(Topic ID: 230751)

Stern Pinball Sales Have Grown 80% in the Last 3 Years....


By BackFlipper

4 months ago



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  • 135 posts
  • 47 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 months ago by Bublehead
  • Topic is favorited by 6 Pinsiders

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    There are 135 posts in this topic. You are on page 3 of 3.
    #101 4 months ago
    Quoted from wdennie:

    Apparently nothing.
    If you want to be the biggest, then you should be the best.

    Really? In how many industries is this true? Are the best cars made by the biggest car companies? Is the best furniture made by the biggest furniture companies? Does MacDonald’s make the best hamburger? Or maybe you can get a better car, table, or hamburger from a smaller more “boutique “ type of operation (usually at a higher price though).

    By the way, I am not trying to say that jjp or ap or CFC games are superior to Stern offerings....I’m not technically qualified to say. I was just struck by how wrong that “biggest should mean best product” sounded to me.

    Sorry about the cargument

    #102 4 months ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    There's also the Stern fanboys knocking JJP regullary, going into JJP owners threads to bash their games, and acting like they are on the brink of going out of business every day. It's old.

    If people trash talk in a club thread get them baned club threads are the one place on Pinside trash talk is not tolerated

    #103 4 months ago
    Quoted from Eightball88:

    Really? In how many industries is this true? Are the best cars made by the biggest car companies? Is the best furniture made by the biggest furniture companies? Does MacDonald’s make the best hamburger? Or maybe you can get a better car, table, or hamburger from a smaller more “boutique “ type of operation (usually at a higher price though).
    By the way, I am not trying to say that jjp or ap or CFC games are superior to Stern offerings....I’m not technically qualified to say. I was just struck by how wrong that “biggest should mean best product” sounded to me.
    Sorry about the cargument

    I think we trying to say the same thing.
    but it should be there goal.

    #104 4 months ago

    Congrats to Stern on this great milestone. While the sales are up the hobby still needs to grow.

    Events that encourage people to reach out and bring someone new.
    Free Admission to Leagues for new people.
    More local events featuring people representing the hobby.

    I hope they stop making games with insanely difficult rulesets!
    Begin a new era of highly approachable, intuitive games without the mind numbing rulesets.
    I don't want to think about it and shouldn't have to study to be top player.

    #105 4 months ago

    Gary Stern should be calling Williams every single day thanking them for shutting the pinball division down. If they had not Stern would just be a distant memory and out of business.

    13
    #106 4 months ago
    Quoted from Squeakman:

    Gary Stern should be calling Williams every single day thanking them for shutting the pinball division down.

    Sorry he's been on the phone thanking JJP for the ability to triple prices in the last 7 years.

    #107 4 months ago

    Warning, long post ahead...

    What seems to be the problem IMO is the fans of one manufacturer seem to think it is an exclusive club. It is all or notihing, sort of like the old 3 automakers or the old three pinball makers... WMS, Bally, and Gottlieb... there were some major arguments back then as to who built the best machines... then Sega showed up and proved why some of us liked Bally and WMS machines better... then everything went in the shitter, Stern hung on (thank you Gary) and now we are back fighting the same war with different armies and different players.

    I have given Stern so many passes over the years just because they were the ONLY game in pinball, and they kept it alive so it could have another renaissance. Now that they are the WMS of the latest resurgence, it just seems fitting people say the same things about the big dog Stern that they said back then about the big dog WMS/Bally.

    JJP showed up because Jack thought he could do pinball better than Stern. Stern continues to do what Stern does, build pinball machines and sell to ops to use them to make money, oh and they sell more than a few games to the home market as well.

    JJP makes machines that they hope live up to the the same standards as the old WMS and Bally titles. They are not cheap, and so require more capital to put on route. One would hope that means less cost on site, but JJP have had some quality issues on initial builds that have proven that is not always the case. They have had some misses. But ops do put them out on site and make money with them, some claiming the cost is worth it.

    Every new manufacturer of pinball goes through the growing pains that come with maturing from a startup to big kid on the block, and I expect we will see the chaff fall by the wayside as all the new suppliers spring up and then die back as the next pinball frost hits which will certainly do a lot of them in.

    You only need look at other industries caught in a positive growth curve to see that the battle ground gets strewn with the bloddy carcasses of failed companies pretty quickly. For the automotive world, during the start of American’s love for the automobile, we produced this classic list of failed companies, and it is not short:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_defunct_automobile_manufacturers_of_the_United_States

    So now I just enjoy all the new, unexpected growth that I didnt think could happen again and wish every new manufacturer the best of luck. Without them, new, playable, REAL pinball machines might become a thing of the past.

    #108 4 months ago
    Quoted from JY64:

    If people trash talk in a club thread get them baned club threads are the one place on Pinside trash talk is not tolerated

    I think it's good to have a few enforced civil zones. Some threads remind me of sports fans from opposing teams engaging. Lots of trash talk from both sides from the more vocal fans that may have some basis in fact but is due more to the dislike of the other team.

    #109 4 months ago
    Quoted from Bublehead:

    Warning, long post ahead...
    What seems to be the problem IMO is the fans of one manufacturer seem to think it is an exclusive club. It is all or notihing, sort of like the old 3 automakers or the old three pinball makers... WMS, Bally, and Gottlieb... there were some major arguments back then as to who built the best machines... then Sega showed up and proved why some of us liked Bally and WMS machines better... then everything went in the shitter, Stern hung on (thank you Gary) and now we are back fighting the same war with different armies and different players.
    I have given Stern so many passes over the years just because they were the ONLY game in pinball, and they kept it alive so it could have another renaissance. Now that they are the WMS of the latest resurgence, it just seems fitting people say the same things about the big dog Stern that they said back then about the big dog WMS/Bally.
    JJP showed up because Jack thought he could do pinball better than Stern. Stern continues to do what Stern does, build pinball machines and sell to ops to use them to make money, oh and they sell more than a few games to the home market as well.
    JJP makes machines that they hope live up to the the same standards as the old WMS and Bally titles. They are not cheap, and so require more capital to put on route. One would hope that means less cost on site, but JJP have had some quality issues on initial builds that have proven that is not always the case. They have had some misses. But ops do put them out on site and make money with them, some claiming the cost is worth it.
    Every new manufacturer of pinball goes through the growing pains that come with maturing from a startup to big kid on the block, and I expect we will see the chaff fall by the wayside as all the new suppliers spring up and then die back as the next pinball frost hits which will certainly do a lot of them in.
    You only need look at other industries caught in a positive growth curve to see that the battle ground gets strewn with the bloddy carcasses of failed companies pretty quickly. For the automotive world, during the start of American’s love for the automobile, we produced this classic list of failed companies, and it is not short:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_defunct_automobile_manufacturers_of_the_United_States
    So now I just enjoy all the new, unexpected growth that I didnt think could happen again and wish every new manufacturer the best of luck. Without them, new, playable, REAL pinball machines might become a thing of the past.

    Well said

    10
    #110 4 months ago

    Call me crazy, but I root for all of the pinball manufacturers to make a big profit. Just the same way as I have always rooted for every American automobile manufacturer to make a big profit. Big profits in an industry typically lead to more competition within that industry which typically leads to better products and more innovation which eventually leads to me getting some pretty cool shit in my car.

    So I am rooting for Stern and JJP and API and CGC and API and Spooky and Multimorphic and the guys making Kingpin and everybody else that dares to enter this crazy hobby of ours. I just want cool shit in my games.

    11
    #111 4 months ago
    Quoted from BackFlipper:

    Call me crazy, but I root for all of the pinball manufacturers to make a big profit.

    Then you are doing Pinside wrong man. It's very simple, pick a side and worm that thought into every other goddamn post you make on here!

    #113 4 months ago
    Quoted from BackFlipper:

    I just want cool shit in my games.

    Cool shit = innovative design.

    He writes "cool shit", gets 5 upvotes.

    I talk about good design, I get destroyed.

    That's pinside for ya.

    #114 4 months ago

    Pinside is not a good place to go looking for support... as a matter of fact, if Pinside is your support group, you are way past the abilities of modern psychology and therapy to help you.

    #115 4 months ago
    Quoted from Bendit:

    Cool shit = innovative design.

    Nope.

    -1
    #116 4 months ago
    Quoted from Jvspin:

    I think it's good to have a few enforced civil zones. Some threads remind me of sports fans from opposing teams engaging. Lots of trash talk from both sides from the more vocal fans that may have some basis in fact but is due more to the dislike of the other team.

    I agree club threads should be a no trash zone. I do not believe people are trash talking on JJP club threads I believe JJP fans always try and make themselves the victim to justify their trash talk on a Stern thread

    #117 4 months ago
    Quoted from JY64:

    I do not believe people are trash talking on JJP club threads...

    I agree, I don't see trash talking going on in club threads, it's nice.

    Usually just the same people who go into most of the opposing team's threads, other than club, to stir the pot with something negative to say, doesn't really matter what game or topic.

    #118 4 months ago

    Actually you're right. I mean, cool shit often comes from innovative design, but not always.

    #119 4 months ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    2019 is HUGE for pinball.

    in 2019, most manufactures will be spending the majority of the year making the games they already announced/promised in 2018.

    AP = oktoberfest
    CGC = monster bash remake
    JJP = pirates
    spooky = ACNC

    #120 4 months ago
    Quoted from Bublehead:

    you are way past the abilities of modern psychology and therapy to help you.

    Hey man. Go suck a lemon, you condescending twit.

    #121 4 months ago

    bendit And you, sir, are taking yourself way to serious, because my comment was not aimed at you, but was joke. Not sure there is a more appropriate time to say “Lighten up, Francis!”

    #122 4 months ago
    Quoted from JodyG:

    I don't think it was very smart to basically reveal Stern's wholesale pricing to the world on the K podcast. Nothing like biting the hand that feeds you! I honestly think when the next crunch hits, manufacturers are going to cut out distributors and go to direct sales in order to maintain their margins. I've seen it happen in other hobby segments, and it would't be much of a stretch to see it happen in this one as well. Or think about Stern knocking the pinball manufacturing world to their knees by offering games directly for "just over 3900" per game.

    I don’t listen to the K podcast and saw this in The Pinball Co WeFunder thread, but wanted to find out more. Has Stern’s pricing been revealed?

    #123 4 months ago
    Quoted from Bublehead:

    And you, sir, are taking yourself way to serious

    Actually, Yeah, that's probably true in general.

    Mommy! the pinside guys are not nice to me!

    To be fair, I was really trying to contribute to this thread in a civilized way, trying to watch what I write. I see now, that this concept is not really needed. That's fine.

    Quoted from greenhornet:

    in 2019, most manufactures will be spending the majority of the year making the games they already announced/promised in 2018.
    AP = oktoberfest

    I for one, cannot wait to play that title. Wondering if the gameplay from my Champion Pub has spoiled me though. We shall see.

    #124 4 months ago

    No problem bendit, thanks for understanding. Passion is not in short supply around here, and if we could somehow figure out how to harness this passion, and channel it into the flux capacitor... it just might work.

    #125 4 months ago
    Quoted from Bendit:

    Wondering if the gameplay from my Champion Pub has spoiled me though. We shall see.

    I wouldn't be worried about that at all. I don't find them similar.

    #126 4 months ago

    I wonder if Stern has another manufacturing facility in Brazil b/c it ran out of capacity at the new manufacturing facility or just a cost savings move to have them manufactured in Brazil now too.

    Edit(video of facility):

    #127 4 months ago
    Quoted from jathomp22:

    I wonder if Stern has another manufacturing facility in Brazil b/c it ran out of capacity at the new manufacturing facility or just a cost savings move to have them manufactured in Brazil now too.
    Edit(video of facility):

    You can't import complete pins into brazil, you have to build them there. They just built that assembly plant so they could sell in brazil.

    #128 4 months ago

    I know a couple American Pinball games sent there assembled.

    #129 4 months ago

    Great news all without me buying any post SAM pins.

    CGC, JJP, Spooky and AP making pins as well.

    I’d like to see how much all new pin sales have grown in the last 8 years.

    #130 4 months ago
    Quoted from epthegeek:

    You can't import complete pins into brazil, you have to build them there. They just built that assembly plant so they could sell in brazil.

    You can import them, but it's INCREDIBLY expensive. Stern must have done the math, and (seems unbelievable!) it's less expensive to build them there. The QA training alone of starting up something like that new, and a potential language barrier would give me nightmares.

    #131 4 months ago
    Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

    You can import them, but it's INCREDIBLY expensive. Stern must have done the math, and (seems unbelievable!) it's less expensive to build them there. The QA training alone of starting up something like that new, and a potential language barrier would give me nightmares.

    I find it extremely interesting that pin sales are high enough there to justify a plant. That's actually pretty cool. Or is it more about the exports?

    #132 4 months ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    I find it extremely interesting that pin sales are high enough there to justify a plant. That's actually pretty cool. Or is it more about the exports?

    Exports are not tariffed in Brazil, so perhaps they are planning on that being a distribution point for South America and Europe (?)

    #133 4 months ago

    Import Tax/Tariffs are high, so it is cheaper in this case to partner with another company to make their machines for local markets in South America.

    #134 4 months ago
    Quoted from Bublehead:

    No problem bendit, thanks for understanding. Passion is not in short supply around here, and if we could somehow figure out how to harness this passion, and channel it into the flux capacitor... it just might work.

    That's 2 BTTF references now.... : )

    #135 4 months ago

    Apologies people, my bad, the BTTF quotes were not meant to raise any hackles... and now that I realize how deep behind the lines I am in Sternistan, my “Uh oh” meter just went off... So, this was just me not thinking before engaging my wit engine, nothing more... going to quietly and slowly back out of the thread... one step... at... a... time... <door slam>

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