like what I see but do not know enough yet. I think the art on Guardians of the Galaxy will be spectacular though as there is no requirement to keep the look of '70s early '80s graphics. Could be some great interstellar looks. In general, Pinside is a great resource of intelligent problem solvers and experienced information sharers as well as trolls and negative ninnys, some people in both camps. Typical forum stuff, pinball or otherwise. Would like to know what Mr Ritchie said though, hopefully not a wholesale indictment of Pinside.

Not really sure why Pinside is allowed to vent about the frustrations over Star Wars, but Steve Ritchie isn't allowed to vent about our venting?

dont give the topper people any ideas!

Venting about venting is what I do between words.

Sincerely,

Death Vader

I am curious about what kind of time restraint Stern puts on their designers for creating a pinball machine? Do they have years or months? Sterns goal is to produce 3-4 titles per year. It does not appear like they have the resources to accomplish this goal with original titles without implementing other measures such as vault editions(re-runs of old titles) or by modifying the design of previous machines(re-hashing). To design a machine from the ground up takes a lot of time and effort and it makes a game unique. To take certain elements or features from previous games is one thing but to copy layout and ramps seems like taking the easy road? Yes it will probably play different with the tweaks but it will probably feel similar as well. Family Guy and Shrek come to mind as the blatant re-theme from Stern. Kiss and Aerosmith, now AC/DC and Star Wars.....The list goes on and on.

Well if he did vent, it's not well sourced, nobody knows what he vented.

I think their goal is more "keep factory producing at acceptable levels". They release titles as needed to satisfy that goal.

If titles under perform, then the next one has to get released. If they have a runaway hit, then that keeps the line busy for a while.

I think we will see more and more of this. Will make it interesting to see if collectors go for having two games with such similar layouts in their home collection. I would personally not have both ST and SM in my collection, they both shoot awesome but they shoot to similar. I like to Dial In new shots and layouts.

XMen and Tron had nearly identical but inverted layouts. They don't feel like they shoot similar at all for this reason (XMen also has one extra shot squeezed in making it a bit tighter geometrically). I think inverting layouts is fine since it gives the games a different feel.

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Page 29 of this thread, post 1421

He can vent all he wants, but he has to consider he is also selling a product and it is not smart to piss off your potential buyers. So free speech..yes, he can say whatever he wants, but he needs to be prepared for any fallout from those words....just the same as all of the rest of us. If I came on here and trashed by employers products and this got back to them, I would expect to be fired....free speech or not. It is up to Pinside to decide if calling everyone here a "Disease" is shrugged off, or if folks will take a stand. My guess is since this is the beloved and long awaited Star Wars grail, there will be very little, if any impact. Steve and Stern know they could sell an egg crate with a playfield right now, so long as they paint on a picture of Darth Vader and slap an LE designation on it.

Well said.

He could phrase it, "Don't let the leaked low res pics fool you. Wait til you see it in person and see the gameplay. I think you're going to love it. I mean, it's Star Wars!"

But he didn't.

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I am a big fan of Stern pinball but hard to rush in on this after no code updates on Kiss and this slow jigsaw puzzle of Batman code ! i am a bit skeptical . I plan on getting a Star Wars but if its priced above Aerosmith I may hold off !!

And well said. I remember meeting Steve R at a Pinball Expo while he was unemployed after being let go from Stern. He was selling old memorabilia and pinball related items. Sadly, word on the street he was struggling financially. If history serves me right, the community (not just pinside) chirped and chirped "how can the best designer be sitting on the sidelines?", "give this man a job already". Fast forward x years, the community is a disease.

Remember the good and the bad times. I wish Steve nothing but the best.

Yep, I still credit Ritchie 100% for getting the XMen code done after Borg had quit pushing for it and basically abandoned the game and moved on, so Ritchie will always be held in high esteem by me since he had the testicular fortitude to speak up about it publically at HAAG. Even so, calling this great group of pinhead customers we have here a disease is BS in my book.

But that wouldn't be Steve Ritchie. I've never met him, but I understand that he's a genuinely nice but extremely curmudgeonly guy. He's about as far from a PR guy as you get, and I don't think there's anything wrong with him effectively posting on his private Facebook page, "Haters gonna hate, but they're wrong." Compared with many of the posts on here, his FB comment is tame.

Anyone find it coincidental Stern re-releases AC/DC, just as they release Star Wars? They have pretty much the same playfields. Maybe they are getting a deal to manufacture the same playfields with different art work.

Also, since Dwight was pulled off GB to work on Star Wars- there's a good chance the code is going to be exactly like that - but 're-skinned' with the Star Wars theme. I really hope not, as the linear modes on GB got old after a few months.

What makes ACDC's layout fun to play is really Lyman's code. I hope Dwight can improve on what he did with GB because that code never really improved after Day 1 and that was lame. Lots of bugs in it too.

My how things have changed in the almost 7 years I've been around Pinside.

Back then, JJP and Woz was the primary punching bag. I was the Kool aid drinker and full of optimism and excitement with getting back into the pinball hobby. To me, JJP was making it cool with that LCD.

We argued, fought about each Woz update, laughed, joked, made fun of ourselves and hugged it out at the end of the conversation. Back then a good Titty pic would QUICKLY put a thread back on track.

I also purchased my first pins, a LOTRLE for $5200 and a WOZ for $6500, which at the time was like WTF am I doing, that's crazy.

Fast forward, we have had the SkitB, Jpop, DP and now Heighway debacles/disasters. AND pricing for these pins have gone up dramatically.

On the flip side, so has the FUN FACTOR, sound, lighting and LCD.

Optimism has been replaced with cynicism and people on edge in large part I think due to pricing.

With respect to Ritchie, in large part due to PRICING, he ought to have a little thicker skin.

It's hard to enjoy purchasing a pin these days, and sharing info about that pin with fellow pinsiders without it turning into a bash fest.

It's always good to hear the negatives and people's opinions, the constructive ones.

Yes options are great and are the foundation of any Internet forum. Just don't be a dick.

Man, I love Steve and all he's done, but pinside is not a disease. It's a place where pinball collectors/fans/operators say shit they wouldn't say to your face, some truths, some not. Stern should view it as a potential to sell 1000 pinballs .....
$5000-$8000X1000pins=.....yeah. That amount of cash isn't a disease, it's a blessing.

For those about to beep..... we salute you!

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Everybody at Stern including Steve should praise Pinside. Pinside has sold thousands of their machines for them. Pinside is directly responsible for many collections doubling and tripling over the years. Praise Pinside!

I do not hold any hard feelings toward Steve for his comments. After pouring so much time into a project only to have low res pics get released and every armchair artist begin slamming it. All for things that Steve has no direct control of. Folks are going to start playing it, find out there are features these cruddy pics are not revealing and that the lighting will drastically alter the current perception of the artwork, much like ST. It will be a fun game and when the machines start rolling out and get played these initial concerns will hopefully no longer seem so dire. Lets see better pics, the matrix and actual gameplay before going straight for the five point palm exploding heart technique. Naaw, this is Pinside.

Absolutely. What I find so funny lately is Stern employees just keep lying about the importance of Pinside.

Stern employees claim "Pinside is just 5% of our buyer base" and "is an incredibly small fraction of who we sell games to". That is a TOTAL absolute lie and anyone who can do math can see it is a total absolute lie.

Let's take Metallica for example. There are 1,200 Pinsiders that list Metallica (pro or prem/LE) in their collection. So...Stern expects us to believe they have sold 24,000 units of Metallica.

That is a lack of respect from Stern expecting us to believe they have sold 24,000 Metallicas and that we represent 5% of their user base. Times have changed, we are over 5% now, half your purchasers are not operators, half your games do not leave North America... They should have some respect for those of us who can do math...

The above is my personal opinion and not representative of Pinside or it's views.

I've been on Pinside for a long time (and RGP before that). I'm not offended in the LEAST by what SR said. We all know the reputation of Pinside, and I saw his comment as a witty jab at that reputation (notice the smiley face at the end of his comment?).

Does SR need thicker skin, or do Pinsiders offended by his comments need thicker skin?

If you want to stand up for Pinside, make sure you have a red heart next to your Pinsider name

What's the over/under on an "official" release by Stern tomorrow??

At the Stern "party" last year I'm standing there gawking like a schoolboy trying to process that Steve Ritchie is standing right in front of me. I'm trying to think of something witty and cool to say when he says...
"Well what the fuck are you lookin at??"
I busted up laughing and said
"Oh man you're funny"
He said "Funny like how?"
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We had some laughs and a couple beers and didn't even talk pinball for 15 minutes.
He's a great guy.

That's a good number to examine. I'd take a ball park guess at around 5,000 sold, that's 24% bought by Pinsiders (who reported in their collection - the actual numbers are likely higher). Even if my number is wrong, I am way closer than the 5% they claim.

I still stand by my statement that the largest number of pinball buyers in the world are collected on Pinside. Companies spend tons of money to travel and exhibit at trade shows around the world to sell far less machines than what is bought on Pinside.

Our venting is "as designed." Perhaps he's still sore about that Stern "fix" for his machine. I would be.

I bet the number is even higher, I was lurking here for about a year before signing up for membership.

Vader's on the premium not the LE.

You are GOOD at math.

There's a difference in "registered machines by thousands of pinside Members" and "the vocal minority of the same 50 Members bitching around all the time in the forums, thinking to represent everyone".

Back to the GAME for one second:
- What may the thing (grey bar'ish' thingy) between the Mini-Display and the Targets be? (Can only see it in the group Photo from players perspective.)
- Does the extra ramp on the Premium/ LE go through the backpanel?! (I think it is and would explain why there's another -smaller- picture on it.) Where does ist lead?

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Hopefully, it is understood why this occurred for this single title particularly regarding the BM66 SLE, as it was not their normal practice or methodology.
Specifically, by elimination and removing distributors from the equation pairing to their proposed concept of opening up their own retail store chains, a concept that is currently still tabled, and potentially further increasing profit margins.
Stern used this game as a test marketing example for pricing and gauge effectiveness of sales and management direct from the factory.
It was successful based on the low production volumes.
Considering the fact that owners received a rushed, unfinished overpriced product that was rethemed from an existing mediocre game and incomplete code from the final evaluation of the received license, it was a validation of acceptance by new enthusiasts that were willing to pay 3X more for even less of a game than any other title in the past 18 years.
From this perspective alone, it was highly successful, and disconcerting on my behalf as long time collector based on experience.
It was not an anomaly exclusive as their "30th anniversary", if you understand the background, as it most likely will occur again.

So true.

A Star Wars SLE would make some people on here pour honey all over their bodies, roll in a pile of feathers, and run around like Ewoks down Michigan Ave for a chance to BUY one. Passionate collectors is a scary thing. Hard to blame Stern for capitalizing with all the Ewoks in this hobby.

To each their own though. As long as people are happy, it's all good.

Not sure what it is but if it's not an LCD protector shield that'd be the first mod I'd be looking for.

How cool would it have been to have a tractor beam type of effect with a magnet, before being pulled into the ship? Kind of something like the sanctum on the Shadow..

Are you F'ing serious? Its not the same layout! Yes its similar but its not the same & its not like they just put new art on the same layout like they did with FG/Shrek.

Totally agree with Tiger re Stern.

They might claim they don't read or pay attention BUT we know for a fact that's not true AND they would have to be total idiots to ignore a large chunk of their buyers.

They might not like the criticism but I've always said, you gotta take the bad with the good and own it.

The alternative is that no one gives a flying F about your pins and don't comment either way

When people stop caring enough to voice an opinion that's what they really ought to fear.

I could also envision Mark Hamill doing custom call outs, too...

Steve has always has some choice words. Expo 2015, Stern Factory Tour, just after Game of Thrones reveal. Steve is with a small group, myself included; chatting after the tour is over and he had some very interesting things to say about specific a pinsider in this thread. But I don't hold that against him. He was proud of his game being unveiled (that got shit on) and is a passionate guy. Love the passion even if it makes him pissed off from time to time. He cares and is human. It's all good.

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What I'm not getting is why he would piss anybody off with his opinion? A lot of opinions here I disagree with...even when they're opinions about me. Doesn't bother me a bit. So he smeared Pinside, so what? He worked his ass off to design his last 2 games, and they've both taken a drubbing here (an unfair one, IMO). I'd be a little pissed about it. I'm still buying his games, even if the guy directly calls me a dick to my face. I don't really care. Keep making great games, and I'll keep buying them.

His only error, I think, was painting this forum with such a wide brush. A lot of great, intelligent, and fair-minded people here.

Not me, though. I'm still a judgmental dick.

I'll just go ahead and say it: I hate mini LCDs. Why do you want us to look at a small picture on the playfield? It looks horrible too... Hopefully I'll change my mind when I see it in real life, but so far all the mini LCD 'mods' I have seen so far have left me with more questions than answers...

Is there an option to get a LE and remove the screen yourself?

In my opinion, if you want to integrate video, the Highway screen is a much cooler way of doing it.

Overall though, looking at the pictures for a couple of days I might warm a bit more up to it, but Stern could really have made this much easier for themselves with some better pictures and information.

With respect I completely disagree. I do not care for the LCD in the playfield and I think it is a distraction. The mini LCD on top of playfield could be cool depending on how well it is integrated with video and target interaction.

I hope LCD's in the playfield do not become the 'thing'