(Topic ID: 175720)

Stern announces another price increase- TELL THEM NO!

By shacklersrevenge

7 years ago


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  • 804 posts
  • 223 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by JY64
  • Topic is favorited by 12 Pinsiders

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    “Will you continue to buy NEW Stern games?”

    • No 510 votes
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    92
    #1 7 years ago

    So Stern has just announced a new price increase for January 2017 and has put the pressure to the distributors again. This is too soon. With their issues, lack of adequate code across the board and cost shaving, we are getting less and less and Stern keeps getting more and more. This to me is no longer acceptable.

    Show your support below that you are OUT and make Stern take notice of this post. I am a Stern Pinball fan and I like their games but enough is enough. Stern, stop hiding the real numbers and skirting around what people actually have to pay, typically a PRO costs $5000 and a Premium at $6600-6700, why is this such a secret when we're the ones that pay for it?

    Tell them NO with your wallet.

    #18 7 years ago
    Quoted from hool10:

    Do you have a link on where Stern said this or is this via a distributor?

    Distributor

    #35 7 years ago
    Quoted from jalpert:

    Useless thread unfortunately. Between all the NIB flippers and people who have money, they are raising prices because they can and they know it. If they are selling games with enough room for NIB flippers to make money, then they are idiots. And people who can afford it will continue to buy as they should.
    Also, spoiler alert, prices will go up again after this.

    You know what? You're wrong. They can and they will, maybe...but not from ME.

    12
    #38 7 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    I'd love to join the boycott but Aerosmith looks awesome and you know Star Wars is gonna rule. And pulp fiction with Mark Ritchie making a comeback?
    As soon as I'm done buying all three of these I'll be sure to rosa parks this shit along with you guys.

    How many NIB have you purchased? My guess is none. I'd get off that branch, looks like it's about to buckle under the weight of your inflated ego.

    -10
    #43 7 years ago
    Quoted from Chambahz:

    When you guys are done in this thread, could you also please start boycotting groceries, hydro, and plane tickets for me?
    Thanks much!

    Certainly, right after I don't have to hear another Canadian bitch to me about the exchange rate and having to pay border fees to get their game.

    #113 7 years ago
    Quoted from bigd1979:

    I believe its around 5500 for a pro now and 7100-7200 for premium...... i said this a while back and everyone downvoted me and said no way .

    the current price is $5000 for a pro and $6600 for a premium. In the past, the increases have been $200.

    #114 7 years ago

    Dirty bastards too, they've inched out the new spiderman home model and said ''look, here you go...under 4k...'' which looks interesting but it is garbage, because this was a full featured pro not too long ago for the same money.
    Then they continue the slap in the face by raising the cost of the pro. This isn't just a little bit here and there, the premium features that used to be Pro's are costing thousands extra now.

    The slimers are sliming you.

    #175 7 years ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    What prompted this unprovoked and vicious attack james?
    You've been sour with me ever since I bought a couple games from you. If you didn't like the price, you shouldn't have agreed to it. And considering you knowingly sold me "100 percent working" games with a badly outgassing display and slot reels that didn't work correctly and I didn't make a big deal out of it, I figure you got off pretty good. If it were me I probably would have offered up some dough towards a new dmd.

    I listed them as working 100%, and here in my home they were. You claimed ''gassing'' on the dmd and I thought it was pretty bright and clear every time I played- and this is the first I've heard of the slot reels not working correctly. I said it was probably the high voltage dmd board and not the display. You're talking about the price because I accepted your offer, so I'm not sour and neither should you be, because you're admitting it was a good deal and that was a solid deal for some good games. That BSD is worth every penny and then some and you know it. (And if you want to send me the dmd board, I'll do a voltage kit to it)

    The only part I'm sour about is you sent a 70+ year old guy to pick them up and I did most of the insane packaging to them on the fly, I must of went dizzy around those games a hundred times! Luckily, he's a good dude that I know.

    And lighten up, I was jokingly poking at you.
    P.S, did you beat the high score i put on bsd?

    #276 7 years ago
    Quoted from 85vett:

    There in lies the problem. 4K today gets you "the pin" version. 2 years ago I bought a ST pro for 4.2k. That's a bit eye opening to me...

    this is EXACTLY why I started this thread. I want everyone to at least realize they are pulling the wool over our eyes and laughing all the way to the bank- don't sit for this.

    In 2010 I went to the Allentown show and NIB Iron Man was $3700 off the trucks. A couple years ago, I bought a Mustang Pro for $4300- a fair value overall. To inch the Pros up to 5k while cutting their trim, their lockdown bars, the board sets, the under playfield pegs, etc. and now over 5k for this AND introduce the home model for just shy under 4k which was the old pro pricing, shame on them and shame on us for accepting this.

    But worst of all? The old pros from LOTR/Simpsons up to Spiderman, think of the features these games had- LOADED. They made their own ''market'' to make game choices between two buyers, making you choose now a Pro with less features over a premium or LE with all the features, BUT WE ALREADY HAD ALL THE FEATURES!

    Someone earlier really said a mouth full, about how they almost went under if Avatar didn't succeed, and I heard the story of how Spiderman saved the day to keep the lights on because of revisiting and polishing the code and a certain distributor ordering 75 of them when they needed it most.
    They have slapped everyone in the face that help keep their boat above water. By raising the prices constantly, that's like taking the oars and hitting the people in the water on the head.

    You can say what you want about JJP but I'll tell you this. He DIDN'T create two markets for different featured games. Different trims? Yes, but their games are the SAME, and when he heard grumblings over the pricing of Dialed In, he offered a lesser standard option.

    #278 7 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    but Stern has kept this game alive for the past few years and they deserve some ******* respect for doing so.

    No, the people have kept the game alive and put them in a new factory. They almost went under more than once.

    I like Stern pinball but I also like fair. They're not being fair to their customer base that bailed them out by constantly stripping and raising the costs.

    #284 7 years ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    You were expecting Unicorns and Show Ponies? They don't owe us anything but supporting what we have purchased. The Stern games in my gameroom don't buy me shit as far as future releases go.

    At the very least, timely code would be a step in the right direction. And as far as what I'm expecting, I think I speak for almost everyone when I say, I expect games to be priced according to the quality.

    It has nothing to do with unicorns or show ponies.

    #289 7 years ago
    Quoted from Edenecho:

    blablablabla
    So what is the actual price increase that is causing this whole whine and cheese thread?
    No distributors leaking it, or have they only been informed that there will be a yet unknown price increase?
    If so, why not just wait until the price is actually made public, and THEN go on a rampage? (while still buying the machines, as people usually do despite whining).

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    #410 7 years ago
    Quoted from chill:

    I get the frustration with Stern. But somebody has to buy their pins NIB or they won't make any (maybe some people are cool with that).
    The prices don't seem that out of line. What did NIB B/W games cost back in 1992-1997?
    Heck, the $5000+ price tag on 20+ year-old B/W games is crazy to me too. Especially when I bought those games 10 years ago for half the current prices and the games were half as old.

    What are you talking about? They won't make any? That's ridiculous. They will continue to make them because they have been making them, and they used to for a lot less than they have been, so put the violins away. Their glass is full and spilling over (big pimping new factory) plenty of profits for them at older prices, they've just gotten greedy.

    #415 7 years ago
    Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:

    It is just an indication of how much hobbyists within the market have changed.
    Three plastic translites do not equal one quality back glass.
    This is another Stern cost savings measure that was overlooked by hundreds both here on PinSide and around the world.
    It slipped by many Stern fanboys as well.
    In the late 90s (1995-1999), hobbyists/operators refused to pay increased NIB prices similar to the significant price jumps that started with Stern around 2012, even though construction quality of games was tenfold of today.
    This includes games from Data East, Sega, and even AGC from the early 1990s.
    Granted some of the early games (1992-1995) had overstocks but not 1000s of games.
    Everyone kept waiting for closeouts for purchases.
    Many games STILL had proper backglasses such as NGG and CP.
    Both these game title examples also have many more features than Stern's latest game.
    The backglasses were sharp, ink screening solid, and quality superb.
    The jumps of game prices to offset shrinking production runs was one of several reasons that contributed to the fall of WMS.
    Does this sound currently familiar?
    This is the same occurrence now with Stern's direct refocus to the home market, partial disregard of operators, and hopeful expectations in the consumer market.
    It does work for a while, but the "regulations" people sometimes refer does not exactly work out as hoped.
    Manufacturers just close when times are tough, not readapt to changes.
    It generally does not make financial sense.
    Stern almost "bought the farm" when they tried to restart in 2001 with potential closures considered as early as 2003.
    TSPP saved them the first time as sales were excellent.
    New buyers need to be educated on what they are receiving for their money, or Stern with planned construction of BM66 will continue to reduce features with measured effectiveness. This is also why Stern's "The Pin v2.0" has been moderately successful this holiday season. People have no real idea what they are buying, they just "want it".
    "Knowledge and astute observation provides the power to ensure good purchases."
    I am just here to inform people interested in the hobby to pay attention.
    There are a handful of trolls here that will not take the time to understand what I am trying to explain, and I am not being negative, just direct.
    You can still find superb deals on used games, just stop looking at the "buzz feed" titles.
    Pinball has so much more to offer.
    Stern cannot justify the increasing costs of their games with anythings logical like economic changes, wage salaries, or the fact that games are "hand made".
    Stern only employs approximately 200 people with average wages less than $25/hour.
    Pinball games have always been hand made, because their is no way to properly construct a industrial robot to construct assemblies, do soldering, or validate manual game testing.
    I heard this last sentence from Jodi during the John's Arcade Stern tour video, like it was some type of revelation.

    Excellent post, one of the better ones I've read.

    #429 7 years ago
    Quoted from drsfmd:

    Stern code has never been W/B quality.

    I personally do not understand this comment. There are many Stern games that I would consider coded masterpieces, such as LOTR, TSPP, Spiderman, AC/DC, etc. They have the ability to do great code, but they rely on someone that is a master at coding (Lyman) to do it on his free time instead of paying a dedicated team of coders to do nothing but code because...well...if you don't have a lockdown bar or playfield rails, I think you can guess why.

    The story of Wheel of Fortune is an interesting tale.

    #437 7 years ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    One thing to consider is their LCD is going in all models, including their Pro, which none of their competitors try to match on price. If their LCD is inferior to others, its because of maintaining the Pro line.

    Smoke and mirrors. You can go to Walmart now and get an lcd tv for practically dirt, this technology is old and affordable now. This is their idea of justifying the cost to us for the upgraded offering. If anything, it probably costs less than the standard dmd. Cost cutting to them and up charging to us always makes sense.

    #448 7 years ago
    Quoted from Hazoff:

    R u guys for real? Prices increase on most items every year from food to electricity so on and so on and all of these factors play a role in the increased pricing of manufactured goods and a lot of other areas, I would agree prices are too high but to make it out like ur some victim when you don't have to buy pins is really stupid, priced out then find a new hobby. Jesus am I the only one that can see whats happening here, these guys know this won't last and are capitalizing, same thing in the used market, 3 to 4K for a Shadow, WTF? don't buy anything, its quite simple.

    It's not about pricing me out and the need to find a new hobby, I have a hobby, it's pinball. It's about the greedy push from Stern and the quality behind the product is not satisfactory. It's even beyond the collector market, what about the operators? Price increases are normal, sure, but not every two seconds, and not for worse or cut back product.
    Smart buyers will look elsewhere, and that's what I have done. I know of some games that are a lot less than a NIB, full featured games. That's where my money is going.

    #498 7 years ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    The do or die multiball is the biggest problem. I've never even seen it; it is not attainable except for the literally the upper upper echelon of player (top 100 quality player).

    IM rules are similar to Avatar. I've done both do or die and Final Battle on Avatar a few times. I prefer Avatar though, I think it's the better game and the scoring is more balanced.

    #515 7 years ago
    Quoted from stevevt:

    Do or Die Multiball ≠ Do or Die
    shacklersrevenge
    If you played in a way that you were trying to get to Do or Die, I'd guess you'd get there every 2 to 5 games on anything other than the most brutally set up IM.
    If you played in a way that you were trying to get to Do or Die Multiball, you might never get there.

    Hmm.. going to say not 100% sure, though now I want an Iron Man to do this if I haven't, it's been years. I have beaten Metallica and beaten Portal in Tron. I've heard a whisper or two of people doing end of the line, haven't heard of anyone else beating Portal.

    1 week later
    11
    #707 7 years ago
    Quoted from Chrizg:

    Have not seen anyone actually list what the increase is, just 14 pages of complaining? I found out what the increase is (not saying so don't ask) and it isn't very much. Not enough that I am upset about it and I buy a lot of new Sterns. Not enough for a 14 page pitchfork rant either. If the increase is large from your dist then they are just trying to make more money off you.

    That mentality is what is wrong with this hobby. You talk about 14 pages but skip to the end to inject your thoughts. Facts is, they keep going up frequently and they keep cost cutting. We had all the features for a reasonable price, now they slice and dice these games for more profits, have more and more issues, and we're left twiddling our thumbs.

    Not me, I'm out. I bought a Spider-Man for $4200 with a shaker in near mint condition and no issues. Full side rails, real lock bar, under playfield slide rails, a real board set, full playfield features and masterpiece code. They can take that $3800 home model (which is the price a real "pro" used to be not so long ago) and shove it up someone else's behind, I'm done being their scarecrow.

    1 week later
    #781 7 years ago

    That's funny, 2 1/2 years...
    Every distributor I talked to said STERN had put the heat on them to raise their prices. I've been hearing this since the $4400 days, and every so often, it would rise $200 until it's where it is now.

    Surprised he didn't say Wheel of Fortune code is now complete in that e-mail.

    #782 7 years ago
    Quoted from volcanodiver:

    I want to see how the routed ones hold up. the ones in someones house should be fine.

    Fortunately for everyone, I'm pretty sure they hold up pretty well. They have a testing room at Stern I saw in a video, where they have games with completely black playfields from play that do nothing but flip and play all day long by themselves.

    #786 7 years ago
    Quoted from volcanodiver:

    if they are that dirty, that actually can protect a PF.

    I was speaking mainly of the electronics, which have always been pretty rock solid (so far)

    #796 7 years ago

    Stern didn't do any price increases but pressured the distributors to raise and raise they did. This was an easy way for Stern to wash their hands of the dirty work.

    #803 7 years ago
    Quoted from Nevus:

    I'd like to read more about minimum pricing etc. I'll be the first to admit I'm not informed on this topic.
    Does Stern get the same price per unit, or do they have bulk discounts to distributors?
    How does it benefit Stern to control distributors pricing?
    Just curious.

    What I want to know is, what the distributor actually pays per unit. Lets say one, or an order of 5, is there a difference?
    This is information I haven't been able to obtain.

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