I think the poll shows that a large majority of Pinsiders support JJP and older BW games. I support everything pinball. I do believe that SW will outsell DI. To me that means most people that like and buy Stern are not on Pinside.

I'm not sure how you came up with this logic.

People care about theme and gameplay and less about who manufactures the game. The whole Stern vs JJP is so old now.

Thank you well said,
WOZ becomes Evil Dead (spinning house with no sign of a rainbow in sight)
The Hobbit becomes The Highlander
and DI just a cooler sci fi original theme and I would have or still would own at least 2 JJP pins while also taking a close look at #3. Ok I know theme isn't that important to everyone but its the most important thing for me, it won't save shitty gameplay but its definitely the first piece of the puzzle.

Star Wars will outsell Dialed In. Why? Because it's Star Wars.

I keep seeing several people say they're buying SW pro because the other options are out of their budget. I think that alone has a big effect on the poll, or decisions. It sounds like if both games were priced the same, DI could have even more of the votes.

I have to agree with the guy that referenced the tortoise and the hare. Ultimately, SW will outsell di mainly because of theme, and a lower price that more people can manage. Operators will definitely get SW as an easy money maker, which makes sense.

Op, everybody values games differently. My advice to you is try both of them enough to decide yourself. For me, my value is based on several things including in no special order, fun factor, uniqueness compared to my current lineup, looks of the machine, theme, quality of the product. If a machine hits on all or close on those things for me, I'm willing if possible to pay more money for it. I'm going to live once, so why not buy what I truly like.

This would be a great clip to play if a multiball is lit yet not collected and the ball drains.

I haven't played Star Wars, so I can't compare them, but I will say that DI is a godsend for people looking for a Bally/Williams style game. We have been waiting a very long time for this and I am so grateful that JJP has taken the time and spent the dollars to make it.

& would you rather see SW icons on the PF or Flo and Bob the builder?
Imagine SW as a theme for JJP on that same DI playfield...Id buy it.

bob12 (resized).jpg

flo1 (resized).jpg

Who cares its a super loaded fun original themed pinball and is a breath of fresh air from all the licenced stuff imo. Most who like b/w original themed pins will love di as its a modernized version of those(which many are top pins ).

I played both at Pintastic. There's just no comparison. DI is the most advanced machines ever from the greatest designer ever. SW wasn't horrible, but it wasn't memorable either, other than to say that I was one of the first to play it.

You could also attribute it to the fact that while a small percentage of pinball fans can afford a 5k pin, a very small sliver can afford an 8k game. Even though DI seems to be a really good game, they will not hold their value at that price either. Very few games in the pricing stratosphere have.

In fact, even though JJP seems to have a winner here, I do question their long-term health. The only reason why people spend the money they do now on games is because the pin hobby has proven that you can usually get most of it back in the secondary market. When that pillar snaps, it's game over for high prices. WOZ and TH don't hold up in the secondary market unless you were very early on WOZ. TH in particular is on its way to 6K. Does JJP really have to charge that much to turn a profit or do they have room to come down if the market changes?

Bob the builder rules!

download (1) (resized).jpg

Its sad how stripped down Stern's LE's are now.....Not worth buying

I played a lot of SW at Pintastic, and Dialed In. Loved DI so much I bought one yesterday. The ruleset for SW is not done and may not be done for x years, so you can't compare rulesets to DI which has a complete ruleset.

The fit and finish of DI is far superior to any Stern I've owned, although the initial quality (issues out of the box) is about the same. The balls that came with my DI were garbage and the camera was unplugged. After fixing those issues, the game is a classic. Ruleset may not be ridiculously deep like TSPP or LOTR but it's plenty deep enough and more important it's so much fun. Great fanfare, outstanding light shows, and the code still has plenty of updates on the way for aesthetics. Definitely like a new WMS game. The theatre even duplicates the cool Sanctum magnet effect from The Shadow.

The design detail of Lawlor is on another level. Even compared to WMS designers now working for Stern, it's next level. Lawlor takes the time to ensure there are no 'gotcha' shots where the ball bricks and then flies STDM or nothing-but-nets the outlane. Every Stern I've played has multiple numbers of these. Every shot on DI (except that damn SIM card shot) is a fun shot. It's a humorous game - and you get a crap ton of value for the $1,000 more on the LE over the Standard.

I love Star Wars but a theme can only take you so far. I found the shots to be boring (a switchback in 2017?) and the game to be heavily reliant on the screen. I don't want to play a video game. I felt like the best parts were on the screen. It's hard to compare a game like Woz or Dialed In to any Stern - Stern tries to find things they can get away with removing while JJP seems to try to stuff as much as they can into the game. Granted, that can only take you so far just like the theme, but when you add everything up, DI to me is worth every penny of the [not quite] $9k I paid for it - even if it's $2k, even $3k more than SW.

Good to hear a very thoughtful review from someone who played both recently.

But it has a numbered plate.....

I have about 10 games on both SW Pro and DI. Maybe a little less on DI.

Quickly, SW draws you in much faster than DI (in my opinion).

It's my experience that you need 2 hours+ on JJP games to start getting the feel of them, and get your head around their "grandeur". That's why JJP games are great in a home environment. The game becomes a sustained pleasure, that burns bright, but slower.

SW was fun. It kicked me in the Jimmy right away with its theme and music, and fast balls. It was like a quickie. It left me satisfied, but I walked away from it easily too... I haven't craved its gameplay since.

Is that bad?

Any vote for neither?
Love SW but not enough nostalgia left to own one.
Love DI innovation but can have B/W nostalgia for less.
Maybe playing both on location will change my mind..

I bought a TWDLE and ACDC Prem recently for roughly the same price as Dialed In Std. And SW Pro so in a way I voted for neither. I don't regret it at all as I had a chance to buy proven games with finished code that I love! I may buy DI or SW in a year or two once I have a chance to better evaluate and for a nice discount HUO.

just think, should be easy to get bob the builder dolls and sell them for $99 eh Hooked?

really100 (resized).jpg

If only Han checked to see if the SD card shipped with the hyperdrive.

"It's not my fault....It's not my fault!"
-Han's Distro

Totally agree 100%. Let them say what they want about DI, it's a great game, period!!!

Figures. That's STERN!!!!

if i had cash i buy a starwars pro.
If i had more cash i buy a starwars pro and a dailed in.
And if i had even more cash i would buy a starwars pro, dialed in and a houdini.

Time to wake up.

So that wy i sell my Medieval Castle to buy a SW .

I wouldn't want a SW pro, so DI free.

SW and 3k for me please.

DI, without blinking. SW just wasn't all that interesting, and I'm indifferent to the theme.

I ordered a Star Wars LE. I dont think people have much to say about it.. Im worried, does anyone out there like it????

That's cause no one has played it. If you want a LE new in box, this is the process. Gonna have to hope you like it. Or you can just wait until someone sells their used one later. Your call.

Both games look good, I've played DI didn't decide to buy it. That doesn't mean it's bad but I elected to spend my money on Woz.

Both games will be for sale new for years to come so I'm going to wait and see what else comes out in the future.

JJP Potc, Toy Story or HP would be much more likely to buy.

Star Wars is a dream theme for me, but I see no value at all in this game. Meanwhile, DI is packed with goodies and a ton of fun. I'm not saying SW won't be fun, but for those prices, I need to see some sort of bang for the buck. There are lots of fun, stripped down games out there that don't cost what SW does.

The Bob the Builder comments are funny, but isn't it ironic that the Bob the Builder machines looks far more modern than Star Wars? Maybe they were chasing the "A long time ago..." vibe.

I don't think people realize how bad of a theme toy Story would be for pinball. I have a 4 year old and we watch the toy Story movies from time to time, and the sound package in a pinball would be so bad, so annoying. Toy story is by far one of my kids least favorite movie shows; If jjp is serious about a kids themed movie pinball, they should look at Lego movies, minecraft, despicable me, or cars.

POTC could be good, bUT I'd imagine dealing with thst license could be a headache based on sterns Potc. That leaves Harry Potter. Id rather see some 80s throw back with back to the future or something that direction.

My 2 cents.

Hard pass on Toy Story. Bring on Lego Batman!! My kid would flip.

Lego batman or lego emit would be epic for kids. Or just a generic lego pinball with throwbacks to all the movies.

Bob the builder? He looks more like fix it Felix to me. Especially holding the lightning bolt up just like Felix holds his wrench up.

IMG_0422 (resized).PNG

Agree on Toy Story! They are all good movies but I just don't see the theme translating well to pinball. And the music would be bad. I just can't see myself getting amped up listening to "You've got a friend in Me" which would likely be the main gameplay music. Better get an external sub so you can really hear that bassline. lol..

As far as Kid's themes go I really think either Lego or a Nintendo Mario game would be the best choices. These work because both adults and kids are passionate about those themes.

All y'all ain't considered the dramatic potential of a Buzz Lightyear pin.

Regarding TOY Story

It'd be great if they could use the characters but not necessary follow the movies

For example could have Buzz with space rangers, could have Woody in a western theme etc.,

Despicable Me or Cars over Toy Story? That's madness.

Kind of makes me sad, though. So many missed opportunities. I've always had the feeling Jack knows his stuff but has a WAY different understanding of "cool" than I have.

I'd be all over a toy story pin. Army men, Sid, the claw machine, and so many other toys. A speak and say or that two knob tablet thing as an on field instruction guide. Tons of potential

Hey OP. You know what I just started thinkng about after reading this thread? I have a SW LE on order and DI was not on the radar do to costs and I like and dont have any problem with JJP pins, but lean on Sterns. Now I am thinking of getting both!

I sold my nice HUO modded lotr to get cash and space for SWLE. I played DI a lot when last year at a show and liked it. I even liked my RCT but had to sell it to get POTC. Yes RCT! Ha ! For me buying SWLE and adding DI, even standard, would be out of my comfort zone. 5 is my max, I woild need cash so I would have to sell one of my games, maybe IM that has kikced my butt for 3 years? I could lower my SWLE to a pro and use the $3000 savings ($3000?! Yikes!), add IM money to go towards DI and i would be good cash wise. Hmm? I have a family. I am a good, not great player and play for fun, so a line up of POTC, SMVE, AS and then add SW and DI would the off the charts! IMHO!

So back to you - maybe sell your LOTR like I did and get both? Lotr is aweome, but if you have SW and DI sitting next to each other that would be epic! I always try to think outside the box and upgrade or get something new when I can. Sell something out of yout collection to make things happen. I never miss a game I sell.

First off, as i've said many times, THEME MATTERS. That's why SW will stay relevant for a long, long time.

When the JJP defenders that can only see it ONE way shout out the better "value" comparison, they give little to no "value" to theme, X factor immersion fun (think the Williams SW music score playing) and the other Intangibles that go into a pinball machine like future resale value, a biggie.

The difference of opinion really does revolve around theme though, JJP defenders would buy a Muppets pin or ANY theme just because they think it has more BOM. As the other intangibles hit home, like resale value, that thinking will start to change in the future.

Like Hooked said, JJP should have watched and listened when people got up and walked out at Expo on the reveal of DI. He listened the Expo before with the horrendous TH artwork.

Most people on here would buy ANY pin they liked, whether its from Stern, JJP, Spooky etc. based on the THEME and other INTANGIBLES.

How do you put a value on what is the X FACTOR FUN FACTOR to each individual? What' the BOM on hearing the SW score and seeing video clips, rules integration and IMMERSION on one of the most iconic film series ever?

X factor immersion matters a lot, a huge part of the BOM for me and most people that buy pinball machines.

When and IF JJP makes another pin I want that has what i think is the X factor immersion and theme, then I'm all over it.

Lego movies and despicable me for sure. Cars maybe not so much. But anyone who thinks toy story would make a good pinball theme, go watch all 3 this weekend and let me know what you think on Monday. Sound package alone would be a deal breaker.