(Topic ID: 314118)

Star Trek: TNG all coils fire when coin door closed

By RebootMac

2 years ago


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#1 2 years ago

Hey guys,
picked up a star trek as part of a group buy and am slowly working through a ton of gremlins. The good: the game is in ok shape with a ton of work and new rottendog boards throughout. Pinsound board and some LED's. Ran down issues with the aux 8 board and replaced all the ribbon cables in the backbox as well as did the tieback mod and ran an extra jumper from J4 to J107 for peace of mind. Did all this running down a multiple ground short issue that I did finally resolve after repairing a couple of opticals. Now with the game no longer throwing errors on startrup I closed the coindoor and all the coils fired at once. Blowing F103, 104 and 105. I began trying to isolate the aux board but it seems like i'm missing a major ground or something. Double checked all the connectors against the manual. Don't really know where to start with this issue as there are plenty of topics on idividual coils, but it seems like multiple or all across each of the 3 groups. Coils ohm out, and no crazy obvious shorts.

#2 2 years ago
Quoted from RebootMac:

Hey guys,
picked up a star trek as part of a group buy and am slowly working through a ton of gremlins. The good: the game is in ok shape with a ton of work and new rottendog boards throughout. Pinsound board and some LED's. Ran down issues with the aux 8 board and replaced all the ribbon cables in the backbox as well as did the tieback mod and ran an extra jumper from J4 to J107 for peace of mind. Did all this running down a multiple ground short issue that I did finally resolve after repairing a couple of opticals. Now with the game no longer throwing errors on startrup I closed the coindoor and all the coils fired at once. Blowing F103, 104 and 105. I began trying to isolate the aux board but it seems like i'm missing a major ground or something. Double checked all the connectors against the manual. Don't really know where to start with this issue as there are plenty of topics on idividual coils, but it seems like multiple or all across each of the 3 groups. Coils ohm out, and no crazy obvious shorts.

So it didn’t do this before you worked on it? It boots?

I’d first check all cables and connectors in backbox are connected to correct locations, are oriented correctly, are not off by one pin, etc.

#3 2 years ago

Would be great if you. Oils substitute in non-rotten dog boards just to check.

QC always a possible issue with rotten dog.

#4 2 years ago

Game boots with no errors now, bought it non-working in a group buy and am finally getting to it. The boards were already replaced. And I have no history on it. Totally in the blind. I have a BoP I'm going to begin by swapping the MPU and doing some basic tests. I however swapped the Aux 8 driver board and all the ribbon cables. repaired a damaged motor homing switch and finished the tieback mod which had been halfway started I found. Came to me with multiple ground short errors. The display is still chippy, test menu's are coming in clear however the attract graphics are real flaky and its reporting a sound board error. It currently has a pinsound custom board in. No original boards i'm afraid. Getting more fuses today and hope to isolate the solenoid circuts to the PPU and see if it is indeed all solenoids.

#5 2 years ago

Sounds like you didn't connect the aux board ribbon cable correctly(reversed on 1 end). Make sure the red stripe is on pin 1 at both ends. It happens.

Although even if that's the problem and you correct it the new aux board may already be damaged with blown transistors.

#6 2 years ago

I would get some 3, 4, and 5 amp mini circuit breakers to aid in your troubleshooting. It'll save you $ on blown fuses.

Often very strange behavior like this is ribbon cables that are either backwards or shifted off by one pin. Good luck, you'll figure it out!

#7 2 years ago

Thanks,
I did put in new cables. So the odds of me missing by 1 aren't impossible. They're both new rottendog boards without the housing as well so its very possible. I'll check and report back.

#8 2 years ago
Quoted from RebootMac:

So the odds of me missing by 1 aren't impossible.

He's suggesting one may be reversed, not off by one pin (or row). The orientation of the aux board ribbon cable is usually towards the center of the board, opposite of all the others. Pin 1 --> Red stripe.

Also inspect the CPU to driver board ribbon cable. CPU tells the driver board which coils to fire through that cable. Might be getting mixed messages.

#9 2 years ago

Hey guys,
so after checking and reseating all my new ribbon cables the issue persisted. Finally pulled the ribbon cable from the PU to isolate the issue to either the CPU or the Power driver. Fired it up to try and the only solenoid that fires on startup now is the knocker, which may be tied to a different circuit? Fliptronics board I'd suspect? Again the display is also really chippy and I have a sound board interface error. So I believe the issue is on the CPU. Pulled the new and old aux 8 boards and tested the transistors individually and all test out out of game without load. Wondering what drives the solenoids on the CPU, as this is a rottendog board it has no battery damage but wondering if the custom williams that carried from the previous board could be migrating the issue?

#10 2 years ago

Hey guys. Checked all my ribbon cables all are good. Swapped in the working MPU from my bride of pinbot and still coils fire. So i guess i was wrong on that. Next im pulling and swappin thr power solenoid board. See if the issue carries then. If so then the problem must be in the playfield. Ive gone over the solenoid wiring over and over, but if a single coil were reversed or something it would just be that coil, not the entire section. Odd that it would carry across multiple solenoid sections as well correct?

#11 2 years ago

Update,
so the power solenoid board also caused all the flashers and solenoids to fire in bride of pinbot. This is a Rottendog boards but has had some work done to it. I believe maybe VR1 has gone out. I have an older power board from a friend I'm going to try in STTNG and see if I can run down what could have caused/ is causing the issue. I've redone the tieback and will see if the redone board reveals any new issues.

#12 2 years ago

Update again,
so I received an original board from a friend, rebuilt some transistors and fired up the game. All seemed well for a moment until a weak buzz and random pull in came from one of the boomerangs. The coil sort of flutters, then sticks hard. Also the left flipper has a low buzz, pretty sure its the low end hold winding firing when I close the door for the 50v. This also happens with J127 pulled, and it seems a second coil on with a brown signal cable (so tied to the same connector but not in circuit). So i'm wondering if there is a shared ground somewhere? Checking through with my DMM hasn't really netted any results. Any possibilities of a blown pre-driver im missing on the whole bank of solenoids or something? It firing without the connector makes me believe there is voltage leaking from somewhere else on the playfield.

#13 2 years ago

Reseat all the ribbon cable connections. Sounds like one ribbon cable connector is plugged in one row off.

#14 2 years ago

So after checking and putting on new ribbon cables the problem persisted. However out of curiosity I pulled my working fliptronics ii from my shadow and the issues cleared up. Absolutely nuts. As none of the playfield solenoids go through that connection I thought. I have a second fliptronics in storage im putting on the bench to rebuild tonight, hopefully these is the final game play problem and I can begin to tackle the pinsound board next. The fliptronics change cleaned up some issues on the DMD with flakey imagery as well. So im wondering where the problem could be. More than likely on the ribbon cable connector I suspect.

#15 2 years ago
Quoted from RebootMac:

Hey guys,
picked up a star trek as part of a group buy and am slowly working through a ton of gremlins. The good: the game is in ok shape with a ton of work and new rottendog boards throughout. Pinsound board and some LED's. Ran down issues with the aux 8 board and replaced all the ribbon cables in the backbox as well as did the tieback mod and ran an extra jumper from J4 to J107 for peace of mind. Did all this running down a multiple ground short issue that I did finally resolve after repairing a couple of opticals. Now with the game no longer throwing errors on startrup I closed the coindoor and all the coils fired at once. Blowing F103, 104 and 105. I began trying to isolate the aux board but it seems like i'm missing a major ground or something. Double checked all the connectors against the manual. Don't really know where to start with this issue as there are plenty of topics on idividual coils, but it seems like multiple or all across each of the 3 groups. Coils ohm out, and no crazy obvious shorts.

Look at for sale photos of people's backboxes then look at yours. Make sure the stripe on the ribbon cable is plugged in the exact same way. I had a similar issue where my issues had started when I plugged in a ribbon cable backwards on my machine. The solution was a few new coils, a new aux board, and correctly installed ribbon cable all installed at exactly the same time.

This thread starting with post 5019 shows my issues and ultimate solution along with a ton of pictures and troubleshooting steps.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/sttng-owners-club?tu=sataneatscheese#op

Good luck!

#16 2 years ago

Make sure this ribbon cable is plugged in correctly at the MPU and at the auxiliary board.

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#17 2 years ago

Maybe your coils have a path to ground. Closing the door turns on the high voltage to the coils causing them to fire.

When you say “fire” do you mean fire and stop or are they locked on.

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