(Topic ID: 175720)

Stern announces another price increase- TELL THEM NO!


By shacklersrevenge

2 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 804 posts
  • 223 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by JY64
  • Topic is favorited by 12 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic poll

    “Will you continue to buy NEW Stern games?”

    • No 510 votes
      75%
    • Yes 85 votes
      12%
    • unsure 87 votes
      13%

    (682 votes by 0 Pinsiders)

    Topic Gallery

    There have been 37 images uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

    aerosmith-topper-concept1 (resized).jpg
    20161223_112227 (resized).jpg
    20161223_104858 (resized).jpg
    20161223_104905 (resized).jpg
    00image-7 (resized).jpg
    000image-8 (resized).jpg
    20161228_163457 (resized).jpg
    image (resized).jpeg
    Sabers (resized).jpg
    darth (resized).jpg
    pulp-fiction-pulp-fiction-13185677-1920-810 (resized).jpg
    mark-hamill-star-wars-the-force-awakens-png (resized).jpg
    SeaRaider (resized).jpg
    338033145f188f99b6ac6def558ea45bc62dc68b (resized).jpg
    mmrow (resized).jpg
    139rxc (resized).jpg

    There are 804 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 17.
    #251 2 years ago

    Interesting poll, but get ready to be tempted.
    Gary and Disney are preparing a Tauntaun party next year!
    Which cold wallet will jump inside that warm belly first?

    #252 2 years ago
    Quoted from MrBally:

    If the USA slaps a 20 or 30% tarrif on cars, trucks and trailers built in Mexico, you'll see how fast those companies close those plants up and move that manufacturing (back, in some cases) to the USA as there is not enough demand in Mexico for those vehicles.
    Maybe Ford. GM, Fiat/Chrysler and Hyundai will lease their plants there to Jarritos so they can bottle soda in them.

    and your Ford. GM, Fiat/Chrysler and Hyundai will all be 30% more expensive! probably more - given the investment right off of international plants. not that this will happen.

    #253 2 years ago
    Quoted from NeilMcRae:

    and your Ford. GM, Fiat/Chrysler and Hyundai will all be 30% more expensive! probably more - given the investment right off of international plants. not that this will happen.

    This is the rather important bit that people seem to be forgetting about!

    #254 2 years ago

    Is there no possible way to inspect a game before taking delivery of a NIB? Honest question...

    #255 2 years ago
    Quoted from Rondogg:

    Is there no possible way to inspect a game before taking delivery of a NIB? Honest question...

    Only if you're buying from a local dealer or showroom. Many of us order from distributors from other states - so, for us - nope. We get what we get when we open the box.

    #256 2 years ago
    Quoted from Rondogg:

    Is there no possible way to inspect a game before taking delivery of a NIB? Honest question...

    If you buy it from a distributor that is willing to unbox it, which some do, then yes. But you'll have to go there.

    #257 2 years ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    If you buy it from a distributor that is willing to unbox it, which some do, then yes. But you'll have to go there.

    Which could mean paying taxes...

    #258 2 years ago

    It's a taxing hobby....

    34
    #259 2 years ago

    You know, this is all very simple really. Prices will keep going up as long as people pay it. Nothing complicated. If you want to show Stern you're not going to buy anything more from them, you put your wallet away.

    Me, I was done once I bought TWD Prem, and I saw that lame BG flap-ramp and how "mediocre" its design was. To think that B/W got that perfect with BSD, and Stern had another 22 years - think about that - 22 years to replicate that design and couldn't; it just made me sick.

    With all the things "gone wrong" with Stern this year, it doesn't matter as long as people have more dollars than sense.

    I don't care when dream theme they come up with; I really couldn't care less. When you suck at QC and yet raise prices like nobody's business like they are, you don't get my money. I DGAF what they do or what theme they come up with. I don't care if they somehow make LEs $4500 out the door - if they cannot get their QC under control and stop being a greedy corporation I am through with them.

    Problem is too many people are lukewarm here, or people off Pinside are naive and are just ready to throw money at them to have a game in their house.

    Me, I'm staying in the "B/W class of 92 to 98". CFTBL, SS, and TZ will all come home down the road. I'll pay $6000 for a used TZ from 1993 before I pay $5000 for a present day Stern with less features and wet toilet paper for a playfield.

    Oh, and I'll definitely buy Alien from Heighway first.

    13
    #260 2 years ago

    Personally I am surprised Stern keeps raising prices. If I was them I would control costs and own the mid-market. Let JJP and DP take the high-end market. I think they are leaving money on the table by going up market.

    I think going head to head with JJP and DP is a mistake. That upper end will get saturated and their churn and burn model doesn't work well in the upper market. All raising prices will do will be to raise expectations of the product. They already can't keep up with code updates and have had some quality challenges. Not that JJP hasn't had their issues too. At least the long-term commitment to code though is there.

    Stern, listen to your market. Stabilize costs and prices. Keep owning the mid-market. You have a loyal customer base too. The only thing I would work more on is having more of a commitment to really polishing up the code.

    But then again, I am just a computer guy that loves pinball. Won't be buying a Stern at these prices....that is for sure. Value isn't there.

    #261 2 years ago

    Completely agree with above post. I have no problem spending money on a quality machine. I have zero issues spending $9k on a nib hobbit, but when I have to spend almost the same amount on a nib stern, i feel like I am being taken for a ride. Hell, I spent NIB prices on my LOTR LE, but that was because I knew it was a quality game with complete code. Game of thrones was a good enough theme for me to consider NIB stern, but after the unveiling the art wasn't enough for me justify the price. Keeping my fingers crossed for Star Wars to change my opinion.

    #262 2 years ago
    Quoted from iamabearsfan:

    If I was them I would control costs and own the mid-market. Let JJP and DP take the high-end market. I think they are leaving money on the table by going up market.

    And Stern has analysed the market and they have come to a different conclusion. It's just that simple. Every company looks at their market and makes decisions based on the conclusions they reach. In this case Stern has decided that a higher price with lower volume is the best way to make more profit.

    -2
    #263 2 years ago

    Isoquants and Isocosts. I would bet that Stern has not only "looked at the market", but made graphs, projections, and a whole lot of pretty charts showing that this is the way to profit.

    Companies make decisions on one thing and one thing alone, dollar signs.

    No decision is a blind guess. It's all based in cold hard data.

    #264 2 years ago
    Quoted from GotAQuestion:

    Isoquants and Isocosts. I would bet that Stern has not only "looked at the market", but made graphs, projections, and a whole lot of pretty charts showing that this is the way to profit.
    Companies make decisions on one thing and one thing alone, dollar signs.
    No decision is a blind guess. It's all based in cold hard data.

    Right, right, right. Of course, Stern is the same company who looked at the market and is now on their THIRD attempt at a cheap home version of a pinball machine (ie. The Pin, now SM) in the 2-4k range and it's not still not getting a warm reception.

    #265 2 years ago
    Quoted from NPO:

    You know, this is all very simple really. Prices will keep going up as long as people pay it. Nothing complicated. If you want to show Stern you're not going to buy anything more from them, you put your wallet away.
    Me, I was done once I bought TWD Prem, and I saw that lame BG flap-ramp and how "mediocre" its design was. To think that B/W got that perfect with BSD, and Stern had another 22 years - think about that - 22 years to replicate that design and couldn't; it just made me sick.
    With all the things "gone wrong" with Stern this year, it doesn't matter as long as people have more dollars than sense.
    I don't care when dream theme they come up with; I really couldn't care less. When you suck at QC and yet raise prices like nobody's business like they are, you don't get my money. I DGAF what they do or what theme they come up with. I don't care if they somehow make LEs $4500 out the door - if they cannot get their QC under control and stop being a greedy corporation I am through with them.
    Problem is too many people are lukewarm here, or people off Pinside are naive and are just ready to throw money at them to have a game in their house.
    Me, I'm staying in the "B/W class of 92 to 98". CFTBL, SS, and TZ will all come home down the road. I'll pay $6000 for a used TZ from 1993 before I pay $5000 for a present day Stern with less features and wet toilet paper for a playfield.
    Oh, and I'll definitely buy Alien from Heighway first.

    True about the ramp... but there's a really fix to make it shoot as reliably as the ramp on BSD...

    #266 2 years ago
    Quoted from 27dnast:

    True about the ramp... but there's a really fix to make it shoot as reliably as the ramp on BSD...

    Umm no.... sorry my bsd is super smooth and much more reliable stock compared to my twdp with the fixes. .

    #267 2 years ago
    Quoted from NPO:

    You know, this is all very simple really. Prices will keep going up as long as people pay it. Nothing complicated. If you want to show Stern you're not going to buy anything more from them, you put your wallet away.
    Me, I was done once I bought TWD Prem, and I saw that lame BG flap-ramp and how "mediocre" its design was. To think that B/W got that perfect with BSD, and Stern had another 22 years - think about that - 22 years to replicate that design and couldn't; it just made me sick.
    With all the things "gone wrong" with Stern this year, it doesn't matter as long as people have more dollars than sense.
    I don't care when dream theme they come up with; I really couldn't care less. When you suck at QC and yet raise prices like nobody's business like they are, you don't get my money. I DGAF what they do or what theme they come up with. I don't care if they somehow make LEs $4500 out the door - if they cannot get their QC under control and stop being a greedy corporation I am through with them.
    Problem is too many people are lukewarm here, or people off Pinside are naive and are just ready to throw money at them to have a game in their house.
    Me, I'm staying in the "B/W class of 92 to 98". CFTBL, SS, and TZ will all come home down the road. I'll pay $6000 for a used TZ from 1993 before I pay $5000 for a present day Stern with less features and wet toilet paper for a playfield.
    Oh, and I'll definitely buy Alien from Heighway first.

    Well said and i completely agree with it all and cldnt have said it better myself ..... my pinball fun experience has been so much better with my latest b/w purchases and my poor stern pins are just collecting dust now unfortunately. Just 2 more left to get rid of ......

    -3
    #268 2 years ago
    Quoted from Brickshot:

    and it's not still not getting a warm reception.

    On pinside. A niche forum for highly dedicated dedicated hobbyists with, you must admit, an EXTREMELY pessimistic general view on things.

    We know it's lacking features compared to $6000 machines but some random nobody who wants a NIB but doesn't want to pay real NIB prices? Time will tell. There's a demand for it.

    I also find it funny that people say "games shouldn't cost $6,195" and "the game that costs $4,000 sucks" in the same thread. People asked for a $4,000 game. Spider Man Home Edition is what $4,000 worth of game gets you. From what I hear, the $4,000-ish HomePin early reception is that it feels cheap too. In allllllllllll my other hobbies there's a familiar saying - "you get what you pay for". I'm not surprised the budget games feels like budget games.

    #269 2 years ago
    Quoted from GotAQuestion:

    On pinside. A niche forum for highly dedicated dedicated hobbyists with, you must admit, an EXTREMELY pessimistic general view on things.
    We know it's lacking features compared to $6000 machines but some random nobody who wants a NIB but doesn't want to pay real NIB prices? Time will tell. There's a demand for it.
    I also find it funny that people say "games shouldn't cost $6,195" and "the game that costs $4,000 sucks" in the same thread. People asked for a $4,000 game. Spider Man Home Edition is what $4,000 worth of game gets you. From what I hear, the $4,000-ish HomePin early reception is that it feels cheap too. In allllllllllll my other hobbies there's a familiar saying - "you get what you pay for". I'm not surprised the budget games feels like budget games.

    What I think people expect is the current quality of Stern games at about 2k less than the current MSRP. Nobody can understand the minimal increase in game quality from 5-7 years ago to the percentage price increase of today. The two do not correlate.

    The current 4k game you refer to is so cheaply made the margin must be incredible. Clearly the folks paying for the SM VE shouldered a lot of the costs (notably the artwork costs).

    13
    #270 2 years ago
    Quoted from GotAQuestion:

    On pinside. A niche forum for highly dedicated dedicated hobbyists with, you must admit, an EXTREMELY pessimistic general view on things.
    We know it's lacking features compared to $6000 machines but some random nobody who wants a NIB but doesn't want to pay real NIB prices? Time will tell. There's a demand for it.
    I also find it funny that people say "games shouldn't cost $6,195" and "the game that costs $4,000 sucks" in the same thread. People asked for a $4,000 game. Spider Man Home Edition is what $4,000 worth of game gets you. From what I hear, the $4,000-ish HomePin early reception is that it feels cheap too. In allllllllllll my other hobbies there's a familiar saying - "you get what you pay for". I'm not surprised the budget games feels like budget games.

    There in lies the problem. 4K today gets you "the pin" version. 2 years ago I bought a ST pro for 4.2k. That's a bit eye opening to me...

    #271 2 years ago
    Quoted from GotAQuestion:

    Isoquants and Isocosts. I would bet that Stern has not only "looked at the market", but made graphs, projections, and a whole lot of pretty charts showing that this is the way to profit.
    Companies make decisions on one thing and one thing alone, dollar signs.
    No decision is a blind guess. It's all based in cold hard data.

    No doubt. That said, it is not long term thinking. They will only grow the market with good entry point pricing to start/entice new collectors coming in. Maybe I'm wrong and their home model spider man for $3,800 will attract entree level people...maybe.

    #272 2 years ago
    Quoted from GotAQuestion:

    People asked for a $4,000 game. Spider Man Home Edition is what $4,000 worth of game gets you. From what I hear, the $4,000-ish HomePin early reception is that it feels cheap too. In allllllllllll my other hobbies there's a familiar saying - "you get what you pay for". I'm not surprised the budget games feels like budget games.

    That's the problem, the $4,000"ish" game three years ago was a Metallica Pro or Star Trek Pro (okay, $4,300...but close enough).

    I've not played the Pin 2.0 (it looks cool) but can say it can't be as good of a game as Met Pro or Star Trek pro or Iron Man VE.

    #273 2 years ago

    Buyers: Is it just me or is it getting warm in here?

    Stern: Come on, the water's fine. Look Star Wars.

    Buyers: Geronimo! Ow hot hot HOT.

    Stern: Come on, it's only a gradual increase in temperature.

    Buyers: Yeah, I guess so.

    Rinse and repeat.

    Boiling_Frogs_Syndrome (resized).jpeg

    #274 2 years ago

    I have purchased 3 NIB pins in the last couple months. They are a Ghostbusters Pro, a standard Wizard of Oz and a Smaug SE The Hobbit. The Ghostbusters cost me $5500 with shipping and has functioned perfectly and has been enjoyed dozens of times by me and my guests. The Hobbit Smaug SE and Wizard of Oz standard each cost me $8300 with shipping and both have had multiple problems from day 1. Stern may have its issues but they are delivering a more reliable product for less money than any other manufacturer out there. When my The Big Lebowski arrives, that sentiment may change, but for now there is no more reliable manufacturer than Stern. Heighway, Spooky, Dutch and some other manufacturers may have some good looking stuff but Stern has kept this game alive for the past few years and they deserve some ******* respect for doing so.

    10
    #275 2 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    Stern has kept this game alive for the past few years and they deserve some ******* respect for doing so.

    I hear you and do respect Stern on many levels. That said at that some point they need to respect the customer base to though, I don't feel valued by them right now.

    #276 2 years ago
    Quoted from 85vett:

    There in lies the problem. 4K today gets you "the pin" version. 2 years ago I bought a ST pro for 4.2k. That's a bit eye opening to me...

    this is EXACTLY why I started this thread. I want everyone to at least realize they are pulling the wool over our eyes and laughing all the way to the bank- don't sit for this.

    In 2010 I went to the Allentown show and NIB Iron Man was $3700 off the trucks. A couple years ago, I bought a Mustang Pro for $4300- a fair value overall. To inch the Pros up to 5k while cutting their trim, their lockdown bars, the board sets, the under playfield pegs, etc. and now over 5k for this AND introduce the home model for just shy under 4k which was the old pro pricing, shame on them and shame on us for accepting this.

    But worst of all? The old pros from LOTR/Simpsons up to Spiderman, think of the features these games had- LOADED. They made their own ''market'' to make game choices between two buyers, making you choose now a Pro with less features over a premium or LE with all the features, BUT WE ALREADY HAD ALL THE FEATURES!

    Someone earlier really said a mouth full, about how they almost went under if Avatar didn't succeed, and I heard the story of how Spiderman saved the day to keep the lights on because of revisiting and polishing the code and a certain distributor ordering 75 of them when they needed it most.
    They have slapped everyone in the face that help keep their boat above water. By raising the prices constantly, that's like taking the oars and hitting the people in the water on the head.

    You can say what you want about JJP but I'll tell you this. He DIDN'T create two markets for different featured games. Different trims? Yes, but their games are the SAME, and when he heard grumblings over the pricing of Dialed In, he offered a lesser standard option.

    #277 2 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    I have purchased 3 NIB pins in the last couple months. They are a Ghostbusters Pro, a standard Wizard of Oz and a Smaug SE The Hobbit. The Ghostbusters cost me $5500 with shipping and has functioned perfectly and has been enjoyed dozens of times by me and my guests. The Hobbit Smaug SE and Wizard of Oz standard each cost me $8300 with shipping and both have had multiple problems from day 1. Stern may have its issues but they are delivering a more reliable product for less money than any other manufacturer out there. When my The Big Lebowski arrives, that sentiment may change, but for now there is no more reliable manufacturer than Stern. Heighway, Spooky, Dutch and some other manufacturers may have some good looking stuff but Stern has kept this game alive for the past few years and they deserve some ******* respect for doing so.

    With all due respect you are basing your opinion on VERY limited numbers. My SM VE has the auto-launch dead currently. I've had minor issues with other NIB Sterns too. It happens. I've heard from two different FT owners that their games have had multiple issues so Heighway is no different. Pinball is not easy. To suggest Stern is more reliable at this point (especially after the recent palyfields fiasco) is a little silly.

    I'm more interested in how well support responds to help me!

    #278 2 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    but Stern has kept this game alive for the past few years and they deserve some ******* respect for doing so.

    No, the people have kept the game alive and put them in a new factory. They almost went under more than once.

    I like Stern pinball but I also like fair. They're not being fair to their customer base that bailed them out by constantly stripping and raising the costs.

    #279 2 years ago

    JJP has been excellent in customer service so far but they still haven't "fixed" any of my problems (I've had at least 4 with each NIB pin). I am not sure how Stern customer service is because I haven't needed them.

    #280 2 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    Stern has kept this game alive for the past few years and they deserve some ******* respect for doing so.

    This information is not pessimistic just "illuminating".

    The real pinball history:

    Owners/collectors kept pinball alive not Stern as some type of "Jesus Savior".
    Collectors provided technical experience in restoration and reproduction of parts, many times over before Stern did anything.
    Hell, they relied heavily on expert feedback to troubleshoot their own early designs out of the gate in 2001 well into 2006.
    They do not seem to say much on this subject lately.
    Stern, "We are the champions!!!"?
    Horse apples.

    I am not sure why new owners continually try to perpetuate Stern's made up concepts, propaganda, and advertising, that they proposed during their 30th Anniversary by drinking their "cool aid".
    It is like people that are saying, "there is no reason to have a coin door on pinball machine".
    They are just helping the process along at a nice trot.
    This is the reality.

    There were no "days of grandeur" on Stern's behalf before 2007.
    Behind closed doors every single remaining designer, programmer, coder, or engineer will provide justification, if it did not cost them their job. Times were rough, and the future was highly uncertain.
    Most of the non-management people working in every single factory were not around of anything of the past.

    Stern recycled 3 specific titles (TSPP, LOTR, and SM) under multiple production runs to provide survival of their company.
    They changed their business practices because they were forced in order to recognize that the collector community was even the higher importance.
    Stern was just grateful for our help (and buying many of their extremely lukewarm titles), until the tide changed.
    They have rode on the coat tails of the latest revival starting in 2010, and have not looked back.

    It is hard for me to give Stern respect based on these current circumstances.

    They are just thumbing their noses at the people that supported them, in the firm belief, that if they cater to the same boutique buyers as high end cars, in tiny volumes, they will survive.
    That is the mindset of JJP and DP as well.
    Spooky and Heighway are somewhere in the middle, but everybody keeps throwing out promises they cannot keep, and we are supposed to reward all of them for lying or trying promote false hype?
    This does not consider the fiasco with American Pinball, which was even worse at this point, but at least they decided to keep their mouths shut until they figure out how to proceed, if ever.

    I don't see BM66, MG, Houdini, or Alien shipping in less than two weeks, AS PROMISED.
    At least JJP was honest in stating the game was not ready for sale, but he also turned around and said he would not take any more pre orders until the game was ready to be shipped.
    How long did that last, 1 month before Expo?

    I wish them all extremely good luck with that economic concept, but it is flawed stability in the long term, unless pinball machines turn into a "chicken in every pot" with growth of the hobby.
    Unfortunately, the quality to cost is far from equal at this point, and move further away with every "release".
    Stern is by far the worst of the lot in terms of misdirection at the present time.
    They had to clean up their QA, QI, and QM acts due to the mistakes made alone in the past 6 months due to the mess they made on the neighbors backyard with GB.

    Stern Surfing (resized).jpg

    #281 2 years ago
    Quoted from Brickshot:

    Right, right, right. Of course, Stern is the same company who looked at the market and is now on their THIRD attempt at a cheap home version of a pinball machine (ie. The Pin, now SM) in the 2-4k range and it's not still not getting a warm reception.

    Third?

    1. Costco Batman "Standard": Real cabinet, minimized features...the proto "Pro"

    2. Iron Man "Classic": Cheaper MDF cabinet, minimized features

    3. Transformers & Avengers "The Pin": Smaller, cheaper, one speaker, alpha numeric display, not serviceable.

    4. The Pin 2.0: Redesign of the same concept

    We're on #5!

    #282 2 years ago
    Quoted from shacklersrevenge:

    They're not being fair to their customer base that bailed them out by constantly stripping and raising the costs.

    You were expecting Unicorns and Show Ponies? They don't owe us anything but supporting what we have purchased. The Stern games in my gameroom don't buy me shit as far as future releases go.

    #283 2 years ago

    This thread basically echoes the previous one and what people have been saying about Stern for a while now.

    They aren't going to change. They can get away with whatever they want to. They don't care about you. You don't matter to the bottom line.

    Competition is the only way. Hell, with how much some of you have spent you could have started a pinball company by now.

    I don't care about Stern. I care about pinball. I think survival of the fittest applies here and Stern feels no pressure. Someone needs to step up. JJP is not the answer and Spooky has a long way to go beyond just being a value alternative.

    How do you change things? Build a better machine for less money.

    #284 2 years ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    You were expecting Unicorns and Show Ponies? They don't owe us anything but supporting what we have purchased. The Stern games in my gameroom don't buy me shit as far as future releases go.

    At the very least, timely code would be a step in the right direction. And as far as what I'm expecting, I think I speak for almost everyone when I say, I expect games to be priced according to the quality.

    It has nothing to do with unicorns or show ponies.

    #285 2 years ago
    Quoted from 85vett:

    There in lies the problem. 4K today gets you "the pin" version. 2 years ago I bought a ST pro for 4.2k. That's a bit eye opening to me...

    Hell up to a year ago you cld get a awesome met pro for 4500-4600 delivered with some extra mods.......

    #286 2 years ago
    Quoted from TRAMD:

    I have purchased 3 NIB pins in the last couple months. They are a Ghostbusters Pro, a standard Wizard of Oz and a Smaug SE The Hobbit. The Ghostbusters cost me $5500 with shipping and has functioned perfectly and has been enjoyed dozens of times by me and my guests. The Hobbit Smaug SE and Wizard of Oz standard each cost me $8300 with shipping and both have had multiple problems from day 1. Stern may have its issues but they are delivering a more reliable product for less money than any other manufacturer out there. When my The Big Lebowski arrives, that sentiment may change, but for now there is no more reliable manufacturer than Stern. Heighway, Spooky, Dutch and some other manufacturers may have some good looking stuff but Stern has kept this game alive for the past few years and they deserve some ******* respect for doing so.

    Wow so stern pros are allready 5500 shipped...

    #287 2 years ago

    Stern knows that Star Wars is going to be big, and with the release of the shiny new Star Wars Pinball will be 80% of the "I'm done with Stern!" proclaimers on here lining up to find who has an LE left at the new higher price Stern is offering. Just wait and see.

    #288 2 years ago

    blablablabla

    So what is the actual price increase that is causing this whole whine and cheese thread?
    No distributors leaking it, or have they only been informed that there will be a yet unknown price increase?

    If so, why not just wait until the price is actually made public, and THEN go on a rampage? (while still buying the machines, as people usually do despite whining).

    #289 2 years ago
    Quoted from Edenecho:

    blablablabla
    So what is the actual price increase that is causing this whole whine and cheese thread?
    No distributors leaking it, or have they only been informed that there will be a yet unknown price increase?
    If so, why not just wait until the price is actually made public, and THEN go on a rampage? (while still buying the machines, as people usually do despite whining).

    0zczfRw (resized).jpg

    #290 2 years ago
    Quoted from Cobray:

    Stern knows that Star Wars is going to be big, and with the release of the shiny new Star Wars Pinball will be 80% of the "I'm done with Stern!" proclaimers on here lining up to find who has an LE left at the new higher price Stern is offering. Just wait and see.

    even if Star wars is a success at end, i think more and more people will wait the product coming and playing it before ordering.
    if people are really done with Stern, preorders should be down at first, whatever the theme/licence. Then orders if the quality and code development do not live up to expectations.

    i think this is normal that prices are increasing in some extent, i mean material, bom costs, wages etc increase. But not 20% increasing in few months!!
    i only bought 3 NIB in the past, ACDC premium 7100€, STLE 8500€ and recently GB premium 8500€. i paid my GB 20% more than my ACDC premium and now the price of a premium is a LE of 3 years ago.

    Everybody though that more manufacturers in the business would be a chance to get a pinball machine cheaper.
    Stern premium is normally 8300-8500€ (over 9000€ for B66)
    JJP SE is around 9000€
    TBL is 10000$ i have no price in € coz this european pin is not sold in europe )
    HP with Alien is around 7500€ pro and 9000€ LE (need to be confirmed)
    Don't know for Spooky, maybe it is currently the best deal.

    if people still go on to pay higher, so Stern will still increase their prices...as JJP and others. why would it change?

    #291 2 years ago
    Quoted from Cobray:

    Stern knows that Star Wars is going to be big, and with the release of the shiny new Star Wars Pinball will be 80% of the "I'm done with Stern!" proclaimers on here lining up to find who has an LE left at the new higher price Stern is offering. Just wait and see.

    Is star wars that great of theme? I know i cld care less and my friends cld give 2 shits about it also. I can think of alot of other themes that be better. Hopefully its better than sterns other 2 trys at it especially for this big money

    #292 2 years ago

    I do miss the usually provided hitler vid.

    #293 2 years ago

    I'm frustrated by the price increases, too... it's hard to believe how quickly they've inflated. But, reality is that there's a healthy market for high pin prices. If it wasn't there, these companies wouldn't set their price points so high. That's the bottom line... and a lot of collectors are having a hard time accepting it.

    The only way this changes is for people stop buying. Period. No exceptions.

    I see absolutely no evidence that's happening... people have a "stomp my feet...ok... I'll buy" attitude. And prices on the second hand market continue to explode, too. Believe it or not, but every time one of us shells out $8K for a Tron LE... or a SS... a *mint* CV, or a LTBR AC/DC, pin companies are watching and are further aware that collectors are willing to pay big bucks for a big toy.

    We're all part of this problem. So, the choice is to (a) holster the collecting impulse to buy high dollar pins or (b) shut up and continue to buy.

    #294 2 years ago
    Quoted from Cobray:

    Stern knows that Star Wars is going to be big, and with the release of the shiny new Star Wars Pinball will be 80% of the "I'm done with Stern!" proclaimers on here lining up to find who has an LE left at the new higher price Stern is offering. Just wait and see.

    Star Wars is about as appealing to me as eating a plate of jello with regurgitated cat hairballs suspended throughout, and me seeing how much of the jello I can eat without inadvertently eating a hairball.

    In other words, I won't be one of the lukewarm ones.

    #295 2 years ago
    Quoted from Cobray:

    Stern knows that Star Wars is going to be big, and with the release of the shiny new Star Wars Pinball will be 80% of the "I'm done with Stern!" proclaimers on here lining up to find who has an LE left at the new higher price Stern is offering. Just wait and see.

    I don't agree. Each new pin is just a box of coils with art. I love Star Wars and would like to see the theme. I can't imagine any pin, even my precious Led Zeppelin, getting the new pricing out of my wallet. It's just a game and the new pricing is now beyond where I'm willing to deal with the possibility of bad playfields, peeling decals and other common issues with recent Stern titles. I have disposable income, but don't like to be anyone's sucker.

    How long before a $5700 pro, $7200 Premium and $8700 LE? I'm predicting during Calendar 2017.

    #296 2 years ago
    Quoted from Cobray:

    Stern knows that Star Wars is going to be big, and with the release of the shiny new Star Wars Pinball will be 80% of the "I'm done with Stern!" proclaimers on here lining up to find who has an LE left at the new higher price Stern is offering. Just wait and see.

    How many people are already on the star wars list with their distributors?

    I bet a whole lot more than people are willing to admit.

    #297 2 years ago
    Quoted from bigd1979:

    Is star wars that great of theme? I know i cld care less and my friends cld give 2 shits about it also. I can think of alot of other themes that be better. Hopefully its better than sterns other 2 trys at it especially for this big money

    Star Wars is a marque theme. It is the biggest franchise in the word with the biggest earnings and the most loyal fan base.

    There are Star Wars collectors that pay big money for all sorts of merchandise and collectables. They collect everything from candy bars, expensive maquettes to life size statues worth more than a pinball machine.

    I am certain that a Star Wars pinball machine will be many peoples first time NIB purchase, for the fanboys and the serious collector. It is a license to print money for Stern. It will be a guaranteed smash hit.

    #298 2 years ago

    Calling a pinball machine JUST a box of coils is reaaaaaaaaally diminishing the effort it takes to design and build one. Go mass produce just an unpopulated playfield and come tell us how easy that is alone. Ignore having all of the small-quantity custom parts manufactured. Ignore the actual populating of the playfield, running a mile of wire or more between everything, soldering, etc.

    Most games take 40 hours give or take about 5 to build the playfield. And that's on an assembly line. Design takes at least a year, and you'd have to assume the more desirable designers don't come cheap either.

    Most people who build their own machines from nothing spend about a year of consistent work. Heck I've seen rethemes take longer. A Pinball machine is more than "just" a box of coils.

    #299 2 years ago
    Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:

    This information is not pessimistic just "illuminating".
    The real pinball history:
    Owners/collectors kept pinball alive not Stern as some type of "Jesus Savior".
    Collectors provided technical experience in restoration and reproduction of parts, many times over before Stern did anything.
    Hell, they relied heavily on expert feedback to troubleshoot their own early designs out of the gate in 2001 well into 2006.
    They do not seem to say much on this subject lately.
    Stern, "We are the champions!!!"?
    Horse apples.
    I am not sure why new owners continually try to perpetuate Stern's made up concepts, propaganda, and advertising, that they proposed during their 30th Anniversary by drinking their "cool aid".
    It is like people that are saying, "there is no reason to have a coin door on pinball machine".
    They are just helping the process along at a nice trot.
    This is the reality.
    There were no "days of grandeur" on Stern's behalf before 2007.
    Behind closed doors every single remaining designer, programmer, coder, or engineer will provide justification, if it did not cost them their job. Times were rough, and the future was highly uncertain.
    Most of the non-management people working in every single factory were not around of anything of the past.
    Stern recycled 3 specific titles (TSPP, LOTR, and SM) under multiple production runs to provide survival of their company.
    They changed their business practices because they were forced in order to recognize that the collector community was even the higher importance.
    Stern was just grateful for our help (and buying many of their extremely lukewarm titles), until the tide changed.
    They have rode on the coat tails of the latest revival starting in 2010, and have not looked back.
    It is hard for me to give Stern respect based on these current circumstances.
    They are just thumbing their noses at the people that supported them, in the firm belief, that if they cater to the same boutique buyers as high end cars, in tiny volumes, they will survive.
    That is the mindset of JJP and DP as well.
    Spooky and Heighway are somewhere in the middle, but everybody keeps throwing out promises they cannot keep, and we are supposed to reward all of them for lying or trying promote false hype?
    This does not consider the fiasco with American Pinball, which was even worse at this point, but at least they decided to keep their mouths shut until they figure out how to proceed, if ever.
    I don't see BM66, MG, Houdini, or Alien shipping in less than two weeks, AS PROMISED.
    At least JJP was honest in stating the game was not ready for sale, but he also turned around and said he would not take any more pre orders until the game was ready to be shipped.
    How long did that last, 1 month before Expo?
    I wish them all extremely good luck with that economic concept, but it is flawed stability in the long term, unless pinball machines turn into a "chicken in every pot" with growth of the hobby.
    Unfortunately, the quality to cost is far from equal at this point, and move further away with every "release".
    Stern is by far the worst of the lot in terms of misdirection at the present time.
    They had to clean up their QA, QI, and QM acts due to the mistakes made alone in the past 6 months due to the mess they made on the neighbors backyard with GB.

    Must make for some mighty interesting pillow talk

    #300 2 years ago
    Quoted from PinSinner:

    Star Wars is a marque theme. It is the biggest franchise in the word with the biggest earnings and the most loyal fan base.
    There are Star Wars collectors that pay big money for all sorts of merchandise and collectables. They collect everything from candy bars, expensive maquettes to life size statues worth more than a pinball machine.
    I am certain that a Star Wars pinball machine will be many peoples first time NIB purchase, for the fanboys and the serious collector. It is a license to print money for Stern. It will be a guaranteed smash hit.

    ... hasn't the Star Wars theme hit the pinball streets four times? Last I checked they aren't exactly knocking down the doors of insane fanboys willing throw stupid money away just because it says Star Wars on it. Besides, who's to say Star Wars geeks will give two craps about a themed pinball?

    Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
    $ 48.25
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    The MOD Couple
    $ 60.00
    Playfield - Plastics
    Vandelay Industries
    $ 62.95
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    Super Skill Shot Shop
    $ 7,995.00
    Pinball Machine
    Classic Game Rooms
    $ 7,500.00
    From: $ 13.00
    Electronics
    Third Coast Pinball
    $ 89.99
    $ 50.00
    Lighting - Led
    Rock Custom Pinball
    $ 229.99
    Lighting - Other
    Lighted Pinball Mods
    From: $ 9.00
    Electronics
    nvram.weebly.com
    $ 48.00
    Cabinet - Other
    ModFather Pinball Mods
    $ 34.95
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    ULEKstore
    From: $ 7.60
    Cabinet Parts
    PinBoltCaps
    $ 8,999.00
    Pinball Machine
    Nitro Pinball Shop
    $ 29.95
    Gameroom - Decorations
    ULEKstore
    $ 46.95
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    Super Skill Shot Shop
    $ 15.00
    Playfield - Plastics
    Pinball Haus
    From: $ 9.99
    Eproms
    Matt's Basement Arcade
    $ 18.00
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    The MOD Couple
    $ 1.95
    Various Novelties
    Pinball Wheezer
    $ 27.99
    Eproms
    Matt's Basement Arcade
    From: $ 55.00
    Playfield - Plastics
    Pinball Mod Co.
    $ 7,499.00
    Pinball Machine
    Little Shop Of Games
    There are 804 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 17.

    Hey there! Got a moment?

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside