I am thankful to live close to The Pinball Wizard Arcade in Pelham, NH.
Sarah always has the latest and greatest titles. I am sure with Stern's increase, I couldn't blame her if she had to charge more.

Last I heard Game 3 go's on the line in April I do not see announcement of game 4 before expo

new game, new price.
new lcd, cost less, ask for more money. like it's a privilege.
2 screws instead of 4, ask more.
less toys in pro and premium to justify the premium/LE, ask for more and make them pay for additional options that used to be included.
rince and repeat on every new title.

nothing will change until JJP and others starts to pump out games on a regular basis, then it will bite stern in the ass, and it will, eventually.

There is a place for the pin not for me but it is good for the future of the hobby

I am done and out.Price increases combined with lower quality.And no quick (if any)resolutions For fixes due to poor quality.Weak code (With the exception being L. sheets)

I am slowly selling off my pristine collection of solid pins from the good stern years (My TRON is in the marketplace as I post this to prove it) and jumping into a new hobby.

If I have a desire to play pinball.I will go to one of the several arcades here in Vegas.And let the operators deal with the headaches.

Saying 'no' with your wallet could most likely result in more SLE games on future titles. Why build hundreds of games if you can make more money with just dozens?

That's a great point. A lot of Stern's recent changes (Spike system, new backbox design, new lockdown bar latch design, putting pegs in pro's, LED's, etc) have led to cost reductions but for customers they have only led to price increases, lol.

It's a case of paying more for less. However, we are not talking about paying more for less ice cream in a container, lol. No we are talking about dropping $5k-$10k on a pinball machine of all things. Value should and needs to be offered at those prices to justify the crazy prices.

Based on the current poll results, Stern has a serious issue here going into 2017.

I think they need to re-evaluate the people making these decisions, namely Jody Dankberg. I know he is their marketing person, but I truly feel he is the driving force on some of these polarizing decisions that has impacted how consumers view and feel about Stern right now.

From their questionable social media censorship, to the application to purchase a $15K pinball machine - and now another price increase with no justifiable reason to do so, makes me think Gary needs to seriously sit down and question the advice he is getting from his employees. Let's not forget Jody's meltdown during the DeadFlip GBLE video.. that guy has some serious issues.

At the end of the day, the numbers speak for themselves on the poll. When the two biggest recent subject matters regarding Stern has been both quality concerns and price increases- that's a losing formula no matter how you try to explain that.

Look at the BM66 marketing strategy- come out with flyers saying the game would be released in November. Collect a bunch of deposits from people hoping the game would be delivered as an Xmas gift- then not even show a gameplay video, let alone update the public as to when the pin will actually be released! That to me is total bullshit, sorry.

You forgot not having a playable BM66 at the Launch Party and having all 3 models at Pinball Expo behind a rope non-playable.

Totally agree with Jody Dankberg needing to be let go.

who_designed-tech_support_3_laughing_man (resized).jpg

link?

Yet somewhere on this site,there is another thread where guys are calling this a great time for pinball.

It IS! Gary is making tons of money!

About 30 mins in. Some one must have been in a chat room impersonating my name here, so it took me by surprise he was using my name here in the video. After that others are named and Jody starts asking peoples addresses and getting all pissed off on DeadFlips stream. They even needed to tell him to chill out. Totally unprofessional.

Not necessarily.

If I had a dime for every time a poll/thread like this was done over the last several years, with people promising that they will no longer buy a NIB Stern (for dozens of different reasons in addition to price) I'd be a very rich man.

I am willing to bet that the percentage of people who voted that they will not buy a NIB Stern, who actually *will* buy a NIB Stern, is extremely high.

People have been bitching about price increases on Pinside forever. Yet, we have more pinball manufacturer's than ever, and prices are as high as ever.

I get that they are a business and as a business they have to institute a price increases on a regular basis, however given that [we] here on pinside have a bit more knowledge than the average joe customer, it's kind of sad that things like the quality control issues, the clear coat issues (and it's replacement program, or lack there of) and the cheapening of the BOM haven't been addressed to a respectable level before instituting said price increase

if stern were a [normal] company with a lot of competition, this simply wouldn't fly. but given that stern really doesn't any other companies that can complete with what they are doing at the same level (volume, number of titles, etc...), unless their entire customer base (or a good portion) let them know by voting with their wallets, these things will continue to happen.

You might be right, but I plan on sticking to my guns on this one.

Enough is enough.

I believe Stern will release new titles into the 2018, 2019 year and will take deposits shortly for those titles sight unseen.
How many will buy?

As you can see here, the majority seems to be very passionate about this. I think that thought process is what the big guns at Stern laughed about in their conference room - but it can't keep going up forever. NIB prices weren't very high vs the used market- now there's such an extreme delta it can't be ignored. As the poster above me said, enough is enough already. Many great used games out there with more value, like the $6K great condition TZ I just picked up instead of a $8-9K NIB Stern, which I would have gladly bought had the price vs value made sense.

LOL KIRK! That's your new name

...and he defends Kaneda.

I'm sure it will come as a big shock to Stern that people don't like price increases.

The pricing would be easier to swallow if the quality and attention to detail were there.

Yeah, I've never heard that one before.

It's like Deja Vu all over again.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Etc. etc. etc.

If he is unprincipled in his marketing strategy and arrogant to the consumers of pinball. It might be too late to volte-face Stern.

Let's try this. You guys want to get the words out and you want to speak with your wallet. If people "SHARE" this post on their facebook timeline it would get alot of traction. I'm not talking "LIKES"... you must hit "SHARE" That way friends of your friends of their friends get to see the post. Sharing a post 10 times can get at least 1000 views. If we can share this 100 times then we can get 10,000 public views. However, I'm not holding my breath.

https://www.facebook.com/wheresthecode/ (SHARE the first post)

nomore-sterns-pinball (resized).png

I'd be happy to join but I have to do all my votes for the Ultimatesternpinballfan first.

And that might take a while.

Finally, RobT weighs in as a voice of reason. I thought i was out on an island.

Btw, when the corporate tax rate goes to 15% I'm sure a "huge" price decrease will be coming as well

Very true, but these issues are not new. These threads happen a few times a year. More and more people swear off buying sterns, but when the latest and greatest get displayed the sheep rush to buy.

I am expecting this to turn into another long rant of a thread and then boom, stern announces a new machine in a few weeks and suddenly the fervor starts. Then the game will be released to fanfare. After that comes the moaning period where teething issues are discovered. The game gets stale and people whine for a code update. Around this time stern will announce something new and shiny that costs money and people will complain and swear of buying stern yet again, only for the next game to be announced.

These threads are so cyclical and pointless.

Meanwhile, i'll keep banging away at my TWDLE, GBLE and AC/DC premium! That's great pinball.

stern/gary said recently that the home use market is 50%+ sales.
now, i'm curious i asked this before. what will happen in 15-20 years when this generation is gone/too old or went to do something else.
i doubt the next generation will be enough to keep pinball alive.

everyone i know under 25 years old (my son and friends included) don't give a sh*t about pinball, even most 40+ years old don't even know pinball still exist. ''what? those still exist?...''
at these prices, going up on every release no one will be able to buy one, think about it 5k-15k for a toy, really.

the 10% rich people with more money than common senses won't be enough to keep pinball alive.
future of pinball is in jeopardy.

pinball manufacturers need to wake the f*ck up.

I wouldnt be suprised if 2016 was Sterns best year in the quantity of pins sold. Im not sure why they would make any drastic changes to their operation like some folks here would encourage.

i think is useless to talk about price increase. Shareholders drive the car now, Stern, JJP..they are on the same business road, on the same "how to make more money" road. so that is not surprising. that was very funny to see Stern announcing his super LE and JPP his collector edition in the same time!! they mark themselves, man to man. As if they though that the more it is expensive the more it is better quality. maybe they though that we thought it.
as it has been said, you get the power. ok Stern will probably get a success with Star Wars, but what about Aerosmith or other shitty licence/theme. What about Dialed in? People could buy NIB before, now more and more people sell to buy NIB so what will it be tomorrow?
some distributors are also pinsiders and it would be interested to know if in the last year, their sale volume for NIB has increased or not and they earn as much on a nib sale.

Clint would shoot that dude that looks like an old lady and not ask any questions.

I thought they were trying to compact their cycle down some. Not to the extent of Stern, but if they only produce one title a year, I will be worried for them. Especially with Dialed In having some backlash. I for one am interested in game #4. Dialed In doesn't do it for me. I will be curious who gets the nod for game #4. Hope it is the same group that did WoZ with some cool licensed theme.

The LCD is not what costs more or less. To me that is a rounding error compared with the $ it costs to program an LCD over a DMD. I am sure it is ten fold the work to deal with an LCD over a DMD. All that real estate creates a content nightmare. Cool results, but a lot of work none the less.

Prices go up once the LCD display era begins at stern, and on top of that star wars is coming. They know star wars will sell out no matter the price. It's hard to justify these prices already.

I am 30 and none of my friends who are around my age really care that much for my pins when they are round, they might have the odd play while we are kicking our heels waiting for others to arrive or a taxi but that's about it, two of them brought a pin each but sold them within a couple of months of having them, because "they didn't do enough" compared to tablets, smartphones, digital tv with game centres etc.

I hope I am wrong but it feels like Stern especially are maybe getting as much money in the bank as they can to either sell up or simply preparing for the bubble to burst and dark ages of pinball to return again, this continual price gouging is not something a business does if they want longevity, its usually done to make the books thicker in preparation for a sale or a goodbye, hope I am wrong.

Good points. Lets also not forget that JJPs business failed to profit a dime on WOZ and TH and had to be taken over by an angel investor. Making pinballs is tough and making a profit on it is even tougher (especially when they are made in America). Threads like these crack me up because people expect companies to operate in the negative or no profit otherwise they are greedy. Anyone who thinks Stern is raking in big profit is crazy. I truly do hope they are making a profit, because it wasn't that long ago Stern had to take on an investor too.

Price increases are what they are. Once the corporate tax rate is 15% we should see price increases slow and we will all have a little more disposable income.

You are 30? Enjoy the fruits of your youth young man!

The first time I read someone online making all of the arguments you just made, you were about 13. If you are bored enough go google "pinball is dying" on RGP.

Pinball is enough of a niche that you don't have to know anybody who likes it for it to survive - this isn't the NFL. There's no evidence that things are gonna slow down anytime soon. Raising the price of NIB games a few hundred bucks has never done it before and it isn't going to do it now.

south park 4 point plan p (resized).jpg

15-20 yrs from now? Who knows. I have a tough enough time figuring out what's going on tomorrow.

My guess is pinball manufacturers are F Ed with the combination of higher prices and 99% of the younger generation not giving a F

Cry me a river for Stern? No way. They will be fine. They have a manufacturing plant and could transition into a lot of different avenues if the profit margins and/or volume isn't there

If I'm not mistaken, Bally/Williams did just that. Pinball is F ing hard, especially if you aren't pumping out 25,000 TAFs every release

Stern might be doing that anyhow. Nobody knows their true cost structure and profit margins. They are in business to make money

If sales drop off and more profitable opportunities arise then we will simply be left with less pinball

But that's a given down the road anyhow isn't it?

No NIB for me anymore
i bye previous NIB

Spiderman
Black Spiderman
Batman dark knight
shrek
NBA
Ironman x2
Avatar x 2
Avatar LE x 2
Transformers Decepticon
Transformers LE
Tron LE
LOTR LE
ACDC premium
Star trek

the price is to high and no more for me wallet

i bought all of this games sNIB

POTC
Spiderman
Black Spiderman
Batman dark knight
Shrek
Avatar LE
Transformers Deception
Tron LE
LOTR LE
ACDC premium
Star trek LE
GB Pro
GB Prem

the titles and licenses are great
but the quality is to pos now for this price
and another price increase is a absolut NO GO for me

good luck Stern

i love my WOZ and Hobbit it is a different league

like a Toyota VS BMW

So the poll is currently sitting at ~300 people saying no to Stern NIB in 2017. At the old factory they could do up to 50 a day right? So that is less than a week's worth of machines by the old standard, likely even fewer now.

StrawCamel (resized).png

Sweet! My first NIB was a closeout Wheel of Fortune for $2450! BRING IT ON!!!!

why is that yellow shag carpeting monster attacking that camel?

Enjoy Sarah's collection while you can, lease is up in February and I doubt she is renewing.

Oh I do man I enjoy life, doing as much as I can but one of those things that makes me smile just so happens to be pinball. I grew out of computer games (the entertainment of my generation) but pinball still puts a smile on my face. I was actually reading RGP years ago when I was younger, my old man used to post on those forums and I used to sit and read with him so I have seen some of the old threads, that place had more drama than pinside LOL.

My point was that I am to some on these forums part of the next generation that is often referred to and a few of my friends are the generation after me, I have my friends with kids who are the next generation after them etc and no one really cares all that much for pinball, as you said its a niche, which is all well a good when you have one maybe two manufacturers fighting over that market but how much longer can this niche market support the emergence of more and more new companies brining more titles than ever to the market? while pricing are on the up and up? Higher and higher prices is simply another way to put off the up and coming generations to even consider giving pinball a try when they already feel a PS4 at $300 and a xbox one at another $300 plus games at $50 a pop are already superior.